Tinnitus with Shaky, Jerky Vision (and Possible Improvement with Alexander Technique)

[SillyMama]

My tinnitus began in August 2017. I hear high pitched crickets, which pulse intermittently (but not in a rhythmic way), and which come and go rather randomly. When the crickets chirp, my eyes jerk. The louder the sound, the bigger the jerk. Initially I called it vertigo with tinnitus, because the eye jerking messes with my proprioception. While chasing a possible BPPV diagnosis, I saw an ENT doc, who said "BPPV doesn't occur with tinnitus." Sadly, since my symptoms weren't classic, the doc couldn't have seemed less interested in helping me further. However, because BPPV is partly postural, I had already moved my keyboard, chair height, and monitors to keep my head more still, which did help, and by December it abated!

It returned again in August 2018. This time I researched from the other direction, starting with tinnitus and ending up with vision or eyes, and I found this forum. I'm grateful for the people posting before me with similar symptoms... including Doggone T and Mad maggot. We seem to have identical experiences, so there are probably hundreds of us out there...

I also read a Brazilian journal article on "Diagnosis and management of somatosensory tinnitus: review article" which stated that "...other methods are used to relax the neck muscles, with some success in treating tinnitus: the Alexander method, autogenous training, the Briigger method, craniosacral treatment and Feldenkrais. All act on the same point - the posterior neck muscle."

Okay, so maybe my problem IS something postural, and I looked at the therapies mentioned. One short introductory video on the Alexander Technique ("Improve Posture Using the Alexander Technique") showed how to reach a better sitting posture, so I imitated it... And the crickets stopped. I was stunned. Now I can reach a position to stop the symptoms, but I can't maintain it. Next step: I plan to sign up for Alexander Technique classes, and I'm optimistic that I'll get even more relief from this.

The journal article was: http://www.scielo.br/scielo.php?script=sci_arttext&pid=S1807-59322011000600028 and the short intro video to the Alexander technique that helped me is at:

Maybe this will help someone else, too. I will report back how it goes.

 

[ganga66]

This is the 1st time I have seen my own symptoms other than tinnitus described exactly, I will definitely look at the video recommended, please post back about your progress

 

[SillyMama]

Thank you ganga66, for posting. Now there are 4 of us. I will report back on my progress.

 

[SillyMama]

Okay, my first lesson in Alexander Technique is scheduled for January 2...
In the meantime, I also found that I can stop a new tinnitus/shaky eye episode using a series of accupressure taps.
In desperation, I've poked nearly every inch of my neck and cranium, and got nowhere.
However, I found this short video which leads me to tap a sequence of 8 accupressure points.

The title is: "How To Tap For Pain: Intro to Tapping and Using it for Pain" but it works for stress, etc., as well.
I've been able to use it to shorten the duration of at least 7 new tinnitus episodes this morning.
So far, this helps me for about 5 minutes, and the tinnitus/shaky eyes come back, BUT it has worked fairly predictably. So when I *really* need it to stop, I may try this first.
(To *keep* the episodes away, I still think my most likely help will be the Alexander Technique lessons.) More on that later...

 

[SillyMama]

And... while reading in the forum for "Alternative Treatments and Research," rtwombly posted a video link on massage of musculoskeletal trigger points:

I will be trying this, too.

 

[SillyMama]

Reporting back on my experiences. I'm certain now that my tinnitus and the shaky vision that syncs with it are caused by one or some of the head/neck muscles. So my tinnitus can be called somatic, or external.

In addition to using all of the above therapies, I also use a night guard (bite guard) prescribed by a TMJ specialist, because I clench and grind my teeth at night. He is the only medical professional that has been interested in my tinnitus symptoms. He recently recommended magnesium supplements (which I did start taking) to help calm muscular elements, and offered "cool laser" treatment for a possible future treatment.

I've also completed 8 one-hour Alexander lessons over a 9 week period.
I *am* experiencing much improvement in my symptoms.
I started the magnesium during the Alexander lessons, so I can't differentiate between the effects of each one, but my intuition is that they both are helping.

If my symptoms worsen again, I will possibly also follow up with an "upper cervical" chiropractor.
But for now, it's better.

 

[DoggoneT]

Thank you so much for sharing your experiences! I am going to try all of the above for myself. Typically, I have the tinnitus all day (and night, I presume - it does not wake me) in a pretty regular on and off pattern. When at its worst the tinnitus / visual shaking lasts 20 seconds with breaks in between of about 75 seconds. It fluctuates in intensity - sometimes I will go months where, although it doesn't go away completely, it doesn't really bother me. Then something triggers it to change to a higher pitch.

