From 10/10 “Suicide Tinnitus” to Periods of Almost Silence — Possible, But Not Without Some Effort

Yes I'm still using it, but find that the serving (2 tablets) they recommend is way too much and I take like half a pill at a time and not every day even. I get irregular heart beat if I take too much. You could try lowering the dose or another brand, but I doubt the batch was dodgy, though everything is possible. I've been using that brand magnesium for years and also a bunch of other supps I get that same brand.
It's probably because it's Magnesium glycinate and it's chelated. When most brands/types of magnesium say take 500mg or whatever a day only a small percentage of that is being absorbed (so maybe only 50mg gets absorbed for example from 500), but with this pretty much all the 200mg is being absorbed.
 
@SoundB0und may I ask you what heart problems you encountered from taking NAC? I've been taking it for a few days and it has given me chest pain and back pain since. I even went to hospital because I felt like my chest was being crushed.
 
I'm sorry you've had problems with your heart and NAC @Steph1710. The best I can describe it is it was fluttering, not too painful. Took only 1 dose. I didn't go to the hospital and have had an ECG that was unrelated to the NAC after it, it came our fine. I hope you recover.
 
Yes I'm still using it, but find that the serving (2 tablets) they recommend is way too much and I take like half a pill at a time and not every day even. I get irregular heart beat if I take too much. You could try lowering the dose or another brand, but I doubt the batch was dodgy, though everything is possible. I've been using that brand magnesium for years and also a bunch of other supps I get that same brand.
Thanks! I think maybe it was just too much for me. I'll try taking less and see how I react to it.
 
See this post:

https://www.tinnitustalk.com/thread...-induced-hearing-loss.7101/page-4#post-383994

It's very rare to get this much side effects.

Think it helped my tinnitus and hyperacusis, I could feel the effect somewhat from 10 doses already, had I taken it longer it'd been a cumulative effect.


NAC was a weird one. I took it also for like a few months a few years ago, I had heart trouble back then too but it was 10x milder. I took NAC again for tinnitus after a smoke alarm went off 1 meter from my head like 1,5 years ago(I had it ready so I took it instantly).

I woke up in the middle of the night with heart fluttering and acting all weird, it wasn't too painful but it freaked me out. The tinnitus acted weird too, it was sort of pulsating with it being very quiet in between for 1 second and then regular loudness after. I have no idea what it was.

My sensitivity to supplements is insane, I doubt you'll have these problems with NAC and NR. I wouldn't have quit them if the side effects weren't super bothersome.
It might be the filler strangely in these supplements. Some people have touchy Mast Cells that can react to certain things. Something to consider for people who are sensitive to supplements in general and not just certain ones.
 
I'm sorry you've had problems with your heart and NAC @Steph1710. The best I can describe it is it was fluttering, not too painful. Took only 1 dose. I didn't go to the hospital and have had an ECG that was unrelated to the NAC after it, it came our fine. I hope you recover.
I can't find it in your thread, how much curcumin do you take please?
 
how much curcumin do you take please?
You're asking about Curcumin and quoting NAC, so I presume you mean NAC? Just in case and so it's in this thread, I'm going to answer both.

I went back and checked my order invoice of Curcumin from 6 years ago, I took 500 mg and had to quit it in a month or two. About 2 years ago when I wanted to try it for tinnitus I tried Turmeric, as I thought it might make a difference. I took 500 mg of Turmeric. The same thing happened, I got psoriasis worsening. I still have the NAC and Turmeric bottles because I don't throw supplements I no longer take away unless they're expired. The NAC I took 600 mg for 1 day.
 
SoundBound, thanks for your great information you posted. I developed BAD tinnitus from Doxycycline in June. It is horrible and driving me crazy.

I am looking at your laser information and wanted to see where you got your laser from? I have found it here:

http://www.konftec.com/html/Products-EN/EM-520.htm

Is this where you bought yours?

My tinnitus is around
Right ear = 7,000 Hz
Left ear = 8,000 Hz
According to the hearing test on their site.

The 520C states it is effective at 4 Hz-10,000 Hz so I am thinking that may be the one to use?

Is there any other sources for this laser and would anybody want to chime in on any laser experience that they may have had?

I made note of your supplements as well!
 
Is this where you bought yours?
Yes.
The 520C states it is effective at 4 Hz-10,000 Hz so I am thinking that may be the one to use?
When I first bought my laser I asked Konftec what the graph on their site is based on, what science etc. They just ignored my email. Now it might have been because the person didn't know, was too lazy or didn't want to bother the higher ups with her question, I'll never know, but I take that graph with a grain of salt. Also I don't agree with their instructions on the duration of using the laser.

I have high frequency tinnitus, somewhere between 8 kHz and 9 kHz, and I use the emLas 520 BCB (last B stands for black only, the color, it looks more professional). Both of the wavelenghts are useful for me, I have tried each one separately and it didn't yield as good results and my ears started craving the other wavelength the last time I tried.

I suggest you read as much about the lasers as you can, going back to Tinnitus Talk threads might be very useful. Be prepared for a spike in your tinnitus when you start using it, almost everybody gets one with the lasers. Consistency is key, I have done it nonstop for years now, every day not skipping days.

Good luck!
SoundB0und
 
Yes.

When I first bought my laser I asked Konftec what the graph on their site is based on, what science etc. They just ignored my email. Now it might have been because the person didn't know, was too lazy or didn't want to bother the higher ups with her question, I'll never know, but I take that graph with a grain of salt. Also I don't agree with their instructions on the duration of using the laser.

I have high frequency tinnitus, somewhere between 8 kHz and 9 kHz, and I use the emLas 520 BCB (last B stands for black only, the color, it looks more professional). Both of the wavelenghts are useful for me, I have tried each one separately and it didn't yield as good results and my ears started craving the other wavelength the last time I tried.

I suggest you read as much about the lasers as you can, going back to Tinnitus Talk threads might be very useful. Be prepared for a spike in your tinnitus when you start using it, almost everybody gets one with the lasers. Consistency is key, I have done it nonstop for years now, every day not skipping days.

