Acupuncture for Tinnitus

[slc]

Would you mind sharing what Ayurvedic herbs you have used? I know it's specific to your constitution, but I am curious what has been helpful. Also, did you ever have hyperacusis?

Cheers,
S

Yes, I had catastrophic hyperacusis and tinnitus eleven years ago. Crickets, a neighbor's air conditioner, even the inner workings of a CD player were nearly impossible to endure. I lost a good amount of weight, was unable to sleep more than a couple of hours, couldn't drive a car, was unable to use a computer because the stimulation or sound of the fan set off a full-blown crisis. The sound of water was comforting.

I can give you my current Ayurvedic formula which would be a bit different than the herbs I first took. They all add up to a multi month supply of 338 grams that I take three times a day after meals (half teaspoon with warm water after) but the amounts are a bit different for some herbs with Dashmula and Punarnava being somewhat more than others:

• Dashmula
• Punarnava
• Yogaraj Guggulu
• Saraswati
• Kutki
• Tagar (valerian)
• Shankhapushpi
• Turmeric
• Gokshura
• Shilajit
• Triphala Guggulu

I also use:

• SuperNasya oil (three times a day sniffed up nose).
• Sidha Soma oil (let several drops sit in each ear for a couple of minutes).
• Jatamansi oil (several drops on forehead and on nostrils right before bed).
• Bringaraj oil (several times a week on scalp and then wash off in warm shower).

The Yoga of Herbs probably has detailed information on each of these.

Note: My vikruti (current state of the body's constitution) shows elevated vata pushing pitta (to a lesser degree). It is my understanding (from my own studies and being treated by Ayurvedic doctors and practitioners) that most people with hyperacusis and tinnitus would have vata "derangement" (with possible symptoms including tinnitus, arthritis for some -- which is the case for me, anxiety, insomnia especially from the hours of 3 AM to 6 AM, to mention only a few). Elevated pitta could manifest as increased anger, impatience, sensitivity to sun, heat or very spicy foods. (My sleep is now pretty solid, anxiety is much lower and I experience few, if any, noticeable pitta symptoms aside from perhaps impatience at times.)

Ed Danaher (Dr. Lad's assistant when the Ayurvedic Institute was in New Mexico; it has just relocated to the Carolinas) is my primary Ayurvedic practitioner, although I have also seen Dr. Lad and have gone for panchakarma in India (something I will do again this Spring). I get the herbs through the Ayurvedic Institute store. Ed calls in the formula. I call the Institute's store phone number and request the formula that Ed has prescribed.

Cheers,
Stephan

It sounds like you are throwing the kitchen sink at tinnitus and you do have some money and patience to persevere. Maybe with this latest Acupuncturist there is some other factor which resulted in the temporary lower tinnitus levels you are not aware of.

This is the problem with expensive treatments which make claims like - balancing the body. Perhaps - (a big perhaps) Acupuncture "balanced your yin and yang" for 2-3 days every time you had a session. That means for continual lower tinnitus levels you would need to spend $80 every several days plus the time spent for the rest of your life.

At least with a dubious piece of kit like the Lenire you spend £3,000 and that is it. Therapy costs are ongoing and could run into tens of thousands over the years.

The amount I have spent has been enormous. I can't ascribe improvement to a specific treatment, but what was catastrophic tinnitus and hyperacusis left me unable to drive, sleep more than two hours at a time, and eat a normal diet, thereby losing lots of weight. The hyperacusis resolved to near normal within two years. The tinnitus went from catastrophic to moderate (a level where I didn't need to wear white noise maskers) within several years. I have had two acoustic traumas within the past 7 years. The most recent one, an alarm, spiked things to a severe level for a year and is just calming down.

Other than my own experience and study, I can't prove that my course of action is what changed things for the better, but there are multiple studies using control groups, albeit with small numbers of people, that show Ayurveda has been helpful. From my perusal of Lenire, I would not waste $ on it. The scientific studies of Dr. Shore's device show actual benefit in decibel level, not just THI. (Lenire, as we known, bases their improvement simply on THI and has other major weaknesses in how the research was conducted.)

