Taking pills and psychoactive support

[nills]

I have to say it but it saddens me to see so many of our forum people on pills! Honestly you all do as you please but I can not stand behind your doctors advice and the meager attitude of following it ... you are so much stronger than you believe yourself to be! and your problems and worries are so much more insignificant than you believe them to be! ... don`t hide behind little feelings and small mindedness ... my god .. so many of you are loaded with so little knowledge and self esteem that it really baffles my mind ... and i`m not talking about book knowledge ... i`m speaking about the intelligence that you are far greater and stronger than this society it`s doctors and politicians and most of all ... your mind tell you! Wake up and be strong ... don`t crumble under every little feeling or fear or even those suicide thoughts dancing in front of your minds eye! ... my god, they don`t even exists, if you only would be ably to see it you would understand. Yet you choose fear over courage, small over big, being a slave of your mind over making the mind your servant! A servant to your Heart and well being...

I don`t need anyone opinion on this ... you read my stance and I hope it enters your heart so you can be released of your smallness and stand strong.

I have T for 6 years, and never took a pill ... i`m pretty sure it is as loud or even louder than any of you and suicide thoughts alse come and try to seduce my body to reject this world ... I sat before doctors and shrinks since I was 8 and was prescribed pills ... even than I refused and took life in my own hands ... I found peace, courage ... I reject regret, hope, praise and blame cause it doesn`t serve me ...

stop being a sheep ... Be a Lion! cause that is what you are ... strong independent and fearless!

Om Shanti

 

[MariaH]

Well said Nills. Prescription drugs are what got me into this mess. I would like to add a link to http://articles.mercola.com/sites/a...rsing-depression-without-antidepressants.aspx.

 

[amandine]

all crazy - i am only depressed cos of this noise in my head.
How do i stop being depressed while i cannot get any help with this noise
all the rest is just stuff to sell us
take our money and enjoy their lives
i want to enjoy my life and cant since this noise which is getting louder each day and i dont know what to do about it here in rural france with no help whatsoever
any ideas??
I know that there is somewhere on this forum from various places in france - anyone near the dordogne? thank you for all help

 

[Nick the Swede]

Easier said than done at times. Intrusive T is pure anxiety, specially in the beginning. CBT in the first months of T was waste of money for me. The lady told me that everything was just fine but for sure it wasn´t. Meds helped me cope in the first months. I never had any anxiety issues or visits at therapists before T. I dont think that i would have made the early days without it. Pure strong anxiety is hard to get by just using just a positive mindset. The only thing that works for me when anxiety attacks is a really hard workout, like running 10kms or more.

 

[amandine]

great - well thank you - dont actually think that i can cope with this....
dont have the strength of mind or lifestyle that can cope with this
too hard
need to think in terms of bye....just too hard.....sorry....tooooo scared with no one here to help me.....madness is this and i am going mad.....would rather die before i go insane with this - so sorry that i am not such a strong person like all of you - you are amazing and i am just useless here.....should be stronger but i am not sadly....

 

[MariaH]

Hi Nick,
The article states that ''taking a drug is unlikely to relieve your symptoms and may actually increase your risk of killing yourself.'' It certainly does not seem like a good choice. Actually, ''research has confirmed that antidepressant drugs are no more effective than sugar pills. In addition, since most of the treatment focus is on drugs, many safe and natural treatment options that DO work are being completely ignored.''
No wonder so many people are suffering. There is a serious lack of research to prove that any of these pills truly work, rather than it just being a placebo effect. On top of that: most research is being done by the lucrative pharmaceutical industry... how objective is that? In most cases, negative research outcomes are not being published.
And let's not even begin to talk about the side effects, such as (in my case) eye floaters and TINNITUS. Quite a risk to take if you're already in a state of anxiety.
It's just a warning - nothing more, nothing less.
Maria

 

[amandine]

Mariah, that is why i have stopped today to take any meds whatsoever. But here in rural france i need to know where i can go for some help. Cold turkey....is just so difficult....i dont want to take meds...never did before ...not even alcohol as i never liked it....this should not be happening to me.....desperate....no one knows or understands....maybe you guys do but you are all far away from me......cannot cope .....sorry...

