Clonazepam (Klonopin, Rivotril)

[Helheim]

well, a month later, back on daily KPin for the first time in many years and so far I feel amazing :-P

How are you doing with the long-term benzo stuff? Any plans? My sulpiride/hydro/benzo combo seems to stop working if I drop the clonazepam to 0.5 and I'm kind of thinking about just sticking with 1 mg/night as I seemed to be stable on that. I was very intent on tapering and eventually dropping the benzo but after experiencing the massive decrease in volume/shrillness on this cocktail, I'm suddenly not as opposed to staying on them long-term, consequences be damned. Or at least until I can try Neuromod. Most of the internet is like BENZOS BAD though and I'm scared shitless, but at this point it's about quality of life...

 

[OnceUponaTime]

@linearb I am glad you are doing well.

Why did you stop taking it in the first place??
How much are you taking now?

My sulpiride/hydro/benzo combo seems to stop working if I drop the clonazepam to 0.5 and I'm kind of thinking about just sticking with 1 mg/night as I seemed to be stable on that. I was very intent on tapering and eventually dropping the benzo but after experiencing the massive decrease in volume/shrillness on this cocktail, I'm suddenly not as opposed to staying on them long-term, consequences be damned. Or at least until I can try Neuromod. Most of the internet is like BENZOS BAD though and I'm scared shitless, but at this point it's about quality of life...

I understand. I think about this often and if it is worth it or not to go down this road.

Best to you both.
Once

 

[gorzakus]

How are you doing with the long-term benzo stuff? Any plans? My sulpiride/hydro/benzo combo seems to stop working if I drop the clonazepam to 0.5 and I'm kind of thinking about just sticking with 1 mg/night as I seemed to be stable on that. I was very intent on tapering and eventually dropping the benzo but after experiencing the massive decrease in volume/shrillness on this cocktail, I'm suddenly not as opposed to staying on them long-term, consequences be damned. Or at least until I can try Neuromod. Most of the internet is like BENZOS BAD though and I'm scared shitless, but at this point it's about quality of life...

Don't forget it's only the negative stories getting all the attention, if you look for example to the reviews on drugs.com,you see almost only positive experiences and this is from people who have been taking the same dose for 10 years and more and live a happy anxiety- free life.
I read somewhere that it's around 15 percent that has trouble with hitting tolerance or withdrawal issues.
If you decide to quit I advise you to use the Ashton manual and do a slow taper.
Most of the problems start when patients are being forced to get off their benzo because their doctor is afraid of losing his license. Then there are also the studies that benzo use would lead to dementia but for every study there is another one saying it doesn't lead to Alzheimer or dementia.
https://www.drugs.com/comments/clonazepam/klonopin.html?sort_reviews=time_on_medication

https://psychcentral.com/news/2016/...risk-still-not-advised-for-elderly/98811.html

https://www.drugs.com/answers/many-years-you-klonopin-oldest-person-you-taking-755571.html

 

[linearb]

How are you doing with the long-term benzo stuff? Any plans?

Plans are to keep doing it until it stops working or until Neuromod or some other thing makes it less necessary. I say "less" because my situation is complex and tinnitus is one of a myriad of things that make benzos desirable. As for how I'm doing with the long term, let me get back to you in 5 years

Why did you stop taking it in the first place??
How much are you taking now?

1mg/day and 100mg gabapentin. I just got my KPin script increased to 2mg, which was my stable dose for years, but we'll see if I actually need to go up to that. Obviously, lower doses seem less hazardous.

I stopped taking it because I was 25, I'd been on it since I was 19, I was done with college, I had made peace with my visual snow and some of my other issues, and I wanted to try life without it. Getting off sucked, then I was fine for a few years until I developed some TMJ-related health problems, and then a few years later blasted my ears to pieces and have had the shittier tinnitus ever since. So, it's important to note that I did not discontinue as a result of "the drug stopped working, became paradoxical, or started to cause bizarre side effects", which is a lot of what you read online.

Don't forget it's only the negative stories getting all the attention, ...
I read somewhere that it's around 15 percent that has trouble with hitting tolerance or withdrawal issues.
If you decide to quit I advise you to use the Ashton manual and do a slow taper.