 

[DoggoneT]

What magnesium are you taking?

 

[SillyMama]

The supplement I've been using is a powder that dissolves in a cup of water. Its name is "Natural Calm" and is made by the "Natural Vitality" company. I've been told by a local health food store that the "Bluebonnet" company also makes a similar product which is less expensive.

 

[Greg Sacramento]

Cervical-dystonia - an aging neck with all the conditions that goes with it. It's best to use extension therapy on neck muscles and not press muscles against the C spine and arteries.

 

[DoggoneT]

Thanks! Just ordered the Magnesium powder!

 

[DoggoneT]

The other lady with these symptoms (MadMaggot) had eye surgery at age 4 for strabismus - I had same surgery at age 3.

Anyone else have the eye surgery?

 

[SillyMama]

Cervical-dystonia - an aging neck with all the conditions that goes with it. It's best to use extension therapy on neck muscles and not press muscles against the C spine and arteries.

Hi, Greg, it's unclear if you have the somatic tinnitus with visual disturbances that we're posting about.
Can you elaborate, specifically, what you meant for "extension therapy?"
I'm willing to try anything specific, especially since many of the things I've tried so far *do* help somewhat.

 

[SillyMama]

Hi, Doggone T; No eye surgery in my history... so that's not an obvious link for us.

 

[Lane]

I'm willing to try anything specific, especially since many of the things I've tried so far *do* help somewhat.

Hi @SillyMama -- In case you're interested, you may want to check out THIS POST I made, in which I shared some links to some exercises I've been doing. You may want to check out THIS POST as well, where I share some thoughts on tracking down tinnitus of unkown origin. -- Best...

 

[Greg Sacramento]

Hi, Greg, it's unclear if you have the somatic tinnitus with visual disturbances that we're posting about.
Can you elaborate, specifically, what you meant for "extension therapy?"
I'm willing to try anything specific, especially since many of the things I've tried so far *do* help somewhat.

For some it's hard to know if a neck problem - including muscles - is a sender - or receiver as being from another problem. With having vertigo with visual disturbances complete examination of eyes, and just about everything else shoulders up may need examination. Veins, arteries and thyroid may need examination.

Many conditions not only within the neck are possible. So many possible neck conditions are possible where most have to do with injury. A series of radiological testing may be needed with visual disturbance that goes beyond just a sternocleidomastoid or a straightening of C spine problem. The brainstem and upper neck may need full radiological examination. One problem often leads to another. Complete blood work is always needed.

If there was also eye pressure with headaches, then cause may be easier to diagnose. A complete medical history including injuries would be needed when having any vertigo and visual disturbance. A hundred questions would need to be asked. If you would like to go one on one by use of the PM feature - I be willing.

Vitamins and powders will not solve most problems for those with any type of non hearing loss tinnitus. Other than vitamin C, vitamins can be a negative for some with disease or a syndrome problem.

Here is just one article of a thousand that discusses a few things that may have association. This is a basic article. Basic articles are not very helpful when it comes to physical problems and more so with physical tinnitus.
https://www.healthline.com/health/oscillopsia#causes

 

[Greg Sacramento]

All eye problems need the attention of doctors.
Drink a fair amount of water, control forward head bending and hypertension.
Some neck associations - Ankylosing spondylitis and (rare) Chiari malformation .
Intercranial hypertension.
read:https://home.bt.com/lifestyle/healt...-diseases-an-eye-test-can-spot-11363945289583


Feeling unsteady or weird from whiplash, neck and head injuries, neck discomfort, head vibrations, vertigo, dizziness, vomiting, pulse sounds, heartbeat sounds, humming, thumping, and possible infection are some other concerns that needs evaluations.

 

[SillyMama]

Hi, Greg,
Thanks for your kind responses. I started my journey with my personal physician, then an ENT specialist, then my TMJ dentist/specialist. So I'm not hiding in a self-diagnosing denial. My TMJ doc prescribed the Magnesium, and it *does* help. My blood labs are recent, my BP is managed, and my overall health is great.
The eyes are only jerky during (and in sync with) the tinnitus. This isn't the same as vertigo. It's intermittent, and at times disappears completely (once for a whole YEAR). And I'm certain this left-ear tinnitus of mine has some kind of a muscular-related component (to make a long story short) because when lying on my back on a table, I heard the sound through the table in my other ear. Something somewhere must be vibrating. Body/head position helps. Stress management helps. Mg helps.
It took me 18 months to figure out that it's somatic, but I think there are probably dozens and dozens of others out there who probably have these same symptoms too. I mostly wanted to post something that others could find, and report details on anything that seems to help.

