Audiogram Accuracy and How to Read It

Cal18

Member
Author
Benefactor
Dec 7, 2016
333
San Diego
Tinnitus Since
12/2016
Cause of Tinnitus
2010 / 2016 Both SSRI Withdrawal and Mild Hearing Loss
I think the thing I'm not grasping is how one is supposed to be able to hear sounds of the audiogram that the tinnitus is covering. So for example, if there is a beep that matches my T (which was quite loud the day I took the test with several different sounds) wouldn't that show up as hearing loss? My test showed mild mid-level hearing loss which I don't think is even associated to my T. Just wondering how a test could be accurate with T screeching over it.
 

Attachments

  • cropped.pdf
    125.7 KB · Views: 229
I think the thing I'm not grasping is how one is supposed to be able to hear sounds of the audiogram that the tinnitus is covering. So for example, if there is a beep that matches my T (which was quite loud the day I took the test with several different sounds) wouldn't that show up as hearing loss? My test showed mild mid-level hearing loss which I don't think is even associated to my T. Just wondering how a test could be accurate with T screeching over it.

Thats so unfair. I also doubt the legitimacy of audiograms. Getting a diagnosis on your hearing situation is difficult.
 
Get an OAE and DPOAE test done alongside your audiogram,if the loss is real the OAES will confirm this and match the dips in your audiogram.

OAES are objective,you just sit there and do nothing so there's no human error involved.

I just had a high frequency audiogram done(0-16,000hz)

No loss between 0-8000hz(5db dip at 4 bilaterally)and minor loss at around 15/16000hz in my left ear same with my right but less so.Basically at 16,000hz my hearing drops off completely but according to the audiologist this is remarkable hearing for someone my age(25)and typical for a male of my age.I should be able to hear up to 16,000hz until I'm around 30 or so according to her so this is completely typical,nothing unusual.

I got my girlfriend to do the audiogram and my thresholds were just as good as hers but yet I have unbearable T and H.
 
Get an OAE and DPOAE test done alongside your audiogram,if the loss is real the OAES will confirm this and match the dips in your audiogram.

OAES are objective,you just sit there and do nothing so there's no human error involved.

I just had a high frequency audiogram done(0-16,000hz)

No loss between 0-8000hz(5db dip at 4 bilaterally)and minor loss at around 15/16000hz in my left ear same with my right but less so.Basically at 16,000hz my hearing drops off completely but according to the audiologist this is remarkable hearing for someone my age(25)and typical for a male of my age.I should be able to hear up to 16,000hz until I'm around 30 or so according to her so this is completely typical,nothing unusual.

I got my girlfriend to do the audiogram and my thresholds were just as good as hers but yet I have unbearable T and H.


Tinnitus and Hyperacusis are so strange. The medical community are still primarily looking for dips in our audiograms when it comes to tinnitus. My first ENT thought my T could go away within 3 months based on how good my hearing was. I don't think we understand it at all. The severity of our T can be mild, severe, or anywhere in between, yet in a lot of cases the audiograms and OAEs are good.

What's really going on? If it's really just hearing loss then T would be present in all cases, but as we know it's not. It's selective in who it picks to torment. This randomness is just another reason why it's so hard to understand and treat.

I'd add that my tinnitus fluctuates - as I know it does with others - which only adds to the bizarreness.
 
Yeah I think the severity of tinnitus/hyperacusis bears little to no real world relationship to audiogram performance.
 
Tinnitus and Hyperacusis are so strange. The medical community are still primarily looking for dips in our audiograms when it comes to tinnitus. My first ENT thought my T could go away within 3 months based on how good my hearing was. I don't think we understand it at all. The severity of our T can be mild, severe, or anywhere in between, yet in a lot of cases the audiograms and OAEs are good.

What's really going on? If it's really just hearing loss then T would be present in all cases, but as we know it's not. It's selective in who it picks to torment. This randomness is just another reason why it's so hard to understand and treat.
Maybe haircells have nothing to do with it at all,maybe it's the auditory nerve that's been affected and the haircells are fine and working well.

