Flying & Tinnitus

[JohnDoe]

Hi JohnDoe, a year back I went on a 18 hour flight, and back home again after a month , another 18 hours.
My t was v v low before the flight, and I would,d get long moments of silence too specially in the mornings when I woke up after a good night's sleep. T went crazy after the flights, I wore ear plugs and earplanes throughout the flight. Also my seats were in the front of the plane so there was less engine noise. It's the air pressure, that's really damaging. T is beginning to get better now . I had to habituate all over again.
However there are people who's t doesn't get affected at all by flying.

I'm sorry to hear this. I'm planning on taking a short flight soon to "test" if i can deal with flying with my Tinnitus. I hope the air pressure is going to be bearable. I've gone into the hyperbaric oxygen chamber to try and heal my tinnitus (to little / no avail). I think flying is less stressful than HBO.

If this short flight goes well I might consider long(er) flights again.

My checklist so far is:
- ear plugs during the flight (not during lift off or take off in order to equalize).
- try and sit in front of the engines
- try not to have a panick attack
- mouth open during descent.

Anyone have any more tips?

Fingers crossed.

 

[Sherri786]

A short flight first, is a very good idea. If you have a cold, do NOt fly !

 

[Gosia]

Well, easy to say 'don't go if you have a cold', but this kind of travels are usually preceeded by a lot of preparations, cost and so on. If we take decongestant, drugs stopping producing secretion in tge sinuses it should be ok, no? Actually that's my worry too.I'm preparing my first flight with T in 2 weeks. I'm not planning on to have a cold , but since May 2015 I have some weird chronic sinuses problems . I don't have runny nose, but my noze is often stuck without me realising it. Only when I check if I can breath through one openinb in the nose only , 1 in 3 times I doscover I can't. I know it's probably a queston for a doctor, but doctors were helpless about it too. And I guess the symptoms are too small to be detected dufing check up, nonetheless I have consta'tly some secretion from sinuses going down my throat. Before flying, I'm planning to take some pills stopping the secration and clearing the sinuses and I hope that will do. Does anybody have a similar problem, T and flies?

 

[linearb]

Flying with a cold isn't the same thing as flying with a severe sinus or ear infection.

I've flown with colds many times, and would do so again if necessary. Serious sinus or ear infections are pretty uncommon, and if I had one, I would change my travel plans, at the last minute if need be.

 

[awbw8]

I'm sorry to hear this. I'm planning on taking a short flight soon to "test" if i can deal with flying with my Tinnitus. I hope the air pressure is going to be bearable. I've gone into the hyperbaric oxygen chamber to try and heal my tinnitus (to little / no avail). I think flying is less stressful than HBO.

If this short flight goes well I might consider long(er) flights again.

My checklist so far is:
- ear plugs during the flight (not during lift off or take off in order to equalize).
- try and sit in front of the engines
- try not to have a panick attack
- mouth open during descent.

Anyone have any more tips?

Fingers crossed.

Hey there! You will be fine, I might recommend considering the following, though your list is good:

1. Bose headset for listening to movies etc. or just for general comfort - they're made to kill plane-frequency noise.
2. Flitemates, same purpose as earplanes, but for whatever reason, these work better for me, you might want to try both if you feel one doesn't work: http://www.amazon.com/Flitemate-Pressure-Reducing-Ear-Plugs/dp/B0014H4HKW
3. No panic attacks after the flight either. Even "normal" ears can take a little while after landing to pop. It's not great, but it might make your T seem louder when it isn't really. Just breathe
4. Sudafed + flonase if you get even mild runny nose/congestion. I seem to always have a somewhat stuffy nose, so this always helps me

Have a happy flight!

 

[awbw8]

Well, easy to say 'don't go if you have a cold', but this kind of travels are usually preceeded by a lot of preparations, cost and so on. If we take decongestant, drugs stopping producing secretion in tge sinuses it should be ok, no? Actually that's my worry too.I'm preparing my first flight with T in 2 weeks. I'm not planning on to have a cold , but since May 2015 I have some weird chronic sinuses problems . I don't have runny nose, but my noze is often stuck without me realising it. Only when I check if I can breath through one openinb in the nose only , 1 in 3 times I doscover I can't. I know it's probably a queston for a doctor, but doctors were helpless about it too. And I guess the symptoms are too small to be detected dufing check up, nonetheless I have consta'tly some secretion from sinuses going down my throat. Before flying, I'm planning to take some pills stopping the secration and clearing the sinuses and I hope that will do. Does anybody have a similar problem, T and flies?