I've tapered benzos twice, administered a Yahoo benzo withdrawal group years ago, and still hold a senior staff position at one of the higher profile benzo forums on the internet. For better or worse, I know exactly what hornet's nest I am stepping in....

Then there are also the studies that benzo use would lead to dementia

I don't dismiss this; on the other hand, severe, long term stress and anxiety is also demonstrably neurotoxic and contributes to cognitive decline, so... I'll just have to hope the power of my AMAZING ( :-P ) meditation practice can keep the benzo alzheimer's at bay.

 

[Helheim]

Don't forget it's only the negative stories getting all the attention, if you look for example to the reviews on drugs.com,you see almost only positive experiences and this is from people who have been taking the same dose for 10 years and more and live a happy anxiety- free life.
I read somewhere that it's around 15 percent that has trouble with hitting tolerance or withdrawal issues.
If you decide to quit I advise you to use the Ashton manual and do a slow taper.
Most of the problems start when patients are being forced to get off their benzo because their doctor is afraid of losing his license. Then there are also the studies that benzo use would lead to dementia but for every study there is another one saying it doesn't lead to Alzheimer or dementia.
https://www.drugs.com/comments/clonazepam/klonopin.html?sort_reviews=time_on_medication

https://psychcentral.com/news/2016/...risk-still-not-advised-for-elderly/98811.html

https://www.drugs.com/answers/many-years-you-klonopin-oldest-person-you-taking-755571.html

You're right, people who have no issues usually don't post on forums about it. Funny thing is, for me it's not even about anxiety, it's about literal volume reduction. I have no other mental issues when I'm not aware of my T and my cocktail can lower the volume to where it can easily get lost in background noise, even if it still pops up when I look for it. Gotta figure out what risks I'm willing to take with meds, I suppose...

 

[Helheim]

I don't dismiss this; on the other hand, severe, long term stress and anxiety is also demonstrably neurotoxic and contributes to cognitive decline, so... I'll just have to hope the power of my AMAZING ( :-P ) meditation practice can keep the benzo alzheimer's at bay.

Gotcha. Thanks for the detailed reply. Fwiw my plans are somewhat similar - keep taking whatever meds help until Neuromod is out or something better comes along. I also have some TMJ issues, just got an NTI-tss dental guard like two weeks ago to see if it helps as I grind my teeth - I'm hoping to make a dent in the T in any way I can. Let's hope this works out well for both of us. Will ask a neurologist about gabapentin on Friday to see if it's a possible option, maybe to replace the klonopin in the cocktail... although I'm not sure how much better it'd be, lol.

 

[linearb]

there's some limited evidence that klonopin + gabapentin together is an effective suppression tool for tinnitus, which is why I picked the combo. If you poke around pubmed you can probably find it.

 

[gorzakus]

Plans are to keep doing it until it stops working or until Neuromod or some other thing makes it less necessary. I say "less" because my situation is complex and tinnitus is one of a myriad of things that make benzos desirable. As for how I'm doing with the long term, let me get back to you in 5 years


1mg/day and 100mg gabapentin. I just got my KPin script increased to 2mg, which was my stable dose for years, but we'll see if I actually need to go up to that. Obviously, lower doses seem less hazardous.

I stopped taking it because I was 25, I'd been on it since I was 19, I was done with college, I had made peace with my visual snow and some of my other issues, and I wanted to try life without it. Getting off sucked, then I was fine for a few years until I developed some TMJ-related health problems, and then a few years later blasted my ears to pieces and have had the shittier tinnitus ever since. So, it's important to note that I did not discontinue as a result of "the drug stopped working, became paradoxical, or started to cause bizarre side effects", which is a lot of what you read online.


I've tapered benzos twice, administered a Yahoo benzo withdrawal group years ago, and still hold a senior staff position at one of the higher profile benzo forums on the internet. For better or worse, I know exactly what hornet's nest I am stepping in....



I don't dismiss this; on the other hand, severe, long term stress and anxiety is also demonstrably neurotoxic and contributes to cognitive decline, so... I'll just have to hope the power of my AMAZING ( :-P ) meditation practice can keep the benzo alzheimer's at bay.

Well I will be the last one to judge anyone who is trying to ease his suffering , can you please explain me the effect of gabapentin, does it work on anxiety and does it work immediately?

