Going to a Rock Concert with Tinnitus

[Bill Bauer]

I'd like to think I know what I'm talking about, especially when it comes to concerts

Your T hasn't faded in all of those years. That might be because you Don't know what you are talking about when it comes to concerts.

 

[Bill Bauer]

With due respect its easy to find this forum by just typing tinnitus.

People might be looking for medical sites, and not for forums.

Like with tinnitus some that continue their lifestyle with loud sounds and will pay the consequences while the majority of others it may not have any significant repercussions. No one can tell what the outcome will be unless there is any a large scale studies carried out.

I agree.

If someone thinks that this is a risk that they are willing to take, then that's fine, but they shouldn't complain if they live to regret this decision.

a more sensible message is there is a risk but just be ultra careful.

That's my message: There's risk. If you want to expose yourself to this risk, in my opinion you are insane, but of course different people have different preferences, so you should do what feels right to you.

 

[Gman]

@Gman
What a deeply ignorant statement

Great advice you're giving. Keep it up.

 

[Greg Clarke]

"Your T hasn't faded in all of those years. That might be because you Don't know what you are talking about when it comes to concerts."

My tinnitus was never going to fade. Aside from the initial year or two I've largely gotten on with life. What's wrong with the occasional bit of positivity lads, serious question?

@Gman That all you got?

 

[Gman]

"Your T hasn't faded in all of those years. That might be because you Don't know what you are talking about when it comes to concerts."

My tinnitus was never going to fade. Aside from the initial year or two I've largely gotten on with life. What's wrong with the occasional bit of positivity lads, serious question?

@Gman That all you got?

Everyone is free to do whatever they want to, but this is a support forum where people go to for help. It's moronic to brand this as the "worst place" for advice on going to concerts just because some members advise against going. What the f@#k do you expect?! For everyone to say it's fine to go? Don't be a prat.

 

[Bill Bauer]

My tinnitus was never going to fade.

If you had protected your ears during the first year, then perhaps the above is true. Otherwise, you will never know. That's another reason to protect your ears early on.

What's wrong with the occasional bit of positivity lads, serious question?

The positivity (e.g., a concert or a movie) will last a couple of hours. The consequences (that happen with probability of, say, 1%) will last a lifetime. The payoffs are such that those enjoying those diversion no longer makes sense. Also, not sure how one could actually enjoy the diversion, if one knows that there is a chance that one would pay for these hours of fun for many years to come.

 

[Greg Clarke]

Yeah - SUPPORT forum.

How is advising everyone to stay locked up in their bedroom avoiding any type of noise supportive? Makes things seem even more desperate if you ask me.

Yes, this is the worst place to come for that specific advice. A large percentage of this board have Tinnitus <5 years. So why would you accept advice from someone at the beginning of their journey that's probably not in a good place themselves??? My problem is that people like yourself are giving advice on the topic. What shows have you hit in the three years since onset of your Tinnitus? Have you any experience of playing live concerts/rehearsals during that timeframe? If the answer is zero then your advice is worthless.

Same for Bill Bauer, I've had many years of enjoying what I love doing. My life isn't dictated by my tinnitus, if I'd taken your advice I'd have done nothing and would've been miserable.

 

[Flamingo1]

Same for Bill Bauer, I've had many years of enjoying what I love doing. My life isn't dictated by my tinnitus, if I'd taken your advice I'd have done nothing and would've been miserable.

I don't go out anymore due to my tinnitus. I can attest to becomimg quite miserable from staying at home and not allowing myself to do things that I used to enjoy, like clubs and shows. I just moved to a new city and am really scared to go out. So after six months of being here, Surprise! - I still haven't made any friends. Unfortunately, my fear of tinnitus becoming permanently louder has outweighed all else and I have resigned myself to being permanently miserable. Which still beats having super loud and intrusive tinnitus. So the choice wasn't difficult.

 

[Gman]

Yeah - SUPPORT forum.

How is advising everyone to stay locked up in their bedroom avoiding any type of noise supportive? Makes things seem even more desperate if you ask me.

