Stop Telling Me to Live with It or Habituate

[sanj100]

@threefirefour and @Gl0w0ut

You and some others are obviously hateful and embittered young people. Pity! I do feel sorry for you though.

I don't blame them. Severe tinnitus can bring out the worst in anyone.

I know some here have it worse than others but we are all suffering with this to some degree and all want the same thing, either to habituate to the sound or have it go away entirely.

 

[threefirefour]

I'm not so well off at all. I am also suffering with tinnitus.

And I fully understand and accept that tinnitus that is a lot louder is much much harder to deal with and to habituate to. I don't pretend to act like I know what some of you are going through. I was just trying to help and to highlight the fact that there are some people out there with very severe tinnitus that have habituated, so it is possible.

I really really hope your condition improves and from quickly glancing at your avatar it seems to me that you have a lot of hope that things will improve for you as you've not had tinnitus that long and you think its from ETD which I have in quite a few cases can be resolved.

I wish you all the best.

Hopefully it can. It's taking a while and my ETs have been gummier than ever.

 

[sanj100]

Hopefully it can. It's taking a while and my ETs have been gummier than ever.

Mate, I have every hope that it will. And I'm not just saying that. From what I've read ETD is one of the conditions that has a better chance of being addressed and the subsequent tinnitus going away than others such as ototoxic poisoning. I hope you come out of this and have a sneaky feeling you will. No one deserves tinnitus.

 

[threefirefour]

Mate, I have every hope that it will. And I'm not just saying that. From what I've read ETD is one of the conditions that has a better chance of being addressed and the subsequent tinnitus going away than others such as ototoxic poisoning. I hope you come out of this and have a sneaky feeling you will. No one deserves tinnitus.

I sure hope too. Thanks, hope yours goes away too.

 

[sanj100]

I sure hope too. Thanks, hope yours goes away too.

Thanks, appreciate it. We all want an end to the noise.

Out of interest. How loud is yours? Does it always remain the same throughout the day and have you had any reduction at all since onset?

 

[threefirefour]

Thanks, appreciate it. We all want an end to the noise.

Out of interest. How loud is yours? Does it always remain the same throughout the day and have you had any reduction at all since onset?

Mild reduction overall, has been getting worse this past week. ETD appears worse. Not constant and is either very bad or almost nonexistent.

 

[Michael Leigh]

You and some others are obviously hateful and embittered young people. Pity! I do feel sorry for you though.

Well said @Bobbie7 I can't help feeling sorry @Gl0w0ut as I think he is in a lot of distress and not here just to make trouble. I have corresponded with people on and off the forums with tinnitus and have a feeling for those that are genuine. It is sad to see because I've been there and know how tinnitus can make a person feel.

Michael

 

[Onsdag]

Mild reduction overall, has been getting worse this past week. ETD appears worse. Not constant and is either very bad or almost nonexistent.

You should try Ear Popper (google it) for your ETD

 

[sanj100]

Mild reduction overall, has been getting worse this past week. ETD appears worse. Not constant and is either very bad or almost nonexistent.

It's good to hear you have gotten some reduction even though it's only mild.

And in a way you are lucky that your tinnitus is almost non existent sometimes. There are some who have it super loud all the time with no relief. And the fact that your tinnitus can be almost non existent is also promising because it shows that your brain can already get it that low, it's just figuring out a way of making that last for longer periods of time.

 

[threefirefour]

You should try Ear Popper (google it) for your ETD

Popping my ears via valsalva doesn't always work to reduce it either. Sometimes it does but I don't know if an ear popper will help. It pushes all the gunk up into my ear cavity. I'm trying to clear that.

 

[Gl0w0ut]

@threefirefour and @Gl0w0ut

You and some others are obviously hateful and embittered young people. Pity! I do feel sorry for you though.

Not hateful, just frustrated.

 

[Luman]

I think I'd rather habituate, than suffer just to prove that I'm unwilling to compromise. Habituation is like a medicine, for which there's little or no financial cost, and it's safe and effective in improving the quality of life for most with tinnitus. Not exactly a great comparison, but take diabetes. There's no cure for that, either, so people with it must take their insulin, and this is true of many conditions.

 

[threefirefour]

I think I'd rather habituate, than suffer just to prove that I'm unwilling to compromise. Habituation is like a medicine, for which there's little or no financial cost, and it's safe and effective in improving the quality of life for most with tinnitus. Not exactly a great comparison, but take diabetes. There's no cure for that, either, so people with it must take their insulin, and this is true of many conditions.

I think we would all rather have diabetes.

 

[Luman]

I think we would all rather have diabetes.

