Going to Concerts with Tinnitus?

[birt]

Going to concerts with Tinnitus?

Hi. Yesterday by a fluke I won two concert tickets to see Paul McCartney live. Concert is in a week in a Stadium. At first I was super excited that I actually won something and of such an artist. Then I realized, 'Oh yeah, I forgot I've got Tinnitus. Knowing concerts I'm sure it will be pretty much to very loud!

I'm a musician and it's already hampered a lot of what I was doing and the plans I had. I was diagnosed also with Lyme Disease and I wonder how much that has played into the Tinnitus and sensitivity to things over 100db.

Anyways, now I don't know what to do with these tickets. I've looked for hearing protection but are there really any ear plugs that can protect you from the noise levels of a large venue concert? Of course I looked into the in-ear molded plugs but they can't be made soon enough before the concert. I'd sure hate to give away these tickets...but.

Anybody else give tips on earplugs that really do block out besides the usual 15-20 dB or so?

 

[Sven]

If you really want to go and are afraid of the loud volume, I'd recommend double protection. You can always wear regular earplugs (unless you have custom made ones (those are great, btw)) and for example a pair of Peltor hearing protectors (I'm not sure of the word in English) over those.

 

[Mr Registered User]

I've read the following, and I reckon it's true: 'volume' is one thing, but pounding from low frequencies (obviously bass and drums) can vibrate through the skull, straight into the inner ear. So, plugs can protect from the lo-mids, mids and highs, but not always the lows.

I'm a "former" musician (I still do one relatively quite duo gig a week), and I'm positive my tinnitus has been triggered by bass and kick drum (drum machine) at gigs, even when i've been wearing plugs and a bit of plasticine on top of the plug

 

[birt]

Thanks for the input. I'm getting closer to not going or listening safely outside the stadium. Shame, love to see a beatle and free tickets. That hurts.

From what I heard the concert goes for 3 hours. That is a long time of exposure. I called the Stadium and there are supposedly no temporary places to hide out and rest the ears. Also, I'm a musician and still trying to come back after T knocked me down 4 or 5 years ago. I switched from electric to acoustic and had to teach myself a whole new style. I'm concerned to make my T permanentley worse and again knock myself out of playing live music altogether. But, at the same time I don't think it's healthy to step early out of life and let T control everything and to live life in a shell of T and regrets. It's a tightrope sometimes. Question-I found some earplugs that have 32db protection but they are just the typical foam inserts. Are foam plugs good? I can't make customs in a week's time and you're not allowed to bring big earphones into the stadium.

Was wondering. Does anybody know if headphones as hearing protection are allowed in large venues, ie. stadiums? I was told you are not allowed but I can't imagine that's the case. I know they allow children in the States to wear protective headphones. Anyways, I'm going to try to get a Dr's slip and maybe buy some headphones from a hunting store and bring them to the concert. Just hope they don't take them at the gate.

 

[Mr Registered User]

Yep, foam plugs are pretty good, but sometimes they're not enough. New ones work better; after using them a few times they tend to lose some of their "expandability" and thickness/waxiness. Also, the db ratings are either the maximum reduction at one narrow frequency range, or an average reduction over a broad range -- I can't remember which. Protection tends to drop off at lower frequencies. For example, as a rough guess, the protection might be 35db at 8000Hz, but only 16db at 125Hz for the same plug

 

[Markku]

Was wondering. Does anybody know if headphones as hearing protection are allowed in large venues, ie. stadiums? I was told you are not allowed but I can't imagine that's the case.

I wonder why you wouldn't be allowed to bring in noise-cancelling headphones / ear muffs as protection? Who told you that?

I'm pretty sure you are allowed, and to confirm, please give the venue a call and ask them directly. I don't think you'll need to show any proof for needing them.

 

[Hudson]

I've got a couple observations I can throw in here:

I have been to plenty of concerts after I first got tinnitus. I always had ear plugs, and I never stood close to speakers. At a show like Paul McCartny in an Arena, my guess is you will probably be sitting somewhere away from the speakers (although the arena will trap the sound). I would go for double protection as stated above, load up on some magnesium supplements the day before and a couple days after, and avoid smoking or anything that will constrict blood vessels.