I'm certain noise induced T and H are peripheral(auditory)neuropathy symptoms,the clues are there for all to see but yet we blame the brain.I see the brain as a scape goat,when we can't work out what's wrong with us we immediately blame the brain,we blame it because it's a simple solution to a hard question and thus we provide ourselves with an answer albeit a wrong one.

Us humans are always doing stuff like this,when we can't find an answer we associate it with a higher power,in our cases the brain.Just look at everyday life,if a man walks on water he must be magic,if a child survives a car crash it must have been God.Its only when you look deeper do you realise that the man walked on water because there was a clear sheet a plastic resting just below it and the child survived simply because she wore her seatbelt.My point is there's always a logical explanation to these questions,we just have to make ourselves look a little deeper.
 
I'm not grasping is how one is supposed to be able to hear sounds of the audiogram that the tinnitus is covering.

The same way you can hear someone talk during a rock concert.

So for example, if there is a beep that matches my T (which was quite loud the day I took the test with several different sounds) wouldn't that show up as hearing loss?

Adding two tones does not make either one inaudible. You can still hear the difference, no matter how loud your own tinnitus is. This of course does not apply to signal to noise ratios and would be better seen with a speech recognition test.

The test reads you have a 40db dip in your hearing compared to a completely healthy woman of your age that has incurred no hearing damage ever throughout life. Then you have a second dip in only the right ear. Both look like they are not due to natural hearing loss. And beyond that anything could have happened.
 
Maybe haircells have nothing to do with it at all,maybe it's the auditory nerve that's been affected and the haircells are fine and working well.

I'm certain noise induced T and H are peripheral(auditory)neuropathy symptoms,the clues are there for all to see but yet we blame the brain.I see the brain as a scape goat,when we can't work out what's wrong with us we immediately blame the brain,we blame it because it's a simple solution to a hard question and thus we provide ourselves with an answer albeit a wrong one.

Us humans are always doing stuff like this,when we can't find an answer we associate it with a higher power,in our cases the brain.Just look at everyday life,if a man walks on water he must be magic,if a child survives a car crash it must have been God.Its only when you look deeper do you realise that the man walked on water because there was a clear sheet a plastic resting just below it and the child survived simply because she wore her seatbelt.My point is there's always a logical explanation to these questions,we just have to make ourselves look a little deeper.

I'd say there's certainly damage of some sort, but there must be more to it. Maybe a genetic element? Why do some acquire tinnitus whilst others don't, even though damage can be present in both cases. Is it specific damage in cases of T or is it a genetic difference, or something else that's happening that triggers T in some and not in others.

Could it be that the stars need to align for T to arise. Maybe it occurs when different conditions come together in the right way, rather than just outright damage. I find it interesting how (some) people with tinnitus show activity in different areas of the brain compared to normal people.

Then again, maybe I'm just talking bollocks.
 
Thanks @Cityjohn. I think that makes sense now. I don't feel like my T is related to hearing loss as it came on from a med reaction and I have had slight trouble hearing people speak for at least a few years now (I thought it was more from me not paying attention to them). It does however make me want to try a laser so I feel like I'm doing SOMETHING. I also have mild H but it has gone down some since the initial onset about 1.5 months ago.
 
I'd say there's certainly damage of some sort, but there must be more to it. Maybe a genetic element? Why do some acquire tinnitus whilst others don't, even though damage can be present in both cases. Is it specific damage in cases of T or is it a genetic difference, or something else that's happening that triggers T in some and not in others.

Could it be that the stars need to align for T to arise. Maybe it occurs when different conditions come together in the right way, rather than just outright damage. I find it interesting how (some) people with tinnitus show activity in different areas of the brain compared to normal people.

Then again, maybe I'm just talking bollocks.
Feel like genetics or certain neurotransmitters play a part. It seems that some (not all) T sufferers also tend to have some form anxiety or depression which makes them more susceptible. This would also explain why antidepressants sometimes help with T volume. I don't know, just a guess.
 
I'd say there's certainly damage of some sort, but there must be more to it. Maybe a genetic element? Why do some acquire tinnitus whilst others don't, even though damage can be present in both cases. Is it specific damage in cases of T or is it a genetic difference, or something else that's happening that triggers T in some and not in others.