Yes, this is the worst place to come for that specific advice. A large percentage of this board have Tinnitus <5 years. So why would you accept advice from someone at the beginning of their journey that's probably not in a good place themselves??? My problem is that people like yourself are giving advice on the topic. What shows have you hit in the three years since onset of your Tinnitus? Have you any experience of playing live concerts/rehearsals during that timeframe? If the answer is zero then your advice is worthless.

Same for Bill Bauer, I've had many years of enjoying what I love doing. My life isn't dictated by my tinnitus, if I'd taken your advice I'd have done nothing and would've been miserable.

You're getting petty. I wouldn't advise anyone to shut themselves away from sound at all. There's enriching sound and then there's dangerous sound. Avoiding overtly loud situations should in no way be seen as a negative thing. But people can do what they want.

Anyway, it doesn't really matter how long you've had it. It's so juvenile to talk about it like a "mine's longer than yours" thing. Please. Not everyone is the same and what might be OK for you might not be for others. Being a veteran, you should know this.
Worsening tinnitus is just one of the risks, there's also acoustic shock syndrome, reactive tinnitus, various forms of hyperacusis, vestibular issues (ie vertigo), TTTS etc. Not sure if you've ever had any of these, but I have and my tinnitus wasn't even directly caused by loud sound.

I would not take advice from someone who doesn't understand that loud sound can travel to the cochlear via bone conduction, even with ear protection.

 

[Greg Clarke]

Yes @Gman I'm petty yet you're the one resorting to childish name calling.

It's not a mines longer than yours thing either. Tells me what way your mind works. You still have no relevant experience on the topic other than your bone conduction and cumulative damage theories. If that's the case explain to me why my tinnitus hasn't worsened despite my frequent presence in those environments.

 

[Gman]

@Greg Clarke I didn't say you are a prat, I said don't be one.

You're a weird one though. By choosing to not tempt fate by avoiding loud events, my advice is worthless? I can accept your view point, despite disagreeing with it. You're the one calling this forum the worst place for advice. Just accept others may see things differently to you.

My situation worsened, a couple of years ago, after medical negligence and a series of unfortunate incidents. I didn't need to go to a loud concert to make things worse and I certainly wouldn't go to one now. It's a no brainer. I am happy just to be able to appreciate music again at a normal volume, after not being able to for a long time. I don't need any other experience and any advice I choose to give is done with the best of intentions. I don't want others to get worse and certain things are easily avoided.

Anyway back to your last point, you are saying you think that people should keep going to loud concerts purely because your tinnitus hasn't gotten worse? You are transposing your own situation onto others. Everyone is different, including their auditory systems. Also not everyone puts on ear protection correctly either. One mistake could result in a lot of regret.

 

[Greg Clarke]

"You're a weird one though. By choosing to not tempt fate by avoiding loud events, my advice is worthless? I can accept your view point, despite disagreeing with it. But I'm not the one calling this forum the worst place for advice. Just accept others may see things differently to you."

I can't reiterate enough, this forum is the worst place to ask about a concert, cinema, band rehearsal. Those specific topics, obviously and clearly not referring to other types of interaction and information here.

Yes, I can accept that others will have a different view. I can also accept others won't want to take the risk. If you go back over my old posts on the topic I state that it's down to the individual over and over.

We get a Rock concert post very frequently here, I get tired of people with no experience giving their thoughts on it. Yes, I believe worthless. The lad that started this thread went to a show and had a great time.


My situation worsened, a couple of years ago, after a series of medical negligence and unfortunate incidents. I didn't need to go to a loud concert to make things worse and I certainly wouldn't go to one now. It's a no brainer. I am happy just to be able to appreciate music again at a normal volume, after not being able to for a long time. I don't need any other experience and any advice I choose to give is done with the best of intentions. I don't want others to get worse and certain things are easily avoided.

Sorry to hear that there was a worsening in your situation, I truely am and it seems like you've figured out whats comfortable for you. But there's people out there that get great comfort from music. It's their choice at the end of the day but I really believe they shouldn't be discouraged from picking upo a guitar or hitting a show (With precaution obviously) Anything that brings an individual enjoyment should be encouraged, I believe it's an important step on the path to habituation.