I went to a Metallica show which was ridiculously loud. I wore the ear muffs and ear plugs. Between those two, you can expect at least attenuation of 40 dbA. I don't think you've got too much to worry about at that point. If it's worrying you, take a break and walk to the concession stand to get out of the arena area. I doubt Paul is going to have any explosive fireworks going off onstage either, but I'm just guessing.

The only time my tinnitus has been affected by noise has been when I went to a bar or was near loud sound unprotected. It has never been affected as far as I could tell when I wore protection, and I was definitely hyper sensitive the first few times.

The advice on doubling up on ear protection is about your best bet if you're really concerned. Your other option is to totally avoid the event as Markku has suggested above, but I am of the opinion that avoiding situations in life due to tinnitus only prolongs the negative emotions and suffering that we attach to it. If you're smart, wear protection, and have a good time, that's a win in my book. It takes your mind off of the tinnitus and makes you feel like a normal person again, which is never a bad thing. But if you are honestly very concerned about it, abstinence is the only 100% sure way though

Another thing I'll toss in here: I wouldn't be conerned about low frequency sounds or bass travelling through your body. I just don't think that the potential for damage in that aspect is that great. Now if a dentist was hammering and drilling away at your jaw right next to your ear, that would be a different story. If you are away from the speakers, but you can feel the bass, it still isn't a big deal as long as you're wearing external ear protection. The loud, high frequency sounds are the ones we really need to be worried about. The most vulnerable frequencies of our hearing are high pitched; as they're the ones to almost always go first due to noise exposure.

My vote is to double up on protection and go. So what if you get a couple stares? I would bet you a hundred bucks Paul will be wearing hearing protection on stage. If people stare at you, screw them. They're not your friends and you most likely won't see them again anyway. Buy a beer and enjoy the show.

 

[birt]

Thanks everybody. Hudson-the concert will be in a Stadium so maybe that will help some with the sound. I was only concerned because my tickets are on the field around the stage, not in the bleacher which are probably a little farther away from the stage. I asked the venue if I could escape up in the bleachers if I need to and I'm not allowed. The only way out is if I leave the Stadium---and no turning back. Also Paul WILL have Fireworks on stage. If you go on youtube and watch the song, 'Live and Let Die' it's quite a firework show. I think though that double protection would help me in that case.....I saw that there's also earmuffs that help muffle sudden explosive type volumes. I'm going shopping Tomorrow.

What are better, noise cancelling headphones or construction type earmuffs? I suppose you can get earmuffs (ex. Peltor) that cancel out way more dbs than noise cancelling phones.

like said, the only thing that concerns is as a musician I'm already often around noisy environments. Nothing of course stadium size.

Even as a solo acoustic guitarist you have to amplify. I also get occasional offers to play in bands which isn't always easy. But I def. don't want a permanent increase that would stop my playing.

 

[Esko]

I was at Summerburst (music festival) recently and used Killnoise earplugs almost all of the time around the music. I didn't go very close, but it was loud without earplugs! UltimateEars SPL app indicated around 90-96 dB with frequency weighting 'C' (captures more bass). Tried the other mode 'A' briefly and it was around 90 dB as well.

Had no trouble with my tinnitus my whole time there. Not sure why. Took Postafen and picamilon before the flight both ways, but those might just be placebo. It sure didn't completely remove my tinnitus like the guy in the Postafen thread. Let's just hope the picamilon didn't counteract the effect.

I'm happy with whatever works, but I can't say for sure why my perception of it was lower there. I did drink alcohol during the festival, and I do remember noticing the tinnitus at least the second day.

I feel like I'm lucky mine is this subtle, but it's still very annoying.

 

[birt]

Ok, I'm looking at these earmuff- Peltor Optime 111. They cose about 26 Euros but and take away 36 db but I'm reading that they mostly are taking away the lower frequencies. Anybody ever used them? I'm also looking at earmuffs at gun stores that are active but cut out less db (21). They cost way more too. Yes, I'm getting radical hear but my T is already loud enough. Want to be careful.

 

[t-man]

I'm a "former" musician (I still do one relatively quite duo gig a week), and I'm positive my tinnitus has been triggered by bass and kick drum (drum machine) at gigs, even when i've been wearing plugs and a bit of plasticine on top of the plug

I can attest to this.

