Ginger for Noxacusis

[chinup]

@chinup, could you please post a more detailed account of what you did to improve so much?

Your story really is interesting and it could help others in a similar situation.

Did you avoid sound for a while by any chance?

Sure, here's everything I do during a severe setback:

1. Initially I wear heavy duty foam earplugs during all waking hours (this is torture because it magnifies my tinnitus 10x but it has to be done).

2. Avoid as much sound as possible during the day, but particularly avoid anything from a small, cheap speaker like the plague. No talking on a phone, no watching tv thru built-in tv speakers, no laptop speakers, etc. Try to avoid horns, yells, alarms, blaring music... just common sense stuff that is clearly dangerous for us
.
3. Sleep with a pink noise track looping on Spotify. I use my soundsystem, not headphones or cheap speakers. The speakers are about 8-10 away from me. Low volume. This gives me a little noise exposure each night so that I can start to slowly desensitize. It also drowns out my tinnitus thankfully.

4. Regularly throughout each day I consume ginger in some form. There's no special trick or recipe or preparation. I've found that everything benefits me, from ginger ale to ginger beer to ginger tea to ginger gummies to ginger honey. Fresh ginger as well of course. This really prevents my noxacusis burning from getting too bad. It doesn't seem to affect my stabbing pain loudness hyperacusis which is what most folks have when they talk about hyperacusis. So if there are loud sounds it still hurts like hell but only temporarily.

5. Spend a ton of time in the woods on hikes. I work from home due to my conditions so I can go out into nature in the middle of the day thankfully. This helps my mental health immensely.

6. As the months tick by I slowly start to reintroduce myself to sound. I switch from heavy duty foam earplugs to musician's earplugs. I listen to tv at low volumes thru a nice stereo system. I play games at low volume. I continue to consume ginger and avoid cheap speakers and super loud sounds. If my ears hurt I go back to protecting with heavier earplugs and avoid stuff for a few days. It's a drawn out process but I do think protecting 24/7 forever is not the answer.

7. Gradually I reintroduce music at low volumes, mostly chill stuff and very little electric guitar.

8. As the months continue and the improvement continues I gradually reintroduce slightly more energetic music. Eventually I can listen to 75-80% of music but I still avoid old recordings and stuff like metal or grunge rock.

9. Around the 5-6 month mark I start going to low-key bars or restaurants once or twice a week with hearing protection. For some reason the din of a bar/restaurant really helps my hyperacusis the next day. It's like a reset or something. Others around the internet have spoken about this mysterious effect. I also start to listen to tv at something closer to medium volume. I start to watch more sports with the volume on. I think once you get the initial constant noxacusis under control you start to benefit from exposing more and more. At least that's how it works for me thus far. More exposure is benefiting me at this point. But nothing crazy.

9. I try to avoid caffeine and chocolate and stuff as it spikes my hyperacusis.

10. Mentally I do some visualization techniques where I imagine myself listening to really loud guitar music and loving it and not being afraid or in pain. I have no clue if this helps at all but it's 5-10 minutes every couple days so it's not a huge investment. When you start doing this you'll be amazed how hard it is to not associated imagined loud volumes with pain, it's quite sad actually.

In general I do think time is the MOST important factor, and the second most important factor is avoiding sound over 80 dB at all costs, as well as avoiding harsh sounds such as the cheap speakers at any volume. Again I've had to rearrange my life significantly due to this condition. I work from home, I live in a chill college town instead of a major city, I haven't traveled much (thankfully COVID-19 made this not much of a big deal the past couple years), I don't have kids yet, etc. You may not be in a position to do all of the things I've done, but hopefully you can get some help from this.

Also I'm not a doctor or a hearing professional. Use these techniques at your own risk and be careful; we are all different. If it was as simple as popping some ginger every day this wouldn't be a worrisome condition at all...

 

[chinup]

I would get instant fluttering, like a butterfly in my ear, which is the tensor tympani basically spasming.