Good luck!
SoundB0und
How do you actually know if you are hitting the cochlea? I feel like this thing needs a sight to help aim. I just stick it deep in my ear and hope for the best.
 
Comprehensive post. Thank you.

May I ask for more info around notched sound therapy?

Eg., did you wear headphones/ear buds? Would it work with speakers as I'm too scared to use headphones?

How long did you use it for? How much of a difference did it make for you?
 
How do you actually know if you are hitting the cochlea?
I have been putting the probes in now for almost 2 and a half years and know from the feel even if it's the right angle, but I check from the mirror before I press the start button. I also have some self adhesive fabric tape put on the probes, on the parts they touch the earlobe, so the angles are pretty easy to get right for me. You should also know from the spike to the tinnitus you get from the laser.

I've heard people having success with cutting the Konftec devices base of the rubber tips 5mm, I wasn't able to do it because it made the probes not stay in the ear as well, but it's fine for most people, you could try it. Doing this makes the beam much wider and thus it's very hard to miss the cochlea. But even without doing this it shouldn't be super hard to hit it, my angle was just quite bad with the stretched out left ear canal opening.
 
Eg., did you wear headphones/ear buds? Would it work with speakers as I'm too scared to use headphones?

How long did you use it for? How much of a difference did it make for you?
I definitely wasn't going to use headphones or earbuds, especially back then, but I was willing to try it with my phone speakers. It's very difficult to say how much it helped but maybe a tiny bit. I started the laser like a month after I started notched sound I believe and I was improving some without the notched sound too, in the initial stages.

I haven't gone back to the notched sound therapy in the chronic phase, don't really feel the need for it because for me the results were marginal. Then again, I didn't give it a very good try. It was good though to be able to listen to some music for longer(the notched tracks spiked my tinnitus much less, they still did but I could at least finish a song and then take a break).

Now I've improved so much that music from speakers isn't much of a problem anymore, on medium volume. I was using AudioNotch. If it was easy to do and free, like with TinnitusPlay that should have been out some time ago (I only have an Android device), then I'd give it another go for sure.
 
More recently my left ear has been catching up to the right, it's still much worse but the right ear isn't improving much, not sure if it has improved at all within the last half a year or so. I attribute that to the right ear probably being already at the level I had before my horrific spike where it was at a very low volume tinnitus for 6 years.
@SoundB0und how's the left ear coming along?
 
how's the left ear coming along?
Thanks for asking. I made the thread 6 months ago, since then there's definitely been improvements, but at a snail's pace. The hyperacusis is the one which is most improved, dishes are pretty much not painful anymore. But so has the reactivity and the tinnitus itself.

Hard to quantify because the improvements have been so gradual. If I'd have to guess I'd say the tinnitus has improved an additional 30 percent or so in the left these past 6 months and it's same intensity as it was before in the right. I've been careful and have had no serious injuries plus it's much harder to have one now.

So my regimen right now is: LLLT, intermittent fasting 16:8, grounding in nature, Magnesium, D3, Selenium, Zinc Citrate plus some other things but I don't think they can help tinnitus. I do/take these things every day.

One more thing I could add to my list, I tried Resveratrol about 3 months ago. My luck with supplements is incredibly bad like I've stated many times here and I got incredible GERD worsening at only a fraction of a capsule that I took, felt almost like choking. So there's that. Not sure I'm ever going to try any substances or supplements that aren't vitamins or minerals for tinnitus anymore.
 
Thanks for asking. I made the thread 6 months ago, since then there's definitely been improvements, but at a snail's pace. The hyperacusis is the one which is most improved, dishes are pretty much not painful anymore. But so has the reactivity and the tinnitus itself.

Hard to quantify because the improvements have been so gradual. If I'd have to guess I'd say the tinnitus has improved an additional 30 percent or so in the left these past 6 months and it's same intensity as it was before in the right. I've been careful and have had no serious injuries plus it's much harder to have one now.

So my regimen right now is: LLLT, intermittent fasting 16:8, grounding in nature, Magnesium, D3, Selenium, Zinc Citrate plus some other things but I don't think they can help tinnitus. I do/take these things every day.

One more thing I could add to my list, I tried Resveratrol about 3 months ago. My luck with supplements is incredibly bad like I've stated many times here and I got incredible GERD worsening at only a fraction of a capsule that I took, felt almost like choking. So there's that. Not sure I'm ever going to try any substances or supplements that aren't vitamins or minerals for tinnitus anymore.
Glad to hear! Sucks about the supplements but at least the laser has been effective. Thanks for the great recap.
 
Thanks for asking. I made the thread 6 months ago, since then there's definitely been improvements, but at a snail's pace. The hyperacusis is the one which is most improved, dishes are pretty much not painful anymore. But so has the reactivity and the tinnitus itself.

Hard to quantify because the improvements have been so gradual. If I'd have to guess I'd say the tinnitus has improved an additional 30 percent or so in the left these past 6 months and it's same intensity as it was before in the right. I've been careful and have had no serious injuries plus it's much harder to have one now.

So my regimen right now is: LLLT, intermittent fasting 16:8, grounding in nature, Magnesium, D3, Selenium, Zinc Citrate plus some other things but I don't think they can help tinnitus. I do/take these things every day.

One more thing I could add to my list, I tried Resveratrol about 3 months ago. My luck with supplements is incredibly bad like I've stated many times here and I got incredible GERD worsening at only a fraction of a capsule that I took, felt almost like choking. So there's that. Not sure I'm ever going to try any substances or supplements that aren't vitamins or minerals for tinnitus anymore.
Can I ask, did you ever have reactivity/distortion?
 
Can I ask, did you ever have reactivity/distortion?
I've had both. Reactivity was actually the main issue for me, maybe still is. My tinnitus is much more reactive to synthetic sounds meaning sounds from earphones and speakers. I used to not be able to listen to a song more than 2-3 seconds with the volume so low I did not hear the words, it would spike the already insane tinnitus to incredible levels.