 

[birt]

Well, I guess if worse comes to worse I'll just stay for a song or two to see a Beatle and then leave. I too have noticed that bass frequencies travel through the ear bones and cause a lot of rattling. I will be very surprised if I'm able to stay throughout the whole concert.

t-man, did you experience permanent increase of your tinnitus as a result of low frequencies or just irritation?

 

[birt]

Hi everyone. To report back, the concert was great. I was given a nice seat which was a tad farther away from the stadium field but right center in front of the stage. The concert 'felt' loud but it registered at least at the beginning, barely 100 dB. It definitely got louder, later.

I put in my 37 db 3M foam ear plugs and I was comfortably able to enjoy the whole 3 hr show plus mega fireworks.

No problems, no distortion in ears and and no T increase this morning.

In fact w/ the earplugs I heard my tinnitus, which probably isn't good, just as much as I heard the music.

Anyways, I didn't need the earmuffs as double protection.

Last night gave me more confidence that I can do certain fun things that might be louder occasionally with a little caution with the right protection.

Those 3M earplugs kept me safe. I do feel sorry for those people right under the wall of speakers, say during Helter Skelter.

 

[Piper]

I am or should I say was a musician before this tinnitus, I got ear plugs yesterday that musicians wear, they hang round your neck when you want to take them out but haven't tried them yet, I have stayed away from bands for 6 months but miss it terribly.

 

[martin12]

Absolutely ZERO influence to my tinnitus. I have tinnitus in my right ear only from head injury. Was at a concert the other night for The Killers with dedibels easily reaching 120-130. 2 hour set.

My tinnitus has actually improved or even become milder than before. Perhaps the loud noise woke up my hair cells. Who knows?

 

[sjtinguy]

Absolutely you will be risking increasing your tinnitus. There is a chance you will go and be fine, or there is a chance you will go and have permanent hearing damage and/or loud ringing in your ears for the rest of your life. Wear ear plugs at least, there is no reason not to.

 

[JurgenG]

Well, if you go protect yourself as much as possible. But why would you listen to loud music in the car?

 

[Bill Bauer]

To answer your question, we get reports like the one below on a weekly (and sometimes daily) basis:
https://www.tinnitustalk.com/threads/i-ruined-my-recovery.25514/
Here are some more for you to look at, but this is just the tip of an iceberg:
https://www.tinnitustalk.com/threads/earplugs-muffs-give-very-little-protection.21737/

https://www.tinnitustalk.com/threads/tinnitus-much-worse-after-club-despite-wearing-solid-35-db-custom-earplugs-—-im-at-my-wits-end.15744/#post-186018

https://www.tinnitustalk.com/threads/bad-spike-not-subsiding-after-loud-bar-—-despite-wearing-properly-inserted-earplugs.20675/#post-239000

https://www.tinnitustalk.com/thread...t-an-acoustic-trauma-shock.18964/#post-219363

https://www.tinnitustalk.com/thread...le-in-real-life-situations.19067/#post-220314

https://www.tinnitustalk.com/threads/33-decibel-earplug-not-protecting-from-sound.22151/

I could go on and on and on (provide links to more horror stories where people found out the hard way that it was a bad idea to rely on earplugs), but you get the idea.

Even if those spikes end up being temporary, we are given a limited number of second chances. If one keeps being reckless, eventually a time might come when the spike won't go away...

 

[just1morething]

I thought Cialas would increase blood flow to your ears and help tinnitus?

 

[Aaron44126]

I've been told that if you get temporary tinnitus after hearing a loud sound (as you are describing as you exit the car), it is because you have incurred (minor) hearing loss. Fortunately, your brain is adapting quickly, but this may not continue if you keep it up. I recommend that you take steps to protect your ears... Avoid loud sounds when you can. Maybe it won't be an issue for you, but if perusing this forum can teach you anything, it's that there is no going back once the damage is done.

 

[Paulmanlike]

I've quit loud clubs, concerts don't risk it

 

[MidnightOilAudio]

Yes.

 

[Zug]

I've been to live band events. With earplugs.