 

[Nick the Swede]

Wasn´t responding to the article Maria but saying that ADs are no more effective than sugar pills is a bit strong.
Of course there are possible side effects on all meds. It´s possible to have side effects if eating a steak as well.
The natural options when you really have anxiety isnt´t the one that i would put my money on. I dont like beeing dependant of any meds and rather put my shoes on and hit the roads but sometimes there is no choice.

 

[mmacabre]

this thread is super condescending. don't call people out on their "smallness" and don't make that tired, obfuscated argument that extrapolates to and judges the personal character of those who choose to pursue or not to pursue pharmacological intervention. here at TT many ppl weigh out their options carefully before making such decisions. we're not stupid and we're not small. just because what's available now turns out to have problems doesn't mean that in time we can't make better medications that work on new mechanisms of action that could help many and hurt next to none. look to the future, don't get stuck in the past, and don't be so judgmental on a support forum where everyone is struggling somehow.

 

[amandine]

why are people fighting and argueing with each other? I dont get it? Dont we have enough problems without infighting with each other? People can have an opinion.....and write it politely...and then we can exchange ideas and viewpoints - no need ot argue with each other. Sorry but i had to say this as i dont understand what good arguing will do at all.....

 

[mmacabre]

because unnecessarily judgemental and emotionally manipulative "calls of action" to abandon all medications on a support forum that lots of newbies see for the first time every day, should be confronted.

 

[amandine]

oh right.....ok then.....thank you......

 

[mmacabre]

sorry i'm just sensitive because my tinnitus was caused by medication that i took to treat stubborn depression that wouldn't respond to other options. a lot of people know that medications aren't the safest and can really cause issues but i mean, you have to try some things some times. taking medications is not a sign of weakness, it's a sign of wanting to try something new to solve a problem, which isn't a weakness of the mind or anything. you know? i just don't want someone to read something and feel weak. these topics are seen on google searches. someone could be searching tinnitus and taking pills and see this and feel really lousy because they're taking a medication or thinking about taking one

 

[amandine]

yes i understand and thank you
personally i have stopped with the xanax etc...at least for now
did not need it before so why do i need it now
think that i am doing myself more harm than good
maybe need to be strong with myself and stop thinking about it or at least try
i am not here to judge anyone nor should i ever make such judgements.....we are all doing the best we can with the information that we have at the time......please be okay......i feel for you

 

[MariaH]

Hi @mmacabre, I am not sure if you are replying to the contents of my post, but if you are, my reply would be this:

Unfortunately, I am confident in saying that many people do not weigh out their options carefully before making decisions on meds. Not because we are stupid, but because it is simply not possible. The main reason being that those struck with tinnitus, such as myself over a year ago, are full of anxiety, stress and are faced with an overload of information on a topic none of us ever chose to be exposed to. We are bombarded with statistics, scary stories, fake cures, research trials and other confusion information. Of course we want to do whatever we can to find a solution and try new options!

Unfortunately for us tinnitus is a relatively unknown issue and therefore we end up consulting specialists who are forced to base their medical advice and choice of drugs on limited research and limited knowledge on the topic. This makes it very, very difficult for anyone, let alone the patient, to make informed decisions. Many of us have come to this forum not knowing what to do or what meds to take. This has nothing to do with stupidity or being small. I hope nobody reading this ever thinks that. I took them too. Besides, most people will Google their prescribed meds at some point and it might be a good thing if they end up reading a thread such as this one.

I think what we should remember here is that we are, as @amandine said, here to help each other, and no matter what our opinions are, they are intended to help, inform and warn others. It would be worse not to say anything.