I can't comment on raw turmeric although high dose curcumin supplements do seem to help me.

But in all honesty nothing makes sense. The fact @chinup seems to be getting better from ginger while my TTTS flares up goes to show how idiopathic and weird this condition can be. It could also be a matter of subtype. I have a pain component with sound-induced trigeminal neuralgia, which may explain why that gets worse. I'm not sure if @chinup has the same presentation or just loudness?

I have bouts of severe noxacusis (24/7 sunburn-like pain deep in the ear) combined with severe loudness hyperacusis (feels like you're being stabbed when you hear certain sounds like clinks from the kitchen, horns, loud music, dog barks, etc.) Sometimes it's so bad that the shower is unbearable. But thankfully I've recovered multiple times from multiple setbacks, and have found a decent system to regain some of my life.

But yes I am recovering from burning *noxacusis* as well as loudness hyperacusis, which seems uncommon around these parts as most folks with burning noxacusis appear to only get worse and worse with continued exposure to sound...

 

[chinup]

@chinup, could you go through details of how you prepare the ginger tea? Do you drain ginger once boiled in water? And does it have to be fresh ginger or can it be ginger teabags mixed with other herbs? What are you specifically preparing? Thanks.

It's a premade tea. I literally drop the teabags into hot water, add honey, add some milk, done. The specific brand of tea is called The Republic of Tea decaf ginger peach. But I also get relief from virtually anything else with ginger in it, regardless of preparation. So don't think it's some magic tea or anything like that. Also it's more like popping an Ibuprofen. I haven't tried it yet but I bet if I stopped consuming ginger entirely for a week I'd be feeling worse than I do now.

 

[GeorgeLG]

Good to hear. Be sure to use musician's earplugs while playing. I haven't played much the past 6 months but starting to get back into my keyboard at low volumes.

@chinup, I have actually increased my time in the studio by using foam earplugs instead of musicians earplugs. I also record and mix at very low volumes, everything mellow and good speakers/room (as you mention often. Track with speakers and a noise gate, no cans. I leave everything dull sounding until final mixing and mastering because as you have said shrill distorted sounds are bad. Mute cymbals until the end. My guitar tone is much mellower than it used to be but quite nice. Middle or neck pickup only. The plugs only come out for final mixing and mastering.

George

 

[KDMG]

Sure, here's everything I do during a severe setback:

1. Initially I wear heavy duty foam earplugs during all waking hours (this is torture because it magnifies my tinnitus 10x but it has to be done).

@chinup, thanks for posting! This is very helpful.

Like you, I also work from home and luckily am in a small town so can go for walks without much bother.

It's really hard trying to work out what noise to block out.

For instance, my computer has a fan which gives me a slight tingle on my face.

It's barely noticeable, but I still wonder whether it's good or bad.

How do you handle Zoom meetings considering you work from home?

 

[Aaron91]

Just wanted to chime in here and say that ginger flares up my TTTS, which in turn makes my hyperacusis worse.

Initially, this didn't make much sense to me as the tonic tensor is linked to the trigeminal nerve, whereas taste is transmitted by the facial nerve and glossopharyngeal nerve (or at least so I thought).

It was only upon further investigation did I find out that although the facial nerve and glossopharyngeal nerves are responsible for taste, it is the trigeminal nerve that is responsible for transmitting the specific signal for heat/spice when we eat capsaisin (the active component of chilli peppers). This activates the pain pathway, hence why we react badly to hot chilli. Turns out the molecular structure for gingerol (the active component in ginger) is very similar to capsaisin, which in turn allows it to bind to the same TRP ion channel.

TLDR: Ginger can flare up TTTS.

Wanted to post an update to the above.

