First Post — Jazz Drummer with Tinnitus and Hyperacusis

[Jazz drummer]

Hi everyone,

I've been looking at this forum a lot the past two months and this is my first post. I'm 46 years old and have been a professional jazz drummer for 25 years. I have never had any ear problems from playing drums. In August, I attended a birthday party at a karaoke club, which is not the kind of place I usually go to. It was very loud and I was foolishly near a speaker. I was there for maybe a half hour and realized it was getting painfully loud. I left, and I had a loud ringing and painful sensitivity to sound in my right ear. It was very scary, as I'm sure you can all relate to. It slowly got better over two weeks and then I was completely fine; no ringing, no painful sensitivity. I felt completely back to normal and thought I had dodged a bullet.

Unfortunately, this only lasted about five days. Then I was in a car going to a gig and the musician sitting next to me was telling a story and talking really loud. He shouted twice to punctuate a joke in his story and it felt like a knife in my ear. The tinnitus and hyperacusis immediately came back and I've had them now for over two months. I haven't played in six weeks because of it, the longest time I've gone without playing in decades (aside from the beginning of the pandemic). I had a hearing test and my hearing is actually really good. I am hopefully going to start sound therapy/retraining soon at the Center for Hearing and Communication here in New York.

Needless to say, this has been very scary and depressing and I'm extremely worried about my future, particularly as a musician. I'm planning to try to playing a gig this Sunday, to see how it goes. It's a quieter brunch gig and I'll wear the custom musician ear plugs I recently had made, even though I hate wearing ear plugs to play.

Anyway, I just wanted to introduce myself and saw that I've already gotten lots of good information on this forum, particularly from Michael Leigh and Jazzer (I'm also a huge Eddie Condon fan!). If anyone has anything to impart to me that they think might be helpful at this time, I would l0ve t0 hear it. I was just getting my career going again after the pandemic and this has been a terrible situation; one that I'm sure is only too familiar to everyone here.

Thanks in advance for any information or advice and my best to all of you.

 

[Juan]

I'm planning to try to playing a gig this Sunday, to see how it goes. It's a quieter brunch gig and I'll wear the custom musician ear plugs I recently had made, even though I hate wearing ear plugs to play.

Hi Jazz Drummer, if I were you I would err on the side of caution. My advice would be not to play now. Try to rest your ears for a longer time.

All that you have said on your introduction, the karaoke club, speakers too close, feeling hearing symptoms immediately after... symptoms briefly go away and come back when your colleague speaks loud etc etc etc...

...this is the typical onset of hyperacusis. Classical pattern, symptoms etc...

Sound damage is cumulative. New loud noise exposures build up on previous damage, and symptoms sometimes are very obvious and sometimes are less intrusive, but damaged ears are more sensitive and prone to damage.

Good luck!

 

[Jazz drummer]

Hi Jazz Drummer, if I were you I would err on the side of caution. My advice would be not to play now. Try to rest your ears for a longer time.

All that you have said on your introduction, the karaoke club, speakers too close, feeling hearing symptoms immediately after... symptoms briefly go away and come back when your colleague speaks loud etc etc etc...

...this is the typical onset of hyperacusis. Classical pattern, symptoms etc...

Sound damage is cumulative. New loud noise exposures build up on previous damage, and symptoms sometimes are very obvious and sometimes are less intrusive, but damaged ears are more sensitive and prone to damage.

Good luck!

Thank you, Juan! This is the kind of guidance I was hoping for and I really appreciate it. I realize that every case is different, but is there a certain length of time you would recommended laying off? Should I wait until I feel completely better (if that happens?). It's been very difficult to find knowledgeable people about this topic and I want to make sure I do the right thing. I don't mind taking as much time off as is needed, but I don't know what I'd do (both psychologically and financially) if I can't play drums again at some point.

 

[Michael Leigh]

I've been looking at this forum a lot the past two months and this is my first post. I'm 46 years old and have been a professional jazz drummer for 25 years.

Hi @Jazz drummer.

Thank you for your kind comments. I am sorry to hear of the difficulties that you are going through. Since you have read some of my posts. Please go to my started threads and read and print the following posts mentioned below and refer to them often. Take your time and read them and this will help you to understand what you are going through and give you more insight into noise induced tinnitus.

I do not want to be a killjoy but if you are not careful your symptoms will get a lot worse. Sorry to be so sobering but noise induced tinnitus is not something to take lightly or play around with. Since you have read @Jazzer's posts, my advice is to read them again. Unfortunately you may have to stop playing drums for quite some time and restrict yourself to being exposed to other forms of loud sounds. Try not to use any type of headphones even at low volume.