Anyway back to your last point, you are saying you think that people should keep going to loud concerts purely because your tinnitus hasn't gotten worse? You are transposing your own situation onto others. Everyone is different, including their auditory systems. Also not everyone puts on ear protection correctly either. One mistake could result in a lot of regret.

Nope, I'll say it again. You're all saying don't go. I've been reporting my own actual experiences, not asking anyone to do anything.

 

[Gman]

"You're a weird one though. By choosing to not tempt fate by avoiding loud events, my advice is worthless? I can accept your view point, despite disagreeing with it. But I'm not the one calling this forum the worst place for advice. Just accept others may see things differently to you."

I can't reiterate enough, this forum is the worst place to ask about a concert, cinema, band rehearsal. Those specific topics, obviously and clearly not referring to other types of interaction and information here.

Yes, I can accept that others will have a different view. I can also accept others won't want to take the risk. If you go back over my old posts on the topic I state that it's down to the individual over and over.

We get a Rock concert post very frequently here, I get tired of people with no experience giving their thoughts on it. Yes, I believe worthless. The lad that started this thread went to a show and had a great time.


My situation worsened, a couple of years ago, after a series of medical negligence and unfortunate incidents. I didn't need to go to a loud concert to make things worse and I certainly wouldn't go to one now. It's a no brainer. I am happy just to be able to appreciate music again at a normal volume, after not being able to for a long time. I don't need any other experience and any advice I choose to give is done with the best of intentions. I don't want others to get worse and certain things are easily avoided.

Sorry to hear that there was a worsening in your situation, I truely am and it seems like you've figured out whats comfortable for you. But there's people out there that get great comfort from music. It's their choice at the end of the day but I really believe they shouldn't be discouraged from picking upo a guitar or hitting a show (With precaution obviously) Anything that brings an individual enjoyment should be encouraged, I believe it's an important step on the path to habituation.

Anyway back to your last point, you are saying you think that people should keep going to loud concerts purely because your tinnitus hasn't gotten worse? You are transposing your own situation onto others. Everyone is different, including their auditory systems. Also not everyone puts on ear protection correctly either. One mistake could result in a lot of regret.

Nope, I'll say it again. You're all saying don't go. I've been reporting my own actual experiences, not asking anyone to do anything.

You might be the god of rock induced tinnitus on this forum, but unfortunately tinnitus doesn't care what your experience is. Loud noise is loud noise. Continual exposure can and does lead to worsening of tinnitus. People can choose to keep going, but when they ask for others to input on whether they should go to a concert or not, there will be people who discourage it. I hope you don't want to censor that and for your own point of view to be the only one, just because it works for you? The OP had a great time, but what about next time? What about taking into consideration that initial/further damage can take time to express itself?

I get a great deal of comfort from music and listen to it regularly to help overcome hyperacusis, but at a safe level.
I really just want to live a relatively normal life again, so I consider your approach/advice to be worthless and reckless. You're part of an industry that makes money off of ruining peoples hearing via live shows. But that's just one of many issues in the clueless world we currently live in.

If you haven't had any of those other afflictions I mentioned, I think you should consider yourself very lucky. There are all sorts of worlds of pain with tinnitus and related conditions. Anyway this is getting tiring talking in circles, so I'm going to stop. Good luck fella.

 

[PeteJ]

"Your T hasn't faded in all of those years. That might be because you Don't know what you are talking about when it comes to concerts."

My tinnitus was never going to fade. Aside from the initial year or two I've largely gotten on with life. What's wrong with the occasional bit of positivity lads, serious question?

@Gman That all you got?

Why would you risk it getting worse though for a few hours at a concert? I have gone to concerts years ago - I had the ringing but it went away. However, if I could do it over again, I would never go to one ever. If it is possible, that every acoustic trauma over time potentially 'adds up to the presence of moderate/severe tinnitus' then I would never take the risk. Going some place in which the sound is exorbitantly and unnecessarily loud doesn't make sense to me. You can listen to the same music at home, on a stereo and/or adjusting the volume to a reasonable level. But, going to a concert in which they turn up the volume to unbearable levels (that you need ear plugs) makes little sense to me now.

