How Dangerous Are Sirens and Train Horns from a Distance?

[Red]

I live close to train tracks. Almost precisely 1000 feet away. How damaging are the train horns to me?

 

[linearb]

Probably not damaging at 1/5 of a mile, more likely to just be annoying.

 

[Princess Leia]

I have no idea, but that must be awful... back in my early twenties I lived right beside a track and after while I didn't even 'hear' it. Of course that wouldn't be the case now.

I've encountered a few (close) train horns since my onset of Tinnitus and Hyperacusis, and it fortunately left no lasting damage.

 

[Bill Bauer]

I live close to train tracks. Almost precisely 1000 feet away. How damaging are the train horns to me?

If your ears react in a negative way, then my guess is that damage is taking place (or at least this slows down your recovery).

 

[Red]

If your ears react in a negative way, then my guess is that damage is taking place (or at least this slows down your recovery).

Yeah, possibly. I have lived here for 4 years. Never had a problem. But now I have T. And the trains have been more frequent lately. It honestly does not sound loud but sometimes noises do not need to be to irritate my ears. I am in the process of moving but that will not be for a month or two yet.

 

[Codaz]

Train horns are 120dB, European spec defined by the European Commission. And I had one once 15 meters away. It was absolutely shit. Lots of people bowed down to the ground. And the railway company doesn't keep any logs. They are called Tyfoon. And it has to be fired by a footpedal. So i don't like them

 

[JurgenG]

Well let's say they are 120 dB. That's normally measured at one meter.
2 meters is 114 dB, 4 = 108, 8 = 102, 16 = 96, 32 = 90..
64 = 84
128= 78
260= 72.

So I'd say you are fine.

Sometimes we get a negative reaction on certain sounds because we know they are loud if we would be closeby.

For instance, sirenes scare me even when they are only 60 dB, because I make the association with "loud". Same with screaming people in films. They are not actually too loud.

 

[HCR123]

For instance, sirenes scare me even when they are only 60 dB, because I make the association with "loud". Same with screaming people in films. They are not actually too loud.

Well I'm a week in with T and mine was a milder one and I was adjusting quickly. I noticed at the end of the day it could spike but then go back down after a good night's rest. Last night my window was open and a f&ing police car blasted its siren. I'm not near the street but the sound echoed down into my window and I freaked out. I have a feeling my spike did not go down last night not because of the actual sound but my perceived reaction to it. I was feeling great, calm and relaxed before this. Sigh. I considered taking prednisone but after reading everything, there's no hearing loss and the last thing I need is for my anxiety to zoom up again. Now I wait I guess.

 

[Elfin]

Now I wait I guess.

sounds like my current daily cycle.

wake - hear a sound that seems loud/is loud - worry - try to reassure myself - wait to see if ears worse. Repeat.

 

[Sam Bridge]

sounds like my current daily cycle.

wake - hear a sound that seems loud/is loud - worry - try to reassure myself - wait to see if ears worse. Repeat.

Coming to this forum daily will reinforce that, I know because I was stuck in the same cycle. I actually left the forum for 3 months and I did get better, now I come back once or twice a week.

 

[Codaz]

Well let's say they are 120 dB. That's normally measured at one meter.
2 meters is 114 dB, 4 = 108, 8 = 102, 16 = 96, 32 = 90..
64 = 84
128= 78
260= 72.

So I'd say you are fine.

Sometimes we get a negative reaction on certain sounds because we know they are loud if we would be closeby.

For instance, sirenes scare me even when they are only 60 dB, because I make the association with "loud". Same with screaming people in films. They are not actually too loud.

Thanks but unfortunately an ear that is already sensitive to noise I won't rely on standard physics. It felt really loud.

 

[Elfin]

It felt really loud.

Where were you when exposed?

 

[linearb]

Thanks but unfortunately an ear that is already sensitive to noise I won't rely on standard physics. It felt really loud.

"standard" physics is the only physics

something "feeling" loud can be entirely a psychogenic reaction. the more keyed in to sounds we are, the more we fixate on them, the more anxious we become and the louder and scarier they seem. That's just how perception works, any time you are subconsciously convinced something is a threat, your brain is working hard to make you stay aware of it. In a distress state, adrenaline ensures that more synapses fire and perceptual input is expressed more strongly in consciousness.

Basically I am suggesting that you should trust physics and science, and should not trust your own subjective internal experience, because one of these things is static and the other is extremely malleable and unreliable.

