My Trip to Bangkok: Stem Cell Treatment [Comments]
- Thread starter Markku
- Start date
Member
Let's make a trip, maybe if we get in a large group they might do a special discount price.
- Nov 6, 2017
- 177
- Tinnitus Since
- 26-9-2017
- Cause of Tinnitus
- Unknow possibly noise trauma
How is your tinnitus now? @undecided
undecided
Member
Today it has been really quiet.
Yesterday it was a bit annoying.
It's fluctuating. But it's only been a month, obviously I don't expect to see any real progress so soon.
Excited to see how it turns out for you. This has been on my mind a lot lately. It's a lot of cash, but really I would pay anything to even a little reduction 
Sorry I haven't followed all the discussions...Excited to see how it turns out for you. This has been on my mind a lot lately. It's a lot of cash, but really I would pay anything to even a little reduction
So there is someone who tried to do the Stem Cell Treatment??
ATEOS and LJMD have seen improvements, Undecided just went recently and is yet to be determined.Ok great!
And all of them have seen some progress??
Whaou !
Actually I would be afraid of seeing improvements for a while and some time later a new increasing of my tinnitus...
And the price is like USD 25'000.- ?
- Oct 14, 2016
- 1,270
- Tinnitus Since
- All my life, but got worse 2016
- Cause of Tinnitus
- Noise induced / Concert
Yea it's expensive... I've been in contact with the clinic here and there through emails. I want to do it but I haven't even had tinnitus for 2 years yet and have seen gradual mind you minor improvements but not without setbacks hahaWhaou !
Actually I would be afraid of seeing improvements for a while and some time later a new increasing of my tinnitus...
And the price is like USD 25'000.- ?
Yeah anyway I really don't have the money to do it !
Did you have any spikes since you got tinnitus ?
Yeah anyway I really don't have the money to do it !
Did you have any spikes since you got tinnitus ?
Plenty, mine fluctuates so wildly that I'm not even sure what baseline is for me. I'd kill for some consistency
Pleasure_Paulie
Member
Myself and a few others have as well. There is another thread about all the members whom have had MSC. I've talked about my experience in a few threads around too.
- Aug 14, 2013
- 2,455
- Tinnitus Since
- Resolved since 2016
- Cause of Tinnitus
- Unknown (medication, head injury)
When I did my preparations for my stem cell treatments back in 2013, I used two main sources of "inspiration" at the time: the story of Chloe Sohl and the anticipated study concerning the Florida Hospital for Children trial. The result Chloe Sohl got has long been known, but only just recently have the results of the 10-patient study been released in a journal:
www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/30126263
The authors note in their paper:
"The observed safety of the protocol and promising clinical data suggest a benefit from cord blood-derived cell therapy for acquired SNHL. The data warrant the implementation of larger controlled phase 2/3 trials of this intervention in children with acquired SNHL."
Over the years, there have been quite a few arm-chair critics voicing their opinions about me in this thread (and many other places), and so with this update, I am glad to now also have clinical scientific backing for doing what I did.
www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/30126263
The authors note in their paper:
"The observed safety of the protocol and promising clinical data suggest a benefit from cord blood-derived cell therapy for acquired SNHL. The data warrant the implementation of larger controlled phase 2/3 trials of this intervention in children with acquired SNHL."
Over the years, there have been quite a few arm-chair critics voicing their opinions about me in this thread (and many other places), and so with this update, I am glad to now also have clinical scientific backing for doing what I did.
TinnitusLogic
Member
Since the adipose derived stem cell (MSC) treatment (autologous) described in this thread is currently available in the US why are you going to Bangkok? The FDA is seeking a permanent injunction (via DOJ) against several major clinics performing this type of treatment in the US but for now it's still available via intravenous, intrathecal, intra-articular and other methods of delivery. Is it cost effective to travel overseas or are they performing a procedure that's unavailable (donor) in this country? Thanks so much! Great thread!
No clue, Im still researching it to find out. Do you have any names of clinics you could PM me?
