Is It Better to Suffer Tinnitus Now Than It Was 2,000 Years Ago?

[Ed209]

Just please don't get mad at other people for being "repetetive" when they want to post something contrary.

I'm not mad at all. I'm just saying no matter what the thread subject is it always ends up being the same discussion. I've never been anti-anything, this is why I'm so confused? I'm anti-suffering, is that bad?

I once replied to you on a thread to try and give your morale a boost, and yet you decided the right approach to this was to rant at me in private. However, I don't think you're a bad person at all. You're pretty funny at times (if a bit immature at other times), but overall you add a different perspective. That's a good thing. I've always said that there should be balanced arguments on here otherwise it would just be a back patting convention. I'm just flabbergasted at the way people are talked to sometimes when they are only trying to help. We're all on the same team. I wonder if people with other debilitating conditions argue amongst themselves like T sufferers do?

 

[threefirefour]

I wonder if people with other debilitating conditions argue amongst themselves like T sufferers do?

I don't think they do. Maybe about things like "what company is the best" or "what will lead to the cure" but I doubt many if any have the massive habituation-focus vs treatment-focus divide like we do. Some people want to only focus on habituation because they don't believe a treatment is coming anytime soon, and others want to focus on a treatment because it's the best way forward and the whole CBT mind-over-matter paradigm has been stale for the past 30 years. Tinnitus has a lot of sufferers, so there's going to be a wide range of opinions on it.

 

[Jcb]

Apparently when there's a thread like this, it's "repetetive" but nbody ever says that about the countless habituation posts. You're right double standards when it suits.

I'm not saying you shouldn't post what you want, feel free to post your perspective, and others who agree with you should be allowed to as well. Just please don't get mad at other people for being "repetetive" when they want to post something contrary.

Anyways in your previous post I feel like you're missing the point a bit. People like you, Fishbone, ML, etc, don't like it when people like me post about how we should only focus on a treatment. If you think all we care about is posting negativity and complaining about positivity, then you would be mistaken. To simplify it to a core, a lot of people here feel that we shouldn't be pretending habituation is a treatment, and that we should hold our treament options up to a higher standard. The situation that tinnitus is in, where 1/8th of people have it yet there's absolutely no treatment I'm sure you can agree is awful. A lot of people want to change that, and I don't blame them. Some of us are just really sick of all the habituation shilling too. Trust me, that get's old really quickly.

Maybe you don't understand what you call the "new wave" of posters because you never looked from our perspective. Try doing that so you can understand where we're coming from.

I think the biggest problem on here, is peoples egos and the need to be right about everything.

I agree to a certain point. I'm all for a cure or at least a treatment that will reduce volume etc. I try and see all sides because I truly feel like I'm in the middle as far as I want to see a cure/treatment, as it stands I don't think what's available to us at the moment is acceptable. I also want to live my life the way I was before I got T. I'm well aware I'll have to make adjustments to my life but I can't obsess over a cure/treatment as this will impact my life and it will pass me by.
I understand why people get mad at the word "habituation" as it can be seen as preventing the medical field from taking T seriously as they may see this as "you're coping so no need to do any research"... but that being said if this allows me to live my life like I was, then I'm all for it.

As much as you make me laugh and I appreciate your views, you can antagonise certain people on here on purpose as you know this will get a rise from them.

What do you do, to raise awareness? This isn't an attack on you so please don't take it as it is, I'm Just curious.

 

[threefirefour]

What do you do, to raise awareness? This isn't an attack on you so please don't take it as it is, I'm Just curious.

Good question. It's not praticularly honest, but I'm shilling Tinnitus research on other websites. Also, I'm saving up money for a potential treatment in the future. I'm trying to save up $6,000 by 2020. If no treatment is avalable by 2021, I'll donate it all to research, because it clearly needs that money to advance.

 

[Jcb]

Good question. It's not praticularly honest, but I'm shilling Tinnitus research on other websites. Also, I'm saving up money for a potential treatment in the future. I'm trying to save up $6,000 by 2020. If no treatment is avalable by 2021, I'll donate it all to research, because it clearly needs that money to advance.

That's admirable man. Do you think you could do more in terms of pushing the awareness of T? I know your an intelligent guy, I liked the way you put this subject across (even though I think still part of it was to cause a stir haha) my only thing is you seem to put down others opinions if they mention anything to do with "habituation" and don't seem to see it from their side. If I'm mistaken then please correct me.

