I Need Help with These Thoughts! Does It Get Worse as We Get Older?

[Hope2015]

I am overthinking everything since I got t, I used to overthink everything even before it but now I do even more.
We know that tinnitus works on the same principle as epilepsy, hyperactivity of neurons, I know some stories about people with epilepsy. For example my neighbour had epilepsy since age 6 and he had seizures only when he was sleeping, then when he was older he started to have seizures even in the day time when he was doing something.
Now I was thinking about this and had a panic attack again, is this going to happen to us too? When we will be older our t will get louder or worse? If it works on the same principle with epilepsy is it logical to happen to us? The neurons will get even more hyperactive?
Are here persons who had t, loud t since they were young and it remained the same, it did not get worse?
Sorry if I am paranoid but these thoughts are haunting me, I need some answers!

Thank you!

 

[linearb]

Some people have T that gets worse as they age, some people have T which stays fairly stable, and some people have T which improves as they age.

95% of people I have known in real life who have this condition, have either said it was stable, or improved over time... so I try not to let horror stories from the internet frighten me too much.

Beyond that -- there is some simple existential fear here. You're going to age, and your body is going to fall apart. You will be in new kinds of pain and discomfort before you die. You can't avoid that. You can't escape it. Fixating on it to the point that you become anxious, is only going to make it worse, it is increasingly well documented that stress and anxious thinking are very bad for you over a period of years or decades.

So, what then, are we to do with this? Well, this isn't a new problem -- awareness of our own frailty, is something which has terrified humans for as long as we've been able to think in words, possibly longer.

Everyone has to find their own path towards making peace with the limits of our existence and the suffering we endure in our time here. This is where I get a little preachy, but for me, the answer has been meditation, because Eastern notions of suffering make sense to me. I have posted this excerpt from Samyutta Nikaya on here before, and here it is again. The legend is that in response to a King who has asked the Buddha, "Is anyone who is born, free from aging and death?", the Buddha replied

Great king, no one who is born is free from aging and death. Even those affluent khattiyas—rich, with great wealth and property, with abundant gold and silver, abundant treasures and commodities, abundant wealth and grain—because they have been born, are not free from aging and death. Even those affluent brahmins…affluent householders—rich…with abundant wealth and grain—because they have been born, are not free from aging and death. Even those monks who are arahants, whose taints are destroyed, who have lived the holy life, done what had to be done, laid down the burden, reached their own goal, utterly destroyed the fetters of existence, and are completely liberated through final knowledge: even for them this body is subject to breaking up, subject to being laid down.

Basically, I think you're grappling with a much deeper set of questions than "what is tinnitus", and the fear/anxiety you're experiencing is not unique to tinnitus. Because tinnitus is an ailment that can occur at any age, I think it is often the first reason that some people have to contemplate these questions... but if you were to go talk to a survivor of any other unpleasant malady with an unclear prognosis, you'd find out that you have a lot in common with them!

I can honestly say that regular meditation combined with a couple other significant personal experiences, have helped me unwind my anxiety about this issue to a great degree -- but only with a significant investment of effort, and a willingness and desire to change my understanding of myself and the world.

 

[Bertman]

For me, I have hope that as long as we take care of our ears, that by the time we are older (where age related medical conditions usually start to kick in) there will be some form of relief. Maybe not a cure, but something that helps it lower. My fears are about the near to mid future (5 to 15 years). I'm only 20 and don't want to have this condition slow me down when I start my career, let alone stop me from forming relationships. Sorry I don't have more positive things to say, the past few weeks have taken their toll on me.

 

[Hope2015]

Thank you for your wide answer @linearb !

95% of people I have known in real life who have this condition, have either said it was stable, or improved over time... so I try not to let horror stories from the internet frighten me too much.

This made me feel better, horror stories from the internet really affect my habbituation. Even if mine it is the same since it started, sometimes crazy, sometimes better, I started to have good days too, to be able to ignore it and to get my life back. But like I said I use to overthink everything and I have some questions that are hard to answer myself. Even if I have good days and I feel ok, there are days when anxiety hit me because I have spikes and then I start to worry and be sad again. I hope time will be our friend and in time it will stay the way it is or it will get better!