I did find that the level of tinnitus decreased significantly while I received a 6 week course of Ayurvedic treatment in India. If you want to look at some of the literature, here is a link to one article: The Role of Ayurveda in Managing Tinnitus.

 

[SaraK18]

I can give you my current Ayurvedic formula which would be a bit different than the herbs I first took. They all add up to a multi month supply of 338 grams that I take three times a day after meals (half teaspoon with warm water after) but the amounts are a bit different for some herbs with Dashmula and Punarnava being somewhat more than others:

• Dashmula
• Punarnava
• Yogaraj Guggulu
• Saraswati
• Kutki
• Tagar (valerian)
• Shankhapushpi
• Turmeric
• Gokshura
• Shilajit
• Triphala Guggulu

I also use:

• SuperNasya oil (three times a day sniffed up nose).
• Sidha Soma oil (let several drops sit in each ear for a couple of minutes).
• Jatamansi oil (several drops on forehead and on nostrils right before bed).
• Bringaraj oil (several times a week on scalp and then wash off in warm shower).

Thank you so much Stephan. I really appreciate you taking the time to share your protocol with me. I have had success with Ayurveda in the past for other issues, it's very healing. I also have primarily vata imbalance, with slight pitta as well.

Did you put the Sidha Soma oil in your ears even when you had more severe ear issues? Did you ever have a fluid issue in your ears that you noticed?

Thanks!
Sara

 

[DeanD]

That's a simplification. There were more negatives and neutrals than positives and for the positives there were methodology flaws.

And I am not claiming Acupuncture is ineffective. I never made that claim.

I am saying there is insufficient evidence to back up the claim it IS effective.

For conventional medicine - that is not enough to get approval.

So you are offering treatment for a condition which by the standards of conventional medicine frankly would not be approved.

I have read a number of research papers on Acupuncture for stress only, nothing to do with tinnitus, and almost all have said 'more research is needed'. Wow. But in general the studies suggest Acupuncture does reduce stress levels compared to sham procedures during the same studies.

A traditional medicine that has been practiced for 3,000 years now, and still more research is needed. That end sentence on many research papers is getting very frustrating.

Acupuncture releases endorphins. This has been shown in many studies and literature. I don't think this is in dispute. I remember being asked at Brai3n whether alcohol reduces the volume of my tinnitus. They said they have a number of patients where the release of endorphins through alcohol have a positive temporary effect on the volume of tinnitus.

For me alcohol doesn't really do much, perhaps improves things a little. For others it increases their tinnitus but, for some, including some I know, it reduces it.

Isn't in conceivable that if alcohol and caffeine can affect the way tinnitus reacts, as well as cortisol through stress levels, which has been reported on Tinnitus Talk a number of times, then something like Acupuncture could provide some relief?

I'm not suggesting someone goes for Acupuncture and they become cured, unless there is a very unique and specific reason applied to them, but it would be a shame for people who may have given this a go and decide against it due to the negativity shown.

I go for a weekly massage now. It was never something I ever thought of doing before. This is mainly due to another illness causing chronic spasms and muscle tightness. During these 30 minute sessions I feel calmer than I do most other times.

I personally am not one for talking therapy as to me there are no changes going on physically or chemically within the body - but if caffeine, alcohol and natural cortisol have shown time and time again to affect the volume of tinnitus, couldn't the release of endorphins through Acupuncture provide a similar temporary benefit for a small number of tinnitus sufferers, particularly as a result of stress?

@SaraK18, as the expert on Acupuncture, feel free to correct or rip apart any of my understanding on Acupuncture here

 

[UKBloke]

For me alcohol doesn't really do much, perhaps improves things a little. For others it increases their tinnitus but, for some, including some I know, it reduces it.

I would like to chime in here. I can say that alcohol definitely reduces my tinnitus temporarily. Whether that's an effect of the alcohol itself or a result of endorphine release after the initial alcohol "hit" that I find relaxing, I've no idea. But I've sank enough bottles at Beer o' Clock to know that this isn't just a random phenomena for me.

