My Analogy of Habituation

[brody24]

It will be nice (one day) to see some kind of proof of this, until then there will always be people (especially those of which T has taken everything) that are skeptical or flat out don't believe it. Until there is real proof, this debate will go on in the tinnitus comunity forever.

I agree. The subjective nature of T makes it natural to be skeptical or hesitant. I have what I would call bad T, yet some people have posted sound bytes of what their T sounds like, and I listened for a second and thanked god mine wasn't that bad. And I'm sure there are some people who say they have bad T, who would hear mine and shudder. Again, its all so subjective.

So yeah, its natural for us to question the severity of others. The way I have been approaching it is to generally take people at their word. At the end of the day, I want to believe that I can recover and habituate. And if I immediately put up a wall to those who have succeeded in doing so, I'm ensuring that I will never make that leap. Maybe I'm setting myself up for failure with nothing but false hope. But to me, it beats the alternative of thinking of it like a foregone conclusion.

 

[linearb]

It will be nice (one day) to see some kind of proof of this, until then there will always be people (especially those of which T has taken everything) that are skeptical or flat out don't believe it. Until there is real proof, this debate will go on in the tinnitus comunity forever.

well, I mean, how can you ever prove this? It invariably turns into the no-true-scotsmen fallacy... no one with truly severe tinnitus could possibly habituate to it, therefore if you habituate you didn't have severe tinnitus.

What do you define as "severe"? Here are some criteria:
* high pitched
* variable
* loud enough to be heard clearly over 75-80db white noise

if we could agree that anyone who's tinnitus meets those criteria has "severe" tinnitus, then, yes, it's habituatable (in some cases at least) because I know a number of people with tinnitus like that who say that they spend less than 10 minutes a day thinking about it consciously -- and I've gotten glimpses of this myself, because my tinnitus meets those criteria, and yet I have had periods of weeks/months where I've been able to spend less than 10 minutes a day thinking about it.

On the other hand, if we define "severe" tinnitus as "tinnitus which it is not possible to habituate to", well...

Beyond that, again, my point from the previous page was that truly severe, life-changing tinnitus represents a tiny minority of cases, and so I don't think we're doing justice to anxious new sufferers to pretty much let that perspective dominate this board.

 

[brody24]

^^^
I get what you are saying about trying to have a special place on the forum for those with "truly bad" T, but how does one make that distinction? Where is the cutoff? Of course, it would lead to the very same debate and discussion over whose T is "truly bad". The subjective nature of T makes it impossible.

 

[Telis]

I agree. The subjective nature of T makes it natural to be skeptical or hesitant. I have what I would call bad T, yet some people have posted sound bytes of what their T sounds like, and I listened for a second and thanked god mine wasn't that bad. And I'm sure there are some people who say they have bad T, who would hear mine and shudder. Again, its all so subjective.

So yeah, its natural for us to question the severity of others. The way I have been approaching it is to generally take people at their word. At the end of the day, I want to believe that I can recover and habituate. And if I immediately put up a wall to those who have succeeded in doing so, I'm ensuring that I will never make that leap. Maybe I'm setting myself up for failure with nothing but false hope. But to me, it beats the alternative of thinking of it like a foregone conclusion.

Yes I agree with your strategy totally, it's a good one.

For me, and I didn't come to this conclusion quickly or lightly, I have very rare T that includes constant ear pain, fleeting T's every few minutes, pressure, and crippling hyperacusis. Can someone get back to a normal life with what I have, IMO no way in hell, I would bet my life on it. Could someone deal with it better than me, yeah maybe but I do not believe in any way that this can be ignored by anyone.. And if what I have is severe T then no, I don't believe in habituation at all in these cases. I think the positive here is that this type of T is rare, very rare.

As much as I would like to believe, I have to be realistic in my own mind and tackle the problem from a realistic (again in my own mind) point of view.

If people want to call me a hater , negative or whatever else that's cool. I personally won't call names or put labels on people, I will just post my opinions, I don't think it should be a big deal, I don't know why people get their panties in a bunch over differing opinions.

 

[Telis]

well, I mean, how can you ever prove this? It invariably turns into the no-true-scotsmen fallacy... no one with truly severe tinnitus could possibly habituate to it, therefore if you habituate you didn't have severe tinnitus.

What do you define as "severe"? Here are some criteria:
* high pitched
* variable
* loud enough to be heard clearly over 75-80db white noise

if we could agree that anyone who's tinnitus meets those criteria has "severe" tinnitus, then, yes, it's habituatable (in some cases at least) because I know a number of people with tinnitus like that who say that they spend less than 10 minutes a day thinking about it consciously -- and I've gotten glimpses of this myself, because my tinnitus meets those criteria, and yet I have had periods of weeks/months where I've been able to spend less than 10 minutes a day thinking about it.