- Aug 14, 2013
- 2,455
- Tinnitus Since
- Resolved since 2016
- Cause of Tinnitus
- Unknown (medication, head injury)
There was a recent press release regarding the study that was published and I which I referred to here:
Good article from the good people at Gulf Coast Stem Cell
https://www.gulfcoaststemcell.com/stem-cells-finally-silence-tinnitus/
Now we know the Japanese have had much success with stem cell therapy and tinnitus so far so this definitely a positive track. Again, because tinnitus is so multifactoral - really meaning different kinds of tinnitus - there likely won't be a magic bullet for it - at least for a long while yet. The upside is however, that particularly in somatic based cases that if you remove one of the problems that started it, you resolve the problem.
Posting the body of text here in case the link ever becomes invalid...
I did not know that about the pathogenesis of new neural networks being established that actually keep the tinnitus going when the underlying issue(s) that caused it had been resolved, but it certainly makes a lot of sense. Amazing though the brain is, it's pretty bad in a lot of ways as well. One of those problems is how we can get stuck in a self-reinforcing negative feedback loop. Tinnitus is an example of that. And therapies like TRT can help break that cycle, which is important, because that's when the brain let's go and those bad networks will start to decay and that's what eventually makes the T stop - barring ongoing physical problems. Still, all they need to do is fix one aspect of it and the rest comes tumbling down like a house of cards, and bingo bongo...silence!
It's coming folks. Do not doubt. And sooner than later.
https://www.gulfcoaststemcell.com/stem-cells-finally-silence-tinnitus/
Now we know the Japanese have had much success with stem cell therapy and tinnitus so far so this definitely a positive track. Again, because tinnitus is so multifactoral - really meaning different kinds of tinnitus - there likely won't be a magic bullet for it - at least for a long while yet. The upside is however, that particularly in somatic based cases that if you remove one of the problems that started it, you resolve the problem.
Posting the body of text here in case the link ever becomes invalid...
"Tinnitus is a condition affecting one's hearing and manifests as recurrent auditory hallucinations, often heard as a ringing or buzzing sound but sometimes described as humming, grinding, hissing, whistling or even singing or musical. One subtype of tinnitus, pulsatile tinnitus, is experienced as pulsatile and synchronous with the patient's own pulse.
Tinnitus is a poorly understood phenomenon and is relatively difficult to study owing to its subjective nature. Studies suggest that it can originate from different physiological areas of the ear and neural circuitry; and while it is often combined with hearing loss it is sometimes experienced independently. Tinnitus is sometimes associated with hyperacusis, a hypersensitivity to everyday noises.
Why Tinnitus Happens
Two widely accepted theories regarding the etiology of tinnitus are damage to or loss of auditory hair cells and damage to the auditory nerve which relays sensory information from the ear to the brain. Auditory hair cells are sensors located on the organ of Corti in the cochlea of the inner ear. They are fragile and can be damaged by various factors from infection, trauma and loud noise to aging. Unfortunately for humans and other mammals, these never grow back under normal circumstances.
Both hair cell loss and auditory nerve damage usually result in some degree of hearing loss and evidence generally points to a connection between hearing loss and tinnitus. For example, people with otosclerosis, a correctible condition whereby the joints of the little bones in the middle ear occurs harden, will often experience tinnitus alongside their hearing loss. When they undergo stapedectomy both their hearing loss and the tinnitus often resolve. The link between hearing loss and tinnitus is also evidenced through the experiences of patients receiving cochlear implants. Implant recipients tend to report that their tinnitus resolves when the implant is turned on and that this improvement persists for a while after it has been turned off again. In addition, temporary hearing loss and accompanying tinnitus can be induced after an auditory shock, with both resolving over time (for example, the 'ringing in the ears' regularly experienced after a loud rock concert). Some studies suggest that a reduction in the number of hair cells sets up a permanent imbalance in the cochlea and that this may be responsible for the patient's perception of phantom sounds while other studies suggest that the brain itself compensates for the missing input and that this may be the root cause of tinnitus. Lesions in the hair cells responsible for the more subtle pitches (above 8,000 hertz) could explain why some patients experience tinnitus without any significant hearing impairment.