 

[Hope2015]

@Bertman , I am only 21, so that's why I worry a lot. Next year I graduate, I will be an Accountant, Economist, not an easy job but I just followed my dream and I hope this affliction won't be an obstacle. I think the same as you, as long as we protect our ears and we sleep we should be fine, but some noises we just can't avoid, for example here where I live before 2 weeks and after 2 weeks New Years Eve they use on the street firecrackers which are so damn loud (they sound like explosions) and I can't go on the street run after them and tell them to stop, even if I did this they won't listen... That's why a treatment would be Heaven for us, to be able to protect ourselves from not getting worse and lower it even a bit. I hope even in 5, 10 or 15 years we will have something and until then to be able to bear this.

 

[Bertman]

That's unfortunate about the firecrackers thing. Yeah some loud noises are just unavoidable. It's cool that you mention economics and accounting. I'm in my first accounting class now and my third econ class. I find economics really interesting.

 

[Nick Pyzik]

@Hope2015 I'm really sorry to hear your Tinnitus problem. You know, I think that in time Tinnitus can get better because the brain adjusts to the ringing and you don't notice it as much. But I'm pretty sure that when the Tinnitus becomes permanent then it won't go away ever and we'll only have to wait until a treatment is developed for that. Is this the first time you've ever had ringing in your ears from loud music? How were you listening to the music? Headphones or through loud speakers?

https://www.tinnitustalk.com/thread...nnitus-hearing-loss-—-normal-audiogram.12040/

If you click on the link above you'll be escorted to my story about how I have ringing/hearing loss now but still have a "normal audiogram" through 3 tests I've taken, two at a local audiologist and one at The University of Michigan.

I'm not sure if you're one to want to read a long post with a good amount of researched information tied into it, but that will be my thread. There's something much deeper to Tinnitus and the connections I've made with it is the loss of nerve fibers in our ears, not hair cells. I could be completely wrong, it could be something that's wrong with just my hearing, but when someone like myself has almost an above average audiogram tested 3 times but I feel like I've lost the sensation I would always get from my hearing, then there has got to be something deeper to hearing loss/tinnitus than just losing hair cells in the ears.

My tinnitus has in 2 months, gone from loud ringing to a very low humming when I'm in a quiet room and just continues to change with any kind of loud noise involved in my day.

I played in a band for about 4 years (starting in 2011) without protecting my hearing until about halfway through. I had ringing after a good majority of shows and never even gave a thought about it. It wasn't until last year did I really put a thought into how my hearing was and started over-protecting it but it was to late because I my hearing has simply deteriorated since last summer from a small incident with headphones and "close to loud music". I not only played in a band with loud music but I also listened to a lot of music, not loud, but for long hours. Slowly but surely without me generally realizing it, my hearing caved in. I noticed a slight ringing in my ears that didn't bother me much over the summer and that was just the start.

My tinnitus has in 2 months, gone from loud ringing to a very low humming when I'm in a quiet room and just continues to change with any kind of loud noise involved in my day.

I apologize for talking so much about myself but I want people to realize that the nerves, not hair cells, in our ears are SO much more vulnerable to damage. Once they are damaged, they'll die in from what I've read, in months or close to a year. Once it's a neuron is gone, it does not come back. Just read through some of the articles I linked in my thread and you'll realize it through the tests they have done on animals. I'd like to hear more about how you got your Tinnitus though from loud music?

 

[Natalie Roberts]

Thank you for your wide answer @DebInAustralia



This made me feel better, horror stories from the internet really affect my habbituation. Even if mine it is the same since it started, sometimes crazy, sometimes better, I started to have good days too, to be able to ignore it and to get my life back. But like I said I use to overthink everything and I have some questions that are hard to answer myself. Even if I have good days and I feel ok, there are days when anxiety hit me because I have spikes and then I start to worry and be sad again. I hope time will be our friend and in time it will stay the way it is or it will get better!

I've only been dealing with this for 5 weeks but have had the same thoughts and fears as you. I'm 30 and have 2 kids and one on the way. Thinking of this condition as permenant and the possiblity of it worsening causes panic attacks and severe anxiety. So I stopped thinking of it like that. Instead, I've been focusing on one day a time and as @DebInAustralia said, focusing on my reactions to T instead of the T itself. I also have been meditating with the help of a psychotherapist to deal with my anxiety/stress and negative thought process. It's not a magic cure but it has made a dramatic difference in my thought process in a mere 4 weeks of practice. Maybe you can find someone in your area to teach you to meditate or join a class? For me, they aren't sure of the cause and I supose it doesn't matter right? I just try to take it one day at a time sometimes one moment at a time.. We don't have much control at this point and I'm trying to be accepting of that reality.