As mentioned previously, ginger (in isolated, single doses) seems to make my symptoms worse for the reasons I gave above. I did find it interesting though that others on here seem to have benefit. So I dug into this a bit more and it turns out that capsaisin can actually have (long term) pain relieving effects by reversibly depleting sensory nerve endings of substance P and by reducing the density of epidermal nerve fibers, again in a reversible fashion. In other words, if you take capsaisin for long enough, the nerve endings become desensitised and can no longer uptake substance P. This means the pain pathway is exhausted/blocked. This particularly interesting given that substance P has been theorised by Norena to be implicated in the pain symptoms arising from acoustic shock and tonic tensor tympani syndrome (although he now proposes in his latest paper to drop this phrase entirely and replace it with hyperactive middle ear syndrome given that the stapedius muscle also seems to sometimes be implicated).

I therefore wonder if one simply takes ginger or hot chili peppers consistently enough, they may see long-term benefit in pain (but short term aggravation).

 

[NewLionel]

Wanted to post an update to the above.

As mentioned previously, ginger (in isolated, single doses) seems to make my symptoms worse for the reasons I gave above. I did find it interesting though that others on here seem to have benefit. So I dug into this a bit more and it turns out that capsaisin can actually have (long term) pain relieving effects by reversibly depleting sensory nerve endings of substance P and by reducing the density of epidermal nerve fibers, again in a reversible fashion. In other words, if you take capsaisin for long enough, the nerve endings become desensitised and can no longer uptake substance P. This means the pain pathway is exhausted/blocked. This particularly interesting given that substance P has been theorised by Norena to be implicated in the pain symptoms arising from acoustic shock and tonic tensor tympani syndrome (although he now proposes in his latest paper to drop this phrase entirely and replace it with hyperactive middle ear syndrome given that the stapedius muscle also seems to sometimes be implicated).

I therefore wonder if one simply takes ginger or hot chili peppers consistently enough, they may see long-term benefit in pain (but short term aggravation).

So Capsaicin supplements are the best way to take it? I might give this a go/very interesting post.

 

[Aaron91]

So Capsaicin supplements are the best way to take it? I might give this a go/very interesting post.

I'm honestly not entirely sure. My post was somewhat speculative. I know that capsaicin is used in topical creams for pain relief, which would suggest this needs to be targeted, but obviously we can't use those for our condition. As for taking it in supplement form, I am trying to figure as to whether one would need to actually experience the tongue burn, as that is what stimulates the trigeminal nerve - I am not sure how you would get that targeted effect from a supplement. I am not advising anyone to go ahead and ingest a bunch of chili peppers on a daily basis, but if I were to do this then that is probably how I would go about it. I welcome any debate on this though as I am merely speculating.

Edit: I also wanted to state that I'm not sure this effect would last if one were to stop consuming the peppers, as I imagine the neurons would return to their previous excited state. However, blocking pain for an amount of time could aid in calming down the sympathetic system and the role that plays in hypervigilance/hyperactivity, so again this is speculation but perhaps there could be long term benefits after coming off the peppers (assuming they even work in the first place).

 

[SmallRonnie]

I have bouts of severe noxacusis (24/7 sunburn-like pain deep in the ear) combined with severe loudness hyperacusis (feels like you're being stabbed when you hear certain sounds like clinks from the kitchen, horns, loud music, dog barks, etc.) Sometimes it's so bad that the shower is unbearable. But thankfully I've recovered multiple times from multiple setbacks, and have found a decent system to regain some of my life.

But yes I am recovering from burning *noxacusis* as well as loudness hyperacusis, which seems uncommon around these parts as most folks with burning noxacusis appear to only get worse and worse with continued exposure to sound...

I have burning noxacusis 24/7 right now and after initially getting it I did recover from it after about 2 months. Then a setback sent me back to square one. I was recovering again and another setback sent me back to square one again. I pushed too hard it seems but I was definitely getting a lot better over time so I'm having a more positive outlook now about recovering again.

I just ate 4g of fresh Ginger so let's see how that goes!