There may be a further complication in the pathogenesis of certain manifestations of tinnitus with evidence that, over time, tinnitus-inducing neural networks can become independently established in the brain and that these can persist even if the original cause of the tinnitus is resolved (e.g. the Organ of Corti repaired). It is suspected that these neural networks will weaken over time, causing the tinnitus to resolve or become less intense, but testing this theory will only become possible with new reliable interventions.
In short, understanding tinnitus presents significant challenges to researchers and medical professionals and developing an effective treatment is not straightforward.
Possible Roles for Stem Cells and Genetic Engineering in Tinnitus Recovery
Stem cells carry the body's own regenerative potential while genetic engineering modifies the expression of genes to control the production of various proteins, including those involved in cell formation. Both disciplines have much to contribute to tinnitus research. Various studies are focused on finding ways to stimulate the production of sensory hair cells using gene therapy while others are looking at how to cultivate stem cells and then introduce them into areas of damage via transplantation, either directly into the epithelium of the Organ of Corti (to form sensory hair cells), or into the auditory nerve itself, where this has been damaged, to form nerve tissue. There is much research still to be done in both of these areas but a lot of progress has been made. For example, in 2015 researchers from Rockefeller University identified two genes which seem to be responsible for the development of sensory hair cells in mice. Part of the experiment involved turning on these genes in mature mice which led to the growth of new hair cells. The researchers are now investigating which chemical processes are involved in the usual expression of these genes. That same year, in Kyoto, Japan, scientists identified a new method of auditory nerve stem cell transplantation which appeared to aid the movement of stem cells across the glial scar (this is naturally formed as a protective response to CNS damage).
The Hearing Restoration Project, supported by the long-established Hearing Health Foundation, has also brought together a consortium of 14 of the world's leading hearing research scientists from the US, Canada and the UK, including experts in regenerative medicine, in an attempt to accelerate progress in this area.
The Benefits and Limitations of Animal Models
As with all drug trials (non-autologous stem cells are treated as drugs by the FDA), no human trials can take place until successful interventions have been proven in animals. However, the subjective nature of tinnitus presents many challenges to researchers who first need to design experiments able to identify the experience of tinnitus through the physiological and behavioral responses of animals. Some of the behaviors that have been associated with tinnitus in mice are indicative of anxiety and depression and include avoidant behaviors and attempts to locate the source of a sound while physiological signs include tremors, spasms in the respiratory and digestive systems, irregular heart rate, changes to sleep patterns (insomnia) and changes in blood pressure. Through monitoring these signs and manipulating behaviors (e.g. through fear conditioning) it has been possible for researchers to discriminate between when a mouse is experiencing silence and when they are experiencing auditory hallucination (i.e. tinnitus).
Studying birds and fish could prove another fruitful line of enquiry since, unlike mammals, these groups of animals are able to naturally regenerate the hair cells in their hearing organs.
Existing Stem Cell Treatments for Tinnitus
Due to the lengthy clinical trials process and the specific nature of the physiological and neurological mechanisms responsible for tinnitus, direct stem cell interventions are not yet available. Some patients claim to have experienced an improvement in their tinnitus symptoms when receiving injections of autologous stem cells. While it is not impossible that the overall systemic improvement that often results from autologous stem cell treatment might positively impact the patient's experience of their tinnitus symptoms, such anecdotal evidence should be regarded with caution, particularly since many tinnitus sufferers experience variability in their symptoms anyway.
Nevertheless, autologous stem cell treatments / tinnitus stem cell therapy, whereby a patient's own stem cells are harvested, cultured and then redeployed, are becoming routinely used in experimental studies here in the United States. These are perfectly safe procedures when administered by a competent medical team and there is a growing body of evidence to support their efficacy in symptom reduction and tissue regeneration across a wide range of health conditions.