Right now I can handle music at lowish/medium volume without a problem, especially when my tinnitus is in the right, in the left it's still reactive. Distortion I only had while I was on the drug that was ototoxic for me and shortly after, music sounded flat and unenjoyable, though not too different. That has luckily gone back to baseline. I hope this answers your question.
 
See this post:

https://www.tinnitustalk.com/thread...-induced-hearing-loss.7101/page-4#post-383994

It's very rare to get this much side effects.

Think it helped my tinnitus and hyperacusis, I could feel the effect somewhat from 10 doses already, had I taken it longer it'd been a cumulative effect.


NAC was a weird one. I took it also for like a few months a few years ago, I had heart trouble back then too but it was 10x milder. I took NAC again for tinnitus after a smoke alarm went off 1 meter from my head like 1,5 years ago(I had it ready so I took it instantly).

I woke up in the middle of the night with heart fluttering and acting all weird, it wasn't too painful but it freaked me out. The tinnitus acted weird too, it was sort of pulsating with it being very quiet in between for 1 second and then regular loudness after. I have no idea what it was.

My sensitivity to supplements is insane, I doubt you'll have these problems with NAC and NR. I wouldn't have quit them if the side effects weren't super bothersome.
I thought I was the only one who is very sensitive to medicines or supplements. I had a steroid injection in my back and had a horrible reaction for months. I could not sleep, at all. The doctor recommended Benadryl around the clock, even then I would only sleep and hour or two. She then moved on to Gabapentin, I slept, but the taper was horrible.

Everyone I know is astonished at how sensitive I am to medication, food, caffeine or supplements. It really doesn't surprise me though. My mom was the same way and I remember she had to be hospitalized because of an anticholinergic toxicity. Maybe someone in your family is the same.

I pray for you continued health and healing.
 
DISCLAIMER: This post is not medical advice. Please consult your doctor before trying any of the alternative treatments mentioned here. I will not be held responsible for any damages, physical or otherwise, resulting from anybody trying these treatments.

I thought about not writing a success story but I feel I have valuable knowledge to share, knowledge that I wish I had when I first got my horrific tinnitus.

I have mentioned only ototoxicity in my profile but thinking back I was abusing my ears for years with loud music. The antidepressant I was on for 6 years probably made my hearing loss a bit, if not a lot more easily acquirable, but a lot of the damage was from noise exposure as well.

I had mild tinnitus that crept up to a higher volume within 6 years, but still in early 2018 it was very manageable. I could listen to music and ride in a car without protection and it wasn't a huge problem. I almost never thought about my tinnitus. I sort of had bigger problems in my life, all that changed in March 2018.

I was put on a very new medication in February that year. At first things were great, but I soon found out what real intrusive tinnitus was. I had 2 things going on, what we think happened was the new medication caused rapid ototoxicity and also I had a bad cold and there began my severe tinnitus journey.

Within a couple of weeks my tinnitus ramped up to what I call "suicide levels". It was absolute torture, even for Tinnitus Talk I think I'd been a very bad case. I also acquired very severe hyperacusis. I soon found myself in the ENT office and it was discovered that my hearing loss was 85 decibels at 8kHz.

Even the ENT, who probably sees bad cases all the time, was visibly shocked at how bad my hearing was at my age(late 20s). I just got told the usual, "you're gonna have to live with it".

At my worst, I could not read a book because of how loud the tinnitus was and my hyperacusis was so bad I had earmuffs on when using the tap. I was up 3 nights in a row(meaning not a minute of sleep) taking 6 times the dose of sleep med each night that usually knocks me out cold. Riding in a car with double protection spiked the tinnitus a lot.

Dishes were incredibly painful. The worst were "synthetic" sounds, meaning sounds from speakers. Listening to music so low I could not hear the words would spike the tinnitus within 3 seconds to crazy levels.

My doctor who prescribed me the med told me that this medication should not cause tinnitus and to not even quit it. Against her judgment I did quit the medication and my tinnitus stopped getting worse. After coming back from the ENT I was not phased, I thought for sure on the forums or online there'd be talk of effective alternative treatments.

It was only after I had read some forum posts from newbies who came to the forum with their plight and veterans who said the same thing my ENT had told me that I became really worried. I don't think I could have habituated to my tinnitus, it was too loud.

Also, had I not taken the steps I will soon talk about, it would have surely gotten worse, because even though I have lived like a hermit to protect my ears, I was still exposed to several loud situations. What I will say is, incredibly good recoveries are possible, in 2020, before regenerative medicine and without neuromodulation devices.

At the moment, though I don't have silence, and probably will not have it for a while, things are not far off in my right ear(the reason my right is better than left is because of me doing one of the treatments wrong, something which I will get into soon).

There will be people saying "the things you have done to treat yourself didn't work and it was just the normal habituation and healing process that happens". Part of the healing was normal plus habituation, but I'm absolutely sure I accelerated and amplified the end result of my healing by a lot.

I think had I done even more research and found some very beneficial things sooner and tried them, I would have made a complete recovery. My diet could have been better, could have exercised more, many things like that as well.

I joined the forum on the 29th of April 2018, the reason for that was that my sign ups were caught by the spam filter and thus I was unable to sign up. Changing my email, my IP, the device I registered from etc didn't enable me to sign up. That is why there were no hysterical posts by me on this forum early on, I was panicking pretty bad and thought there's a very good chance my life is over.

It came clear to me early on, from reading the forum for a couple of months, that what you do early on is very important, like with HBOT or other things. HBOT was unavailable for me. Back then the laser threads were more active so they caught my eye fast. 2 months in I realized I probably will have to buy the laser, but put it off because almost everybody, including a verified doctor, said they were snake oil scams.

2,5 months in I had a spike to my tinnitus due to loud noise exposure and it became clear to me that I had not much to lose, because if the laser didn't work I'd be dead anyways and the 800 euros I was going to spend on it, well, I could not have taken it to the grave with me. I ordered the laser and started lasering 3 months from my initial spike.