 

[Arseny]

there's some limited evidence that klonopin + gabapentin together is an effective suppression tool for tinnitus, which is why I picked the combo. If you poke around pubmed you can probably find it.

Is it working out for you? I have a prescription for both but I'm afraid to take it.
I heard it can cause tinnitus and it seems I just lost a bit of hearing on high frequencies after a cold with antibiotics.

 

[Helheim]

there's some limited evidence that klonopin + gabapentin together is an effective suppression tool for tinnitus, which is why I picked the combo. If you poke around pubmed you can probably find it.

I'll check it out, thanks.

 

[linearb]

Well I will be the last one to judge anyone who is trying to ease his suffering , can you please explain me the effect of gabapentin, does it work on anxiety and does it work immediately?

Mechanism of action was still "unknown" as of a couple years ago; it is a structural GABA analog which does not bind to the GABA receptor. So, it's... touching other systems that GABA also touches, or something. Experientitally I think it does something to serotonin, because consuming any quantity of it and then consuming cannabis results in dialated pupils and an almost MDMA-like sense of openness and empathy; I believe that effect is actually pretty well documented, too (specifically the cannabis interaction). Cannabis itself is a serotonin releaser but certainly doesn't cause pupil dilation or empathy under normal circumstances. (Note, that, again, since pot is legal here, it is appropriate and easy for me to discuss all this with my doctor....)

Study showing tinnitus improvement in noise-damage group with gabapentin only: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/16652071

Study showing sustained, significant effects on tinnitus using Gabapentin and Klonopin: http://www.tinnitusjournal.com/articles/gabapentin-and-tinnitus-relief.pdf

Study showing relief using "benzodiazepine and gabanoids", unclear if that means gabapentin or something else, and too lazy to pull full text: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/14763233

Note that these drugs have been tried by many people on here, usually with little to no effect. My situation is quite possibly different because of a number of childhood developmental issues, combined with early benzo use...

 

[linearb]

Is it working out for you? I have a prescription for both but I'm afraid to take it.

I feel "great" but I'd be the last person to suggest these drugs to anyone. Like I said, I'm a staff member at a benzo withdrawal board, and I've spent a total of 2.5 years of my life withdrawing from benzos (over 2 different withdrawals, 10 years apart).

It's certainly possible I'm in a honeymoon period with the drug and the wheels will fly off a month or a year down the line. There's just no way of knowing with these things. Benzos are clearly very dangerous, at least as dangerous as alcohol, and benzo withdrawal clearly causes tinnitus to appear in a lot of people who never had it before.

I can't make the decision for you; I agonized over it for years and ultimately the thing that pushed me over the edge was wanting to be a better dad right now, eventual consequences to myself be damned, I don't really matter very much compared to kiddo.

 

[gorzakus]

Mechanism of action was still "unknown" as of a couple years ago; it is a structural GABA analog which does not bind to the GABA receptor. So, it's... touching other systems that GABA also touches, or something. Experientitally I think it does something to serotonin, because consuming any quantity of it and then consuming cannabis results in dialated pupils and an almost MDMA-like sense of openness and empathy; I believe that effect is actually pretty well documented, too (specifically the cannabis interaction). Cannabis itself is a serotonin releaser but certainly doesn't cause pupil dilation or empathy under normal circumstances. (Note, that, again, since pot is legal here, it is appropriate and easy for me to discuss all this with my doctor....)

Study showing tinnitus improvement in noise-damage group with gabapentin only: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/16652071

Study showing sustained, significant effects on tinnitus using Gabapentin and Klonopin: http://www.tinnitusjournal.com/articles/gabapentin-and-tinnitus-relief.pdf

Study showing relief using "benzodiazepine and gabanoids", unclear if that means gabapentin or something else, and too lazy to pull full text: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/14763233

Note that these drugs have been tried by many people on here, usually with little to no effect. My situation is quite possibly different because of a number of childhood developmental issues, combined with early benzo use...

Thanks for the detailed info, I was actually curious about the anxiolytic effect of Gabapentin. It seems more and more people replace the benzo for gabapentin.
Did you ever do a rapid taper using flumazenil?

 

[linearb]

Did you ever do a rapid taper using flumazenil?

No; sketchy science and VERY expensive. When I'd been off benzos for a while I did experiment with intranasal flumazenil, making my own solution from some chinese flumazenil power that a buddy both obtained from china ad then GC/MS'd so we knew what it was.