 

[Andrew_89]

I am overthinking everything since I got t, I used to overthink everything even before it but now I do even more.
We know that tinnitus works on the same principle as epilepsy, hyperactivity of neurons, I know some stories about people with epilepsy. For example my neighbour had epilepsy since age 6 and he had seizures only when he was sleeping, then when he was older he started to have seizures even in the day time when he was doing something.
Now I was thinking about this and had a panic attack again, is this going to happen to us too? When we will be older our t will get louder or worse? If it works on the same principle with epilepsy is it logical to happen to us? The neurons will get even more hyperactive?
Are here persons who had t, loud t since they were young and it remained the same, it did not get worse?
Sorry if I am paranoid but these thoughts are haunting me, I need some answers!

Thank you!

Hey mate chill out your doing just fine .
Seriously your doing awesome I would say your nailing life . All you gotta do is just breathe and not let it get to you . everyones T is different everyone's t journey is different . When you start being in the now and not in the what if it's guna get super easy for you .

 

[I who love music]

I am overthinking everything since I got t, I used to overthink everything even before it but now I do even more.
We know that tinnitus works on the same principle as epilepsy, hyperactivity of neurons, I know some stories about people with epilepsy. For example my neighbour had epilepsy since age 6 and he had seizures only when he was sleeping, then when he was older he started to have seizures even in the day time when he was doing something.
Now I was thinking about this and had a panic attack again, is this going to happen to us too? When we will be older our t will get louder or worse? If it works on the same principle with epilepsy is it logical to happen to us? The neurons will get even more hyperactive?
Are here persons who had t, loud t since they were young and it remained the same, it did not get worse?
Sorry if I am paranoid but these thoughts are haunting me, I need some answers!

Thank you!

Worse.
But my answer came after 40 years of T.
It may be your answer too. For the T, AND the over-thinking.
https://www.tinnitustalk.com/threads/back-to-silence.7172/

 

[Hope2015]

I want to thank all of you for your answers @linearb , @Bertman ,@Nick Pyzik , @Natalie Roberts , @Andrew_89 and @I who love music .
I have now more good days than before I am trying hard to be strong, to fight this but sometimes out of blue all these thoughts monopolize me, I think they are anxiety attacks and setbacks. I have some good days when I am able to ignore it and some days when it is so loud that it's kind of hard to ignore it, mostly now when I have my finals and I have a lot to study.

Some people say that in time it is getting better I wonder what do they mean, it is getting lower or because you are habituated you are not paying so much attention to it? Well, I think here it depends on everyone's luck in life, right?

@I who love music you wrote in your comment "worse", what did you mean? That in time it is getting worse as you grow older? Thank you!

 

[Mithrandir]

Good luck and keep fighting for a better future ! Some good persons on the earth are working to find a solution for us !

 

[I who love music]

I want to thank all of you for your answers @linearb , @Bertman ,@Nick Pyzik , @Natalie Roberts , @Andrew_89 and @I who love music .
I have now more good days than before I am trying hard to be strong, to fight this but sometimes out of blue all these thoughts monopolize me, I think they are anxiety attacks and setbacks. I have some good days when I am able to ignore it and some days when it is so loud that it's kind of hard to ignore it, mostly now when I have my finals and I have a lot to study.

Some people say that in time it is getting better I wonder what do they mean, it is getting lower or because you are habituated you are not paying so much attention to it? Well, I think here it depends on everyone's luck in life, right?

@I who love music you wrote in your comment "worse", what did you mean? That in time it is getting worse as you grow older? Thank you!

My tinnitus has increased in volume and has become lower in frequency through the years.
But would you believe I don't hear it 99% of the time?
I feel for you. T is rotten.
Please try the BTS method. Other people here on the forum are having success like me too.
The good news is that if you use the method, you don't have to work to ignore your T anymore!!!
You ACKNOWLEDGE it and send it on its merry way.
No more running from it or worrying about it, or having to listen to it.
I works for me, why wouldn't it work for you?
Hang in there.

 

[Zug]

My tinnitus has increased in volume and has become lower in frequency through the years.
But would you believe I don't hear it 99% of the time?
I feel for you. T is rotten.
Please try the BTS method. Other people here on the forum are having success like me too.
The good news is that if you use the method, you don't have to work to ignore your T anymore!!!
You ACKNOWLEDGE it and send it on its merry way.
No more running from it or worrying about it, or having to listen to it.
I works for me, why wouldn't it work for you?
Hang in there.