While tinnitus sufferers should understand that researching and developing targeted stem cell treatments is a very time-consuming process, they can at least rest assured that their condition is not being ignored and that the field is moving in the right direction."
The Mississippi Stem Cell Treatment Center is actively treating patients living with a wide range of conditions including orthopedic, neurological and autoimmune disorders. To find out more about what we do, call us on (886) 885 4823. More information and latest updates can be found on our website at: http://www.gulfcoaststemcell.com
Tinnitus is a poorly understood phenomenon and is relatively difficult to study owing to its subjective nature. Studies suggest that it can originate from different physiological areas of the ear and neural circuitry; and while it is often combined with hearing loss it is sometimes experienced independently. Tinnitus is sometimes associated with hyperacusis, a hypersensitivity to everyday noises.
Why Tinnitus Happens
Two widely accepted theories regarding the etiology of tinnitus are damage to or loss of auditory hair cells and damage to the auditory nerve which relays sensory information from the ear to the brain. Auditory hair cells are sensors located on the organ of Corti in the cochlea of the inner ear. They are fragile and can be damaged by various factors from infection, trauma and loud noise to aging. Unfortunately for humans and other mammals, these never grow back under normal circumstances.
Both hair cell loss and auditory nerve damage usually result in some degree of hearing loss and evidence generally points to a connection between hearing loss and tinnitus. For example, people with otosclerosis, a correctible condition whereby the joints of the little bones in the middle ear occurs harden, will often experience tinnitus alongside their hearing loss. When they undergo stapedectomy both their hearing loss and the tinnitus often resolve. The link between hearing loss and tinnitus is also evidenced through the experiences of patients receiving cochlear implants. Implant recipients tend to report that their tinnitus resolves when the implant is turned on and that this improvement persists for a while after it has been turned off again. In addition, temporary hearing loss and accompanying tinnitus can be induced after an auditory shock, with both resolving over time (for example, the 'ringing in the ears' regularly experienced after a loud rock concert). Some studies suggest that a reduction in the number of hair cells sets up a permanent imbalance in the cochlea and that this may be responsible for the patient's perception of phantom sounds while other studies suggest that the brain itself compensates for the missing input and that this may be the root cause of tinnitus. Lesions in the hair cells responsible for the more subtle pitches (above 8,000 hertz) could explain why some patients experience tinnitus without any significant hearing impairment.
There may be a further complication in the pathogenesis of certain manifestations of tinnitus with evidence that, over time, tinnitus-inducing neural networks can become independently established in the brain and that these can persist even if the original cause of the tinnitus is resolved (e.g. the Organ of Corti repaired). It is suspected that these neural networks will weaken over time, causing the tinnitus to resolve or become less intense, but testing this theory will only become possible with new reliable interventions.
In short, understanding tinnitus presents significant challenges to researchers and medical professionals and developing an effective treatment is not straightforward.
Possible Roles for Stem Cells and Genetic Engineering in Tinnitus Recovery
Stem cells carry the body's own regenerative potential while genetic engineering modifies the expression of genes to control the production of various proteins, including those involved in cell formation. Both disciplines have much to contribute to tinnitus research. Various studies are focused on finding ways to stimulate the production of sensory hair cells using gene therapy while others are looking at how to cultivate stem cells and then introduce them into areas of damage via transplantation, either directly into the epithelium of the Organ of Corti (to form sensory hair cells), or into the auditory nerve itself, where this has been damaged, to form nerve tissue. There is much research still to be done in both of these areas but a lot of progress has been made. For example, in 2015 researchers from Rockefeller University identified two genes which seem to be responsible for the development of sensory hair cells in mice. Part of the experiment involved turning on these genes in mature mice which led to the growth of new hair cells. The researchers are now investigating which chemical processes are involved in the usual expression of these genes. That same year, in Kyoto, Japan, scientists identified a new method of auditory nerve stem cell transplantation which appeared to aid the movement of stem cells across the glial scar (this is naturally formed as a protective response to CNS damage).
