Low-Level Laser Therapy (LLLT) for Tinnitus — Experiences (Dr. Wilden, etc.)

[CarrieLee]

I will trust Dr. Wilden's bank transfer. His son takes paypal or bank transfer or credit card. I believe Lux Spa is the same as Luci. It is different name because his son wants to differentiate from him. You can also order it from Amon Kaiser from Barden Barden - http://www.lumomed.de/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=85&Itemid=48&lang=en

I own Luci and am still using it. You also get the consultation follow up from Amon. I think the consultation sessions along with the laser device are the most valuable thing here, not the laser device itself. Think of doctor appointments. The doctors do not do consultation on the phone or email. You always need to go to the office to visit them and pay the co-pay each time, let alone the time wasted to wait for the appointment. The fact you can contact them anytime through email or phone is very valuable.

 

[CarrieLee]

I think the advice from @FERNANDO GIL is also very good. As long as you can get consultation sessions along with the device itself, it is worth spending the money.

 

[bwspot]

Completely right.
And must be bigger, cause is business is small.



For the two:
Anne does not sell lasers, she will advise you to buy the same laser I bought, from LUCKY LASER.
Good part:
1- She uses them on the tretaments and at her clinics, so quality wise is more than aproved.
2- You can ask her to make the order direct, so Lucky laser owner will know that Anne is checking quality after you received the laser.
3- When you receive the laser, you can chat with Anne and ask for advice how your treatment is working and getting some wise advices if need it. You can even see how it works during your stay at Anne, even do, the one is more friendly user, than the one she as at the clinic.
4- The laser has two probes, 650nm/120Mw and 808 /900 Mw ( DO NOT USE 808 nm above 400 MW on your ears, just to strong. you can regulate the power out), you can use 808nm above 400Mw only for pain relief and joints. NOT IN THE EAR.
So compared with Dr widen, YOU WILL GET MORE FOR LESS.- but she told me that more power means less quality time for the probe, so she advice only use it for other treatments ( where you will need more power to be efective) only when you finished with the T treatment.
6- You don´t need to place the order right after finishing the treatment. You can wait a 2/3 weeks, see the results from the treatment and ask Anne to help you placing the order to the factory, after.

Bad part:
1-You will need to wire the money to the factory , as you will do to Dr Wilden, no diference there.
2-Factory does not have lasers in stock, they produce them as they get the order/payment. And take around a week time at least to make it.
3- She is not in Oslo but in Sandvika, if need I will give you all details to get here. Sandvika is 15 km from Oslo.

Besides this I think I can not do much more.
I´m here in Norway, if you have other questions, let me know, I will ask her tomorrow and post here.

This morning when I wake up it took around a few minutes till I noticed the T. My felling is that you will order the laser right after you came here.

All the best
Sheers

I checked with lucky laser and they sent me photos of the probes. How do you use them? How do they hold in the ear compared to Wildens device?
Can you use two at the time?

 

[FERNANDO GIL]

HI @bwspot
In a prrevious post. I said that using the MLS pen from Dr Wilden would be not so comfortable
as using the Lucy Laser, Lucy laser you can wear it eve wille doing other things. If you go to more poweful lasers they start to be bigger.
For the Lucky Laser you have two options. If you only use one probe at the time, you need to handle it in your ears, with your hand. Other option is to lay down and put a side suport ( can be a folded towel) and insert the probes in your ear.
later I will post a picture.

Can you use two at the time?

Yes, since is important to not use same wavelength everyday during some time. this what i´m doing.
Monday, Wednesday,Friday, I use use 8o8 in my bad year and 650 on my good year, at the same time.
Tuesday and Thursday, I do the opposite. This i´m doing 30 minutes.
Weekend, rest time.
After each treatment , 10 /15 minuts, I use the two at the same time in my bad ear, one inside the ear and other behind the ear.
One day 808 inside the ear and 650 behind the ear. The next day I change again.