A traditional medicine that has been practiced for 3,000 years now, and still more research is needed. That end sentence on many research papers is getting very frustrating.

Something I read in passing this week really resonated with me. It was in relation to controlled medical studies and the peer-review process regarding statistical outcomes of efficacy. The chap was basically saying that all the figures regarding clinically meaningful improvement are nonsense absent repeatability.

As I say, this really hit me hard because that big question of repeatability is the crux of the matter for the "end-user". It's a concept I've struggled with ever since the Lenire debacle.

 

[SaraK18]

Haha, thanks @DeanD

I personally am not one for talking therapy as to me there are no changes going on physically or chemically within the body - but if caffeine, alcohol and natural cortisol have shown time and time again to affect the volume of tinnitus, couldn't the release of endorphins through Acupuncture provide a similar temporary benefit for a small number of tinnitus sufferers, particularly as a result of stress?

Yes, it can. It can even help tinnitus from other causes - like neck tension, TMJ, or other issues. I treat myself with Acupuncture and notice improvement in my symptoms. I had an acoustic trauma and have hyperacusis. I have had improvement with symptoms of pain, plugged feeling in my ear, burning sensation, and other things associated with the injury like nausea and anxiety. I have been documenting what I do, and who knows maybe one day I will come up with a protocol that can really help people. My theory is that tinnitus caused from injury needs a modified treatment from tinnitus from other causes.

I have had other tinnitus patients and one with hyperacusis, but none of those were caused by an ear or head injury, so I look at these cases differently.

A traditional medicine that has been practiced for 3,000 years now, and still more research is needed. That end sentence on many research papers is getting very frustrating.

I agree, it can be frustrating, but as practitioners we understand that is an obstacle we face. The nature of how holistic medicine works (taking many factors into account and not treating only 1 or 2 symptoms) creates challenges when conducting clinical trials. But, clinical trials are not everything.

Best,
Sara

 

[slc]

Thank you so much Stephan. I really appreciate you taking the time to share your protocol with me. I have had success with Ayurveda in the past for other issues, it's very healing. I also have primarily vata imbalance, with slight pitta as well.

Did you put the Sidha Soma oil in your ears even when you had more severe ear issues? Did you ever have a fluid issue in your ears that you noticed?

Thanks!
Sara

You are very welcome, Sara. Yes, vata pushing pitta is pretty typical for karna nada (tinnitus). On the occasions when I have had fluid in my ears, it was due to infection and I did not use Sidha Soma oil in my ears. I turned to Western medicine for antibiotic and anti-fungal drops. Once the infection was over, I went back to oiling the ears. There are Ayurvedic approaches for dealing with fluid, but I think that would vary depending upon the circumstance, e.g., neem oil might be used as part of a treatment. An Ayurvedic practitioner/doctor could advise on specific treatments.

By the way, there are other oils, one could use in the ears, e.g., garlic oil one makes oneself. I think Dr. Lad recommended a base of sesame oil? His book on Ayurvedic Home Remedies is useful. But he told me Sidha Soma was a good choice -- and it's super easy as the small bottle makes it simple to add drops to the ear. These days, I'm wearing white noise devices a fair amount of the time and oil clogs them up, but this discussion is a good reminder. I'll see if I have some Sidha Soma oil at home

Another good option, would be to massage the mastoid process with vata oil or Bhringraj oil. I do this in the shower sometimes. One can also massage the outer ear. I gather you're an acupuncturist, so you would know the marma points to focus on.

Oh, one more item. I generally used Super Nasya once a day, not three times a day as I wrote and didn't pick up my mistake until later. Occasionally, I'll use it twice a day.

As you well know, this kind of treatment is making constitutional changes, not just symptomatic, so vata pacifying diet, good sleep, and so forth are also important. I've often found that Ayurveda makes similar recommendations to what my acupuncturist would make: getting to bed early, keeping warm in winter, not exposing ears to lots of wind, avoiding crunchy crunch sweet cold foods especially during cold weather, and so forth.