New to Tinnitus, What to Do? Hyperacusis, As I See It, The Habituation Process, How to Habituate to Tinnitus, Tinnitus and the Negative Mindset, Acquiring a Positive Mindset, Will My Tinnitus Get Worse? Tinnitus, A Personal View.

All the best,
Michael

 

[Jazz drummer]

Hi @Jazz drummer.

Thank you for your kind comments. I am sorry to hear of the difficulties that you are going through. Since you have read some of my posts. Please go to my started threads and read and print the following posts mentioned below and refer to them often. Take your time and read them and this will help you to understand what you are going through and give you more insight into noise induced tinnitus.

I do not want to be a killjoy but if you are not careful your symptoms will get a lot worse. Sorry to be so sobering but noise induced tinnitus is not something to take lightly or play around with. Since you have read @Jazzer's posts, my advice is to read them again. Unfortunately you may have to stop playing drums for quite some time and restrict yourself to being exposed to other forms of loud sounds. Try not to use any type of headphones even at low volume.

New to Tinnitus, What to Do? Hyperacusis, As I See It, The Habituation Process, How to Habituate to Tinnitus, Tinnitus and the Negative Mindset, Acquiring a Positive Mindset, Will My Tinnitus Get Worse? Tinnitus, A Personal View.

All the best,
Michael

Hi @ Michael Leigh,

Thank you very much for your response. I have read many of your posts and they were not only very informative, but were also a big part of what inspired me to post here. You are someone who obviously understands the ins and outs of this kind of situation and I thank you for sharing your knowledge and opinions. Would you recommend that I lay off playing drums until I have (hopefully) fully recovered from hyperacusis? Obvioulsy I want to play and I need to make money, but nothing is more important to me than getting over this, if I can.

On Tuesday I have a consultation session with someone from the Center for Hearing and Communication here in NY and I will report what she says. They seem to have a very good reputation and do TRT. So far, the hyperacusis has been the biggest problem for me and they also provide the sound generators or WNGs I've read about on this forum. I know that some musicians have recovered from hyperacusis and been able to play again. Looks like I'm in this for the long haul.

Again, thank you for your response. I'm so glad I found this forum and it is obvious there are many knowledgeable, caring and generous people on here who will take the time to help an anonymous person they've never even met. It means a lot to me and one positive aspect to this nightmare is that maybe one day I will be able to help someone in a similar way.

 

[Michael Leigh]

Thank you very much for your response. I have read many of your posts and they were not only very informative, but were also a big part of what inspired me to post here. You are someone who obviously understands the ins and outs of this kind of situation and I thank you for sharing your knowledge and opinions. Would you recommend that I lay off playing drums until I have (hopefully) fully recovered from hyperacusis? Obvioulsy I want to play and I need to make money, but nothing is more important to me than getting over this, if I can.

Hi @Jazz drummer.

The reason I post at this forum is to try and help people. Thank you once again for your kind comments. Please give your ears a rest from the drumming and any exposure to loud noise. This does not mean to be wearing earplugs all the time and restrict yourself from hearing normal everyday sounds, as this can cause other problems.

It is good that you are attending the hearing centre but my advice is not to start TRT too quickly. Give it yourself about 6 months as you may find that you don't need it. Please read my articles on TRT in the links below. If you are feeling overly stressed talk to your doctor who may advise medication to help you relax. However, if you are feeling depressed or overly anxious, then counselling with an audiologist that specialises in tinnitus and hyperacusis management might be helpful.

Please read and print the posts mentioned, as I believe it's one of the best ways to help yourself. Tinnitus and hyperacusis are not just symptoms of noise associated with the auditory system, but they can affect a person's mental and emotional wellbeing profoundly. The healing process takes time, by informing yourself you will make progress and this will help you to feel more positive about life, tinnitus and the future.

Take care,
Michael

What Is TRT and When Should It Be Started? | Tinnitus Talk Support Forum
What Happens in TRT Sessions? | Tinnitus Talk Support Forum

 

[Juan]

I don't mind taking as much time off as is needed, but I don't know what I'd do (both psychologically and financially) if I can't play drums again at some point.

Hyperacusis is very individual and only you can know how severe it is.

Specifically these are the two bits of your experience that sound really bad, which are a bit worrying:

I felt completely back to normal and thought I had dodged a bullet.

He shouted twice to punctuate a joke in his story and it felt like a knife in my ear.

That's exactly the feeling of hyperacusis, like a "knife in the ear".

In my case, after my first noise trauma I tried to continue living more or less normally for a good 2 years, but specifically avoiding the obvious loud places and amplified music in general.

However, while I continued trying to live as normally as possible (without using hearing protection at all), my ears felt always uncomfortable around traffic, just walking on the street with buses and motorbikes passing by, brakes screeching etc

My ears would also feel bad in ordinary situations like going to the supermarket (loud announces over the PA system).