@Hope2015 listen to @I who love music , this guy knows stuff

 

[Hope2015]

@Hope2015 listen to @I who love music , this guy knows stuff

Okies teacher!

 

[Nucleo]

My T did indeed get worse over time, as pretty much everything else. It is inevitable.

 

[Hope2015]

@Nucleo, did you protect your hearing?

 

[Luca]

6 years in, I would say, probably about the same as a whole.

On a side note some epilepsy medication has been helpful in lowering T disturbance and volume for some.

But it is still poorly understood, there are probably many stages in the auditory pathways where it can go wrong to the brain or in the brain.

 

[Nucleo]

@Nucleo, did you protect your hearing?

Yes but not enough it would seem. Listened to audiologist advice to not over protect.

Lesson learned. These so called professionals did me more harm than good.

 

[Hope2015]

Yes but not enough it would seem. Listened to audiologist advice to not over protect.

Lesson learned. These so called professionals did me more harm than good.

Overprotection can lead to H from what I heard which is a hell too...right?
In what situations you were and you did not protect yourself?

 

[Nucleo]

Overprotection can lead to H from what I heard which is a hell too...right?
In what situations you were and you did not protect yourself?

I would during long car rides, using power tools and sports events.

I didn't wear protection in crowded restaurants, bars or large social gathering events. That was a mistake.

 

[Hope2015]

I would during long car rides, using power tools and sports events.

I didn't wear protection in crowded restaurants, bars or large social gathering events. That was a mistake.

I don't think it's ok to wear protection in those places, I guess no one does because you can get H which is horrible.
What do you think about this?

 

[Nucleo]

I don't think it's ok to wear protection in those places, I guess no one does because you can get H which is horrible.
What do you think about this?

I do not believe in the theory that protecting your hearing causes hyperacusis. At least not any more than what staying in a dark room does to your vision once you are exposed to daylight.

The notion that protecting your hearing gives you H just seems bogus to me, and has never been substantiated by facts. Let's say for example you put in ear 32 NRR ear plugs in while being exposed to a constant 80 db, which is considered ''safe'' by the OSHA. You are then exposed to 48 db. A quiet room can be less than 48 db. Does sleeping in a quiet environment give you hyperacusis? I haven't heard of such a case.

 

[linearb]

notion that protecting your hearing gives you H just seems bogus to me, and has never been substantiated by facts. Let's say for example you put in ear 32 NRR ear plugs in while being exposed to a constant 80 db, which is considered ''safe'' by the OSHA. You are then exposed to 48 db. A quiet room can be less than 48 db. Does sleeping in a quiet environment give you hyperacusis? I haven't heard of such a case.

well, as far as I can tell, the theory is less to do with db levels, and more to do with the idea that behaviors which feed anxious obsessive fixation, help reinforce that fixation.

My personal view is that there may be different things which get the label "hyperacusis", some of which may represent a feedback loop between behavior and perception, and others which may not, or only to a more limited degree.

The reasons I'm not willing to dismiss the idea out of hand are, #1 - the amount of anecdotes I have seen from people who developed DST for one reason or another, and say that they only improved after they resumed ordinary sound exposure; #2 - the experience of a CBT practitioner I worked with who basically said he had seen the same thing in his own patients, and #3 - my own experience with a limited form of DST/painful stimuli from day to day sounds, which seemed to grow worse and worse the more I fixated on and obsessed about it.

I would stop well short of suggesting that sound exposure is the be-all-end-all solution for anyone with "hyperacusis", or even that anyone who is exhibiting DST/painful stimulation, will necessarily benefit from exposure.

 

[Nucleo]

well, as far as I can tell, the theory is less to do with db levels, and more to do with the idea that behaviors which feed anxious obsessive fixation, help reinforce that fixation.

You are probably right. I do not think 80 db of continuous exposure is good for me (or for anyone else) so I don't even think twice and put ear plugs in. If there are noises I find unconfortable I just put ear plugs and that's the end of it.

I get slightly irritated when Jastreboff and his merry band of TRT practioners claim moderate sound exposure cures hyperacusis with little to no data supporting this claim.

In fact, exposure to sound is probably the worst thing you can do after trauma.

Exposure to light is not indicated for photophobia, in fact it will just make it worse.