This way you keep changing the wavelengths everyday so ears do not get used to same wavelength.
Sheers

 

[bwspot]

HI @bwspot
In a prrevious post. I said that using the MLS pen from Dr Wilden would be not so comfortable
as using the Lucy Laser, Lucy laser you can wear it eve wille doing other things. If you go to more poweful lasers they start to be bigger.
For the Lucky Laser you have two options. If you only use one probe at the time, you need to handle it in your ears, with your hand. Other option is to lay down and put a side suport ( can be a folded towel) and insert the probes in your ear.
later I will post a picture.


Yes, since is important to not use same wavelength everyday during some time. this what i´m doing.
Monday, Wednesday,Friday, I use use 8o8 in my bad year and 650 on my good year, at the same time.
Tuesday and Thursday, I do the opposite. This i´m doing 30 minutes.
Weekend, rest time.
After each treatment , 10 /15 minuts, I use the two at the same time in my bad ear, one inside the ear and other behind the ear.
One day 808 inside the ear and 650 behind the ear. The next day I change again.

This way you keep changing the wavelengths everyday so ears do not get used to same wavelength.
Sheers

So I wonder why Wildens Ibiza spa device has only one wavelenght if you are not supposed to use it everyday?
Lucky laser told me :
"
You need to buy a holder to fix probes before therapy.
"

 

[Nick J.]

You need to buy a holder to fix probes before therapy.

Fernando already explained how to do the treatment with the probes. Best way is to lay on the back with your head on a pillow and a towel behind your neck to keep probes from moving. This is how its done in Norway and it works just fine...trust me!

Oh...and dont listen to Dr. Nagler.
The best deal its deffinitly to buy the Lucky laser.
Anne in Norway is not useing it just for the fun of it. It actually works and works great and u get two wavelength and much more power!
So if one does not feel a thing by this treatment, then the 100% wont do either with any other laser out there imo.

 

[bwspot]

Fernando already explained how to do the treatment with the probes. Best way is to lay on the back with your head on a pillow and a towel behind your neck to keep probes from moving. This is how its done in Norway and it works just fine...trust me!

Oh...and dont listen to Dr. Nagler.
The best deal its deffinitly to buy the Lucky laser.
Anne in Norway is not useing it just for the fun of it. It actually works and works great and u get two wavelength and much more power!
So if one does not feel a thing by this treatment, then the 100% wont do either with any other laser out there imo.

Thx, are you done with the treatment this week? Any improvements?

One member was questioning about laser damaging high frequencies instead of fixing them. Any though about that ?

 

[FERNANDO GIL]

One member was questioning about laser damaging high frequencies instead of fixing them. Any though about that ?

Ask him how Hansi Cross, "fixed them"? That is false. I think that is coming from Sam Blog, but I think she made a mistake when saying that. She started to notice the high frequencies, when she got the low frequencies "fixed". The sound of the T changes during the treatment, the T sound correspond to the frequency more damage in your ear. I think Sam had a problem on low frequencies and on the high´s. She started to notice the high´s only when she got the low´s fixed. Hope I helped.

 

[FERNANDO GIL]

DO NOT USE OVER 808 nm/500Mw

Need to fix this, should use it only till 400 Mw inside the ears.

 

[FERNANDO GIL]

I actually can hear a bit better/clearer, but the "full" feeling is still there

Takes time, remember that, but is good you fell something.

 

[FERNANDO GIL]

There is not restriction for 5mW 650nm is the common pen pointer laser.

Why do you talk on 5Mw?
If you want some results, you must start at the 30Mw. And if you want my advice. Take care of ear, if you keep thinking, that is just put laser in your ears and here you go. Hope nothing goes wrong with them

 

[bwspot]

Ask him how Hansi Cross, "fixed them"? That is false. I think that is coming from Sam Blog, but I think she made a mistake when saying that. She started to notice the high frequencies, when she got the low frequencies "fixed". The sound of the T changes during the treatment, the T sound correspond to the frequency more damage in your ear. I think Sam had a problem on low frequencies and on the high´s. She started to notice the high´s only when she got the low´s fixed. Hope I helped.