 

[Ed209]

Oh come on. Never mind then.
I didn't say @threefirefour was polite. That wasn't my point. Same with the remainder of your points.
I'm trying my best to keep supporting my family and attempt to habituate. There's no bandwidth for anything else.
I also have other stuff to deal with that's serious but T et al are by far the worst from an experiential pov.
Anyway, I hope you're doing ok now.

No seriously, I haven't read every inch of every post. Just say who it is.

Life can kick our ass from time to time; it's all part of the rollercoaster. Believe me, I ain't had it easy either. I grew up with a hugely distressing, and physically restrictive chest condition to which I needed multiple surgeries. Last year I had Sepsis; a suicidal mother (who depended on me immensely); severe pain in both shoulders and knees forcing me to quit the gym (which was my sanctuary) needing possible keyhole surgery; bleeding from my rectum requiring a colonoscopy (waiting for biopsy results), and now I have obstructive sleep apnoea. Happy days eh?

On top of all this my daughter has blood and mucous in her stools which has been ongoing for 2 months. We've seen a private consultant, 2 NHS consultants, 2 health visitors and a dietitian. None of them can figure it out, so we've been referred to a Dr at Birmingham Children's Hospital, which is world class. We're hopeful it's nothing to worry about but it just adds to the list. Believe me, I know what a struggle is. Even so, I remain optimistic and continue each day with a smile on my face. If I ever let life drag me down like it has in the past I know where it heads and it's a slippery slope. We have to stay positive and focused. Life ain't always gravy, but when it's good, it's real good!

 

[threefirefour]

That's admirable man. Do you think you could do more in terms of pushing the awareness of T? I know your an intelligent guy, I liked the way you put this subject across (even though I think still part of it was to cause a stir haha) my only thing is you seem to put down others opinions if they mention anything to do with "habituation" and don't seem to see it from their side. If I'm mistaken then please correct me.

Oh yeah absolutely. Even though I am very active in raising awareness, and trying to unify the tinnitus community under the banner of lazer-focus on a treatment, and saving money to give to research or pay for a treatment, I have yet to actually donate any money. I'm poor, so I am saving for both college and this. I want all my money that I'm not using to go to that pile.

As for causing a stir, I didn't make this post for that. I said I wasn't being sarcastic. But yeah I truly think this post is right, and people focusing on habituation like it's an actual answer is a relatively new force in the tinnitus community, and is an example of social regression. I'm thinking of making a seperate post explaining why I think this.

And yes I know what the other side thinks. I've seen it from their perspective. I just disagree.

 

[Jcb]

Oh yeah absolutely. Even though I am very active in raising awareness, and trying to unify the tinnitus community under the banner of lazer-focus on a treatment, and saving money to give to research or pay for a treatment, I have yet to actually donate any money. I'm poor, so I am saving for both college and this. I want all my money that I'm not using to go to that pile.

As for causing a stir, I didn't make this post for that. I said I wasn't being sarcastic. But yeah I truly think this post is right, and people focusing on habituation like it's an actual answer is a relatively new force in the tinnitus community, and is an example of social regression. I'm thinking of making a seperate post explaining why I think this.

And yes I know what the other side thinks. I've seen it from their perspective. I just disagree.

That's great, it really is. I know you weren't being sarcastic, that's why I said I like the way you actually wrote this thread (Part me of still thinks you did it to get a rise as well) there's nothing wrong with disagreeing with other people's opinions, it just seems and this is not aimed at just you, certain people instantly dismiss other people's views and take things personal when there is no need to and it doesn't solve anything.

 

[Gman]

No seriously, I haven't read every inch of every post. Just say who it is.

Life can kick our ass from time to time; it's all part of the rollercoaster. Believe me, I ain't had it easy either. I grew up with a hugely distressing, and physically restrictive chest condition to which I needed multiple surgeries. Last year I had Sepsis; a suicidal mother (who depended on me immensely); severe pain in both shoulders and knees forcing me to quit the gym (which was my sanctuary) needing possible keyhole surgery; bleeding from my rectum requiring a colonoscopy (waiting for biopsy results), and now I have obstructive sleep apnoea. Happy days eh?