I didn't have much faith in the treatment overall, I was just hoping to get some relief for the years before regenerative medicine comes out. The tinnitus spiked at first and again I was unable to sleep even with sleep medication on some nights, it was also summer and very hot so that didn't help sleep.

Gradually things settled down and got better. I was very careful with protecting my ears and super diligent with the laser. Then I found out I had made a horrific mistake, where I missed or at least exposed the cochlea in my left ear to much less of the laser. You can read more about it here:

https://www.tinnitustalk.com/threads/low-level-laser-therapy-lllt-for-tinnitus-%E2%80%94-long-lasting-everyday-home-practiced-experiences.25110/page-7#post-390133

This inadvertently and unfortunately proved to me that the laser worked and worked well, that it wasn't only the normal healing process.

I continued doing research and scouring Tinnitus Talk for different things that could help, because with tinnitus, the sooner you try things the better. Here's everything I tried in my tinnitus journey, I tried to make the list chronological but I'm not sure it is:

Ginkgo - made tinnitus worse.

Betaserc - did nothing.

Apple Cider Vinegar - did nothing.

Ear Tone by New Nordic, pills - Did very little, maybe 10-15 percent reduction, not worth the steep price.

ACRN - made tinnitus worse(maybe did it wrong).

Notched Sound Therapy - helped a bit.

Konftec Laser - responsible for, I'd say, at least 75 percent of the recovery, if not more. I'm still lasering every day and have for almost 2 years now.

Turmeric With Curcumin – helped but had to quit very soon because of side effects (psoriasis worsening rapidly).

Nicotinamide Riboside - very good effect, but I'm very sensitive to supplements and couldn't tolerate the side effects. Took only 10 doses. It is the most undervalued alternative treatment on TT imo.

NAC - Good effect, got very bad heart trouble and had to quit.

R. David Case Tinnitus Mix sound file - definitely worth a shot if you don't have hyperacusis. Seemed to work the first time around at first but second time I tried it about a year later didn't have the same effect.

Lion's Mane - Did nothing.

CoQ10 - mild effect, potentiates the laser.

Oxygen Concentrator while doing cardio (exercise bike) - HBOT was not available, had a good effect but again had to quit soon because of side effects.

Intermittent Fasting - helped a lot already, even though lots of time had passed since I got tinnitus.

Cold Showers – Similar to intermittent fasting, helps with cumulative effects. First month or so I noticed no difference, but almost 6 months of intermittent fasting and cold showers seemed to have worked well. Had to quit cold showers but still doing IF.

Hemp CBD Oil – massive temporary spike.

Probiotics – I didn't take them for tinnitus relief, took them to heal my gut as I had pretty bad GERD. Surprisingly, in addition to my GERD being fixed, they helped tinnitus quite a bit as well.

(All of these things have a thread on Tinnitus Talk)

I also have my eye on BPC-157, a synthetic peptide. I probably won't try it because my situation is already so good I can go out without hearing protection to quieter venues where they play music and the peptide has its dangers, but it's good to know I have an ace in the back pocked in case things were to get bad again after an accident. Though it would be interesting to see if it would cure me completely.

That is all I can think of right now, probably missing a couple of things and it's not a comprehensive list of everything worth trying, just the stuff I tried. Obviously there's things like PRP, stem cells and Lenire, which I am not opposed to trying, but I didn't have the money or in the case of Lenire the hearing ability necessary to try it.

Not counting the countless vitamins and minerals I took, most helpful of which have been Magnesium and Zinc. As you can see, I had to quit half or more things that worked well, because of side effects. Most people, almost all people, won't have that issue. I am still improving, after over 2 years since my spike, but the gains have gotten really slow because of the amount of time passed.

Had everything been tolerable, I would easily have made a complete recovery from 10/10 tinnitus with both ears I believe, maybe even silence. I've noticed over the years that all sorts of treatments have good effects on me more often and usually yield better results than for the average person, but I also have much worse side-effects than the average person.

Even if out of the things that had a good effect that I had to quit 2-3 had worked without intolerable side effects, or if I hadn't messed up with the laser, I would be resuming usual life probably. Yes, the tinnitus alternative treatment options are rife with scams, one needs to exercise some common sense, but there are things that help. If they don't, it's a small investment for big potential gains.

I believe my recovery isn't too impressive. In my opinion, most people, had they tried all of those things within the right timeframe (meaning soon, within 3 months or less) after getting tinnitus while being careful and protecting well, would have had a better recovery, because I had to quit so many things. Some things on that list are obviously more worth trying and sooner than others, a couple might not be worth trying at all.

My tinnitus in the right ear(which I would also have in my left had I not made the mistake) is back to pre spike levels, perhaps even better. I'm hoping to make some gains still with the left one which is worse. My tinnitus switches ears daily and fluctuates a lot. If I had to put numbers to it, if in my right, it's 0.5-1.5 severity and in my left about 2-3.5. My hyperacusis is virtually nonexistent during day to day activities.

More recently my left ear has been catching up to the right, it's still much worse but the right ear isn't improving much, not sure if it has improved at all within the last half a year or so. I attribute that to the right ear probably being already at the level I had before my horrific spike where it was at a very low volume tinnitus for 6 years.

Because I had the mild tinnitus for so long I doubt my right ear will improve much anymore, but it doesn't have to, it's at an amazingly low level at the moment with almost no hyperacusis and very mild reactivity.

I'd say I did TONS of things wrong with my recovery. I waited a bit too long to buy the laser, because people(most of whom hadn't even tried it) said it was snake oil, messed up the left ear, I should have done even more research into things and tried more things, sooner, better diet and exercise routine, etc.

There was a thread a while back where people could vote how much money they would spend on a cure, can't find it now. Most people were willing to pay 10 000 dollars or more for a cure. I have spent less than 2000 dollars on my ears.