 

[Greg Sacramento]

@SillyMama

The eyes are only jerky during (and in sync with) the tinnitus.

because when lying on my back on a table, I heard the sound through the table in my other ear. Something somewhere must be vibrating. Body/head position helps.

I've been having problems with my eyes and I been having the same reaction as quoted from you above. I had research cranial nerves 3, 4 and 6. I will see a neuro ophthalmologist team which will be a eight hour session in a few days. Below was mentioned by one of the N.O. in a pre appointment discussion - cranial nerve 4. Over several months I overdosed on vitamin A from eating too much watermelon and fish. This caused an abdominal aortic aneurysm where I hear thumping and humming. Too much Vitamin A can also cause vision problems. The aortic sends messages to my internal carotid in my neck and associates to either cranial nerve 3 or 4.

This subject matter is over my head.
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2801485/

 

[Marianne F]

Hello SillyMama... Just by learning that there are others experiencing the same type of Tinnitus as myself, helps enormously. Here in the U.K. I've been made to feel that I'm almost unique. Lonely or what?

Are you still practising the Alexander Technique? I have a practitioner who lives near me so would be interested if you feel that this treatment has been of some use. I've found yoga helps, especially online Adriene who reminds us to keep plenty of space between our ears and our shoulders... I think my problem is very much posture related. About eight years ago I had terrible pain in my neck and couldn't lift my head from the pillow. I started to see a Chiropractor who helped enormously but told me I had Arthritis in my upper spine. Tinnitus started a few years into the Chiro treatment??

I think like most of us, I have my good days and my bad. Good luck with your continued research. I'd be very interested to hear the outcome.
Take care

 

[tiniturtle]

@SillyMama

Be careful of chiropractic cervical spine manipulation. I've heard too many stories where that has left the patient dead, paralyzed, or with a stroke. MD's generally advise against it.

 

[Marianne F]

I too have heard some horror stories so have now settled for delightful massage treatment instead...

 

[SillyMama]

@SillyMama

I've been having problems with my eyes and I been having the same reaction as quoted from you above. I had research cranial nerves 3, 4 and 6. I will see a neuro ophthalmologist team which will be a eight hour session in a few days. Below was mentioned by one of the N.O. in a pre appointment discussion - cranial nerve 4. Over several months I overdosed on vitamin A from eating too much watermelon and fish. This caused an abdominal aortic aneurysm where I hear thumping and humming. Too much Vitamin A can also cause vision problems. The aortic sends messages to my internal carotid in my neck and associates to either cranial nerve 3 or 4.

This subject matter is over my head.
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2801485/

Hi, Greg, Thanks for posting the reference. Because of a previous career, reading them was actually "in my lane." It's mostly a list of normal anatomical/nerve associations, and already known syndromes or conditions.
None of these describe me. I continue my quest...
Warm best wishes.

 

[SillyMama]

Hello SillyMama... Just by learning that there are others experiencing the same type of Tinnitus as myself, helps enormously. Here in the U.K. I've been made to feel that I'm almost unique. Lonely or what?

Are you still practising the Alexander Technique? I have a practitioner who lives near me so would be interested if you feel that this treatment has been of some use. I've found yoga helps, especially online Adriene who reminds us to keep plenty of space between our ears and our shoulders... I think my problem is very much posture related. About eight years ago I had terrible pain in my neck and couldn't lift my head from the pillow. I started to see a Chiropractor who helped enormously but told me I had Arthritis in my upper spine. Tinnitus started a few years into the Chiro treatment??