Anxiety spiked and kept there for those 2 years, did not go down. Loud unexpected sounds would startle me. I drove without earplugs and was really anxious about other cars honking, loud motorbikes passing by etc

There's no need to go that way and I do not recommend it to anyone. Protect your ears. Get your anxiety down. Get confidence gradually to come back to your life as much as you can, but do not go too fast, bit by bit.

Listen to music at home, have sound around, but protect your ears outside home to avoid another episode with loud noise that can set you back permanently. Avoid loud places for at least 6 months, just to be cautious, see how your ears adapt; ears are slow; progress, if any, is slow.

In my case, hyperacusis has not gone away, and over the years morphed into less hyperacusis (due to some hearing loss as a result of hyperacusis plus unexpected encounters with noise) and more tinnitus.

 

[Jazz drummer]

Listen to music at home, have sound around, but protect your ears outside home to avoid another episode with loud noise that can set you back permanently. Avoid loud places for at least 6 months, just to be cautious, see how your ears adapt; ears are slow; progress, if any, is slow.

Thank you for the information. So would you recommend wearing ear öplugs when I go outside? I'm trying to learn as much as I can, but it's hard to figure out what situations I should wear ear plugs in and when I should avoid them.

 

[Jazz drummer]

It is good that you are attending the hearing centre but my advice is not to start TRT too quickly. Give it yourself about 6 months as you may find that you don't need it. Please read my articles on TRT in the links below. If you are feeling overly stressed talk to your doctor who may advise medication to help you relax. However, if you are feeling depressed or overly anxious, then counselling with an audiologist that specialises in tinnitus and hyperacusis management might be helpful.

That all makes sense, thank you. Hopefully I can at least start some kind of counseling for the anxiety and depression.

 

[Brandon Wong]

Hi @Jazz drummer,

I'm a professional bassplayer and engineer for over 25 years as well and I'm 12 weeks since onset. It was from an audio feedback loop I had in my studio for 3-4 seconds. I totally understand how you are feeling and I went into depression for a while, at least for the first 8-10 weeks. The sounds that I am hearing is still changing and getting mildly louder. Some would say that I perceive it as louder but it might not be. Whatever the case is, I'm gonna give my 2 cents about this... because everyone will give you a different timeline and a different opinion based on their own experiences. You have to find what works for you.

What helped me move on was HOPE: I am still hoping that one day the ringing may stop as my ear slowly heals while taking care that I don't expose myself to loud noises or near any instruments that might exhibit decibels above 85 dB. It will be good you inform your band mates that you are having this condition and be very aware of how they play or soundcheck when they are around you. Have many and various earplugs with you... I carry foam earplugs that blocks out a lot, including high frequencies, and also musicians earplugs from a few different brands that cuts freq a little more evenly so you can hear others. (however I feel that they dun always cuts the high freq enough and not sure if it is entirely safe.) Etymotic, LiveMusic HearSafe, Eargasm. I also bought a Calmer earplug to cut out high frequencies only. I use it occasional as it cuts out the extended highs. Some will say this prevents you from getting sensitised for hyperacusis, but I only use it when I know that there is gonna be extended frequencies involved. I don't use it on the road.

What got me out from my anxiety is this... ACCEPTANCE: Accepting that tinnitus is going to be a part of my life and I have to live my life... Waiting for it to get better or spending too much time actively to find ways to cure it made me monitor my tinnitus constantly. Not accepting it made it worse and honestly I think my brain even actively turned it louder.

Admit that HABITUATION is the best thing you can do for yourself now.

What you are doing to find out about TRT is the right move. It will probably not cure your tinnitus but it will help you manage it. I used sound therapy a lot in the beginning and still do now. Finding the right sounds for your tinnitus is essential but do not mask it completely. I did had my tinnitus react to some masking sounds so I am careful not to use too much of it or too loud, i.e. high pitch, cricket or white noise in the higher frequencies. I also did a lot of meditation in the beginning. Now I am back to doing music recording but not playing yet. I think I will get back to that soon.

Give yourself TIME and PATIENCE while taking care of your ears. I am now more annoyed with my tinnitus than having anxiety about it. It's about ACCEPTANCE while having HOPE that it will get better, or HABITUATION that will happen even if it doesn't go away.

Lastly, and since you have been reading a lot of posts in here like I did to see if I can cure tinnitus... Stay away from negative posts. Read positive ones if you may or look for live support groups in your area. This is essential to minimise your anxiety. I remember getting better one day and then reading a negative post in here... then I got better, then bad... it was a vicious cycle.

I hope you get well soon. Remember there are people with tinnitus who can still do what they did before, with protection of course. Stay well and safe.