I have the same issue. My pre-flight regimen seems to make some difference, maybe it will help you, too:

1. Flonase or Afrin
2. Sudafed
3. Neti-pot (do the neti-pot prior to nasal sprays)

That tends to get me pretty flight-happy. It might seem like a lot to the normal nose, but to the chronically semi-stuffy, it's just about right. If you have allergies or anything like that, you might want to go for an anti-histimine/sudafed mix, whatever normally works for you.

If you have a nasty sinus infection, go to your doc and ask if it's safe to fly first. I've flown with an "approved" bad cold/sinus issue before (going home for Christmas - expensive cross-country flight) and I was fine. It's wasn't fun and it took a little while for my ears to pop, but it was okay.

 

[Gosia]

No, no, nothing nasty, but uncurable as well it seems. Still, it's far better than last ear but as you, I never seem to be completely 'clean'. There's always sth dripping a little, but it's not bacterial. The secretion is cristal clear. Like an hour ago my nose was stuck. Now it's fully clear. Maybe in an hour it will be a little stuck again. Antihistaminiques don't seem to work/ change anything. I hope it doesn't qualify as sth disqualifying from flying. I have my nose cleaning set too actually, I flew a few times before T with this condition and didn't bother about cleaning my nose precisely as I didn't know it can have any impact on ears. Well..i learnt in a hard way. I will do my rituals and visit my GPbefore but I doubt he will be of any mpre help than adviceI can find here..

 

[dan]

Bose headsets are not so harmless, if you read Bose reviews on Amazon, you will find some people complain of ear pressure changes (not due to flight)

 

[Gosia]

Hi there..I would have a few more questions. I guess I've read all there was about flying protocol but I have some doubts concerning the noise level..and I'm flying on Wednesday. It will be a short, around 1h50 min flight.
I know it's supposed to be less noisy in the front part and I will sit in the middle of the front. If there are any free sits left, I will run even more to the front.
I bought the anti-pressure earplugs, but they are french..Quies. From what I checked on the net they look like earplanes you guys mentioned, but what worries me they seem to be quite inflexible and I could swear I hear everything as well when I have them in as without them. Does it mean they won't block any of the noise? That's a bit disappointing. Or maybe it's just that I don't realize it but they block the noise? Those of you who use earplanes, how do they feel to you? I sent the question to the producer but no answer yet.
I'm wondering - if I have anything in the ears, some noise must be blocked, no? Or if there is any 'space' left between the ear canal and the thingy, it's as useless in noise cancelling as if there was nothing? I'm pretty worried about the loudness more than about the pressure I guess..
So for now it looks like the earplanes I have won't block the noise but I can't use regular earplugs to block the dBs cause this way I will create a dangerous pressure for the ear. So I have to choose?
I don't have noise cancelling headphones and I won't get any now. Can't afford and would have to order them from the net..BUT I have a pair of noise cancelling earmuffs for the workers. Like this : http://www.justears.org/peltor-optime-iii-premium-headband-ear-muffs/
The problem with them is they are VERY, VERY tight ! It's almost painful to wear them and mostly, I feel they create a lot of pressure for the ears..I have no scientific background to support this but I just feel it wouldn't be a good idea to have them on while the pressure around my ears would change on the plane. So what could I do..I'm thinking : cover my ears with hand palms in addition to the earplanes ? ( I'm talking only about the take off and the landing). Can that cut any noise in a significant way without creating pressure for the era and thus make the presence of the earplanes useless? Now I checked on the net there are some earplanes, sold for gold, that are supposed to both cut the noise and balance the pressure , but I cannot find them in pharmacies and too late to order them. What's more, people on the net claim they felt like they didn't block any noise anyways.
And the last questions would be : has anybody meassure the noise level on an Airbus 320 ? Maybe the noise level depends on the model of the plane as well ? Thanks a lot to those who have went through this post and who could give me the answers. First flight with T..so I'm quite afraid, I admit.

 

[Rube]

@Gosia the flitemates that @awbw8 linked above have a NRR of 22. Not sure if the earplanes do or not.