Same as sex: Don't stop doing it, just protect yourself.

 

[Bill Bauer]

I still go to them not as often but I have gone to about 4 this year and it hasn't affected my t

If you start hitting a wall with a hammer, it takes a while before you see objects on the other side of the wall.

 

[Bill Bauer]

Same as sex: Don't stop doing it, just protect yourself.

You are right - it is the same as sex - protection won't help you in the long run.

For condoms, perfect use results in 2% of the women getting pregnant each year. For typical use it is 18%.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Condom
If one uses condoms for 20 years and it is "perfect use", the probability that one gets his partner(s) pregnant at least once during 20 years is given by
1-Probability no pregnancies in 20 years = 1 - 0.98^20 = 1 - 0.667 = 0.332.
With typical use, the probability of experiencing at least one pregnancy over the next 20 years is given by
1 - 0.82^20 = 0.98.

If you are a man, and your partner gets pregnant, you will have no say in whether or not the fetus gets aborted. By having sex, you are taking a risk that with probability between 33% and 98% another person will have control over your life. [Note that vasectomy has something like 1% or 5% risk of chronic pain {which would be worse than T} so that is not an option.] To me, even a 33% risk is unacceptable, but of course the risk is closer to 98%, as chances are you are typical.

In any case, sex is not a good example to support the point you were making. The risk associated with both sex and loud events is unacceptable.

 

[Zug]

You are right - it is the same as sex - protection won't help you in the long run.

For condoms, perfect use results in 2% of the women getting pregnant each year. For typical use it is 18%.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Condom
If one uses condoms for 20 years and it is "perfect use", the probability that one gets his partner(s) pregnant at least once during 20 years is given by
1-Probability no pregnancies in 20 years = 1 - 0.98^20 = 1 - 0.667 = 0.332.
With typical use, the probability of experiencing at least one pregnancy over the next 20 years is given by
1 - 0.82^20 = 0.98.

If you are a man, and your partner gets pregnant, you will have no say in whether or not the fetus gets aborted. By having sex, you are taking a risk that with probability between 33% and 98% another person will have control over your life. [Note that vasectomy has something like 1% or 5% risk of chronic pain {which would be worse than T} so that is not an option.] To me, even a 33% risk is unacceptable, but of course the risk is closer to 98%, as chances are you are typical.

In any case, sex is not a good example to support the point you were making. The risk associated with both sex and loud events is unacceptable.

Dude, if you really think those things are too risky you're probably not doing them right.

Life is about living.

Best,
Zug

 

[Elfin]

There are negatives in absolutely everything.

I personally wouldn't risk the concerts (as that is where I got my T and they are needlessly and uncomfortably loud (for me)). I have been to nightclubs with earplugs in though, and have taken regular breaks to smoking areas/away from dance-floors etc and been largely ok - the odd spike here and there. I have also left venues and parties when I have felt that it was too loud.

I guess it boils mostly down to how you want to live your life, what you can tolerate and whether you think the risk is worth it. I wouldn't think the risk of possibly increasing my T is worth it.

I would however accept the pregnancy risk in having sex, as I accept the diabetes risk in drinking soft drinks and the death risk in driving to work every day. Anxiety can bring awareness to a host of things that may or may never happen. With regards to T, I consider this anxiety unfortunate and limiting and horrible; yet a worsening to this already loud tinnitus would be unacceptable.

 

[Bill Bauer]

Dude, if you really think those things are too risky you're probably not doing them right.

When you do it "right", the risk is 33%. This is like playing Russian Roulette with bullets in two of the six chambers. You don't think that's too risky?

Life is about living.

Yes, I get to LIVE - free from alimony payments, and kids sucking up my time and energy.

 

[Elfin]

the risk is 33%

how is this calculated? and how is it reliable, given differences in 'frequency'?

 

[Bill Bauer]

I would however accept the pregnancy risk in having sex, as I accept the diabetes risk in drinking soft drinks and the death risk in driving to work every day.

I don't drink soft drinks either.

I bought one of the safest cars on the market. Unfortunately, in addition to multiple cool safety features, it also has an unbelievable number of airbags surrounding the driver. Of course airbags are unacceptably loud when they deploy, so now I feel silly.