 

[Jack Straw]

Hi everyone,

I've been looking at this forum a lot the past two months and this is my first post. I'm 46 years old and have been a professional jazz drummer for 25 years. I have never had any ear problems from playing drums. In August, I attended a birthday party at a karaoke club, which is not the kind of place I usually go to. It was very loud and I was foolishly near a speaker. I was there for maybe a half hour and realized it was getting painfully loud. I left, and I had a loud ringing and painful sensitivity to sound in my right ear. It was very scary, as I'm sure you can all relate to. It slowly got better over two weeks and then I was completely fine; no ringing, no painful sensitivity. I felt completely back to normal and thought I had dodged a bullet.

Unfortunately, this only lasted about five days. Then I was in a car going to a gig and the musician sitting next to me was telling a story and talking really loud. He shouted twice to punctuate a joke in his story and it felt like a knife in my ear. The tinnitus and hyperacusis immediately came back and I've had them now for over two months. I haven't played in six weeks because of it, the longest time I've gone without playing in decades (aside from the beginning of the pandemic). I had a hearing test and my hearing is actually really good. I am hopefully going to start sound therapy/retraining soon at the Center for Hearing and Communication here in New York.

Needless to say, this has been very scary and depressing and I'm extremely worried about my future, particularly as a musician. I'm planning to try to playing a gig this Sunday, to see how it goes. It's a quieter brunch gig and I'll wear the custom musician ear plugs I recently had made, even though I hate wearing ear plugs to play.

Anyway, I just wanted to introduce myself and saw that I've already gotten lots of good information on this forum, particularly from Michael Leigh and Jazzer (I'm also a huge Eddie Condon fan!). If anyone has anything to impart to me that they think might be helpful at this time, I would l0ve t0 hear it. I was just getting my career going again after the pandemic and this has been a terrible situation; one that I'm sure is only too familiar to everyone here.

Thanks in advance for any information or advice and my best to all of you.

Unfortunately, I think you are going to have to make wearing earplugs a permanent thing if you continue to play drums. Unlike other instruments, drums have loud impact sounds which makes them louder than others. Wearing earplugs is not a big deal and you will get used to it.

I would advise caution with therapies for tinnitus and hyperacusis. They have a lot of big talk with little results, but they will gladly take your money.

Like others have said the best thing to do is rest and recover. I know this is hard because this is your job, but it may be the only way. Definitely keep protecting your ears.

 

[Jazzer]

Hi everyone,

I've been looking at this forum a lot the past two months and this is my first post. I'm 46 years old and have been a professional jazz drummer for 25 years. I have never had any ear problems from playing drums. In August, I attended a birthday party at a karaoke club, which is not the kind of place I usually go to. It was very loud and I was foolishly near a speaker. I was there for maybe a half hour and realized it was getting painfully loud. I left, and I had a loud ringing and painful sensitivity to sound in my right ear. It was very scary, as I'm sure you can all relate to. It slowly got better over two weeks and then I was completely fine; no ringing, no painful sensitivity. I felt completely back to normal and thought I had dodged a bullet.

Unfortunately, this only lasted about five days. Then I was in a car going to a gig and the musician sitting next to me was telling a story and talking really loud. He shouted twice to punctuate a joke in his story and it felt like a knife in my ear. The tinnitus and hyperacusis immediately came back and I've had them now for over two months. I haven't played in six weeks because of it, the longest time I've gone without playing in decades (aside from the beginning of the pandemic). I had a hearing test and my hearing is actually really good. I am hopefully going to start sound therapy/retraining soon at the Center for Hearing and Communication here in New York.

Needless to say, this has been very scary and depressing and I'm extremely worried about my future, particularly as a musician. I'm planning to try to playing a gig this Sunday, to see how it goes. It's a quieter brunch gig and I'll wear the custom musician ear plugs I recently had made, even though I hate wearing ear plugs to play.

Anyway, I just wanted to introduce myself and saw that I've already gotten lots of good information on this forum, particularly from Michael Leigh and Jazzer (I'm also a huge Eddie Condon fan!). If anyone has anything to impart to me that they think might be helpful at this time, I would l0ve t0 hear it. I was just getting my career going again after the pandemic and this has been a terrible situation; one that I'm sure is only too familiar to everyone here.

Thanks in advance for any information or advice and my best to all of you.

Hi buddy.

I have just come across your initial post and read it with interest. Firstly, I am so sorry you also have this affliction.

I'll be try to be very brief to start with.

Tinnitus mildly from 1992.

Continued playing professionally until 2014.

Really damaging acoustic trauma in June 2014 when a 'friend?' who I had worked with for many years thrashed a banjo very loudly in my face. (Asperger's temper tantrum.) My tinnitus doubled the following day.