How about diabetes without insulin?

 

[fishbone]

Not hateful, just frustrated.

It is very frustrating! A cure may or may not be around for a very long time. What's the point of frustrating yourself more vs trying to find ways to cope and still enjoy your life, with tinnitus. You make your choices, I made mine many years ago and i am able to thrive in my life, even with this beyond horrible/LOUD/not-maskable tinnitus.

With you the best, in whatever choices you make.....

 

[threefirefour]

How about diabetes without insulin?

That's true, but they have insulin. If they are having a hard time, they take the insulin and everything is back to normal. We don't have anything. At least they have the option to not suffer.

 

[Luman]

That's true, but they have insulin. If they are having a hard time, they take the insulin and everything is back to normal. We don't have anything. At least they have the option to not suffer.

The point I was trying to make is that there are 600 million people in the world with tinnitus and the vast majority have habituated, and live normally. This is not to say that we should give up on curing it, but my purpose in making the diabetes comparison was not to argue that diabetes is worse, but that to not take the insulin because there is no cure is an example of cutting off your nose to spite your face. Refusing to habituate is the same idea, in my opinion. I'm not there yet, as far as habituation, but I'm working on it.

 

[threefirefour]

The point I was trying to make is that there are 600 million people in the world with tinnitus and the vast majority have habituated, and live normally. This is not to say that we should give up on curing it, but my purpose in making the diabetes comparison was not to argue that diabetes is worse, but that to not take the insulin because there is no cure is an example of cutting off your nose to spite your face. Refusing to habituate is the same idea, in my opinion. I'm not there yet, as far as habituation, but I'm working on it.

Easy for you to say. You probably have ETD that's causing it.

 

[Luman]

Easy for you to say. You probably have ETD that's causing it.

I don't know for sure what is causing it but I have been tested for hearing, and I have SNHL, which could be the culprit. It may very well be due to several causes in my case, including noise exposure. I'm going to a new doctor next week, to see if there's any way to locate a physical cause such as ETD. I can learn to habituate while exploring other options as well, and if there's no other practical options, then I'll stick with habituation and do what I can to support more research in this area.

 

[threefirefour]

I don't know for sure what is causing it but I have been tested for hearing, and I have SNHL, which could be the culprit. I'm going to a new doctor next week, to see if there's any way to pinpoint the cause.

Oh that sucks. I have been tested and I have no hearing loss. I can hear up to 19khz.

 

[Bobbie7]

Not hateful, just frustrated.

I am quite sure each of us can say we experience frustration concerning many aspects of our lives as it relates to tinnitus and if we conduct ourselves with common courtesy, dignity and with a lack of pejorative comments we will all garner more attention and respect. Also, the use of foul language does not enhance a person's credibility.

I wish you well.
Barbara

 

[Luman]

Oh that sucks. I have been tested and I have no hearing loss. I can hear up to 19khz.

Mine, in one ear, is only good below 8khz, the other ear a little better, but nowhere near the ability to hear 19khz.

 

[threefirefour]

Mine, in one ear, is only good below 8khz, the other ear a little better, but nowhere near the ability to hear 19khz.

I did a sine sweep test. No dips. No idea why my hearing is so good.

 

[Onsdag]

I did a sine sweep test. No dips. No idea why my hearing is so good.

Because you are a teenager, teenagers have good hearing.

 

[Vinnitus]

I did a sine sweep test. No dips. No idea why my hearing is so good.

You might still have hearing loss. Current audiometric measures are way too crude to accurately report on such a delicate and detailed organ as the cochlea. Did you know about "hidden hearing loss" (hidden, because it doesn't appear on audiometric tests) before, for instance? It's where your hearing acuity is reduced when you're in situations with a lot of background noise. This can give you problems following conversations in noisy restaurants, for example. Please do not assume you have absolutely no hearing loss just because an audiometric test said so. It is more complicated than a few beeps can ever tell you. I have experienced an acoustic trauma and I can definitely tell something is missing, despite audiometric tests saying my hearing is just fine.

 

[threefirefour]

You might still have hearing loss. Current audiometric measures are way too crude to accurately report on such a delicate and detailed organ as the cochlea. Did you know about "hidden hearing loss" (hidden, because it doesn't appear on audiometric tests) before, for instance? It's where your hearing acuity is reduced when you're in situations with a lot of background noise. This can give you problems following conversations in noisy restaurants, for example. Please do not assume you have absolutely no hearing loss just because an audiometric test said so. It is more complicated than a few beeps can ever tell you. I have experienced an acoustic trauma and I can definitely tell something is missing, despite audiometric tests saying my hearing is just fine.