One of the most important things is also how well I protected my hearing, most people would have called it overprotecting over here. I was willing to basically have no life for almost 2 years in order to recover from this.

It seems to me that a lot of people try a couple of things and then give up, if they even do that. In my opinion that is not the way to go. If you get relief of 10 percent from 1 thing that is already very good, if more then even better.

Combine a few, as long as they're safe, and you'll have a significant improvement of your situation. And remember, the first couple of months are crucial.

In my opinion people are too stingy with spending time and money on their health, it is the greatest investment you can make.
Where did you buy your laser please? Thank you!
 
Where did you buy your laser please? Thank you!
It's a Konftec laser. The exact model I have is emLas520BCB.

I'll give an update since it's been months. I'm still lasering, though I'm not sure it's doing much if anything anymore. I don't want to quit either in case it actually is. I heard somewhere that the maximum duration of using the laser that will do anything is 3 years, I'm exactly 2 and a half years in now. I've been very consistent, skipping a day only if I forget, has happened maybe 2 or 3 times in the past 2 years or so.

Left ear is still much worse than the right (because of my mistake), but both are at a level where it never bothers me anymore. It's very hard to measure my improvements now, tinnitus seems to be marginally improved, but I think the reactivity has improved considerably, even in the past few months, so has the hyperacusis.

Probably little due to the laser and more due to the fact that I cranked up my white noise at night (which doesn't mask my tinnitus at all, it spikes it) and because I protect even less now. I can now listen to music all day (not from headphones of course) no matter which ear the tinnitus is in, sometimes when I'm exercising pretty loud even, though not insane levels of course.

Just to give an idea how loud the tinnitus is, in the right when I compare it to my fridge (that's 6 months old) noise and I'm 1 meter away, the fridge is actually about 2x as loud, in the left things are much worse still and the tinnitus is like 2x as loud as the fridge, still a very far cry from the "suicide levels" I mentioned in the original post.

I started B-vitamins, only thing I've changed supplement wise since my last posts here, haven't noticed a huge effect. I'm exercising way more and my diet's been significantly better. That's all I can think of right now.
 
It's a Konftec laser. The exact model I have is emLas520BCB.

I'll give an update since it's been months. I'm still lasering, though I'm not sure it's doing much if anything anymore. I don't want to quit either in case it actually is. I heard somewhere that the maximum duration of using the laser that will do anything is 3 years, I'm exactly 2 and a half years in now. I've been very consistent, skipping a day only if I forget, has happened maybe 2 or 3 times in the past 2 years or so.

Left ear is still much worse than the right (because of my mistake), but both are at a level where it never bothers me anymore. It's very hard to measure my improvements now, tinnitus seems to be marginally improved, but I think the reactivity has improved considerably, even in the past few months, so has the hyperacusis.

Probably little due to the laser and more due to the fact that I cranked up my white noise at night (which doesn't mask my tinnitus at all, it spikes it) and because I protect even less now. I can now listen to music all day (not from headphones of course) no matter which ear the tinnitus is in, sometimes when I'm exercising pretty loud even, though not insane levels of course.

Just to give an idea how loud the tinnitus is, in the right when I compare it to my fridge (that's 6 months old) noise and I'm 1 meter away, the fridge is actually about 2x as loud, in the left things are much worse still and the tinnitus is like 2x as loud as the fridge, still a very far cry from the "suicide levels" I mentioned in the original post.

I started B-vitamins, only thing I've changed supplement wise since my last posts here, haven't noticed a huge effect. I'm exercising way more and my diet's been significantly better. That's all I can think of right now.
I'm thinking of buying this and trying it for my recently worsened hyperacusis/noxacusis. I've tried LLLT before, both at a clinic and I bought another machine, but had no luck with any of them. As I understand from your threads it could have actually had to do with the angle as well as the duration of my treatments though.

Anyways, just to make sure I'm using exactly what you are using I'd be willing to spend the 820 bucks. Could I ask you though, what is your treatment regiment? What nm, strength and duration are you using? And how long did it take before you saw noticeable improvement the first time? Thanks!
 
I've tried LLLT before, both at a clinic and I bought another machine, but had no luck with any of them.
If you already have a machine, one that's more expensive, then it's probably higher quality than the Konftec emLas. I don't think there's anything special about it other than it's more reasonably priced than Dr. Wilden's and some other devices. We might just be different responders.

I do think some people might be getting the angle wrong, but I also know that there's no way I could have gotten the angle in my left ear wrong if I had not pushed the earplug into my ear canal too deep and stretched out the opening of the canal way before I even got the laser, which didn't happen to my right ear.

There's probably nothing different in terms of light quality from Konftec and Dr. Wilden's device or more expensive well known ear lasers that have been talked about on this forum, if anything's different, the Konftec is probably worse. Maybe the only plus for Konftec is it has multiple wavelengths and afaik Wilden's has one. Perhaps you could just try the device you have once more? But if you're fine spending 820 for a small chance of success, then who am I to judge.
Could I ask you though, what is your treatment regiment? What nm, strength and duration are you using? And how long did it take before you saw noticeable improvement the first time? Thanks!
It's not static or a structured regimen. I used to do 25 minutes 660nm one day and the next day I'd do 808nm 15 minutes(because it's almost twice as powerful), for a while, I didn't skip days. Recently I've been doing a bit less, 23 and 13 minutes or so.

The best advice I got, from a friend, about the lasers is not to have a static regimen, you might need different durations of the laser at different times, I find I need less of the lasers as time passes. What's right for me might not be right for you. People need different doses of medicine for the same condition and sometimes even a totally different medication. I'd say laser might not work for everybody and the optimal "dose" is likely different from person to person as well.

So what's the answer? You need to experiment and see for yourself. Medications are a bit of a crapshoot for doctors and they just try until something sticks. You could take my durations as the baseline and expand on them. Another great advice I got was to develop somatic awareness, it's a bit tricky at first but I feel now how much laser I need, it's an actual feeling.