From 2014 until 2017 I continued playing, carefully and with earplugs. My sound (tone) was very important to me. Brass players all have their own signature sound that they want to achieve. I would keep the ear plugs in during the ensembles but edge them out for my solos and features.

From 2014 until 2017 I noticed no further increase in my tinnitus, because I had been careful.

I was first call trombonist in five bands when I decided to finish.

In 2017 I was 75 years old and decided to take the risk of further damage no longer.
My only link with the jazz world now is that I run a jazz appreciation class for the U3A (University of the Third Age) using YouTube film clips to illustrate my dialogue. Again of course I still have to be careful of volume.

In my heyday I played the Montreax Festival on stage with Stephan Grappelli, Barney Kessell, and Teddy Wilson.

For several years I played jazz trombone on the cruise ship QE2 for the Caribbean Christmas cruises.

 

[Jazz drummer]

Hi @Brandon Wong and @Jack Straw,

Thank you both for your responses. I really appreciate all the help and time that people are giving me.

I have read various posts on overprotecting vs. underprotecting with hyperacusis. The pain hyperacusis aspect of this has been the most problematic for me so far. I haven't been wearing earplugs to go outside (although I do always have them with me now), but I wonder if should be wearing them right now when I walk around, as the streets in New York City can be loud. If anyone has a chance to share their thoughts on this, I'd definitely be interested to hear them. Hard to know the best thing to do.

Thanks again!

 

[Jazz drummer]

Hi buddy.

I have just come across your initial post and read it with interest. Firstly, I am so sorry you also have this affliction.

I'll be try to be very brief to start with.

Tinnitus mildly from 1992.

Continued playing professionally until 2014.

Really damaging acoustic trauma in June 2014 when a 'friend?' who I had worked with for many years thrashed a banjo very loudly in my face. (Asperger's temper tantrum.) My tinnitus doubled the following day.

From 2014 until 2017 I continued playing, carefully and with earplugs. My sound (tone) was very important to me. Brass players all have their own signature sound that they want to achieve. I would keep the ear plugs in during the ensembles but edge them out for my solos and features.

From 2014 until 2017 I noticed no further increase in my tinnitus, because I had been careful.

I was first call trombonist in five bands when I decided to finish.

In 2017 I was 75 years old and decided to take the risk of further damage no longer.
My only link with the jazz world now is that I run a jazz appreciation class for the U3A (University of the Third Age) using YouTube film clips to illustrate my dialogue. Again of course I still have to be careful of volume.

In my heyday I played the Montreax Festival on stage with Stephan Grappelli, Barney Kessell, and Teddy Wilson.

For several years I played jazz trombone on the cruise ship QE2 for the Caribbean Christmas cruises.

Thank you for your response, Jazzer!

I have enjoyed watching your videos and it seems we like the same kind of stuff! I have always played traditional jazz and some of my favorite drummers are George Wettling, Cliff Leeman and Sid Catlett. My favorite music is probably the Eddie Condon band from the fifties, and I read that you got to play with Wild Bill---what a great experience!!! Teddy Wilson is another of my favorite musicians of all-time and that's amazing that you got to play with him as well (and the many others you've played with)!

I'm so sorry you have had to deal with this, but I do think it's great that you got to make so much great music with so many great musicians. Whatever ends up happening with me, I'm trying to feel grateful for the wonderful 25 years I had as a professional musician. I've been fortunate to have gotten to play with many fantastic musicians and even some of my idols (I actually got to play "Big Noise From Winnetka" with Bob Haggart!).

I'm trying to keep a positive attitude and people here have been helping with that. I'm really glad I discovered this forum. I look forward to talking with you more, both about our ear troubles and about jazz!

 

[Jazzer]

Thank you for your response, Jazzer!

I have enjoyed watching your videos and it seems we like the same kind of stuff! I have always played traditional jazz and some of my favorite drummers are George Wettling, Cliff Leeman and Sid Catlett. My favorite music is probably the Eddie Condon band from the fifties, and I read that you got to play with Wild Bill---what a great experience!!! Teddy Wilson is another of my favorite musicians of all-time and that's amazing that you got to play with him as well (and the many others you've played with)!

I'm so sorry you have had to deal with this, but I do think it's great that you got to make so much great music with so many great musicians. Whatever ends up happening with me, I'm trying to feel grateful for the wonderful 25 years I had as a professional musician. I've been fortunate to have gotten to play with many fantastic musicians and even some of my idols (I actually got to play "Big Noise From Winnetka" with Bob Haggart!).

I'm trying to keep a positive attitude and people here have been helping with that. I'm really glad I discovered this forum. I look forward to talking with you more, both about our ear troubles and about jazz!