 

[Gosia]

Yep, they look better adjusted to the ear..eh, only I can't find them here and too late for mail order I hope they will have some at the airport, but I've been there many times and don't remember seeing any earplugs in the stores. Eh.

 

[awbw8]

Yep, they look better adjusted to the ear..eh, only I can't find them here and too late for mail order I hope they will have some at the airport, but I've been there many times and don't remember seeing any earplugs in the stores. Eh.

Even if you can't get your hands on them, try not to worry too much. Take a decongestant and gently pop your ears on the way up and down. Even if you ears feel a little full/funky when you land, it will fade and you can plan for the next time. I don't think one flight is very likely to cause permanent damage if you're feeling healthy. If you have a sinus infection or something of that nature, then try not to fly.

 

[Gosia]

Thank you, but actually my questions reffered to loudness rather than sinuses problems.. for them I'm as well equiped as one can be. I have a chronic sinus condition which is probably allergic, but I'm not constantly using tissues ir anything like that. Just that I have some cristal secretion which is always there going down the throat . I will take pills, sprays, sérum physiologique, marine water spray, some herbal stuff and earplanes. But for the protection from decibels at the taking off and descending when it's pretty loud I assume.? Earplanes and handpalms will do?

 

[geg1992]

Got to fly next week. I have a slight cold but my ears are crackling every time I yawn. I don't feel like they're completely blocked, just feel a bit gunked up. I'm going to the doctors tomorrow but I've spent so much on this and have so many plans.

Is it more aimed at don't fly if you have a severe sinus infection or does this include colds too?

It'[s a 12 hour flight, I have ear planes at the ready (do they prevent barotrauma?) And plan on using decongestants. I really don't know what to do Such awful timing. Will any barotrauma say just ear pain, cause an increase in T? Pretty sure when I flew to Norway in February I had a nasty cold, but can't remember if my ears were blocked. Had no increase from that but was only a 2 1/2 hour flight.

Thanks for any help.

 

[Nucleo]

Both colds and sinus infection are bad for flying. If you cannot equalize the pressure manually by gently performing the Valsalva maneuver then you are asking for trouble.

 

[linearb]

Both colds and sinus infection are bad for flying. If you cannot equalize the pressure manually by gently performing the Valsalva maneuver then you are asking for trouble.

I totally agree, and with all my problems I wouldn't fly with a sinus infection if I could possibly avoid it. However, I did exactly that once a couple years ago when I absolutely had to be on the plane, and, while I did get significant ear pain and problems equalizing for a good 15 minutes after the descent, it didn't do anything bad to me long-term.

I suspect that is very much the norm -- despite it being generally a bad idea, clearly dozens/hundreds of people must fly with colds and allergies and sinus infections every day, and very few of them end up with long-term problems as a result.

It would suck if it happened to you, though, obviously.

 

[geg1992]

I totally agree, and with all my problems I wouldn't fly with a sinus infection if I could possibly avoid it. However, I did exactly that once a couple years ago when I absolutely had to be on the plane, and, while I did get significant ear pain and problems equalizing for a good 15 minutes after the descent, it didn't do anything bad to me long-term.

I suspect that is very much the norm -- despite it being generally a bad idea, clearly dozens/hundreds of people must fly with colds and allergies and sinus infections every day, and very few of them end up with long-term problems as a result.

It would suck if it happened to you, though, obviously.

Thanks for the input you two. Hmm it's strange how even though you got a pain there were no long term problems. I'm wondering if simply the pain landing will actually increase my T, or if it will take something like a burst ear drum for that to happen. When you did fly, did you use ear planes, take decongestants etc?

I've flown many times with a cold and got the pain, but that was with no precautions taken. I'm not worried about the pain, I worry about T, as that's the thing that will have a long term effect.

 

[linearb]

Thanks for the input you two. Hmm it's strange how even though you got a pain there were no long term problems. I'm wondering if simply the pain landing will actually increase my T, or if it will take something like a burst ear drum for that to happen. When you did fly, did you use ear planes, take decongestants etc?

In general, when I fly, I wear over-the-ear muffs, and take a psuedoephedrine tablet 30 mins before takeoff. I can't tolerate earplanes; the adult size is too big for my tiny ear canals, and the one time I tried on a child-sized one, it got "lost" up there and I had to yank it out with tweezers. So, those are not for me. Sometimes once the plane has ascended I'll switch the muffs for in-ear foam plugs, but I always remove those and switch back to muffs prior to descent.