 

[Stuart-T]

Acupuncture releases endorphins. This has been shown in many studies and literature. I don't think this is in dispute.

It is in dispute if you dig a little.

Acupuncture and Endorphins: Not all that Impressive | Science-Based Medicine

Conclusion: Endorphins are myth, not history
Does acupuncture release feel-good hormones called endorphins? It is a bad question since, as is so often the case, exactly what is meant by acupuncture is never specified.

For electro, a tarted up a form of TENS, the answer is often a yes, but electro-acupuncture isn't acupuncture. Of the dozens and dozens and dozens of forms of what passes for acupuncture only electro acupuncture uses electricity. I know. Duh.

All the other forms of acupunctures? Almost all of the data suggests that for the more traditional forms of acupuncture, feel-good hormones have nothing to do with its alleged analgesic effects. That effect, as we know, is actually the same mechanism as beer goggles.

Given how totally picky CR is in their product reviews, it is odd they did not bother to investigate the basis of the idea that 'acupuncture' releases feel-good hormones, it is electricity. Yet another fail when CR accepts the standard mythical narrative of acupuncture without actually reviewing the supporting information and then giving terrible advice. But that is the standard approach to reporting SCAM. Same as it ever was. I do wonder if I can actually trust their advice on the best car or laundry detergent when they have such a fail with health care, a topic far more important.

This is an in-depth article which actually quotes from the studies on PubMed.

My own conclusion - I DO NOT KNOW.

But I have some doubts about whether the claim IS true.

 

[DeanD]

It is in dispute if you dig a little.

Acupuncture and Endorphins: Not all that Impressive | Science-Based Medicine

This is an in-depth article which actually quotes from the studies on PubMed.

My own conclusion - I DO NOT KNOW.

But I have some doubts about whether the claim IS true.

I didn't research it any further but ok, perhaps no one knows, but here's a counter just to add a different point of view.

Many people often feel relaxed after acupuncture. That calm feeling is a chemical release within the body, whatever that chemical release is. Whether endoprhins, dopamine or something else.

Perhaps in some people (say with stress-induced tinnitus) there is a positive effect to tinnitus based on whatever the body is releasing - which may or may not be endorphins - and maybe anything that can bring on that state of calmness from an acupuncture practitioner can help in the short term.

 

[Stuart-T]

I didn't research it any further but ok, perhaps no one knows, but here's a counter just to add a different point of view.

Many people often feel relaxed after acupuncture. That calm feeling is a chemical release within the body, whatever that chemical release is. Whether endoprhins, dopamine or something else.

Perhaps in some people (say with stress-induced tinnitus) there is a positive effect to tinnitus based on whatever the body is releasing - which may or may not be endorphins - and maybe anything that can bring on that state of calmness from an acupuncture practitioner can help in the short term.

Maybe that is the case - I was just questioning your claim that there is no dispute over this. There is some dispute.

Supposing it is the case. Endorphin rushes do not last. So frankly any treatment based on this is not really that viable.

There are self-relaxation techniques which do not involve the stress of getting to and back from a practitioner and the stress of paying out money you maybe cannot afford. MAYBE it is worth trying these techniques if stress is causing your tinnitus.

Frankly if I was a multi millionaire, I would possibly hazard my money on many different therapies including acupuncture (or maybe not - needles in the skin do not really appeal to me that much). But since my money is limited, I tend to be quite careful with how I spend it.

 

[SaraK18]

You are very welcome, Sara. Yes, vata pushing pitta is pretty typical for karna nada (tinnitus). On the occasions when I have had fluid in my ears, it was due to infection and I did not use Sidha Soma oil in my ears. I turned to Western medicine for antibiotic and anti-fungal drops. Once the infection was over, I went back to oiling the ears. There are Ayurvedic approaches for dealing with fluid, but I think that would vary depending upon the circumstance, e.g., neem oil might be used as part of a treatment. An Ayurvedic practitioner/doctor could advise on specific treatments.