I understand musicians need to play loud and 'turn up the volume) but how many of these are developing tinnitus and wishing they did things differently?

 

[Greg Clarke]

Why would you risk it getting worse though for a few hours at a concert? I have gone to concerts years ago - I had the ringing but it went away. However, if I could do it over again, I would never go to one ever.

Your choice.

If it is possible, that every acoustic trauma over time potentially 'adds up to the presence of moderate/severe tinnitus' then I would never take the risk. Going some place in which the sound is exorbitantly and unnecessarily loud doesn't make sense to me.

Again absolutley your opinion.

You can listen to the same music at home, on a stereo and/or adjusting the volume to a reasonable level. But, going to a concert in which they turn up the volume to unbearable levels (that you need ear plugs) makes little sense to me now.

Now, the above is ignorant. Listening to music at home is categorically not the same experience and aside from the live band experience you're getting zero social interation. If music doesn't mean a lot to you then we're coming at it from different angles, some of us can't simply give it up.

Unbearable levels? That's pure ignorance. A typical show peaks around 92-95db, with earplugs you're well in the safety zone. It's not a few hours of sustained sound either. I believe (My own opinion) it's quite safe.

I understand musicians need to play loud and 'turn up the volume) but how many of these are developing tinnitus and wishing they did things differently?

Musicians to not turn up loud. Again, very ignorant statement - The volume on stage is usually kept quite low, same in a rehearsal or studio environment as you need to be able to hear whats going on. If your amp is up to 11 all you'll hear is yourself. These type of statements are typical scaremongering with no basis in fact whatsoever.

 

[PeteJ]

Why would you risk it getting worse though for a few hours at a concert? I have gone to concerts years ago - I had the ringing but it went away. However, if I could do it over again, I would never go to one ever.

Your choice.

If it is possible, that every acoustic trauma over time potentially 'adds up to the presence of moderate/severe tinnitus' then I would never take the risk. Going some place in which the sound is exorbitantly and unnecessarily loud doesn't make sense to me.

Again absolutley your opinion.

You can listen to the same music at home, on a stereo and/or adjusting the volume to a reasonable level. But, going to a concert in which they turn up the volume to unbearable levels (that you need ear plugs) makes little sense to me now.

Now, the above is ignorant. Listening to music at home is categorically not the same experience and aside from the live band experience you're getting zero social interation. If music doesn't mean a lot to you then we're coming at it from different angles, some of us can't simply give it up.

Unbearable levels? That's pure ignorance. A typical show peaks around 92-95db, with earplugs you're well in the safety zone. It's not a few hours of sustained sound either. I believe (My own opinion) it's quite safe.

Musicians to not turn up loud. Again, very ignorant statement - The volume on stage is usually kept quite low, same in a rehearsal or studio environment as you need to be able to hear whats going on. If your amp is up to 11 all you'll hear is yourself. These type of statements are typical scaremongering with no basis in fact whatsoever.

None of that is fact or true. It's scientific fact that concerts can cause hearing loss. Of course, wearing ear plugs helps but I still think it's a risk I would not take. That part is the opinion.

As for listening to music at home and it not being the 'same experience.' Well, obviously. For social interaction, invite some people/friends to join in? My opinion might just be that but this question is about risk and my opinion is it's not worth the risk for the obvious reasons made by several people here. That's all.

 

[Greg Clarke]

None of what I said is true?

You're not a musician but are telling me we turn up loud on stage?

You don't do to concerts yet you're telling me the dB level I quoted is not a fact?

Bottom line, I'm not giving up music. Performance, attendance, rehearsal. You, Gman and whoever else can think whatever the fuck you want.

Wasting my time here, enjoy your wallowing lads.

 

[Tom Cnyc]

OK. Let's level set on a few things.

Anyone commenting that they would never go out again who has had tinnitus less than 6 months - guys, @Greg Clarke is right and you have no perspective. I said the same thing at that point and this summer I already have tickets to P Funk, Shpongle, a 2 day festival with the Disco Biscuits playing 6 times (I'll see 5 of them) and a solid 4-5 other sets, and I'm seeing Markus Schulz on the 23 of this month.