In the case I'm thinking of where I had the blockage/pain, I don't believe I did either of these things -- I was more cavalier about not using hearing protection until the one time I brought a dB meter on a plane with me and realized how loud they really are, and I was more cavalier about not using decongestants right up until that event where it felt like I was being stabbed in the ear.

I don't, personally, find it very surprising that this didn't seem to cause me any long term problems: I think that's actually pretty rare. There are lots of things that can cause barotrauma to a point where it hurts like hell without actually rupturing your eardrum or doing anything very bad to you. However, I would not fly in that state again if I could possibly avoid it; even if it's unlikely to cause me long-term problems, it was painful, unpleasant, and anxiety-producing.

Are you, at present, able to do a (gentle) vasalva maneuvar and get your ears to clear on both sides? If so, then you're probably fine.

One additional risk of flying with an actual sinus infection is that the pressure changes could push infected mucuous from your sinuses into the ear, and cause an ear infection. This has never happened to me, but it would concern me because I think a lot of my tinnitus may be due to a number of very painful, very severe inner-ear infections that I had as a small child.

 

[geg1992]

In general, when I fly, I wear over-the-ear muffs, and take a psuedoephedrine tablet 30 mins before takeoff. I can't tolerate earplanes; the adult size is too big for my tiny ear canals, and the one time I tried on a child-sized one, it got "lost" up there and I had to yank it out with tweezers. So, those are not for me. Sometimes once the plane has ascended I'll switch the muffs for in-ear foam plugs, but I always remove those and switch back to muffs prior to descent.

In the case I'm thinking of where I had the blockage/pain, I don't believe I did either of these things -- I was more cavalier about not using hearing protection until the one time I brought a dB meter on a plane with me and realized how loud they really are, and I was more cavalier about not using decongestants right up until that event where it felt like I was being stabbed in the ear.

I don't, personally, find it very surprising that this didn't seem to cause me any long term problems: I think that's actually pretty rare. There are lots of things that can cause barotrauma to a point where it hurts like hell without actually rupturing your eardrum or doing anything very bad to you. However, I would not fly in that state again if I could possibly avoid it; even if it's unlikely to cause me long-term problems, it was painful, unpleasant, and anxiety-producing.

Ah, it's a shame that the earplanes don't fit you. They seem to help a lot of people with regards to the pain. I'm in such a difficult choice haha, either waste over £2000, or potentially bring on devastating tinnitus if anythign bad happens. I've got used to my T - it no longer bothers me, but I know if it were to ramp up again I'd lose my mind.

Yeah planes are very loud, when I flew to Norway, the announcements were 100db!! Hmm but I always thought that ear damage would mean an increase in T, therefore baratrauma would cause an increase too? Many people say they got their T from exactly that. However, I guess everyone's T is different. I can move it to November and 'only' lose £1000, but then I could always get another cold, especially as winter is approaching!

 

[linearb]

Ah, it's a shame that the earplanes don't fit you. They seem to help a lot of people with regards to the pain. I'm in such a difficult choice haha, either waste over £2000, or potentially bring on devastating tinnitus if anythign bad happens. I've got used to my T - it no longer bothers me, but I know if it were to ramp up again I'd lose my mind.

Yup, it's a judgement call, for sure. It's fine with me that earplanes don't work because ear pain in planes is almost never an issue for me -- I can clear my e-tubes very easily -- I just worry about the noise exposure (and to a far lesser degree the radiation).

Hmm but I always thought that ear damage would mean an increase in T, therefore baratrauma would cause an increase too? Many people say they got their T from exactly that. However, I guess everyone's T is different. I can move it to November and 'only' lose £1000, but then I could always get another cold, especially as winter is approaching!

I think that for some people, less hearing definitely leads to more tinnitus, but I don't think that's automatic. I have a friend who has had tinnitus he can hear in nearly all environments since he was 8; he's in his 30s now, his hearing is definitely not as good as it was when he was 8, but he says the ringing has never changed. Interestingly, he has also never been especially concerned about it, even though he can hear it over a 75db air conditioning unit. He admits that if he just sits around a silent room and focuses on it that it will quickly start to seem really annoying, but somehow his mind just doesn't get stuck on it like mine does, and so it just doesn't faze him too much.

