Laser Device by Medicomat

[MikeEd]

I found a laser device for sale on Amazon for around $444. It's made by Medicomat. I am wondering if anyone has any experience or advice they give me about this before I make a purchase.

https://www.amazon.com/dp/B075V7D6T1/_encoding=UTF8?coliid=IZHEGUVBGHOBH&colid=AHCUMVTFP0NF&psc=0

 

[AZeurotuner]

I found a laser device for sale on Amazon for around $444. It's made by Medicomat. I am wondering if anyone has any experience or advice they give me about this before I make a purchase.

https://www.amazon.com/dp/B075V7D6T1/_encoding=UTF8?coliid=IZHEGUVBGHOBH&colid=AHCUMVTFP0NF&psc=0

At only 5 miliwatts this device is grossly underpowered, and extremely overpriced. The unit that I'm currently using is a konftec; the 808nm is rated at 90mw per ear piece, and the 650nm at 50mw, giving you a combined output of 180mw and 100mw respectively. I have both wavelengths which of course is more expensive, but if you purchase just one, it's about the same price as the medicomat. I'd go so far as to say that the medicomat is an outright scam, because at a scant 5mw and >$400, it's just an expensive paperweight.

http://www.konftec.com/html/ko_product_tinnitus.htm

 

[Eric Speck]

I agree with you. 5 miliwatts won't do much of anything according to the Doctors that developed this technology. I am using 660 @ 40mw per ear. It has improved my hearing in the middle and lower ranges a lot but not much in the higher frequencies. I was wondering how yours is performing with the higher mw's? I bought my unit from Dr. Lutz Wilden from Germany about 4 years ago. Unfortunately I think I keep damaging my ears because of what I do for a living. Can't get away from the noise of construction. Very frustrating.

 

[AZeurotuner]

I agree with you. 5 miliwatts won't do much of anything according to the Doctors that developed this technology. I am using 660 @ 40mw per ear. It has improved my hearing in the middle and lower ranges a lot but not much in the higher frequencies. I was wondering how yours is performing with the higher mw's? I bought my unit from Dr. Lutz Wilden from Germany about 4 years ago. Unfortunately I think I keep damaging my ears because of what I do for a living. Can't get away from the noise of construction. Very frustrating.

Using the 808nm at 90mws per ear feels warmer, but not uncomfortable, actually quite opposite, the heat feels really good and relaxing. The 50mw 660nm (accidentally put 650 is my last post) has a warmth to it but definitely not like the 90mw. I've only been using them for around three months but already I feel a difference, my ears feel less "tired", being around loud noises doesn't seem to fatigue them nearly as badly anymore. The everyday ear pain that I had been experiencing for over a year all but disappeared as well, I now believe that it has nothing to do with hyperacusis and is likely a nerve issue that is greatly reduced by photobiomodulation. I laser daily, alternating between the 808nm (30min 162, joules per ear) and the 660nm daily (55min, 165 joules per ear) , taking a two day break every week. How long are your sessions?

 

[Bobby B]

get a LED - far more powerful than lasers - safer and a fraction of the price

the rated power in W is about 10 times the optical power so a 20w gives you 2 w optical power (like in laser) which is 2000mw more than enough

 

[Eric Speck]

Using the 808nm at 90mws per ear feels warmer, but not uncomfortable, actually quite opposite, the heat feels really good and relaxing. The 50mw 660nm (accidentally put 650 is my last post) has a warmth to it but definitely not like the 90mw. I've only been using them for around three months but already I feel a difference, my ears feel less "tired", being around loud noises doesn't seem to fatigue them nearly as badly anymore. The everyday ear pain that I had been experiencing for over a year all but disappeared as well, I now believe that it has nothing to do with hyperacusis and is likely a nerve issue that is greatly reduced by photobiomodulation. I laser daily, alternating between the 808nm (30min 162, joules per ear) and the 660nm daily (55min, 165 joules per ear) , taking a two day break every week. How long are your sessions?

Thank you for your response. My sessions are 30 minutes per day 5 days a week although it varies depending on my work schedule. I have been doing this for four years and I have plateaued it seems although it is up and down.

I also have middle ear issues in my left ear that an ENT says is Otosclerosis (spelling?) (the calcification of the middle ear bones)

He said 4 years ago it would get worse and I would lose my hearing in that ear. It has slowly gotten better and I don't think it is what he said it was. I think I actually broke one of the bones with trauma. All that said, my progress has been mixed mainly because I have exposed myself to additional noise due to my profession. I'm a carpenter.

And, I'm limited to the 660 @ 40mw unit called a Luci. I have been told by Dr. Lutz Wilden from Germany that if I came to his clinic in Spain he could greatly improve my situation in a 10 day intensive treatment but I simply can't afford it. I do think LLLT works but, (and it is a big but), you have to give your ears a break (not much noise) perhaps for a year if you've had acoustic trauma. My hearing has improved and if it weren't for the LLLT I would be way worse off due to the continued noise I have experienced.

I am presently trying to get away from the construction and working on an online marketing business. I have hopes of going to Dr. Wildens Clinic before he retires which is now in Ibiza Spain. I believe you will continue to see results in your therapy. Good luck with it. BTW, 4 years ago my Tinnitus was unbearable.