 

[SmallRonnie]

I ate 5g of fresh ginger today and it done nothing for my noxacusis. People noticed results over a longer time period?

 

[Aaron91]

I ate 5g of fresh ginger today and it done nothing for my noxacusis. People noticed results over a longer time period?

Try to take it for two weeks at least:

Daily ginger consumption eases muscle pain by 25 percent, study suggests

Assuming ginger's effect is related to CGRP and neurogenic inflammation, I imagine it could take a while to see some benefit as the effect is probably cumulative, particularly for those of us who have had this a long time. I've also decided to give it a go and it's only been a week.

 

[SmallRonnie]

Try to take it for two weeks at least:

Daily ginger consumption eases muscle pain by 25 percent, study suggests

Assuming ginger's effect is related to CGRP and neurogenic inflammation, I imagine it could take a while to see some benefit as the effect is probably cumulative, particularly for those of us who have had this a long time. I've also decided to give it a go and it's only been a week.

The annoying thing is I am not going to only try the ginger on its own because I don't want to wait so long to see if it works so it's hard to know if it's the ginger that helps or something else I've done. Seems to be a common occurrence where people never know exactly why they get better. The getting better part almost always happens though.

I have had hyperacusis for many years but it was only very mild. This severe type now is completely different.

 

[Marshall]

I have had hyperacusis for many years but it was only very mild. This severe type now is completely different.

What made it severe?

 

[SmallRonnie]

What made it severe?

I really don't know exactly what it was. It might have been headphone use because that was slowly causing more pain over time.

Maybe it was the COVID-19 Pfizer vaccine booster. I was under a huge amount of stress at work too at the time. I thought my PC was making a very high pitched noise which might have been that too or else that was just tinnitus, not sure.

I would lean towards it being the headphones. Mainly I had one massive trauma years ago, then lots of smaller things which are usually normal, but just tipped me over.

Something happened due to those things I mentioned anyway. Last November I had ear fullness, tinnitus and worse pain in my ear all together. The fullness and pain did actually go away after 2 months but the tinnitus stayed.

Now the pain is back worse than ever after a setback. The pain happens much more easily now. I'm feeling hopeful that the pain will at least ease over time again. Never using headphones ever again. I need to be more careful.

I was getting too cocky I think, doing too many things without earplugs and then sent back to square one.

 

[Marshall]

I really don't know exactly what it was. It might have been headphone use because that was slowly causing more pain over time.

Maybe it was the COVID-19 Pfizer vaccine booster. I was under a huge amount of stress at work too at the time. I thought my PC was making a very high pitched noise which might have been that too or else that was just tinnitus, not sure.

I would lean towards it being the headphones. Mainly I had one massive trauma years ago, then lots of smaller things which are usually normal, but just tipped me over.

Something happened due to those things I mentioned anyway. Last November I had ear fullness, tinnitus and worse pain in my ear all together. The fullness and pain did actually go away after 2 months but the tinnitus stayed.

Now the pain is back worse than ever after a setback. The pain happens much more easily now. I'm feeling hopeful that the pain will at least ease over time again. Never using headphones ever again. I need to be more careful.

I was getting too cocky I think, doing too many things without earplugs and then sent back to square one.

From the countless stories I've read on here you can never be too careful.

 

[GeorgeLG]

I thought my PC was making a very high pitched noise which might have been that too or else that was just tinnitus, not sure.

I began to notice during periods of a setback that my desktop computer was making my ear pain worse. I upgraded to quieter fans with fan speed management software and now my computer is a non-issue. Recording and mixing music would keep me in the headphones for up to 10 hours a day. I started to notice the early stages of what I have now. I worked very hard over the last year to develop techniques to be able to avoid headphones completely. I have not worn them since this happened.

George

 

[SmallRonnie]

From the countless stories I've read on here you can never be too careful.

I will be more careful in the same situations again for sure. Having earplugs more readily available and such. It had been a long time since I had such bad ear pain, I thought I was getting better.