Thanks for coming back bud.

Hey - we're on the same page.

I never met Bob Haggart but I played the Edinburgh festival with his co-leader Yank Lawson - at his age of 75 he shook my hand and damn near broke my fingers.
Was he ever strong.

Take care,
Dave x
Jazzer

 

[Jack Straw]

Hi @Brandon Wong and @Jack Straw,

Thank you both for your responses. I really appreciate all the help and time that people are giving me.

I have read various posts on overprotecting vs. underprotecting with hyperacusis. The pain hyperacusis aspect of this has been the most problematic for me so far. I haven't been wearing earplugs to go outside (although I do always have them with me now), but I wonder if should be wearing them right now when I walk around, as the streets in New York City can be loud. If anyone has a chance to share their thoughts on this, I'd definitely be interested to hear them. Hard to know the best thing to do.

Thanks again!

NYC streets can be loud. This is tricky because you don't want to over protect, but you also don't want to under protect. The loudest thing in NYC imo is the honking on the streets and subways. You should keep your surroundings in mind and if you are in a loud situation pop your custom molds in. If it is a quiet street in certain parts there is no reason to.

 

[Jazz drummer]

NYC streets can be loud. This is tricky because you don't want to over protect, but you also don't want to under protect. The loudest thing in NYC imo is the honking on the streets and subways. You should keep your surroundings in mind and if you are in a loud situation pop your custom molds in. If it is a quiet street in certain parts there is no reason to.

That makes sense, thanks!

 

[Jazz drummer]

Thanks for coming back bud.

Hey - we're on the same page.

I never met Bob Haggart but I played the Edinburgh festival with his co-leader Yank Lawson - at his age of 75 he shook my hand and damn near broke my fingers.
Was he ever strong.

Take care,
Dave x
Jazzer

That's cool to hear! Bob Haggart was in his 80s when I got to play with him and his playing was as strong as ever. Some of that Lawson-Haggart/WGJB stuff is just incredible.

 

[Jazz drummer]

I have also had chronic migraines for years, not sure if that could be related. I've been to two headache doctors, but they haven't helped. Some of my hyperacusis/tinnitus symptoms feel similar and in fact it seemed that my tinnitus was getting better, but then came back and stayed after a bad headache.

Does anyone have any experience with this relationship? I'm looking up posts here, but so far haven't found anything that sounds like my situation.

I do have a prescription for Prednisone that I haven't taken yet. I already took a steroid the beginning of October and it seemed (so hard to tell) that it helped with the tinnitus part, until the headache.

 

[aura]

Does anyone have any experience with this relationship? I

Yes, I have.

I had tinnitus for two years, then I was fine for about 7 years.

Starting with January 2021, I've experienced horrible migranes for two months on a daily basis.

Because of the pain I couldn't sleep anymore, and the lack of sleep aggravated the headaches.

It was the hardest period of my life.

After 2 months I started to feel better, but the tinnitus came back, this time louder, with new tones and hyperacusis (I haven't experienced hyperacusis back in 2012).

My ENT doctor told me that the headaches and tinnitus are related.
She said I have vestibular migraines and told me what can I do to prevent them from happening so often.

From my experience till now, I can say that the migraines are related to: lack of sleep, stress, certain foods (fats, junk food, sweets, salty foods), weather, hormonal changes (not your case I suppose )

There is also a special diet for migraine sufferers that helped me to prevent some of the episodes:

What works best for me is getting enough sleep and avoiding stress.

Good luck to you, because I don't always manage the sleeping and stress problems very well, so I end up having migraines pretty often, but not the way I had them in January, on a daily basis and debilitating.

There are also some drugs that you could find helpful in preventing migraines: Magnesium (I'm using Magnesium Bisglycinate), vitamin B2, coenzyme Q10.

And the most important thing, please protect your ears from now on because things can get worse.

Good luck!

 

[Jazz drummer]

Yes, I have.

I had tinnitus for two years, then I was fine for about 7 years.

Starting with January 2021, I've experienced horrible migranes for two months on a daily basis.

Because of the pain I couldn't sleep anymore, and the lack of sleep aggravated the headaches.

It was the hardest period of my life.

After 2 months I started to feel better, but the tinnitus came back, this time louder, with new tones and hyperacusis (I haven't experienced hyperacusis back in 2012).

My ENT doctor told me that the headaches and tinnitus are related.
She said I have vestibular migraines and told me what can I do to prevent them from happening so often.

From my experience till now, I can say that the migraines are related to: lack of sleep, stress, certain foods (fats, junk food, sweets, salty foods), weather, hormonal changes (not your case I suppose )

There is also a special diet for migraine sufferers that helped me to prevent some of the episodes:

View attachment 47600

View attachment 47601

What works best for me is getting enough sleep and avoiding stress.