I think like most of us, I have my good days and my bad. Good luck with your continued research. I'd be very interested to hear the outcome.
Take care

Hi, Marianne,
Yes, I'm *trying* to keep using the Alexander Technique. It's difficult to stay mindful of posture, but it does help me. I especially try to use it at my computer and while driving.
I also just finished about 3 months trying chiropractic, which made no difference at all for me. I've discontinued that.
I'm prone to tinnitus while commuting in the car (especially if my internal chatter is negative) so I've been working on actively replacing those with breathing and other thoughts. Which helps.
Stressful feelings makes my tinnitus worse, so I've also started trying to meditate a couple of times a day. Effective meditation takes a bit of practice, but it can't hurt, and may end up helping.
My jaw clenching has proved to be a major player in this. The magnesium supplement helps *some.* Enough that I keep taking it.
I've practicing being very reflective to notice when it comes and goes. I'm getting better at figuring ways to consciously relax my neck and jaw to get relief. Which helps, too.
Because of that, I think maybe the reason that the "tapping" exercise helps me sometimes, is it deflects my tendency to tighten up my muscles.
The update is: So far, it has stayed on my left side, but it still comes and goes. Posture does help me. Magnesium does help some. Relaxation techniques help some. Jaw stretching and massage (from my TMJ doc) help some.
My newest, recent addition: Making certain I get enough sleep.
I remain optimistic about getting better at dealing with this.
I still don't have a clue why I can hear it, or why it makes my eyes jerk.
Warm best wishes in your journey.

 

[Lane]

I still don't have a clue why I can hear it, or why it makes my eyes jerk.

Hi @SillyMama -- You may want to consider looking into whether your dura mater might be affecting both your tinnitus and your eyes. Here's a suggested started point:

After 9 Long Years – Wife is Cured of Fibromyalgia Pain (A Husband's Story)

It's a fairly lengthy (but fascinating) read, but about half way through, he mentions the following (snippet below). As you read, keep in mind that the whites of our eyes are actually an extension of the dura mater. I think it extends somehow into the ears as well. -- As inferred in the title, this was written by the husband of a woman who had her dura mater "adjusted" using the "technique" he's referring to, to bring about dramatic relief. -- @Star64 @Greg Sacramento

"I'm no expert at this technique, but in layman's terms, I'll do my best. The Dura Mater (Latin translation for "tough mother") is the very tough sheath that covers and protects the brain. This "mater" covers the brain and continues downward through the base of the skull and down and throughout all parts of the spinal column. This same protective sheath connects to the vertebrae, the discs, and the muscles that surround the spine column. All of this "mater" is irrevocably connected, but in different areas it is termed either the Dura, Pia, or the Arachnoid mater. This "mater" actually wraps around and protects the "nerve roots" that come out of each side of the spine and goes to all parts of the body.

The theory behind this "Bio Cranial Therapy" is that over time and aging (or injury) the spine changes and discs begin to thin out and get a little out of place, vertebrae make minor changes in their position, etc. These subtle changes apply slight pressure to the "mater system" that protects the nerve roots causing pain. This gradual degeneration of the bone and discs of the spine happens to everyone as you age. However, for those suffering with FM, these minor changes begin a cascading effect of inflammation and pain that the traditional medical community doesn't know how to treat.

This Bio Cranial Therapy actually purports a theory related to the formation and minute movement of skull plates and the effects of this extremely subtle movement. This approach is something that I don't understand and I'm not sure I buy into it. However, the one thing that really hit home for me when evaluating this was that it sure made sense to me the idea that if you compressed or agitated a part of the "mater system" along the spinal column, and you could in some way relieve these minor stresses on the nerve roots, then relief made sense. It also goes a long way to explain "shooting" and "diffuse" pain to certain points in the body (like the inside of the knees or the buttocks)."​

 

[SillyMama]

Hi @SillyMama -- You may want to consider looking into whether your dura mater might be affecting both your tinnitus and your eyes. Here's a suggested started point:

After 9 Long Years – Wife is Cured of Fibromyalgia Pain (A Husband's Story)

It's a fairly lengthy (but fascinating) read, but about half way through, he mentions the following (snippet below). As you read, keep in mind that the whites of our eyes are actually an extension of the dura mater. I think it extends somehow into the ears as well. -- As inferred in the title, this was written by the husband of a woman who had her dura mater "adjusted" using the "technique" he's referring to, to bring about dramatic relief. -- @Star64 @Greg Sacramento

Hi,
I read the whole article, which was pretty much entirely about a fibromyalgia treatment. That poor woman. I'm so glad that the chiropractor could help her. But her circumstances, and the signs and symptoms of painful fibromyalgia don't seem relevant to me.
That husband's lengthy testimonial also seemed extraordinarily oriented toward persuading others to frequent that particular practitioner's chiropractic clinic... I looked at that website, too. (Lots of "testimonials...")