Just living at a quieter volume is really fine as long as the pain does subside.

 

[SmallRonnie]

I began to notice during periods of a setback that my desktop computer was making my ear pain worse. I upgraded to quieter fans with fan speed management software and now my computer is a non-issue. Recording and mixing music would keep me in the headphones for up to 10 hours a day. I started to notice the early stages of what I have now. I worked very hard over the last year to develop techniques to be able to avoid headphones completely. I have not worn them since this happened.

George

I think the fridge in my room might be aggravating my ears right now but really not sure. Even wearing earplugs and earmuffs it still hurts so I'm really not sure. Will probably just have to wait it out.

Earplugs tend to hurt my ears after wearing them for a while. Might be the same with earmuffs too, some people say the pressure isn't good.

I'm just about to install a new PC myself. The thing is top spec so fans need to be on high. I got a silent case though and it has a lot of water cooling. Hopefully it's fine.

I do have confidence I'll get over this setback again though.

 

[GeorgeLG]

I think the fridge in my room might be aggravating my ears right now but really not sure. Even wearing earplugs and earmuffs it still hurts so I'm really not sure. Will probably just have to wait it out.

Earplugs tend to hurt my ears after wearing them for a while. Might be the same with earmuffs too, some people say the pressure isn't good.

I'm just about to install a new PC myself. The thing is top spec so fans need to be on high. I got a silent case though and it has a lot of water cooling. Hopefully it's fine.

I do have confidence I'll get over this setback again though.

With lots of heat pipes and radiator fins the fans can run very low unless you're overclocking and gaming. My 120 mm Noctua CPU fan idles at 400 rpm with a CPU core temp of 39 C. At full tilt music editing the fan goes up to maybe 700 rpm. I don't know much about water cooling.

Ya it's a dance with pain/plugs/muffs. It helps me if I minimize foam plugs and use bigger muffs that barely touch the ears.

George

 

[SmallRonnie]

With lots of heat pipes and radiator fins the fans can run very low unless you're overclocking and gaming. My 120 mm Noctua CPU fan idles at 400 rpm with a CPU core temp of 39 C. At full tilt music editing the fan goes up to maybe 700 rpm. I don't know much about water cooling.

Ya it's a dance with pain/plugs/muffs. It helps me if I minimize foam plugs and use bigger muffs that barely touch the ears.

George

My PC is overclocked but I'll probably take it off. Gaming is the main thing that sends into overdrive for me yes. I'm just unboxing it now today, I got someone else to assemble it for me even though I can myself. I'll probably build it myself next time.

Woke up today with less ear pain so hoping it continues like this now while I still protect a lot.

 

[chinup]

Try to take it for two weeks at least:

Daily ginger consumption eases muscle pain by 25 percent, study suggests

Assuming ginger's effect is related to CGRP and neurogenic inflammation, I imagine it could take a while to see some benefit as the effect is probably cumulative, particularly for those of us who have had this a long time. I've also decided to give it a go and it's only been a week.

I came back to this thread to make sure that people try ginger for a good while before giving up on it. I realized that I had been drinking diet ginger ale for like a month straight before I made the connection. Since then I've had ginger every single day. But that initial month might have been a crucial build-up period.

 

[Ben Winders]

With lots of heat pipes and radiator fins the fans can run very low unless you're overclocking and gaming. My 120 mm Noctua CPU fan idles at 400 rpm with a CPU core temp of 39 C. At full tilt music editing the fan goes up to maybe 700 rpm. I don't know much about water cooling.

Ya it's a dance with pain/plugs/muffs. It helps me if I minimize foam plugs and use bigger muffs that barely touch the ears.

George

I had the same problem with my computer fans spiking my humming tinnitus (as it is connected with my high frequency tinnitus/hearing loss).

I bought an M1 MacBook. Problem solved. No more fans.