Good luck to you, because I don't always manage the sleeping and stress problems very well, so I end up having migraines pretty often, but not the way I had them in January, on a daily basis and debilitating.

There are also some drugs that you could find helpful in preventing migraines: Magnesium (I'm using Magnesium Bisglycinate), vitamin B2, coenzyme Q10.

And the most important thing, please protect your ears from now on because things can get worse.

Good luck!

Thanks, @aura! I will definitely incorporate all of this, it is very helpful.

Have you had any luck with any specific migraine medication? So far, I have not.

 

[Juan]

Thank you for the information. So would you recommend wearing ear öplugs when I go outside? I'm trying to learn as much as I can, but it's hard to figure out what situations I should wear ear plugs in and when I should avoid them.

Yes, I would recommend using earplugs outside home. NYC must be loud place and even if you are more or less ok with the general level of noise, one-off unexpected noises can kill your ears and produce lasting setbacks, so it would be best to avoid those. The problem is that you won't be able to anticipate loud sound at all times, and that's why wearing earplugs is a good idea.

Overprotecting means using earplugs for instance when you go for family lunch and know that there will be the odd noises inside a house, dishes clanking, some door closing and making noise, a chair being dragged carelessly... those are medium noises but may produce reactions and some lasting pain (2-3 days) if you have bad hyperacusis.

However, the noises you really need to avoid, which can produce a true and lasting setback (at least 3 weeks recovery time to come to baseline, in my particular case), are usually produced by machines or amplified sound:

- Power tools.
- Vehicles (loud motorbikes, cars honking, ambulance sirens, loud trucks or machinery).
- Train / boats - engines (and their loud sirens)
- Weapons
- Speakers at loud volume
- I would include instrument in this list, specially trumpet

About TRT etc there is nothing scientific behind that, and it will not prepare you for real world sounds. TRT cannot train damaged ears to get used to loud impulse sounds.

Even if a sound is common it does not mean it is safe. TRT will not make safer sounds like this:

- For instance, when boarding a plane passengers do not wear hearing protection but handling agents do. They are exposed to the same noise, for different amounts of time of course...
- People also walk near construction sites and do not pay attention to the noise.

Music can achieve the same objective as any TRT or sound enrichment method, and it has the benefit of calming anxiety, as you will be listening to pieces you like. Try not to focus too much on details though. When hearing deteriorates (mild hearing loss) some sounds are dimmed, other can be enhanced by hyperacusis etc etc The balance of a composition may be lost, and the textures of some pieces can be lost, like some of the different layers in a piece of classical music.

Listen to music at a volume that you can tolerate. Use a db meter to have a general idea about the db volume. Every week you can increase the volume, if you can tolerate the increase. Otherwise, do not increase the volume. Your ears should adjust bit by bit, very slowly.

Listening to music has the benefit that you can store the true sound in your memory, and if your hearing gets worse you can still evoke the original sound and complete a "broken" piece.

I am going to take this opportunity to ask if, as musicians, you can remember and evoke a complicated piece of music you have previously heard, and if this ability comprises every genre of music... I am asking because for me it is hard to remember classical music (I never had any music training).

 

[Jazz drummer]

Overprotecting means using earplugs for instance when you go for family lunch and know that there will be the odd noises inside a house, dishes clanking, some door closing and making noise, a chair being dragged carelessly... those are medium noises but may produce reactions and some lasting pain (2-3 days) if you have bad hyperacusis.

However, the noises you really need to avoid, which can produce a true and lasting setback (at least 3 weeks recovery time to come to baseline, in my particular case), are usually produced by machines or amplified sound:

- Power tools.
- Vehicles (loud motorbikes, cars honking, ambulance sirens, loud trucks or machinery).
- Train / boats - engines (and their loud sirens)
- Weapons
- Speakers at loud volume
- I would include instrument in this list, specially trumpet

Thanks, @Juan! Would you say this is just until my ears (hopefully) calm down a bit, or for the rest of my life? As I'm sure many on this forum have found, it can be so difficult to find answers and understanding.

I have had headaches for years which I thought were migraines, but I think could possibly be occipital neuralgia. I'm wondering if my hyperacusis and tinnitus has anything to do with that (even though it was obviously noise induced) because the symptoms feel similar. When I get a headache now, it makes my hyperacusis and tinnitus much worse. I've always gotten headaches on my right side, which is the ear that now has problems, and I've had chronic neck problems as well. I saw a headache doctor, but she won't really do anything unless I get an MRI, which I'm afraid to do because of the noise. I'm searching this forum for related posts.

Thanks again to everyone who has responded!