If I overdo it it's sort of a numb overstimulated feeling in the ears, if I undershoot it's kind of a craving for more. It can be very subtle for me, depending on how much I over or undershoot. Again, it might be different for different people, but that's how it is for me. It will probably take time to develop this awareness.

Consistency is what's made me have success in all likelihood. I've been incredibly consistent. Noticeable improvement came I'd say already 3 months in(hard to remember now), but I'm probably a very good responder. In the very beginning it got worse.

I already felt something happening after the first 5 minutes I did, not that the tinnitus got better, it got slightly worse probably, but I felt a kind of a craving for the laser, like something in my body or subconscious realized it was doing something good.

Good luck whatever you decide to do!
 
If you already have a machine, one that's more expensive, then it's probably higher quality than the Konftec emLas. I don't think there's anything special about it other than it's more reasonably priced than Dr. Wilden's and some other devices. We might just be different responders.

I do think some people might be getting the angle wrong, but I also know that there's no way I could have gotten the angle in my left ear wrong if I had not pushed the earplug into my ear canal too deep and stretched out the opening of the canal way before I even got the laser, which didn't happen to my right ear.

There's probably nothing different in terms of light quality from Konftec and Dr. Wilden's device or more expensive well known ear lasers that have been talked about on this forum, if anything's different, the Konftec is probably worse. Maybe the only plus for Konftec is it has multiple wavelengths and afaik Wilden's has one. Perhaps you could just try the device you have once more? But if you're fine spending 820 for a small chance of success, then who am I to judge.

It's not static or a structured regimen. I used to do 25 minutes 660nm one day and the next day I'd do 808nm 15 minutes(because it's almost twice as powerful), for a while, I didn't skip days. Recently I've been doing a bit less, 23 and 13 minutes or so.

The best advice I got, from a friend, about the lasers is not to have a static regimen, you might need different durations of the laser at different times, I find I need less of the lasers as time passes. What's right for me might not be right for you. People need different doses of medicine for the same condition and sometimes even a totally different medication. I'd say laser might not work for everybody and the optimal "dose" is likely different from person to person as well.

So what's the answer? You need to experiment and see for yourself. Medications are a bit of a crapshoot for doctors and they just try until something sticks. You could take my durations as the baseline and expand on them. Another great advice I got was to develop somatic awareness, it's a bit tricky at first but I feel now how much laser I need, it's an actual feeling.

If I overdo it it's sort of a numb overstimulated feeling in the ears, if I undershoot it's kind of a craving for more. It can be very subtle for me, depending on how much I over or undershoot. Again, it might be different for different people, but that's how it is for me. It will probably take time to develop this awareness.

Consistency is what's made me have success in all likelihood. I've been incredibly consistent. Noticeable improvement came I'd say already 3 months in(hard to remember now), but I'm probably a very good responder. In the very beginning it got worse.

I already felt something happening after the first 5 minutes I did, not that the tinnitus got better, it got slightly worse probably, but I felt a kind of a craving for the laser, like something in my body or subconscious realized it was doing something good.

Good luck whatever you decide to do!
Cool, thanks for your answer. I have the LK Combi Laser - similar to this one:

https://emilyluckylaser.en.ec21.com/LK_COMBI_Tinnitus_Laser_ENT--5266943_5274688.html

The thing is that those probes are a pain to get aimed and staying where you put them in the ears. I've been padding up pillows to put them on but it's a major hassle.

Since the one you're using has ear buds, they should be way easier to angle correctly, or? I read something about you not getting the angle right on one of your ears? Are there even different ways you could angle an ear bud like those?
 
Cool, thanks for your answer. I have the LK Combi Laser - similar to this one:

https://emilyluckylaser.en.ec21.com/LK_COMBI_Tinnitus_Laser_ENT--5266943_5274688.html

The thing is that those probes are a pain to get aimed and staying where you put them in the ears. I've been padding up pillows to put them on but it's a major hassle.

Since the one you're using has ear buds, they should be way easier to angle correctly, or? I read something about you not getting the angle right on one of your ears? Are there even different ways you could angle an ear bud like those?
That makes sense that they're a pain. I'm sorry I don't have good advice on how to aim the ones you have and keep them consistent. It'd have to be some sort of a contraption with some sort of a helmet or something? Not sure. I believe the emLas is probably easier to angle correctly just based on the picture you provided, yes.

For me it's very easy now with my Konftec emLas. I have self adhesive fabric on both wavelength probes on the part that the probes touch the earlobe, the one I put in the left has more tape to lift it at the right angle, though the right one has some tape as well just to be sure. I've been doing this ever since I found out I had messed up the left ear.

Normally it doesn't matter which ear you put which probe, but I always have to make sure the left ear gets the one with more tape. The only way to really miss the cochlea, I believe, is when the probe is too low and at a too sharp of an angle with your head(the angle that I mean being sharp is obviously below the probe not above).

That's exactly what happened to me, the probe was hanging too much down and the beam ended projecting too much upwards and missed the cochlea or at least it got a lot less of the laser, I don't believe it missed it completely. You can't really miss it from putting the probe in at an angle too much to the left or right, unless you really try for some reason and even then it's pretty much impossible, I don't think the probe would stay in the ear well if you'd do that.

Another thing I want to add is, people have cut the base of the rubber tip of the Konftec emLas probes, that alone makes it much harder to miss the cochlea because the beam becomes much wider. I could not do that because the probes didn't really stay in the ear after I did it for some reason, but for most who did that it was fine. Konftec will send you many rubber tips.

Like I mentioned before in this thread, the Wilden's device has those hooks that attach behind the ear, I'm almost certain that I'd not have messed up the left ear with the Wilden's laser because of that. Though there was no way of knowing this at the time and had I known about this whole problem could have just used the tape and Konftec device. Hindsight is always 20/20. I hope you get some relief some way or another.
 
@SoundB0und, I just checked the specs of my Combi-Laser and the mW is quite a bit higher than on the Konftec laser.

Mine has:
650nm - 120mW
808nm - 450mW

This is the same specs as a clinic offering this in Sweden and Norway that I know of.