On top of all this my daughter has blood and mucous in her stools which has been ongoing for 2 months. We've seen a private consultant, 2 NHS consultants, 2 health visitors and a dietitian. None of them can figure it out, so we've been referred to a Dr at Birmingham Children's Hospital, which is world class. We're hopeful it's nothing to worry about but it just adds to the list. Believe me, I know what a struggle is. Even so, I remain optimistic and continue each day with a smile on my face. If I ever let life drag me down like it has in the past I know where it heads and it's a slippery slope. We have to stay positive and focused. Life ain't always gravy, but when it's good, it's real good!

Well if it helps, other things I'm dealing with beyond this lovely collection of T related stuff are fairly comparable, without going into details. Not competing, but what I am trying to say is you're not alone.

Totally agree with keeping positive and focussed. Taking it a day at a time, keeping busy and never giving up. I also think being open and honest is important too - not sugar coating things.

Maybe in some ways having faced adversity and struggles helps us in being able to cope with this thing, rather than if life had always been fairly smooth sailing. I can imagine getting T would be brutal if things had mostly been like that. Although when things are bad, it is difficult to not feel like it's just another bad thing to add to the list.

 

[zeroday]

I think medieval peasants with T never bother with it most of the time too busy trying not to die from starvation or other even worst thing...life quality was hell back then so I guess T would be a really small priority even for the sufferer themself

BLAHAHAHAHAHAHA...

 

[zeroday]

More than one road to a cure...habitation is a cure for some...not all...just saying

 

[Ed209]

Well if it helps, other things I'm dealing with beyond this lovely collection of T related stuff are fairly comparable, without going into details. Not competing, but what I am trying to say is you're not alone.

Totally agree with keeping positive and focussed. Taking it a day at a time, keeping busy and never giving up. I also think being open and honest is important too - not sugar coating things.

Maybe in some ways having faced adversity and struggles helps us in being able to cope with this thing, rather than if life had always been fairly smooth sailing. I can imagine getting T would be brutal if things had mostly been like that. Although when things are bad, it is difficult to not feel like it's just another bad thing to add to the list.

I've been through some really bad times. It's all part of life; we all go through bad stuff. You never know what the average person on the street is going through. We just presume other people's lives are perfect but I assure you they are far from it. Both times when my T hit me hard, I got through because I always do. The trials of my life have given me extraordinary coping skills that pull me back up.

I never sugar coat anything. I say things as they are and always have on here. Anytime I've not felt right I've said it, and conversely when things are great I say that as well. I like to stay on the positive track. I prefer looking for solutions to complaining about my lack of options. I found over the years that complaining and looking at the dark side of things just saps too much energy and that energy is wasted. It just doesn't propel us anywhere.

Even now, with all the stuff I've got going on I'm happy and content again. For a while after that MRI I had I was seriously anxious/depressed/suicidal. It REALLY hit me hard. It actually came as a shock to my system because I'd almost forgotten how it really felt to feel that way because of T. I could quite easily have just gone on my merry way once I'd established my life again, but I decided to stay to give a different angle because I figured the positive views are quite hidden. I thought if I can help just one person feel better about their day then mission accomplished.

 

[Jazzer]

people focusing on habituation like it's an actual answer is a relatively new force in the tinnitus community, and is an example of social regressio

Many people confidently claim to have habituated, and to feel happy about their progress.
Why would that not represent an 'actual answer'
to them?
Believing in Tinnitus is a bit like believing in God.
God never happened for me, though I do admit to actively 'going to look for him a few times.'
I did not attend church (swallow other people's indoctrination) or immerse myself in the bible (self indoctrinate.)
I decided that the direct approach of prayer was the only satisfactory way.
Make it personal.
"Dear God - please let me feel your presence in my life."
Unfortunately, I felt absolutely nothing, so I came to my own conclusion.
Perhaps believers have a much better imagination than myself.

If habituation really does happen for some people, why would they not see it as an 'actual answer?'
And to label the whole exercise as "social regression" is obviously cynical and demeaning.

Relegating Habituation to the rubbish bin is disingenuous.
A bit like saying "...I havent habituated, so it must be nonsense!"

That argument looks a bit like sour grapes.