@Bill Bauer says "but your tinnitus won't fade if you do that." Well, my tinnitus has faded dramatically. In fact, it was mostly gone until last October. Why it surely must have been loud noise that brought it back right? Well. WRONG! It was a strep throat infection that spread to my ear. Guess how that happened? I waited too long to get antibiotics because they "might cause a spike". Ironic, eh? And since then, my tinnitus has faded a lot again also. 80% of days I really only hear it at night with my head on the pillow or in a DEAD silent room. Other days it is admittedly pretty annoying. I never hear it at work in my 55 dB office.

@Greg Clarke - your stats on 92-96 dB aren't true in the United States. It's much louder here, with 105 being the cap at LiveNation events. That said, I still find it safe. And much like you, I log in here to keep the conversation somewhat positive.

@Don Tinny - it really sucks to read your experience. I'm curious which EarPeace plugs you used. Were they customs? What show did you go to? Did you stand by the speaker? I have a friend that got tinnitus while wearing "dubz" earplugs. And to be honest, I'm not surprised. They're a poor product and he was at a Soundclash show, indoors no less. Essentially it's a competition to see which DJ's system is louder. Dubz are crap. I used to have a pair of "Eargasm" plugs that were TOTAL shit. They claimed to reduce volume by 19 dB, but I'd be surprised if they reduced it by 3. I never wore them at a concert due to their obvious inferiority just trying them on and walking around. I can't stress this enough, FIT matters. Which is why I'd suggest everyone go custom or wear large foam ones inserted properly that fill to fit your ear canal. If you use a condom with a hole in it it doesn't mean condoms don't work.

Personally, I am conservative and wear the full cap on my silicon customs at indoor shows. That should be roughly 29-33 dB of reduction. You lose a bit of high end but it doesn't bother me. I also stand away from speakers. At outdoor events I'm less concerned and often opt for -15 dB depending on location.

YMMV in life. If live music is something that matters to you you'll eventually start going again. If it's not - then seriously why bother even commenting?

And @Bill Bauer - if my tinnitus gets worse despite precautions at any of these events, I'll gladly share it with the group. But reasonably it doesn't seem that your isolation is helping you. You have nearly double the amount of posts on this site to anyone else (Glynis doesn't count, she WORKS here) despite only having tinnitus for two years. It's not indicative of you getting better and moving on with your life, so is it really worth skipping everything?

 

[PeteJ]

The last two posts above were very insensitive. No one is telling you not to go to concerts. They are just saying they wouldn't risk it. Even if they are warning you, they can't stop you or order you not to go. Enjoy your concert but the fact is, there's lots of people who developed debilitating T and one of the things they said, 'I went to a lot of concerts.' What I am saying, is there is a pattern. Just because it hasn't happened yet, it doesn't mean it won't happen at some time in the future. That's the thing: people exposed themselves to loud noise (including from concerts) and they were 'okay' for a while and then the damage is done at some point and they have moderate or even severe T.

I think the damage accumulates - like some people said here, the 'hidden hearing loss' is not measured or explained/demonstrated by audiologists but it's likely there. Then, enough hair cells are damaged/died (my theory) and you suddenly have a case or worse case of T.

But, no one can tell you how to lead your life or to prevent you from going to concerts. Anyway, people are just trying to help people such as Greg Clarke. No one can tell you/them what to do or wants them not to enjoy themselves. They are just trying to help and suggesting to be careful.

 

[Tom Cnyc]

@PeteJ it may seem insensitive to you now. Again, you've have had tinnitus for like, 3 weeks and have no perspective.

My tinnitus didn't have meaningful fading until I started to habituate. I didn't start to habituate until I stopped fearing everything. Sharing information that can help people push through the fear is actually rather empathetic.

 

[linearb]

it looks like I finally get to see Xiu Xiu this spring

"I like my neighborhood, I like my gun, riding in my little car, I am your girl and I will protect you"

 

[Bill Bauer]

How is advising everyone to stay locked up in their bedroom avoiding any type of noise supportive?