In an earlier lifetime/career, I studied (normal) anatomy, so the terms in that article are quite familiar to me. Yes, the optic nerve (one of 12 cranial nerves) does enter the eye socket and connects to the retina. Another one does work with eye movement. And yes, other cranial nerves participate in hearing, as well as smelling and tasting. But that's a tangent...

I don't want to be unkind or ungrateful for anyone trying to help, but I had serious doubts about that resource.
Thanks anyway, though.

 

[Marianne F]

Hi SillyMama, how is it all going? I've only just noticed that AdrianFox has posted a success story and being as we all have/had the very same symptoms maybe there's hope for us yet. Have you looked at the link he suggested re the neck manipulation? I'll certainly give it a try. I've talked with my dentist and now I'm going to see a TMJ Consultant as, like yourself, I'm still convinced there's a connection between that, cervical neck problems and tinnitus. Still getting the disturbed jerky eye. I'd love to hear how or where you are with your tinnitus. Warm wishes.

 

[SillyMama]

Hi SillyMama, how is it all going? I've only just noticed that AdrianFox has posted a success story and being as we all have/had the very same symptoms maybe there's hope for us yet. Have you looked at the link he suggested re the neck manipulation? I'll certainly give it a try. I've talked with my dentist and now I'm going to see a TMJ Consultant as, like yourself, I'm still convinced there's a connection between that, cervical neck problems and tinnitus. Still getting the disturbed jerky eye. I'd love to hear how or where you are with your tinnitus. Warm wishes.

Hi, Marianne,

I'm actually moving away from thinking mine is an upper cervical issue...
I've recently discovered that it can help if I carefully massage my left TMJ region. (My tinnitus is in my left ear.) Sometimes I can reduce it or stop it that way.
I'm also getting better at intentionally relaxing my jaw and nearby areas, and often I can successfully get it to quiet down that way, too.
I still take the magnesium supplement. It helps me a bit.
I still see my TMJ doc and wear the night-time appliance he made for me.
So I'm still working at managing it, but some things help some (sometimes even that odd tapping technique...!)

I don't remember seeing the AdrianFox posting you mentioned. I will have to go look for it.

I hope you find some improvement with TMJ treatment!
Warm regards,
Donna (aka SillyMama)

 

[Marianne F]

Hello Donna,

In case you can't find the AdrianFox posting he was referring to something called Sternocleidomastoid trigger point massage.

I'm sitting on the fence again about the way forward. Sometimes it all seems so obvious and then I have my doubts. I'm taking the Magnesium though so fingers crossed with that. I'll let you know what my TMJ consultant has to say but I'm sure it will be along the same lines as the advice you're getting from yours. It seems to be working for you so that's good news.

Onwards and upwards. We'll get there eventually but in the meantime, the kindest of wishes.

Marianne

 

[DoggoneT]

Hello all shaky vision folks!

I was tested for TMJ and was negative for it. MadMaggot who has same symptoms had reported that the TMJ splint worked for her like a miracle but then it stopped working. The doctor suggested I get a sports mouth guard (you can custom fit some of them). He said he was willing to make a splint if the mouth guard gave some relief. That was a few years ago and I didn't pursue it.

I am still convinced (at least for me) it has something to do with posture, and cervical spine issues (degeneration?). For me, the shaky vision came first. It presented as vertigo and a sensation that my brain was "wobbling". I had a chiropractic adjustment to my neck (unexpected major adjustment as up to then was only getting micro adjustments) and then the tinnitus started. I no longer go for chiropractic treatments. The fact that I was given a neck adjustment without prior consultation was the last straw for that. (Although that adjustment did fix the pain I was having in my upper left back for years).

I use lumbar spine support, good posture, avoidance of alcohol, sugar, caffeine, magnesium supplementation, a foam neck brace (when in a flare of tinnitus), and neck / shoulder massage. The thing that seems to aggravate it the most is incorrect posture. I slouched all last week knowing I shouldn't and wham! Bad dizziness, shaky vision, and tinnitus this week. I am sitting in a neck brace now with my lumbar support. I am able to modulate the symptoms by adjusting the position and/or stretching my neck and back.

I ordered a few tools yesterday to see if they will help get me through this flare up:
- Kneading neck / back strap massage device with heat option
- cervical spine stretcher / support device
- lumbar spine stretcher / support device

I have gone months with only mild symptoms .. this time I also have palpitations and a feeling of anxiety but that could be due to how crazy the world is at this time and unrelated. OR it could be related according to some reading I've done lately.