You are right in saying that if what's available now turns out to have problems doesn't mean that in time we can't make better medications. But unfortunately for us we are not at that stage yet and therefore I feel that we should be careful and warn each other about possible negative side effects of using meds, and by that I do not mean the negative effects of eating steak @Nick the Swede, but serious life threatening and incapacitating side effects.

If you are interested I would like to ask that you watch this Ted Talk which explains that when a new drug gets tested, the results of the trials should be published for the rest of the medical world — except much of the time, negative or inconclusive findings go unreported, leaving doctors and researchers in the dark. In this talk, Ben Goldacre explains why these unreported instances of negative data are misleading and dangerous: https://www.ted.com/talks/ben_golda...ted.com-facebook-share&awesm=on.ted.com_t08A9.

I am definitely not stuck in the past, but do believe we should learn from the past, have hope for a better future, and most importantly: live in a well-informed present. Let's help each other in achieving that!

 

[mmacabre]

uh... my post was directed towards @nills , the creator of this thread. if you read the original post, he talked down to people who were using or considering using medications to help tinnitus or tinnitus distress and essentially said that those who took meds were "sheep", and he extolled us to be "lions" instead. Super, super condescending if you ask me. you're totally fine, @MariaH .

 

[nills]

You know that my post is calling you to be what you are, beautifull and strong ... and still people find it judgmental ... this is what happens when you have to much investments in your mind... it will tell you even not to trust the person that really loves you and wants you too shine because why? mind = suffering .. and sometimes we are too attached to it.. we think we are our minds but we are not ... we are the observer of our minds ... you are watching a movie thinking it is all happening to you.. but it is not... it is just playing in front of you ... this is what buddha talks about and so many others... times for all of us to wake up...

Amandine ... my dear dear fellow being... this will get better but you need to fight a little bit for it. Not much but at least a bit ... the way to win this is to 1. stop believing what your mind is saying! ... honestly ... YOU have a mind ... this means you are not mind but it is something that you observe... it is now in a state that it is showing and telling you things you should NOT believe! ... please take me serious what i`m writing to you cause this knowledge has changed my life immensly... secondly ... trust only the feeling of your heart ... it is the same as the feeling that `i`m alive` ... `I live` ... you don`t need your mind to know you live ... so this knowledge comes form another place ... you don`t need to look for it but it is like feeling your heart or soul ... now .. This is the only thing you should trust ... your mind will still say random stuff and also negative things .. . it does not matter!! you are not the mind ... you are the feeling of being alive! ... please come back to me on this and we can talk some more ... love you very much ... be well!

x

 

[mmacabre]

That actually makes a good deal of sense. @nills , be well.

 

[MCK Trader]

@MariaH ; @nills

Howdy,

With often severely intrusive T -- what thoughts held in mind, state of mind, mind protocol should I use to achieve a decent amount of restful sleep with "big" T? Some nights without some kind of sleep medication, I do not sleep at all. More than two consecutive nights of such is max! Any input, or sleep med recommendations, would be greatly. I already consistently pursue all current traditional protocols of 'sleep hygiene' / sleep preparation every evening.

Any specific suggestions for inducing / maintaining sleep would be greatly appreciated from anyone.

Thanks and I hope you both sleep well.

 

[MariaH]

Hi @MCK Trader,

Sorry to hear that you are struggling with sleep. It's horrible not being able to get the sleep you need. Are you taking any meds at the moment? Are you getting decent sleep when you do use the meds? Are you experiencing any side effects from taking them? What I remember from taking meds is that my body would get used to them, which meant that they lost their efficiency over the weeks (although I only took them for three weeks) and when I didn't take them, I didn't sleep at all. It's almost as if my body (and mind) were being taught that I could not sleep without the medication.