 

[threefirefour]

Many people confidently claim to have habituated, and to feel happy about their progress.
Why would that not represent an 'actual answer'
to them?
Believing in Tinnitus is a bit like believing in God.
God never happened for me, though I do admit to actively 'going to look for him a few times.'
I did not attend church (swallow other people's indoctrination) or immerse myself in the bible (self indoctrinate.)
I decided that the direct approach of prayer was the only satisfactory way.
Make it personal.
"Dear God - please let me feel your presence in my life."
Unfortunately, I felt absolutely nothing, so I came to my own conclusion.
Perhaps believers have a much better imagination than myself.

If habituation really does happen for some people, why would they not see it as an 'actual answer?'
And to label the whole exercise as "social regression" is obviously cynical and demeaning.

Relegating Habituation to the rubbish bin is disingenuous.
A bit like saying "...I havent habituated, so it must be nonsense!"

That argument looks a bit like sour grapes.

That's not the point I was making. the point I was making is that in general, we used to fixate on a cure a lot more.

It's a very complicated explaination, but the TL;DR is that communities tend to value what they have. Not what they should have. Examples being how a person winning a game cares about the score, and the person losing "only cares about the fun".

Earlier we used to care more about a cure. You see all the quotes from famous people with it, talking about how crap it was. Never "yeah you get used to it". In fact that being the crux of our "treatments" is a pretty modern idea. The reason is we have nothing for tinnitus, and we've tried to find a cure, yet we constantly come up empty. So we've socially come to accept nothing as some sort of treatment. That's what I mean by social regression.

 

[Jazzer]

you can antagonise certain people on here on purpose as you know this will get a rise from them.

The trick when dealing with threefirefour is to look at the logic of his arguments and engage, but never take the emotional bait....'cos he loves it if you fall into that trap!'
He has never antagonised me - and he never will.
Water off a duck's back.

There is one other little trick also:

Just show him a picture of a cuddly-wuddly little pussycat, and he reverts almost instantaneously to a close approximation of a human being.
It's uncanny.....

 

[Samantha R]

Well, if we could put as much energy into actively doing something about finding a cure as we do into arguing - we'd have one by now!

I can only encourage people to do something!

Donate if you can, advocate where you can, start a support group, write your local MP / newspaper.... a few examples of things you can do.

I've always been a proactive person. That's how things happen.

As for "suffering" - my dad has LOUD tinnitus. How do I know? I ask him at random times if he can hear his tinnitus - and he always can - even in a nearly full restaurant! Does he care - not one bit. It has no effect on his quality and enjoyment of life. I asked him if it was loud, and he said it was. He said sometimes at night he wakes up and thinks to himself it's loud, but he turns his mind to other thoughts and is able to drift back to sleep.

He told me recently that it's starting up in his right ear as well as his left. He doesn't care one bit.
If I felt like that, I'd consider myself cured.

 

[threefirefour]

The trick when dealing with threefirefour is to look at the logic of his arguments and engage, but never take the emotional bait....'cos he loves it if you fall into that trap!'
He has never antagonised me - and he never will.
Water off a duck's back.

There is one other little trick also:

Just show him a picture of a cuddly-wuddly little pussycat, and he reverts almost instantaneously to a close approximation of a human being.
It's uncanny.....

Good idea. So you see that my arguments make sense.

And no I don't. Because that implies I'm setting a trap. I am definitely not.

 

[Jazzer]

So you see that my arguments make sense.

Yup - I always get your arguments, but often disagree with your emphasis.
I sometimes detect a whiff of acerbia - but perhaps I am mistaken there.......

 

[threefirefour]

Yup - I always get your arguments, but often disagree with your emphasis.
I sometimes detect a whiff of acerbia - but perhaps I am mistaken there.......

You have the right. As long as your digesting and critically examining my POV I'm cool with disagreement.

 

[Andrei90]

"No Tinnitas Talk 2,000 years ago"

This is an easy one.

 

[Greg Sacramento]

I believe that this is only the second time that I will express a general message board opinion and hope it's the last. Conquer and divide isn't a total thought mechanism on beliefs, it's too to achieve power likeness and often that need comes from childhood or early adult experiences where there was struggle.

All the regulars here have smarts in certain areas, but I often see that some brilliant posters who are not groupies. I prefer to get along with everyone here, but I know that it's impossible for all of us to accept that we are all different.

The subject of noise protection where there's so much disagreement is an example. Some with certain physical nerve problems relating to T & H need to avoid even moderate sound. So it is impossible for all of us to take everything in consideration as we often relate just to "me".