It's a weird drug and felt lightly anxiolytic which is not what I expected, but it didn't do anything for any of my symptoms. I think I still have a couple hundred MG of it in the drug vault.

 

[OnceUponaTime]

I stopped taking it because I was 25, I'd been on it since I was 19, I was done with college, I had made peace with my visual snow and some of my other issues, and I wanted to try life without it. Getting off sucked, then I was fine for a few years until I developed some TMJ-related health problems, and then a few years later blasted my ears to pieces and have had the shittier tinnitus ever since. So, it's important to note that I did not discontinue as a result of "the drug stopped working, became paradoxical, or started to cause bizarre side effects", which is a lot of what you read online.

Thank you for being so open and explaining your reason to me. I appreciate it.
I am under the care of Dr. Abraham Shulman, in Brooklyn, NY and have an upcoming visit next week. He was the Dr. who did the trial with Clonazepam and Gabapentin with great results. I have not been prescribed anything yet as I needed to have some tests done before he can diagnose and discuss a treatment for me.

I am really happy this combo is helping you much. There's another member here on TT that said he has been using this combo for 6 years with success.

If he prescribes this combo to me I will consider it.

Best to you,
Once

 

[Karl28]

Clonazepam is bad.

This thread gave me the idea to try it back in 2017.

I took it every day for a month which was too long and tapered off over another two months which was too long and had bad withdrawals.

Didn't help my tinnitus.

 

[OnceUponaTime]

Clonazepam is bad.

This thread gave me the idea to try it back in 2017.

I took it every day for a month which was too long and tapered off over another two months which was too long and had bad withdrawals.

Didn't help my tinnitus.

I am sorry clonazepam did not work for you. It is actually (as per the study) supposed to be taken together with gabapentin and it is not for every case of tinnitus. Also everyone reacts to medicines differently.

Hope you find something that can help you.
Once

 

[Carlos1]

Thank you for being so open and explaining your reason to me. I appreciate it.
I am under the care of Dr. Abraham Shulman, in Brooklyn, NY and have an upcoming visit next week. He was the Dr. who did the trial with Clonazepam and Gabapentin with great results. I have not been prescribed anything yet as I needed to have some tests done before he can diagnose and discuss a treatment for me.

I am really happy this combo is helping you much. There's another member here on TT that said he has been using this combo for 6 years with success.

If he prescribes this combo to me I will consider it.

Best to you,
Once

@OnceUponaTime I have been on this combination for 6 years and I can say with certainty that it has helped me live with T. I have over the years weened off of Kpin and then gotten back on again just so that my body doesn't get use to the dose im taking. I am on .5 mg of Kpin and 300 mg GP twice a day.
I don't talk about Kpin anymore because people here on this forum tend to frown upon Benzos and tell you its all gloom and doom so I stopped posting about it.
Kpin and GP is not a fix all for all but it sure does help some and I am proof of it.
Good luck with your Doc App
Stay Strong

Carlos

 

[Helheim]

@OnceUponaTime I have been on this combination for 6 years and I can say with certainty that it has helped me live with T. I have over the years weened off of Kpin and then gotten back on again just so that my body doesn't get use to the dose im taking. I am on .5 mg of Kpin and 300 mg GP twice a day.
I don't talk about Kpin anymore because people here on this forum tend to frown upon Benzos and tell you its all gloom and doom so I stopped posting about it.
Kpin and GP is not a fix all for all but it sure does help some and I am proof of it.
Good luck with your Doc App
Stay Strong

Carlos

Hi, did you manage to maintain the dose for 6 years? Or have you had to increase?

 

[Carlos1]

@Helheim
Hi, Helheim
I have maintained the same Klonopin dose .5 mg. Only thing I changed was the Gabapentin. I started at 300 mg x3 and now I just take the Gabapentin once in the morning and then at night with the .5 mg Klonopin.

 

[Helheim]

@Helheim
Hi, Helheim
I have maintained the same Klonopin dose .5 mg. Only thing I changed was the Gabapentin. I started at 300 mg x3 and now I just take the Gabapentin once in the morning and then at night with the .5 mg Klonopin.

Sounds good. Thanks!