How is advising people to not smoke; to not eat only the tastiest food they can find (cheese cake, pastries, bacon); to not use heroin [the euphoria drug] supportive?! You only live once!

 

[linearb]

How is advising people to not smoke; to not eat only the tastiest food they can find (cheese cake, pastries, bacon); to not use heroin [the euphoria drug] supportive?! You only live once!

Are you seriously suggesting that going to a concert once in a while is equivalent to taking hardcore narcotics?

Having done both of these things, I can assure you that you're quite mistaken.

There's a whole spectrum of "safe" vs "unsafe". We get it, you prefer to not leave your house, you're completely happy to be home alone all the time, and think anyone who makes even slightly more liberal decisions is playing with fire for no good reason because there's literally no value in interacting with other humans in loud environments, or, perhaps even in general.

 

[Greg Clarke]

Lol @Bill Bauer comparing a gig to doing Heroin

And I'm only noticing Pete has Tinnitus three weeks, yet sees fit to lecture.

 

[Tom Cnyc]

Bill lives in a black and white world.

I eat sugar, drink alcohol, and occasionally use mind altering substances (although not heroin). Personally, I feel bad for people that can't or don't. It's a life enhancement if used responsibly.

I also drink water, eat salads, exercise, and rest...

Sometimes you need to find a pleasant shade of gray, @Bill Bauer

Speaking of which - I missed Fates Warning this weekend, and really wish I went. Given your musical tastes, @Greg - you may know them.

 

[Tom Cnyc]

Lol @Bill Bauer comparing a gig to doing Heroin.

Given half the people on this site are doped up on AD's and Benzos, and afraid to be above 75 dB, it's rather ironic.

 

[Bill Bauer]

Are you seriously suggesting that going to a concert once in a while is equivalent to taking hardcore narcotics?

Lol @Bill Bauer comparing a gig to doing Heroin

Heroin is unfathomably safer, right? Taking one dose doesn't have a 1% chance of making your body uninhabitable.

 

[Bill Bauer]

I eat sugar, drink alcohol, and occasionally use mind altering substances (although not heroin).

See, I don't.

I don't think that eating foods containing sugar provides enough enjoyment to outweigh the expected discomfort should one get a disease as a result. The problem with heroin is that the risk associated with it is too high. I would definitely indulge in something that were to give the benefit of heroin and were to have the risk associated with sugar.

Given half the people on this site are doped up on AD's and Benzos,

I think it is a mistake to take that stuff.

 

[linearb]

LOL I have been seeing things (far from my home) that are a lot more interesting than some crappy concerts/restaurants.

if you were less judgmental of the tastes that other people have, that would probably be reciprocated.

But I won't distract you from whatever fantasy about me you are having.

Please don't, I'm so close to orgasm!

 

[linearb]

Heroin is unfathomably safer, right? Taking one dose doesn't have a 1% chance of making your body uninhabitable.

People routinely die from "one dose".

The average concertgoer might certainly get some hearing loss over the course of their life which they wouldn't have had otherwise. However, if you think that holds a candle to the gross ends that many average heroin users come to, well, you clearly haven't spent much time working or interacting in recovery-associated spaces.

So, yea, the comparison is insane enough that I think it was well worth making 3 posts to make fun of it, possibly more.

Given half the people on this site are doped up on AD's and Benzos, and afraid to be above 75 dB, it's rather ironic.

I take benzos only, and you know all about my sound tolerances . **revs up chainsaw**

That said, I don't think people who use any significant quantity of alcohol on any regular basis are in a position to be too high and mighty about benzos? Chloride-channel mediated positive GABA allosteric modulation tends to have similar effects regardless of chemical agent, and actually, alcohol is terrible for you in all sorts of ways which benzos are not. Benzos can be a nightmare to get off of, which is why I call them "very dangerous" drugs, but in basically every other regard they're super safe. No real evidence of structural brain damage even when high doses are used for years (which you certainly can't say about booze, or even some ADs / APs) -- almost impossible to overdose on (unless combined with other sedatives, which says more about the other sedatives than it does about benzos)...

Guess you triggered me because I just started filling these scripts more often and so far life is great :-P Overall I agree with everything in your post.