No a sine sweep. That's listening to literally every frequency in a row. If there's no dips there's no hearing loss.

 

[Vinnitus]

No a sine sweep. That's listening to literally every frequency in a row. If there's no dips there's no hearing loss.

I'm afraid you're misunderstanding the complexity of the hearing organ. A sine sweep is an even more crude measurement than an audiometric test, because it has some issues. From the top of my head I name a few;

• A sine sweep is used on a certain volume (loudness), so it only tests your hearing for the ranges of the sine sweep on this certain loudness level. Your cochlea contains hair cells which detect sounds at different frequencies but ALSO different volume levels. It might for instance be, that you can hear 15khz perfectly at a louder volume level, but not at a lower volume (while you could have heard it BEFORE your acoustic trauma at this lower volume level). This is because your cochlea has OUTER hair cells, which detect sounds at LOWER volume levels, and INNER hair cells, which detect sounds at LOUDER volume levels. Damage to the outer hair cells is for example not tested when you use the sine sweep test at a louder volume level. Outer hair cells also appear to be the first hair cells to be damaged upon trauma, meaning you will most probably lose your ability to register high-frequency noises at low volume levels first (the outer hair cells for high frequencies are located near the entrance or base of the cochlea and thus take the biggest hit upon incoming soundwaves).
• A sine sweep does not test your ability to hear sounds in background noise. This is what "hidden hearing loss", also known as "cochlear synaptopathy" is. It is your ability to comprehend speech in background noise.

Hearing is way more complicated than such a simple test can show you. It is one of the most complex organs in our body and, unfortunately, one of the least understood.

 

[threefirefour]

I'm afraid you're misunderstanding the complexity of the hearing organ. A sine sweep is an even more crude measurement than an audiometric test, because it has some issues. From the top of my head I name a few;

• A sine sweep is used on a certain volume (loudness), so it only tests your hearing for the ranges of the sine sweep on this certain loudness level. Your cochlea contains hair cells which detect sounds at different frequencies but ALSO different volume levels. It might for instance be, that you can hear 15khz perfectly at a louder volume level, but not at a lower volume (while you could have heard it BEFORE your acoustic trauma at this lower volume level). This is because your cochlea has OUTER hair cells, which detect sounds at LOWER volume levels, and INNER hair cells, which detect sounds at LOUDER volume levels. Damage to the outer hair cells is for example not tested when you use the sine sweep test at a louder volume level. Outer hair cells also appear to be the first hair cells to be damaged upon trauma, meaning you will most probably lose your ability to register high-frequency noises at low volume levels first (the outer hair cells for high frequencies are located near the entrance or base of the cochlea and thus take the biggest hit upon incoming soundwaves).
• A sine sweep does not test your ability to hear sounds in background noise. This is what "hidden hearing loss", also known as "cochlear synaptopathy" is. It is your ability to comprehend speech in background noise.

Hearing is way more complicated than such a simple test can show you. It is one of the most complex organs in our body and, unfortunately, one of the least understood.

I don't know. Methinks that hidden hearing loss is kind of a meme.

I do lack fidelity in hearing because of my ETD so I assume this is the cause.

 

[Vinnitus]

I don't know. Methinks that hidden hearing loss is kind of a meme.

I wonder on what basis you think it is a meme. Research has been done by Charles M. Liberman on this subject and a loss of cochlear synapses has been demonstrated as a result of excessive noise exposure.

I do lack fidelity in hearing because of my ETD so I assume this is the cause.

Possibly so, I'm not saying your ETD could not be the reason for your hearing issues. ETD is known to cause a perception of hearing loss as well. I'm just informing you about the possibility of (hidden) sensorineural hearing loss and that you shouldn't rule it out on the basis of currently available audiological testing.

 

[threefirefour]

I wonder on what basis you think it is a meme. Research has been done by Charles M. Liberman on this subject and a loss of cochlear synapses has been demonstrated as a result of excessive noise exposure.



Possibly so, I'm not saying your ETD could not be the reason for your hearing issues. ETD is known to cause a perception of hearing loss as well. I'm just informing you about the possibility of sensorineural hearing loss and that you shouldn't rule it out on the basis of currently available audiologic testing.

i consider it to be a meme because it's the tinnitus communities go-to for everything. No reason you should have tinnitus? Hidden hearing loss of course. It shuts down the search of an actual answer to what could be causing tinnitus.

It's more of a "we don't want to admit tinnitus is completely brain based and can exist without any external stimuli". Mostly because we want to think fixing hearing loss will fix tinnitus. And I get it, but there's no point in self delusion.