Thx for me the greatest benefit of llt would be to get some frequencies back.
Anne recommended this place:
http://www.emmagjestehus.no/emma-gjestehus
I only speak English and their website is in cipher. Do people in Norway know English well?
Seems like her treatments are long so there would be no time for site seing.

 

[Mr. Cartman]

Thx for me the greatest benefit of llt would be to get some frequencies back.
Anne recommended this place:
http://www.emmagjestehus.no/emma-gjestehus
I only speak English and their website is in cipher. Do people in Norway know English well?
Seems like her treatments are long so there would be no time for site seing.

"Emma Gjestehus ligger ca 25 min. vest for Oslo retning Drammen. Følg E16 fra Sandvika mot Hønefoss og videre skilting til Emma Hjorth."

Thats like a 10 min walk from where I live

Im not into LLLT though, but if you want me to call Anne and ask for something, translate something on their website or help you out in any way, let me know

 

[Nick J.]

Thx, are you done with the treatment this week? Any improvements?

Im not the one getting treatment in Norway!!
Thats Fernando!

But i treat myself dayly with my MLS from Wilden and it works ok.
I recently had the best days since i got this bad T.
But i was on a cruiseship and i went to a party wearing earplugs only for like 10-15min. and my ears started go bananas and since then, my T has been somewhat bad again...like how it was a month ago.
So pretty stupid of me.
I felt like i was overall 60% cured over the last 10 days.
Cuz every day my T just got lower and lower.
But now its back up and i feel like i have been set back because of that loud music.
I really regret it.
So now its back to avoid all kinds of music or background noise.

 

[Nick J.]

Do people in Norway know English well?

Yes the do.
In Skandinavia, English is our second language. So dont worry. It's not like in Germany or France where people are to arrogant to speak/learn anything else then the native language.

And Anne both speak and write in English.
Not perfect, but ok i think.

In emmas gjestehus, the know how to speak english aswell...obv!

 

[FERNANDO GIL]

Can you use two at the time?

here is the picture

 

[FERNANDO GIL]

Can you use two at the time?

Here is the picture

 

[bwspot]

Here is the pictureView attachment 4768

thx , how do you feel after last treatment? any improvements?

 

[Rube]

What does the laser behind the ear do? How does it penetrate the skull?

 

[FERNANDO GIL]

thx , how do you feel after last treatment? any improvements?

Gimme two more weeks to see, now a lot of activity. Ups and downs and some zingers as well. ( A higher T that comes for a few seconds and then disappear) not as may as previous treatments but few.

I notice my T tone changed looks more thinner, hope is moving to higher frequencies more.
But need to wait at least two weeks.
And no Laser during this week at home.

 

[FERNANDO GIL]

How does it penetrate the skull?

If it´s strong, the light passes the bone.

 

[bwspot]

Gimme two more weeks to see, now a lot of activity. Ups and downs and some zingers as well. ( A higher T that comes for a few seconds and then disappear) not as may as previous treatments but few.

I notice my T tone changed looks more thinner, hope is moving to higher frequencies more.
But need to wait at least two weeks.
And no Laser during this week at home.

that's the scary part for me is that increase. My T is pretty thin and the one that resembles the fridge is quiet and i can only hear it when i go sleep or in quiet places. I wonder if i do laser will all go up very much?

 

[FERNANDO GIL]

that's the scary part for me is that increase. My T is pretty thin and the one that resembles the fridge is quiet and i can only hear it when i go sleep or in quiet places. I wonder if i do laser will all go up very much?

Ok
My T went up, but nothing as it used to be. A bad day now, was a good day 6 months ago. And will go up during a few days. Nothing to scary, but you have to understand that is part of the ealing process. Knowing that you got nothing to fear.

Actualy i´m happy now every time i got those zingers and fluctuation on my T, it means the treatment is working.