By the way, there are other oils, one could use in the ears, e.g., garlic oil one makes oneself. I think Dr. Lad recommended a base of sesame oil? His book on Ayurvedic Home Remedies is useful. But he told me Sidha Soma was a good choice -- and it's super easy as the small bottle makes it simple to add drops to the ear. These days, I'm wearing white noise devices a fair amount of the time and oil clogs them up, but this discussion is a good reminder. I'll see if I have some Sidha Soma oil at home

Another good option, would be to massage the mastoid process with vata oil or Bhringraj oil. I do this in the shower sometimes. One can also massage the outer ear. I gather you're an acupuncturist, so you would know the marma points to focus on.

Oh, one more item. I generally used Super Nasya once a day, not three times a day as I wrote and didn't pick up my mistake until later. Occasionally, I'll use it twice a day.

As you well know, this kind of treatment is making constitutional changes, not just symptomatic, so vata pacifying diet, good sleep, and so forth are also important. I've often found that Ayurveda makes similar recommendations to what my acupuncturist would make: getting to bed early, keeping warm in winter, not exposing ears to lots of wind, avoiding crunchy crunch sweet cold foods especially during cold weather, and so forth.

Thank you! I'm going to start incorporating Ayurveda into my healing regimen again.

 

[slc]

Thank you! I'm going to start incorporating Ayurveda into my healing regimen again.

You are very welcome! It's a good reminder for me as well to remember to take my formula, get to bed on time, maybe make some kitchari when the weather gets colder.

Maybe a nice warm Epsom salt bath to relax...!

 

[SaraK18]

You are very welcome! It's a good reminder for me as well to remember to take my formula, get to bed on time, maybe make some kitchari when the weather gets colder.

Maybe a nice warm Epsom salt bath to relax...!

Nice! I did abhyanga today. So good for pacifying vata!

 

[slc]

Nice! I did abhyanga today. So good for pacifying vata!

Sweet! I often do an abbreviated version in the shower, at least of my scalp and upper body. But I think it's time for full abhyanga (body oil massage, often using a sesame based oil, for those reading this thread). I have the same response. Very vata pacifying!

 

[Stuart-T]

Another overlooked fact about Acupuncture is that the Chinese Emperor outlawed Acupuncture in the 19th century and it was made obsolete. This decision was revisited some time later and confirmed as China switched to modern methods.

Chairman Mao brought it back in the 20th century purely because he wanted to sell the idea that China could cure its own ills with its own methods. Oddly he never himself used Acupuncture when he got seriously ill. Acupuncture found its way to the West in the 1970s but nobody talked about the fact it had been discredited by the actual Chinese in the 19th century.

I just watched a program about the unreliability of self-reporting - asthma patients were asked to evaluate treatments/placebo and all groups reported similar improvements. But pre-treatment lung capacity was measured and post-treatment lung capacity only actually improved in the group that had the real treatments (inhaler with actual medication).

This will be a problem with tinnitus studies - namely - the unreliability of self-reporting whether it be Lenire, medications, or Acupuncture.

 

[slc]

Thank you so much Stephan. I really appreciate you taking the time to share your protocol with me. I have had success with Ayurveda in the past for other issues, it's very healing. I also have primarily vata imbalance, with slight pitta as well.

Did you put the Sidha Soma oil in your ears even when you had more severe ear issues? Did you ever have a fluid issue in your ears that you noticed?

Thanks!
Sara

Sara, How are you doing?

I wanted to share my recent experience and a shift back to basics that seem to be helping. I've had a nasty spike going on for more than a year following exposure to an alarm. I sat down with myself and revisited my entire toolkit.

I've made some recent changes to approaches I know well, but had largely neglected.