Because I have observed in myself that I can literally increase my tinnitus (in terms of MML) just by focusing on it for a period of time, part of me thinks that obsessive fixation on tinnitus, over a long period of time, may actually wire our brains to make the sound louder (in literal terms: increased number of hyperactive cells in the AC, and increased signal strength of the ear -> AC -> thalamus -> RIA -> limbic system loop which drives tinnitus distress).

And, really, that's why I'm gung-ho about various cognitive strategies: "incorrect" thinking, over a long period of time, will make the condition worse. I believe we are getting closer to understanding the exact neural mechanisms by which that works... but we already have 10-20 years of imaging data showing decreased pain signaling among long-term meditators and stuff like that. So, anyone who refuses to put a serious amount of time and effort into meditation because they are "waiting for more convincing data", is just being lazy or ignorant -- the data is there. It's true that only relatively limited studies have been done, but they have literally all come to the conclusion that "the shit works". There is almost no research out there which does concludes that cognitive practices of one kind or another are worthless for the management of long-term pain and distress.

 

[iAzra]

one time I brought a dB meter on a plane with me and realized how loud they really are

How loud was the plane?

 

[linearb]

How loud was the plane?

85-90

 

[iAzra]

@linearb During the ascending or? My friend meassuerd it once for me and it was about 80 dcb. It was an airbus.

 

[linearb]

@linearb During the ascending or? My friend meassuerd it once for me and it was about 80 dcb. It was an airbus.

There is a wide variation in volume between different planes; this was much smaller (and apparantly louder) than an airbus.

 

[geg1992]

Saw the doctor today who didn't help. Was hoping for some advice, nothing except there's a possibility I could rupture my ear drum and it's up to me, which is true I guess.

Also found out that the ingredient in sudafed and many recommended decongestants is banned in Japan This is set for disaster aha.

 

[SoulStation]

I measured the db on an airbus 330 and it was btwn 70-75 db during cruising and spiked at 82-85 db during landing /take off.
Not overly loud by any means.
The noing 737/757 were a bit louder. Cruising btwn 75-85 db .

 

[Gosia]

It depends on what we measure it with I guess..I was on a Boeing 737 around two weeks ago and the ascending was at least 89 ( cause the app doesn't go above this level ) and then cruising varied between 82 - 85 which I don't find very loud given that we put ear plugs in or use another protection. However, the announcements are real hell. The more I hated the staff last time cause instead of limiting them to the essential they read you the whole menu or a list of cosmetics they have , in three languages and that was also AT LEAST 89 db . I was preparing myself for my planes journeys respecting religiously what I have read here..My first 3 flights seemed to be fine, but the last one might have worsened sth..I use ear muffs, very solid and strongly attached to the head , when waiting to enter the plane cause the engines are already on and sometimes other planes taking off in the area. Then I put EARPLANES in which I feel don't protect against the noise AT ALL and the ascending is definitely the loudest part of the journey. Then I switch to foam plugs that I keep in until the descending is announced and for the last 30 minutes I only have EARPLANES in, again. I never put my solid ear muffs on because I was sure we shouldn't as it can prevent ears from equalizing properly. Wasn't I right ? Now I'm asking myself tones of questions..I'm pretty sure I read here that's how people do ..Now I wonder if maybe this 10 - 15 minutes at the beginning of the flight with earplanes only was already enough to cause some further damage and worsen my condition ? I popped 1000 of NAC on that day, my airways were clean but I still used sudafed, so I doubt there were any problems with equalizing, no pain, no stuffy ears whatsoever..The flight was only 2h20 altogether..

 

[iAzra]

What I read seams everything went well for you, what kind of problems - worsening do you say you have?
I think earmufs cant hurt, even foam plugs cause pressure in cabin is similar to the pressure on earth, it has to be, only changes a bit quicker but it's not too hard.. like you drive in a car from a hill?

 

[Gosia]

I hear T louder in silence than before. It used to calm down when I was laying to sleep, now it either doesn't or it does only to wake me up two hours later with a mad volume level. Before it was more spread in the head, now it's more on the level of ears. Before I could already sleep without masking from time to time, now my regular masker doesn't cover the noise. Globally, sth changed and doesn't want to go away. My old ways of calming T down a bit don't work..

 

[iAzra]

Have you considered that you might be a focusing just a little bit more on it therefor giving it a more power? I don't think that you have damaged your ears from what you wrote, airplanes also provide few decibels of protection so I think you were OK....