I'm pretty sure that if you take some healthy person with no hearing problems, take them to a doctor who tells them "you have an incurable auditory disease. Sounds you hear are going to gradually seem louder and louder until you're overwhelmed by them, and you will then become slowly incapacitated" -- that person would in many cases develop full-blown hyperacusis. This does not at all mean that H isn't "real", or that it's not triggered/worsened by actual damage and noise trauma. Obviously it is, and obviously those things tend to have more to do with the onset of the condition than pure psychological factors.

I think that psychology, conscious interaction with ourselves and our conditions have a lot more to do with the maintenance of or recovery from these conditions than a lot of people want to let on, though. Go read testimonials from, or youtube videos of, people who had been incapacitated by hyperacusis (or, to a lesser extent, tinnitus) and then went on to return to basically normal lives. In nearly every case, they talk about the psychology of it, and the cognitive hacks they had to employ to overcome that. Now, juxtapose that with angry anecdotes from people who swear they cannot and will not recover, and also in many cases are completely unwilling to admit that volition or conscious decision making has any influence whatsoever over their conditions.

edit: all that said, if living near trains stresses you out, then that is bad for your brain even if it's not bad for your ears per se. I think cities are awful, the stress of them decreases quality of life and longevity, and I am happy to visit them occasionally but spend most of my time in the middle of the woods where the air is cleaner, the water is cleaner and less laden with metals and pesticides, and of course everything is much quieter.

 

[PaulBe]

I'm impressed @linearb , you've just placed the psychology of T/H into its correct context. Others have tried and failed before.

 

[Striveon]

"standard" physics is the only physics

something "feeling" loud can be entirely a psychogenic reaction. the more keyed in to sounds we are, the more we fixate on them, the more anxious we become and the louder and scarier they seem. That's just how perception works, any time you are subconsciously convinced something is a threat, your brain is working hard to make you stay aware of it. In a distress state, adrenaline ensures that more synapses fire and perceptual input is expressed more strongly in consciousness.

Basically I am suggesting that you should trust physics and science, and should not trust your own subjective internal experience, because one of these things is static and the other is extremely malleable and unreliable.

I'm pretty sure that if you take some healthy person with no hearing problems, take them to a doctor who tells them "you have an incurable auditory disease. Sounds you hear are going to gradually seem louder and louder until you're overwhelmed by them, and you will then become slowly incapacitated" -- that person would in many cases develop full-blown hyperacusis. This does not at all mean that H isn't "real", or that it's not triggered/worsened by actual damage and noise trauma. Obviously it is, and obviously those things tend to have more to do with the onset of the condition than pure psychological factors.

I think that psychology, conscious interaction with ourselves and our conditions have a lot more to do with the maintenance of or recovery from these conditions than a lot of people want to let on, though. Go read testimonials from, or youtube videos of, people who had been incapacitated by hyperacusis (or, to a lesser extent, tinnitus) and then went on to return to basically normal lives. In nearly every case, they talk about the psychology of it, and the cognitive hacks they had to employ to overcome that. Now, juxtapose that with angry anecdotes from people who swear they cannot and will not recover, and also in many cases are completely unwilling to admit that volition or conscious decision making has any influence whatsoever over their conditions.

edit: all that said, if living near trains stresses you out, then that is bad for your brain even if it's not bad for your ears per se. I think cities are awful, the stress of them decreases quality of life and longevity, and I am happy to visit them occasionally but spend most of my time in the middle of the woods where the air is cleaner, the water is cleaner and less laden with metals and pesticides, and of course everything is much quieter.

@hurtingdream so true ...

 

[PeteJ]

@hurtingdream so true ...

But, the question is, are these sirens and loud horns harmful to our ears and/or hearing? There is the question of this to normal ears and hearing and also to ears that are damaged or impacted due to acoustic trauma.

 

[Striveon]

But, the question is, are these sirens and loud horns harmful to our ears and/or hearing? There is the question of this to normal ears and hearing and also to ears that are damaged or impacted due to acoustic trauma.

I mean, why is it that those that have tinnitus (the people around me, including friends) have tinnitus and it does not get worse??? I am so confused! They live a normal life and I don't... it's so frustrating because I am young and want to enjoy my life too...

 

[PeteJ]

I mean, why is it that those that have tinnitus (the people around me, including friends) have tinnitus and it does not get worse??? I am so confused! They live a normal life and I don't... it's so frustrating because I am young and want to enjoy my life too...

Probably their tinnitus is mild and whatever damage they have is not as extensive? If they use headphones and expose themselves to loud sound, they might be gradually be getting worse but the tinnitus hasn't worsened yet.

I don't understand it either but I don't think the worst cases of tinnitus just happen randomly. Something happened over time but everyone is different. Our brains, ears and DNA is different as well as the thresholds.

Just my theory but I haven't encountered a better one.