I was ready to call it quits. This therapy saved my life along with my wife. I still suffer from Tinnitus but, it is 50% less although I have some bad days which I contribute to noise exposure. I also suffer from Hyperacusis but, I think it is primarily due to wearing custom ear plugs constantly.

 

[Tom Cnyc]

I have hopes of going to Dr. Wildens Clinic before he retires which is now in Ibiza Spain.

There is a clinic in Florida. You don't need Spain.

It's Lumomed, so related to Wilden.

 

[AZeurotuner]

get a LED - far more powerful than lasers - safer and a fraction of the price

the rated power in W is about 10 times the optical power so a 20w gives you 2 w optical power (like in laser) which is 2000mw more than enough

Are there any studies showing that LED is more effective than laser for light therapy though? There's plenty showing that monochromatic light yields a higher efficacy than sources such as LED. Another thing to consider is that LED light doesn't have the penetration power of laser; hold a laser up to your hand and the light shines right through, LED doesn't seem to have that attribute. Also that 2000mw of power isn't concentrated like a laser beam, it's spread out, that might be beneficial for superficial healing, but for treating the inner ear, you're probably not getting close to that much power actually hitting the cochlea.

Thank you for your response. My sessions are 30 minutes per day 5 days a week although it varies depending on my work schedule. I have been doing this for four years and I have plateaued it seems although it is up and down. I also have middle ear issues in my left ear that an ENT says is Otosclerosis (spelling?) (the calcification of the middle ear bones) He said 4 years ago it would get worse and I would lose my hearing in that ear. It has slowly gotten better and I don't think it is what he said it was. I think I actually broke one of the bones with trauma. All that said, my progress has been mixed mainly because I have exposed myself to additional noise due to my profession. I'm a carpenter. And, I'm limited to the 660 @ 40mw unit called a Luci. I have been told by Dr. Lutz Wilden from Germany that if I came to his clinic in Spain he could greatly improve my situation in a 10 day intensive treatment but I simply can't afford it. I do think LLLT works but, (and it is a big but), you have to give your ears a break (not much noise) perhaps for a year if you've had acoustic trauma. My hearing has improved and if it weren't for the LLLT I would be way worse off due to the continued noise I have experienced. I am presently trying to get away from the construction and working on an online marketing business. I have hopes of going to Dr. Wildens Clinic before he retires which is now in Ibiza Spain. I believe you will continue to see results in your therapy. Good luck with it. BTW, 4 years ago my Tinnitus was unbearable. I was ready to call it quits. This therapy saved my life along with my wife. I still suffer from Tinnitus but, it is 50% less although I have some bad days which I contribute to noise exposure. I also suffer from Hyperacussus but, I think it is primarily due to wearing custom ear plugs constantly.

Good to hear that the lllt helped you, any improvement is much welcomed when it comes to tinnitus. You'd probably be better off purchasing a high output home unit, there are some pretty powerful devices available now.

 

[Bobby B]

I am talking about monochromatic LED such as 850nm or 940nm and yes we have studies showing those are the same pretty much

Its the exact same photons

The only difference is that for LLLT using lasers you need a lense to unfocus the beam to avoid injury due to heat if it's powerful while the LED is unfocused by design - maybe more than laser with those Lenses so do you waste more photons on a LED but that's irrelevant if the light source is very powerful to start with

Watch the good YouTube video with Prof Hamblin interviewed on LLLT - he goes over all this and he uses LED on himself

 

[Eric Speck]

There is a clinic in Florida. You don't need Spain.

It's Lumomed, so related to Wilden.

I'm aware. Just wanted the guy who originally developed the treatment. I also have other issues that could be corrected by surgery which would require an ear specialist like Wilden.. However, I am increasingly considering Lumomed.

 

[Eric Speck]

Are there any studies showing that LED is more effective than laser for light therapy though? There's plenty showing that monochromatic light yields a higher efficacy than sources such as LED. Another thing to consider is that LED light doesn't have the penetration power of laser; hold a laser up to your hand and the light shines right through, LED doesn't seem to have that attribute. Also that 2000mw of power isn't concentrated like a laser beam, it's spread out, that might be beneficial for superficial healing, but for treating the inner ear, you're probably not getting close to that much power actually hitting the cochlea.



Good to hear that the lllt helped you, any improvement is much welcomed when it comes to tinnitus. You'd probably be better off purchasing a high output home unit, there are some pretty powerful devices available now.

Thank you, It is because of your post that is making me take another look at Konftec. I paid $3700.00 for the Luci 660@40mw. Had to borrow the money. Still was worth it but, it's very encouraging to see there are much cheaper alternatives now.

 

[MikeEd]

get a LED - far more powerful than lasers - safer and a fraction of the price

the rated power in W is about 10 times the optical power so a 20w gives you 2 w optical power (like in laser) which is 2000mw more than enough

Can you post a link to a particular product? I don't know what to look for.

 

[Leoglobe]

Hi @Bobby B

Can you please post a link to a particular LED product?

Thank you

 

[Bobby B]

look in ebay 20 or 50w 850 to 950 nm