Maybe I need less time than you then per session?

I was told to use it for 8-10 minutes on each nm/mW.
 
Maybe I need less time than you then per session?
Yes that would obviously make sense. 450 mW for 808nm is 5 times as powerful as Konftec with the same wavelength.

Like I explained in my first reply, I experiment and I don't have a set static regimen and what is good for me might not be optimal for you imo.
 
DISCLAIMER: This post is not medical advice. Please consult your doctor before trying any of the alternative treatments mentioned here. I will not be held responsible for any damages, physical or otherwise, resulting from anybody trying these treatments.

I thought about not writing a success story but I feel I have valuable knowledge to share, knowledge that I wish I had when I first got my horrific tinnitus.

I have mentioned only ototoxicity in my profile but thinking back I was abusing my ears for years with loud music. The antidepressant I was on for 6 years probably made my hearing loss a bit, if not a lot more easily acquirable, but a lot of the damage was from noise exposure as well.

I had mild tinnitus that crept up to a higher volume within 6 years, but still in early 2018 it was very manageable. I could listen to music and ride in a car without protection and it wasn't a huge problem. I almost never thought about my tinnitus. I sort of had bigger problems in my life, all that changed in March 2018.

I was put on a very new medication in February that year. At first things were great, but I soon found out what real intrusive tinnitus was. I had 2 things going on, what we think happened was the new medication caused rapid ototoxicity and also I had a bad cold and there began my severe tinnitus journey.

Within a couple of weeks my tinnitus ramped up to what I call "suicide levels". It was absolute torture, even for Tinnitus Talk I think I'd been a very bad case. I also acquired very severe hyperacusis. I soon found myself in the ENT office and it was discovered that my hearing loss was 85 decibels at 8kHz.

Even the ENT, who probably sees bad cases all the time, was visibly shocked at how bad my hearing was at my age(late 20s). I just got told the usual, "you're gonna have to live with it".

At my worst, I could not read a book because of how loud the tinnitus was and my hyperacusis was so bad I had earmuffs on when using the tap. I was up 3 nights in a row(meaning not a minute of sleep) taking 6 times the dose of sleep med each night that usually knocks me out cold. Riding in a car with double protection spiked the tinnitus a lot.

Dishes were incredibly painful. The worst were "synthetic" sounds, meaning sounds from speakers. Listening to music so low I could not hear the words would spike the tinnitus within 3 seconds to crazy levels.

My doctor who prescribed me the med told me that this medication should not cause tinnitus and to not even quit it. Against her judgment I did quit the medication and my tinnitus stopped getting worse. After coming back from the ENT I was not phased, I thought for sure on the forums or online there'd be talk of effective alternative treatments.

It was only after I had read some forum posts from newbies who came to the forum with their plight and veterans who said the same thing my ENT had told me that I became really worried. I don't think I could have habituated to my tinnitus, it was too loud.

Also, had I not taken the steps I will soon talk about, it would have surely gotten worse, because even though I have lived like a hermit to protect my ears, I was still exposed to several loud situations. What I will say is, incredibly good recoveries are possible, in 2020, before regenerative medicine and without neuromodulation devices.

At the moment, though I don't have silence, and probably will not have it for a while, things are not far off in my right ear(the reason my right is better than left is because of me doing one of the treatments wrong, something which I will get into soon).

There will be people saying "the things you have done to treat yourself didn't work and it was just the normal habituation and healing process that happens". Part of the healing was normal plus habituation, but I'm absolutely sure I accelerated and amplified the end result of my healing by a lot.

I think had I done even more research and found some very beneficial things sooner and tried them, I would have made a complete recovery. My diet could have been better, could have exercised more, many things like that as well.

I joined the forum on the 29th of April 2018, the reason for that was that my sign ups were caught by the spam filter and thus I was unable to sign up. Changing my email, my IP, the device I registered from etc didn't enable me to sign up. That is why there were no hysterical posts by me on this forum early on, I was panicking pretty bad and thought there's a very good chance my life is over.

It came clear to me early on, from reading the forum for a couple of months, that what you do early on is very important, like with HBOT or other things. HBOT was unavailable for me. Back then the laser threads were more active so they caught my eye fast. 2 months in I realized I probably will have to buy the laser, but put it off because almost everybody, including a verified doctor, said they were snake oil scams.

2,5 months in I had a spike to my tinnitus due to loud noise exposure and it became clear to me that I had not much to lose, because if the laser didn't work I'd be dead anyways and the 800 euros I was going to spend on it, well, I could not have taken it to the grave with me. I ordered the laser and started lasering 3 months from my initial spike.

I didn't have much faith in the treatment overall, I was just hoping to get some relief for the years before regenerative medicine comes out. The tinnitus spiked at first and again I was unable to sleep even with sleep medication on some nights, it was also summer and very hot so that didn't help sleep.

Gradually things settled down and got better. I was very careful with protecting my ears and super diligent with the laser. Then I found out I had made a horrific mistake, where I missed or at least exposed the cochlea in my left ear to much less of the laser. You can read more about it here:

https://www.tinnitustalk.com/threads/low-level-laser-therapy-lllt-for-tinnitus-%E2%80%94-long-lasting-everyday-home-practiced-experiences.25110/page-7#post-390133

This inadvertently and unfortunately proved to me that the laser worked and worked well, that it wasn't only the normal healing process.

I continued doing research and scouring Tinnitus Talk for different things that could help, because with tinnitus, the sooner you try things the better. Here's everything I tried in my tinnitus journey, I tried to make the list chronological but I'm not sure it is:

Ginkgo - made tinnitus worse.

Betaserc - did nothing.

Apple Cider Vinegar - did nothing.

Ear Tone by New Nordic, pills - Did very little, maybe 10-15 percent reduction, not worth the steep price.

ACRN - made tinnitus worse(maybe did it wrong).

Notched Sound Therapy - helped a bit.