One of the things that helped me eventually, (after many many sleepless nights and sheer exhaustion for months on end), was exercise. At one point I was walking up to 3 to 4 hours a day until I was completely exhausted and would just collapse. Exercise helped, but I only starting noticing real improvement when I gave up worrying about the sounds and somehow made myself believe that if I would just surrender to it, I would get the sleep I need to get better - somehow and someday. As well as 'surrendering' to the noise and trying to hold on to that little bit of faith, I would air my bedroom during the day, try to be outside most of the day, spend lots of time on putting together healthy meals and smoothies, have a hot shower before bedtime, curl up in bed with a hot water bottle at my feet, keep big fluffy socks on, and hold on to an extra pillow. No matter how difficult, I would also try to read just a few pages in a good book before going to sleep, just as a ritual. Also, if I wasn't asleep within 30 minutes, I would force myself to get out of bed, make myself a hot cup of milk with honey (not too much otherwise I'd just end up having to go to the loo 10x), or have some porridge, or a banana. Basically, any food you find comforting. Sometimes I would go out for another brisk walk around the block and then get back into bed.

Good luck with it all MCK, I hope you find your perfect routine and that you manage to get some sleep.
Keep us posted!
Maria

 

[Tenna]

Profit is usually ahead of health and cures here and now aren't as profitable as long term medicine.
That being said meds may act as a remedy making people able to see opportunities to become strongers. They're fantastic for some, dreadful for others.

 

[astronomer]

hi,
yes, for me i went full blown into taking this and that for pills from doctors, that messed me right up,i actually was in a worse condition,thinking it was the tinnitus doing it,well i stopped taking anything and dealt with it straight and sober and i am glad i did,i know everyones immunity is different but i am not the strongest person myself but in fact my mind has helped to heal me in a positive light,i choose to live a healthy, natural, normal life with tinnitus and i am,have a good day all ! kevin

 

[Street Spirit]

@amandine please talk to your doctor before ceasing xanax. Going cold turkey is always a terrible idea and could lead to worsening T or worse..

 

[Stina]

Just wanted to point out that a lot depends on the person. There are people who are indeed able to treat themselves however it is not always an option. For example I have generalized anxiety disorder - a condition created due to a long period of uncertainty and problems (tinnitus was just one of them) and bad genes. When before I had felt that I could deal on my own this time there was no way idea. Life became a nuisance and burden. I got one medication in winter but didn't feel a drastic effect (I was still anxious and as a result depressed but my sleep had improved and I was no longer having panic attacks) so I stopped taking them. The sleeping issues and panic came back so I was put on another medication in the summer. The drug fits better so in September I began to feel like myself for the first time. My doctor tells me that the fact that my body is reacting well to the drug means that have hope to to be a normal person.
However, my sister for example has had clinical depression all her life, she has been working with a good therapist for a year and yet if they take the drugs off for even one month she becomes suicidal on the border of psychosis again. So for her treating herself is not an option because of her brain's faulty construction.
So my point is that in some cases yes, people can treat themselves, but other things such as medical history and genetics have to be evaluated too - they might influence the way people react to life and often can't only be treated with the right thinking.

 

[derpytia]

I wish it were that simple to just "wake up" and have self esteem and "knowledge". I've had depression since I was eight years old and I was coping in my own way (not the best way by far) until the T came along and compounded it. Sometimes people need the pills because a person can only be so strong for so long. Life can deal us some pretty nasty cards and we humans are not always capable of handling it.

 

[walkthroughwalls]

There's nothing wrong with taking medication if that's what it takes to get you through the day. Of course, we'd all like to be off medication, but no-one is better of worse for choosing either one.

The way the pharmaceutical industry operates is a problem, and the same goes for psychiatrists who -in my opinion- are way too eager to prescribe heavy meds. Where I live, it's possible to get prescribed anti-depressants after a ten minute interview. No support, monitoring, looking at the source of the problem, input from the client, or considering the possible side-effects. These medications certainly have their place, but that place is closer to 'last resort' than to 'default / first thing to try'.


Nills, it's clear that you want the best for all of us. I think I have some idea of where you're coming from. Looking into Buddhism to see if there's something to be learned, can never be a bad thing for any of us.