On the other hand, if we define "severe" tinnitus as "tinnitus which it is not possible to habituate to", well...

Beyond that, again, my point from the previous page was that truly severe, life-changing tinnitus represents a tiny minority of cases, and so I don't think we're doing justice to anxious new sufferers to pretty much let that perspective dominate this board.

I just posted my definition of severe T above, I don't know if this is right or not, maybe T is just T and shouldn't be associated with the other symptoms that often accompany severe T, but then again, maybe it wouldn't be classed as severe then either? I don't know.

 

[caffclifton]

Maybe you could write a post about your severe T @Telis? Explain to others what it feels like for you and people may ask for your advice on ow you deal with such intrusive horrible T

As I said I didn't want to offend anyone just offering hope to those T suffers that believe they will Habituate. I really hope that one day something changes for you @Telis and you again can live a 'normal' life I really do

Xx

 

[Telis]

Maybe you could write a post about your severe T @Telis? Explain to others what it feels like for you and people may ask for your advice on ow you deal with such intrusive horrible T

As I said I didn't want to offend anyone just offering hope to those T suffers that believe they will Habituate. I really hope that one day something changes for you @Telis and you again can live a 'normal' life I really do

Xx

Well thank you and I'm very happy when anyone works past anything (not just T). I mean who wants a bunch of suffering in this world, who would things running this way. Haha

I'm just heading out for a run, I will respond to your post in more detail when I get back.

 

[Blujay]

Anyone who's taken a writing course knows that there are often disagreements in class over analogies and metaphors, so I hope the poster doesn't take all this talk personally. In this case, the analogy is doubly controversial because the ideas (tinnitus and socks) seem to conflict rather than match.

But in my opinion, anyone who can transform a horrible affliction into something cozy is far above the mental capacity of most people, (including me) and that might be the real reason you're freaking everybody out.

So it might help to tell everyone what happened, and how you successfully pulled it off.

Thanks

 

[linearb]

@Telis I think that much of what you're describing are symptoms that might have a common underlaying cause as your tinnitus, but, pain and hyperacusis are separate symptoms with their own challenges. Habituating to pain, if it's possible at all, seems very different to me than habituating to a purely auditory condition.

@Blujay even though I still have a lot of work to do to really be comfortable with my current T at all times, I do like the analogy, because I personally have found a lot of utility over the years in reframing my understanding of and my reaction to toxic thought processes. I think that basic idea is at the core of both many western cognitive practices like CBT, as well as various mediation practices. In both cases the core idea is that your brain is plastic and can be trained to behave differently.

I can't pretend that any of that is easy, nor do I have any idea if the things that help me will help anyone else... But for me, the shit works, full stop. I'm not as comfortable as I'd like to be, but before I discovered some faith in these practices and had some success with them, I was a train wreck: on benzos, chronically locked in a state of fight-and-flight reaction to my T. I have managed to deal with this condition now without the benzos and largely without the constant fear and severe anxiety for a number of years. I attribute that almost entirely to regular practice of these things.

 

[Kathi]

@caffclifton --your 'socks' analogy sounds very like Dr. Nagler's 'pants analogy.' You can google it. We all habituate in different periods of time--I'm at two years and feel as if I've habituated but it is not the be all end all that I believed it to be at onset. Yes, I am unaware of my tinnitus for periods of time when I'm engaged and yes, I certainly don't feel very bothered by it most of the time but it is not totally forgotten and sometimes it's still very prominent (but I don't have the emotional reaction ). I have adjusted to what is now normal for me. I am very thankful that with the help of time and the members of this board that I took my life back early. I forced myself to go to work, I forced myself to participate in my life--but I have only moderate tinnitus--even though it is 24/7--it is still moderate. I also thank God that I only have moderate tinnitus and wouldn't ever expect people (like many here) with severe tinnitus to be able to relate to the success stories--and I'm sure you can understand that.. I truly believe that loudness and duration hinders habituation. Although you managed with severe tinnitus to habituate-- I didn't hit the 18 month mark for habituating--until I figured out that this is as good as it gets for me. We can't compare mild tinnitus to moderate tinnitus and we certainly can't compare severe tinnitus to either. You are very fortunate but we can't all expect the same or meet the same benchmarks, as tinnitus is such an individual thing as well as unpredictable