 

[OnceUponaTime]

I have been on this combination for 6 years and I can say with certainty that it has helped me live with T. I have over the years weened off of Kpin and then gotten back on again just so that my body doesn't get use to the dose im taking. I am on .5 mg of Kpin and 300 mg GP twice a day.

Oh thanx for sharing your experience! I am super glad this combo is working for you. I've read some of your posts but didn't know you were using it this long. There is another member here who has also taken it for 6 years with great results.

I don't talk about Klonopin anymore because people here on this forum tend to frown upon Benzos and tell you its all gloom and doom so I stopped posting about it.

Seems that way.

Does this combo lowers your tinnitus or does it just help you with anxiety?
When you ween off of it, does the tinnitus come back loud?

Thank you for your well wishes.
Once

 

[Carlos1]

@OnceUponaTime
Hi Once
For me the combination reduces my tinnitus or at least that's the perception I have.
I like many here when I first got tinnitus I felt shattered and didn't think I could go on.
It took about a year and countless doctors to finally have someone suggest I try this combo.
Soon after I had been on the Meds I started feeling less anxious and felt the tinnitus level had reduced.

Tinnitus still sucks but it's much more tolerable. I have accepted life with tinnitus but I have moved forward and I'm living life again.

Stay Strong

 

[OnceUponaTime]

@Carlos1
Who prescribed the Gabapentin and the Klonopin, your primary doctor or a psychiatrist?
How often you taper off and how do you do it?
Do you take one Klonopin and one Gabapentin together at bedtime???

Once

 

[JohnAdams]

I felt shattered

Completely.

 

[Contrast]

How are you doing with the long-term benzo stuff? Any plans? My sulpiride/hydro/benzo combo seems to stop working if I drop the clonazepam to 0.5 and I'm kind of thinking about just sticking with 1 mg/night as I seemed to be stable on that. I was very intent on tapering and eventually dropping the benzo but after experiencing the massive decrease in volume/shrillness on this cocktail, I'm suddenly not as opposed to staying on them long-term, consequences be damned. Or at least until I can try Neuromod. Most of the internet is like BENZOS BAD though and I'm scared shitless, but at this point it's about quality of life...

The reason people critcize benzos is because they are habit forming drugs that make the patient docile and compliant.

NPC pills.

 

[Carlos1]

@Carlos1
Who prescribed the Gabapentin and the Klonopin, your primary doctor or a psychiatrist?
How often you taper off and how do you do it?
Do you take one Klonopin and one Gabapentin together at bedtime???

Once

@OnceUponaTime

My primary doctor actually suggested it.
I actually switched to a new doctor because originally when I went to my long time doctor and told him I had tinnitus he was unsympathetic. So i kept switching doctors until I found one that took Tinnitus seriously.
He read about a study on Gaba and Kpin and asked if I wanted to try it ....So I did and it changed everything going forward.

Currently I take 300 mg of Gaba in the morning and then 300 mg along with .5 mg of Kpin at night.
Originally I was taking the Gaba 300 mg three times a day then couple years ago I cut it back to twice a day.

Stay Strong

 

[OnceUponaTime]

@Carlos1 Thank you so much for getting back to me.
I just started taking 1/2 of .5 mg of Klonopin yesterday and today. I was prescribed Gabapentin also, just 100 mg once a day. I have to take them together right? I'll try this for a week or so and hope I feel better soon. I have 3 doctors communicating with each other and working for me. All great doctors and willing to help.

Until Neuromod gets here.
Here's to better days ahead!

Once

 

[Codaz]

@OnceUponaTime

My primary doctor actually suggested it.
I actually switched to a new doctor because originally when I went to my long time doctor and told him I had tinnitus he was unsympathetic. So i kept switching doctors until I found one that took Tinnitus seriously.
He read about a study on Gaba and Kpin and asked if I wanted to try it ....So I did and it changed everything going forward.

Currently I take 300 mg of Gaba in the morning and then 300 mg along with .5 mg of Kpin at night.
Originally I was taking the Gaba 300 mg three times a day then couple years ago I cut it back to twice a day.

Stay Strong

So what does GABA do? Did you try nortriptyline? Is it the combination that does the thing or just one of the two?

 

[OnceUponaTime]

Is it the combination that does the thing or just one of the two?

It is the combination of Klonopin and Gabapentin taken together.

Once