Too soon to tell if I'm at a turning point of improvement, but the last several days have been mild to moderate -- way down from severe -- following the changes. Here are the biggies starting from what seem to be the most important:

1. Using body temperature Sidha Soma oil (sesame infused with herbs; Bilva taila is the traditional Ayurvedic oil used for tinnitus and I've ordered that. You can make your own garlic oil from sesame with garlic lightly browned in it and then drained, but it does have a strong odor. Dr. Lad mentioned that to me once.)
2. Making sure I take my Ayurvedic formula at least twice a day; it is prescribed for 3x a day but I sometimes forget or I'm not home. (I've added Ashwagandha to my formula as I believe the reason my practitioner eliminated it was because I put on a bit of weight during COVID-19. Ashwagandha is good to have in the mix.)
3. Getting to bed by 11 pm or so.
4. One tablet of Manasamitra Vatakam per day that I had left over and prescribed by the Dr. supervising my PK in India. It is supposed to be taken under supervision of an Ayurvedic physician. (I haven't done a home cleanse, but I decided to give the Manasamitra Vatakam a go. I finally found some to order on Amazon, not my first choice, but it doesn't seem to be readily available in the U.S.)
5. Visit to my craniosacral therapist who helps with lymph drainage, reducing flight or fight, working with various nerves that can play a role with tinnitus.
6. Using Super Nasya oil sniffed in the nose once a day.
7. An occasional hot bath with Epsom salts just to relax.
8. A walk or bike ride as long as it's not too cold or windy.

 

[Nick47]

Too soon to tell if I'm at a turning point of improvement

You're on Clonazepam buddy. Forget that list.

 

[slc]

You're on Clonazepam buddy. Forget that list.

My experience is that Clonazepam is not anywhere near as effective as it first was years back. I take a daily dose. My psychopharmacologist insisted I do this, otherwise she was going to cut me off. I was in early days and in crisis so I unfortunately didn't just do my own thing and take as needed.

I have found what I listed above does help, especially the various Ayurvedic oils and treatment I got in India which reduced my tinnitus from severe to moderate. Not trying to convince you, just reporting what works for me. I've been hit with a couple of noise events that have spiked things, most recently a year back. I'm going to India February and March for additional Ayurvedic treatment.

There have been a number of studies of Ayurvedic treatment for tinnitus showing benefit. Many doctors there train in allopathic approaches as well as the traditional Indian medicine in order to bridge both approaches.

I hope you're hanging in there and, of course, I'm looking forward to Auricle being released for clinical use.

 

[SaraK18]

Sara, How are you doing?

I wanted to share my recent experience and a shift back to basics that seem to be helping. I've had a nasty spike going on for more than a year following exposure to an alarm. I sat down with myself and revisited my entire toolkit.

Thank you @slc. It's good to hear from you, and I'm glad you are noticing an improvement. This comes at a perfect time too because I'm getting over a head cold. I had intense sinus congestion for over a week and I started noticing it affecting my ears. As I write this, my left ear feels plugged and probably twice the tinnitus volume as before I got sick. I had been taking decongestants, but took one last night and my ear felt worse so I'm going to hold off on that moving forward. I'll keep you posted on how my healing is coming along...

Thank you again! And I'm glad you are on a good routine

 

[KenJoe]

Acupuncture, I tried it here in Shanghai, does not work. Just a waste of money.

 

[Luman]

I had Acupuncture treatments to quit smoking decades ago. I don't remember much about it; the earlobes were part of where the needles were. Maybe it helped, or perhaps it was psychological, but I never touched tobacco again.

 

[Mr.VS]

I completed ten sessions of SuJok acupuncture (which exclusively places needles on the fingers). During those sessions, I didn't feel any changes, but I was told that the effects should start to manifest in the coming days.

Has anyone had experience with this type of acupuncture?

 

[Zigs]

Thank you @slc. It's good to hear from you, and I'm glad you are noticing an improvement. This comes at a perfect time too because I'm getting over a head cold. I had intense sinus congestion for over a week and I started noticing it affecting my ears. As I write this, my left ear feels plugged and probably twice the tinnitus volume as before I got sick. I had been taking decongestants, but took one last night and my ear felt worse so I'm going to hold off on that moving forward. I'll keep you posted on how my healing is coming along...

Thank you again! And I'm glad you are on a good routine

@SaraK18, how are you doing now?