 

[Larry OT]

I struggle with the idea of needing meds to live with this condition.
My anxiety was so bad I didn't think I could make it.
Anti anxiety meds gave me the chance to get through the worst of it.
Now I am tapering off.
My depression still looms large and the new anti depression meds my doc wants me to take scare me, but something went so wrong from the anxiety I still suffer with physical problems caused by my initial anxiety and depression.
Not sure about starting new meds, but I know they saved my sisters life.
I don't advocate taking anything, but we are a all not wired the same way.
In desperation I am seeking another way to exist.
Not sure if I will take new meds just yet, but some that I started have got me through the worst of it.
When you feel so down and out and their are no words that help, the options are limited.
My one question - does anyone on this post drink or get high?
Is that any different than taking meds? Those are mind altering substances too.

 

[walkthroughwalls]

These are mind-altering substances, but I'd make a distinction between needing anti-depressants to stay alive and recreational drug use.


Personally, I tried alcohol a long time ago but hated it and never tried anything else. I've had drug-like side-effects from medication which I didn't like either. Sure, it gave a different twist to Coltrane's A Love Supreme, but I still prefer that record clean. I would take meds if there was no way of living a meaningful life without them, but I'd consider the mind-altering part an unwanted side-effect.


The things I value in life (art, travel, knowledge, personal growth, reducing suffering etc.) come from dedication, creativity, hard work and compassion. These are the things you need to paint the Mona Lisa, come up with the theory of gravity or work for Doctors Without Borders. Altering your mind's state doesn't help here.

Also, I like that if I'm going to a concert of art gallery with someone, we're experiencing this art together. It's a human connection. You build a history with someone. And that doesn't happen if one of us is on LSD and sees something different altogether.

Speaking of art, you often hear that drugs will help your creativity and improve your art. I think this is hugely overstated. Drugs will surely influence what you paint, sing or compose. But it will not make a mediocre artist create genius. Maybe your saxophone playing sounds great while you're stoned or drunk, just don't try to record it and listen to it the next morning.

And if you need drugs to feel relaxed, to let go, to get energized, to free yourself from peer pressure etc.. Well, this may actually work, but there are better ways to accomplish this. Life healthily, practice, get some life-experience, do some introspection, meditate, discuss, read, write, take a close look at your feelings, thoughts and behavior. The most open, friendly, natural and energetic people I've met are all completely clean.


Lastly, these are my opinions and it's absolutely not up to me to tell others how to live their lives. Whatever you want to do, I'm cool with it. Just don't start alcohol fueled bar brawls while I'm trying to load gear back into the car after playing my guts out in some dive

 

[Telis]

I struggle with the idea of needing meds to live with this condition.
My anxiety was so bad I didn't think I could make it.
Anti anxiety meds gave me the chance to get through the worst of it.
Now I am tapering off.
My depression still looms large and the new anti depression meds my doc wants me to take scare me, but something went so wrong from the anxiety I still suffer with physical problems caused by my initial anxiety and depression.
Not sure about starting new meds, but I know they saved my sisters life.
I don't advocate taking anything, but we are a all not wired the same way.
In desperation I am seeking another way to exist.
Not sure if I will take new meds just yet, but some that I started have got me through the worst of it.
When you feel so down and out and their are no words that help, the options are limited.
My one question - does anyone on this post drink or get high?
Is that any different than taking meds? Those are mind altering substances too.

I use booze...don't get drunk, just enough to take the edge off T...I also suffer with severe H and constant ear pain. Booze helps with the pain as well. To me it's safer than ADs and helps a lot...although I would rather not do it at all but the fact is I'm in constant pain... A person can only take so much suffering until he snaps and looks to whatever means to take away the pain. I'm only human and I suffer 24 7, I don't give a f@@k what people think, they don't walk in my shoes.

 

[Larry OT]

That's my point Telis. Whatever gets you through the night is fine by me. I fear AD's more than booze, so I am trying to find a better path without the meds. Its a journey that we all have find our own path. At least here we can discuss it and keep moving on.