The Hearing Restoration Project, supported by the long-established Hearing Health Foundation, has also brought together a consortium of 14 of the world's leading hearing research scientists from the US, Canada and the UK, including experts in regenerative medicine, in an attempt to accelerate progress in this area.
The Benefits and Limitations of Animal Models
As with all drug trials (non-autologous stem cells are treated as drugs by the FDA), no human trials can take place until successful interventions have been proven in animals. However, the subjective nature of tinnitus presents many challenges to researchers who first need to design experiments able to identify the experience of tinnitus through the physiological and behavioral responses of animals. Some of the behaviors that have been associated with tinnitus in mice are indicative of anxiety and depression and include avoidant behaviors and attempts to locate the source of a sound while physiological signs include tremors, spasms in the respiratory and digestive systems, irregular heart rate, changes to sleep patterns (insomnia) and changes in blood pressure. Through monitoring these signs and manipulating behaviors (e.g. through fear conditioning) it has been possible for researchers to discriminate between when a mouse is experiencing silence and when they are experiencing auditory hallucination (i.e. tinnitus).
Studying birds and fish could prove another fruitful line of enquiry since, unlike mammals, these groups of animals are able to naturally regenerate the hair cells in their hearing organs.
Existing Stem Cell Treatments for Tinnitus
Due to the lengthy clinical trials process and the specific nature of the physiological and neurological mechanisms responsible for tinnitus, direct stem cell interventions are not yet available. Some patients claim to have experienced an improvement in their tinnitus symptoms when receiving injections of autologous stem cells. While it is not impossible that the overall systemic improvement that often results from autologous stem cell treatment might positively impact the patient's experience of their tinnitus symptoms, such anecdotal evidence should be regarded with caution, particularly since many tinnitus sufferers experience variability in their symptoms anyway.
Nevertheless, autologous stem cell treatments / tinnitus stem cell therapy, whereby a patient's own stem cells are harvested, cultured and then redeployed, are becoming routinely used in experimental studies here in the United States. These are perfectly safe procedures when administered by a competent medical team and there is a growing body of evidence to support their efficacy in symptom reduction and tissue regeneration across a wide range of health conditions.
While tinnitus sufferers should understand that researching and developing targeted stem cell treatments is a very time-consuming process, they can at least rest assured that their condition is not being ignored and that the field is moving in the right direction."
The Mississippi Stem Cell Treatment Center is actively treating patients living with a wide range of conditions including orthopedic, neurological and autoimmune disorders. To find out more about what we do, call us on (886) 885 4823. More information and latest updates can be found on our website at: http://www.gulfcoaststemcell.com
I did not know that about the pathogenesis of new neural networks being established that actually keep the tinnitus going when the underlying issue(s) that caused it had been resolved, but it certainly makes a lot of sense. Amazing though the brain is, it's pretty bad in a lot of ways as well. One of those problems is how we can get stuck in a self-reinforcing negative feedback loop. Tinnitus is an example of that. And therapies like TRT can help break that cycle, which is important, because that's when the brain let's go and those bad networks will start to decay and that's what eventually makes the T stop - barring ongoing physical problems. Still, all they need to do is fix one aspect of it and the rest comes tumbling down like a house of cards, and bingo bongo...silence!
It's coming folks. Do not doubt. And sooner than later.
Thanks for posting this. I'm curious as to how @undecided is doing. Waiting on Mutebutton results, then I wanna try a SC treatment
Just wanted to let everyone know:
I emailed StemCells21 a few months ago asking about a less expensive treatment, and this is what they showed me:
One Day Treatment Program: 5,000 USD
I emailed StemCells21 a few months ago asking about a less expensive treatment, and this is what they showed me:
One Day Treatment Program: 5,000 USD
- IV Nutrition Infusion : NAD+
- Stem cell administration:
1) Stem Cell injection 15 million MSC around both ears with PRP growth factor boosters #1
- Condition Specific Growth factor peptide injection
- IV Medical Laser Therapy + IV Oxyven therapy
- External laser therapy around the ear
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