And I play games on it, I connect a huge monitor to it, watch 4K videos on it, and the fans never kick in.

 

[GeorgeLG]

I had the same problem with my computer fans spiking my humming tinnitus (as it is connected with my high frequency tinnitus/hearing loss).

I bought an M1 MacBook. Problem solved. No more fans.

And I play games on it, I connect a huge monitor to it, watch 4K videos on it, and the fans never kick in.

That sounds really good.

 

[lymebite]

I wonder how much dose matters. Ginger shots seem to have vastly greater quantities of ginger than have been discussed in this thread.

For example one shot of Vive Organic Pure Boost Ginger seems to have 40 grams of ginger. Versus ginger tea which has maybe 1,500 mg.

Big difference! More than 25x the dose of ginger. 40,000 mg of ginger in the shot versus 1,500 mg of ginger in the tea. If I am doing the math correctly.

 

[Olly132]

I have loads of the stuff, I just eat it raw. Not to everyone's liking I guess. It normally gives me hiccups for a few minutes but it certainly helps. The more, the merrier, if you ask me. I have a large chunk about every 3-4 hours with no side effects (I think).

 

[momus]

I wonder how much dose matters. Ginger shots seem to have vastly greater quantities of ginger than have been discussed in this thread

That's dependent on the quality of the ginger. All ginger roots are not created equally, and there are different types of ginger. The effects are different whether it is heated, raw, or cooked. I generally put it raw on my salads, it's just cut into slices w/ a knife. If I'm cooking an Asian type dish, it goes in the fry pan along w/ everything else, but it goes in last. I've never noticed any effect on my tinnitus no matter how it was prepared or how big the quantity was.

 

[MadeleineHope]

So, I think I've figured out why ginger can work. It's a COX-2 inhibitor, essentially more selective NSAID. It also decreases CGRP. Interestingly, it also increases substance P, which can't be good I imagine, @StoneInFocus, @haha ear go eeee?

 

[chinup]

Updating again to say I've made huge strides in my recovery. I am now playing electric guitar almost daily at decent volume for several hours, sometimes with distortion on for 10-15 seconds here and there. Always with ear protection of course. This is something I never thought I'd be able to do again for the rest of my life. It's an emotional endeavor for me to sit and play after so many years of suffering.

I would say my ears are the strongest they have been since 2019 when I first got severe hyperacusis. I think a combination of time, protection, and slow re-exposure have been the main catalysts. I also drink a couple bottles of ginger beer daily, along with chunks of fresh ginger in my daily smoothies. The ginger beer brand is Fever Tree. It burns significantly more than other ginger products I consume. Sometimes I wonder if the actual burning sensation is what helps; who knows...

These days I can basically do everything I could do before getting severe hyperacusis, with the exception of playing live music and going to concerts or the movies. But I can go to restaurants, bars, family gatherings, even weddings. Life is much, much better at this point, and the task now is to be grateful for the progress I've made and not get "greedy" for louder activities. I always make sure to take entire days off a couple times a week where I don't do anything loud whatsoever. This seems to increase my loudness tolerance a lot, almost like resting the day after you lift weights allows your muscles to get stronger.

I don't visit Tinnitus Talk obsessively anymore so I might take a few months off before updating again. Keep in mind progress has been nonlinear and there have been small to medium setbacks along the way but fortunately nothing catastrophic in a couple years.

 

[GG_Ear]

@chinup, your story is very encouraging. Thank you for sharing.

Do you still wear earplugs at restaurants, bars, family gatherings and weddings?

I will never go to a bar, nightclub or concert again but would really like to be able to go to restaurants and cafes etc. without earplugs, and to talk to people.

 

[StoneInFocus]

I will never go to a bar, nightclub or concert again but would really like to be able to go to restaurants and cafes etc. without earplugs, and to talk to people.

If you get custom ones made, wearing earplugs is not bothersome at all. Just a tip.