Is happening the same to the lady that went to norway with me.

Sheers

 

[bwspot]

Ok
My T went up, but nothing as it used to be. A bad day now, was a good day 6 months ago. And will go up during a few days. Nothing to scary, but you have to understand that is part of the ealing process. Knowing that you got nothing to fear.

Actualy i´m happy now every time i got those zingers and fluctuation on my T, it means the treatment is working.

Is happening the same to the lady that went to norway with me.

Sheers

so even with thin T the increase is expected?

 

[Nick J.]

so even with thin T the increase is expected?

Yes

When u get a wound on your knee by falling, it will also hurt alot in the beginning and it will start to itch more and more...but both things will fade out by time, because its a healingprogcess

 

[FERNANDO GIL]

so even with thin T the increase is expected?

I know the bigest fear is the T to increase. But people have to realize, that you are healing a wound, They are cells like any other part of our body.

The main problem is that most people in this fórum expect that some company shows up with pill that will stop the T.
How can you take a pill to cure a precise wound? We have 25 000 cels in our ear,with a body with 5 bilion ( hope I´m correct), how can you just take a pill and define that is taking care of 50 000 in an universe of 5 billion.

For obvious reasons I´m fan of LLLT, and from what I ready here, there is no other way you can help to low you T and gain earing, ( is possible with vitamina and with natural regeneration, it happened to me).Cause in the end is what is all about gainning earing, getting your ear back to normal earing acording to your age. Stem Cells can help, it did help me as well. But you have to spend 25000 USD.Is a lot, is it, but how much do you think will cost a pill that will make people ear again. In portugal the most recent tretment for Hepatit is around 90 000€ . I think people will get suprised with prices if a cure shows up, then maybe they will say that 1500 Usd for a laser is not to much. A TRT device cost up to 2500 USD, how much do yo think those cost to makeeven less tahan a laser. And for sure those do nothing to gain earing.

Sheers

 

[FERNANDO GIL]

Here some pictures of the LUCKY LASER. 650 nm /120 Mw.
Just to see how far the light can penetrante in human body.
The light looks stronger, cause picture were takan with my Phone.

And Cats love the laser as well, for other reasons of corse.

 

[bwspot]

I know the bigest fear is the T to increase. But people have to realize, that you are healing a wound, They are cells like any other part of our body.

The main problem is that most people in this fórum expect that some company shows up with pill that will stop the T.
How can you take a pill to cure a precise wound? We have 25 000 cels in our ear,with a body with 5 bilion ( hope I´m correct), how can you just take a pill and define that is taking care of 50 000 in an universe of 5 billion.

For obvious reasons I´m fan of LLLT, and from what I ready here, there is no other way you can help to low you T and gain earing, ( is possible with vitamina and with natural regeneration, it happened to me).Cause in the end is what is all about gainning earing, getting your ear back to normal earing acording to your age. Stem Cells can help, it did help me as well. But you have to spend 25000 USD.Is a lot, is it, but how much do you think will cost a pill that will make people ear again. In portugal the most recent tretment for Hepatit is around 90 000€ . I think people will get suprised with prices if a cure shows up, then maybe they will say that 1500 Usd for a laser is not to much. A TRT device cost up to 2500 USD, how much do yo think those cost to makeeven less tahan a laser. And for sure those do nothing to gain earing.

Sheers

I always like the idea of healing a wound. To prove that to myself I took dr.wildens advice and i started to wear cotton in my ears for last 2 weeks. I noticed improved hearing and t sometimes gets even thiner but fluctuates. So maybe hair cells can heal and wake up.

 

[skoupidis]

The tinitool is out of the question? 5mW and 650nm
http://orliatrio.gr/ωρλ-εξοπλισμος/εμβοές/tinnitool-detail

 

[briano]

Im not the one getting treatment in Norway!!
Thats Fernando!

But i treat myself dayly with my MLS from Wilden and it works ok.
.

If you had any hearing loss, has Wilden's laser restored it?