Konftec Laser - responsible for, I'd say, at least 75 percent of the recovery, if not more. I'm still lasering every day and have for almost 2 years now.

Turmeric With Curcumin – helped but had to quit very soon because of side effects (psoriasis worsening rapidly).

Nicotinamide Riboside - very good effect, but I'm very sensitive to supplements and couldn't tolerate the side effects. Took only 10 doses. It is the most undervalued alternative treatment on TT imo.

NAC - Good effect, got very bad heart trouble and had to quit.

R. David Case Tinnitus Mix sound file - definitely worth a shot if you don't have hyperacusis. Seemed to work the first time around at first but second time I tried it about a year later didn't have the same effect.

Lion's Mane - Did nothing.

CoQ10 - mild effect, potentiates the laser.

Oxygen Concentrator while doing cardio (exercise bike) - HBOT was not available, had a good effect but again had to quit soon because of side effects.

Intermittent Fasting - helped a lot already, even though lots of time had passed since I got tinnitus.

Cold Showers – Similar to intermittent fasting, helps with cumulative effects. First month or so I noticed no difference, but almost 6 months of intermittent fasting and cold showers seemed to have worked well. Had to quit cold showers but still doing IF.

Hemp CBD Oil – massive temporary spike.

Probiotics – I didn't take them for tinnitus relief, took them to heal my gut as I had pretty bad GERD. Surprisingly, in addition to my GERD being fixed, they helped tinnitus quite a bit as well.

(All of these things have a thread on Tinnitus Talk)

I also have my eye on BPC-157, a synthetic peptide. I probably won't try it because my situation is already so good I can go out without hearing protection to quieter venues where they play music and the peptide has its dangers, but it's good to know I have an ace in the back pocked in case things were to get bad again after an accident. Though it would be interesting to see if it would cure me completely.

That is all I can think of right now, probably missing a couple of things and it's not a comprehensive list of everything worth trying, just the stuff I tried. Obviously there's things like PRP, stem cells and Lenire, which I am not opposed to trying, but I didn't have the money or in the case of Lenire the hearing ability necessary to try it.

Not counting the countless vitamins and minerals I took, most helpful of which have been Magnesium and Zinc. As you can see, I had to quit half or more things that worked well, because of side effects. Most people, almost all people, won't have that issue. I am still improving, after over 2 years since my spike, but the gains have gotten really slow because of the amount of time passed.

Had everything been tolerable, I would easily have made a complete recovery from 10/10 tinnitus with both ears I believe, maybe even silence. I've noticed over the years that all sorts of treatments have good effects on me more often and usually yield better results than for the average person, but I also have much worse side-effects than the average person.

Even if out of the things that had a good effect that I had to quit 2-3 had worked without intolerable side effects, or if I hadn't messed up with the laser, I would be resuming usual life probably. Yes, the tinnitus alternative treatment options are rife with scams, one needs to exercise some common sense, but there are things that help. If they don't, it's a small investment for big potential gains.

I believe my recovery isn't too impressive. In my opinion, most people, had they tried all of those things within the right timeframe (meaning soon, within 3 months or less) after getting tinnitus while being careful and protecting well, would have had a better recovery, because I had to quit so many things. Some things on that list are obviously more worth trying and sooner than others, a couple might not be worth trying at all.

My tinnitus in the right ear(which I would also have in my left had I not made the mistake) is back to pre spike levels, perhaps even better. I'm hoping to make some gains still with the left one which is worse. My tinnitus switches ears daily and fluctuates a lot. If I had to put numbers to it, if in my right, it's 0.5-1.5 severity and in my left about 2-3.5. My hyperacusis is virtually nonexistent during day to day activities.

More recently my left ear has been catching up to the right, it's still much worse but the right ear isn't improving much, not sure if it has improved at all within the last half a year or so. I attribute that to the right ear probably being already at the level I had before my horrific spike where it was at a very low volume tinnitus for 6 years.

Because I had the mild tinnitus for so long I doubt my right ear will improve much anymore, but it doesn't have to, it's at an amazingly low level at the moment with almost no hyperacusis and very mild reactivity.

I'd say I did TONS of things wrong with my recovery. I waited a bit too long to buy the laser, because people(most of whom hadn't even tried it) said it was snake oil, messed up the left ear, I should have done even more research into things and tried more things, sooner, better diet and exercise routine, etc.

There was a thread a while back where people could vote how much money they would spend on a cure, can't find it now. Most people were willing to pay 10 000 dollars or more for a cure. I have spent less than 2000 dollars on my ears.

One of the most important things is also how well I protected my hearing, most people would have called it overprotecting over here. I was willing to basically have no life for almost 2 years in order to recover from this.

It seems to me that a lot of people try a couple of things and then give up, if they even do that. In my opinion that is not the way to go. If you get relief of 10 percent from 1 thing that is already very good, if more then even better.

Combine a few, as long as they're safe, and you'll have a significant improvement of your situation. And remember, the first couple of months are crucial.

In my opinion people are too stingy with spending time and money on their health, it is the greatest investment you can make.
Thank you for sharing your story. It brings me joy knowing that you've managed to overcome your affliction with your own efforts, and sparks confidence that I and others can do the same.

I had one question in particular for you regarding supplementation only (because my case is not as severe as yours was), when you say certain supplements helped, are you referring to addressing your tinnitus directly, or just your perception of it relative to other health benefits they offered? Nicotinamide Riboside, NAC, and Lion's Mane specifically I thought might help my case but I'm becoming conscious of just throwing money away on too many cheap fixes.

I also have a bottle of Turmeric/Curcumin next to me and was wondering how long I'd need to take it before I see an improvement or decline.
 
Which Konfec laser did you recommend that I buy? The 15 commercial laser treatments I did in Florida helped me a lot. It took me from 9 to a 2 I would say. I still have spikes after I work out, ride my loud motorcycle etc but it relaxes within a hour or so back down to normal levels. I want to continue and try more home sessions...
Where did you go for your laser treatments, and how did you get your tinnitus?
 

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