Could it be that the stars need to align for T to arise. Maybe it occurs when different conditions come together in the right way, rather than just outright damage. I find it interesting how (some) people with tinnitus show activity in different areas of the brain compared to normal people.

Then again, maybe I'm just talking bollocks.
I don't think T people are a special breed,nearly everyone on this planet experiences it when around enough noise like going to a concert or loud gig so what makes it permanent is the question.Maybe another form of hearing damage that can occur alongside normal hearing loss?Thats what I believe,it's the most logical answer to the question.

I often wondered,do some people experience T from hearing loss where as others just don't?That some are predisposed to acquire T alongside their hearing loss?

The answer in my opinion is no,that just about anybody on this planet has the capability to develop T,take my brother for example.

He goes to loud places,rides his dirt bike everyday day and works in a loud environment but never in his life has he experienced T according to him.
A few weeks ago whilst in work a tyre popped near him and his right ear rang for twenty minutes after before going away,this was the first time in his life that he ever heard a ringing in his ears.
He said he didn't experience a TTS only a ringing in his ear closest to the pop,if it was a brain thing surely both ears would ring?A central origin would suggest so but seeing as his was one sided this would suggest a peripheral origin.

He's not the only one either,one of my best mates father is the exact same story.
He owns a construction business,worked in horrendous noise everyday of his 60 year old life but never experienced T once,not even once.
He has hearing loss,this has been confirmed but yet no T or H?
Then a few years ago he was working in his garage restoring a classic car,his friend banged a piece of galvanise sheeting with a hammer next to his right ear and it began ringing and has done so ever since that day.His hearing is still the same,he had it tested after the incident and no hearing loss occurred as a result so why the T?Also his T is in only one ear,the ear closest to the bang.

Then there's my uncle who got T from a shotgun blast,the gun was closest to his right ear and this ear is the one with the loudest T,to me it all points at a peripheral cause rather than that of a central origin.The peripheral nervous system talks and communicates within itself,to me this explains why symptoms in one ear tend to spread to the other ear in some instances myself included.

When I developed T in 2011 it began with a fullness in only my left ear,T set in shortly after and then randomly went to my right ear a few days later.Sometimes when I got a spike my right ear would spike and not my left ear or my left ear would spike and not my right ear along with a hotness in the affected ear,if the brain truly was responsible it would have to be the same bilaterally and that's not the case.

As far as the brain scans of T patients go I don't read too much into them,they see activity in auditory brain areas and as such think that's where the T is coming from,but if we scanned a normal person and then stabbed his foot I can quarantee you areas of his brain would light up like a Christmas tree as a result.

The brain only reacts to what we send it,if you cut your finger nerve fibres tell your brain it's in distress and the brain lets you know this by giving you pain,numb the finger and it's nerves and the pain goes away as the brain is no longer getting the signal.I think T and H is just that,a pain signal or damage signal in the peripheral auditory nerves but because we interpret it as sound we fail to recognise it as a pain signal,keep damaging these nerves and H arrives or vice versa.A lot of people come down with H,then along comes T and as these nerves heal the T backs off and so does their H hence why people claim they're cured of H.Then there's others who develop T,get around more noise and develop permanent H as result.It seems those who come down with H after a one time sound exposure improve greatly but those who come down with it slowly don't,this just screams recovery after an injury and slow degrading of a nerve over time.If I saw an extremely bright light I may lose my vision for awhile but it will recover to a certain degree as long as I stay away from bright lights.But if I stared at another slightly less bright light everyday of my life I would slowly lose my vision over time and by the time it becomes a problem then it's already too late,the damage has been done but if I don't want to worsen it further I need to only look at lights that aren't bright and that I can handle.Get what I'm saying?

That's my theory on how this crap works,enough evidence to suggest so.
 
The same way you can hear someone talk during a rock concert.

I understand your point, but to be completely fair, you often don't hear your buddy talk at a rock concert. You either have your friend get closer and cup his/her hands around his/her mouth to isolate the "mouth to ear" transmission channel, or you just sign your friend that "we should get out and can talk there" or "we'll talk later".
 

Log in or register to get the full forum benefits!

Register

Register on Tinnitus Talk for free!

Register Now