 

[Jazz drummer]

I am going to take this opportunity to ask if, as musicians, you can remember and evoke a complicated piece of music you have previously heard, and if this ability comprises every genre of music... I am asking because for me it is hard to remember classical music (I never had any music training).

I will have to give this some thought. At the moment, I don't think I have trouble with this. I've played music for 32 years and done it professionally for 25. Right now, I don't seem to have any hearing loss and my hearing test results were very good. I understand that this is not uncommon with tinnitus and hyperacusis. So far, it's the hyperacusis that's been the more debilitating problem for me.

 

[aura]

Thanks, @aura! I will definitely incorporate all of this, it is very helpful.

Have you had any luck with any specific migraine medication? So far, I have not.

I haven't found a migraine medication that works for me.

That was my biggest problem back in January. NOTHING helped me.

've tried some "cocktails" with painkillers, Dexamethasone, Mannitol, sleeping pills, antidepressants...it's a miracle to be pain free again!

The most important thing for me now is preventing the episodes from happening. Getting enough sleep is crucial.

 

[Juan]

Thanks, @Juan! Would you say this is just until my ears (hopefully) calm down a bit, or for the rest of my life? As I'm sure many on this forum have found, it can be so difficult to find answers and understanding.

That's very hard to tell, as hyperacusis is very individual, and sensitive to things like how one sleeps, diet, exercise, etc etc.

I saw a headache doctor, but she won't really do anything unless I get an MRI, which I'm afraid to do because of the noise.

I would not go for the MRI. I would suggest booking an appointment with a doctor you can talk to for at least a good half an hour (pay for the visit if needed, even if you have insurance). And try to get the doctor to objectively assess your case and think about what may be contributing to the hyperacusis, and how likely is to get that fixed if anything shows on an MRI.

It's like a reverse analysis. There is no point in doing an MRI if:

- Hyperacusis seems to be the result of a noise trauma (as it appeared after very obvious noise)
- Whatever the doctor expects to discard or find on images (MRI) cannot be fixed or trying to fix it implies a greater risk than the benefit that could be achieved.

Doctors usually want to discard things like an accoustic neuroma. Doing some reading I came accross an article where doctors discussed the convenience of performing surgery to remove accoustic neuromas... and well.. the discussion was interesting because many doctors were against going for a surgery that has side effects and may result into hearing loss etc... when the benefit is not great... and some of those tumors grow really really slow so surgery is not needed in a short time frame...

Doing lots of tests may result into being over-diagnosed about things that are not important, cannot be fixed or can try to be fixed but there is a risk involved... so the conclusion is that it depends on the case; sometimes doing nothing is the best option.

 

[Jazz drummer]

- Hyperacusis seems to be the result of a noise trauma (as it appeared after very obvious noise)
- Whatever the doctor expects to discard or find on images (MRI) cannot be fixed or trying to fix it implies a greater risk than the benefit that could be achieved.

I completely agree. It's really frustrating because the MRI is just a formality they have to go through before prescribing certain medications, which may or may not help my tinnitus and hyperacusis, but which might at least help my headaches. They can't prescribe them unless you have an MRI first. I could get a CT scan instead. I'm just trying to get some headache meds. The places my head hurts with hyperacusis are the same places it hurts when I get a headache. I had an MRI years ago for my headaches and everything was fine. The whole thing seems like a waste of time and energy, but if there are meds that can help, I'd like to try them.

On Tuesday I have an hour meeting with an audiologist who specializes in tinnitus and hyperacusis, so hopefully she can give me the objective assessment you described.

Thanks again for your response.

 

[Exit]

I completely agree. It's really frustrating because the MRI is just a formality they have to go through before prescribing certain medications, which may or may not help my tinnitus and hyperacusis, but which might at least help my headaches. They can't prescribe them unless you have an MRI first. I could get a CT scan instead. I'm just trying to get some headache meds. The places my head hurts with hyperacusis are the same places it hurts when I get a headache. I had an MRI years ago for my headaches and everything was fine. The whole thing seems like a waste of time and energy, but if there are meds that can help, I'd like to try them.

On Tuesday I have an hour meeting with an audiologist who specializes in tinnitus and hyperacusis, so hopefully she can give me the objective assessment you described.

Thanks again for your response.

Do a CT.

 

[Juan]

I could get a CT scan instead.

The CT scan should suffice to see anything that is obviously problematic and it is a silent test. Maybe the MRI can be more detailed but I think it is not worth it... as you know, it is very loud.

 

[Jazz drummer]

The CT scan should suffice to see anything that is obviously problematic and it is a silent test. Maybe the MRI can be more detailed but I think it is not worth it... as you know, it is very loud.

I think that's what I'm going to do. Thanks!