Treating Tinnitus with RST Sanexas, Using Electrical Cell Signaling?

[Lukee]

Of the 6 people he has claimed to cure, maybe he could ask those patients to join Tinnitus Talk to share their experience?

This isn't a bad idea. I will ask the doctor. The only thing I see as a possible issue is that they weren't treated as tinnitus sufferers but neuropathic patients. Maybe they won't be so inclined to help others by joining forums and such. Nonetheless I will ask. Still hoping a trusted Tinnitus Talk member could trial it.

 

[Matchbox]

Good question. We don't know either. Most of the people on the Wim Hof thread have had similar symptoms (ETD issues and tinnitus, high pitched, mostly hissing); however, there is a large number of sufferers that don't get the ETD symptoms, just the tinnitus. We are divided between ETD, hypoxia causing neuropathy, shock to the ANS, CSF leak, intracranial pressure and/or a mixture of all the above.

I am less inclined to believe it is a perilymph fistula, CSF leak or intracranial pressure since many of us have had MRIs and they do not show those conditions. I know that they can be hard to diagnose by MRI but our neurologists have dismissed the idea. I am still a little skeptical and believe it could be one of these conditions.

Many of the Wim Hof sufferers seem to have mostly recovered from the ETD symptoms. I am 3 months in and still fighting some form of glue ear and occasional fullness. The tinnitus has gotten worse but only slightly. Seems to be holding steady over the last month.

@FGG, do you believe it could be cochlear hydrops? None of us have been able to get a definitive answer but I know I have additional sinus pressure, headaches (that are getting better) and eye floaters. I feel like the symptoms match a stroke of sorts but the neurologists don't believe that is the case.

There is no way on God's green (blue) earth that Wim Hof breathing created a fistula.

The membranes aren't that weak (your eardrum "should" give out before it does).

Think barotrauma (skydiving, flying, diving and pain / unable to equalize) or super intense weight lifting after cardio, things that affect CSF pressure. Also think unilateral tinnitus and sudden hearing loss (even if a bit). Bilateral fistulae my ENT (who's "apparently" the top ENT in my province) says are basically a miracle when they happen, and you're likely genetically predisposed / at high risk of another if it occured.

Wim Hof is probably a case of acute ischemia of high metabolism nerve cells (high frequency) than anything else.

 

[Lukee]

There is no way on God's green (blue) earth that Wim Hof breathing created a fistula.

The membranes aren't that weak (your eardrum "should" give out before it does).

Think barotrauma (skydiving, flying, diving and pain / unable to equalize) or super intense weight lifting after cardio, things that affect CSF pressure. Also think unilateral tinnitus and sudden hearing loss (even if a bit). Bilateral fistulae my ENT (who's "apparently" the top ENT in my province) says are basically a miracle when they happen, and you're likely genetically predisposed / at high risk of another if it occured.

Wim Hof is probably a case of acute ischemia of high metabolism nerve cells (high frequency) than anything else.

I don't know if I love you or hate you for telling me this. Lol. Thanks for the info, what you say makes a lot of sense. What I can't seem to wrap my head around is the rebound of symptoms and even worsening and now I feel like I have some form of ETD and/or otitis media with effusion.

I hope you guys are doing better in BC than we are in Ontario. It's a bloody disaster over here!

Oh P.S. Do you think some crazy high blood pressure could cause a PLF? During WHM apparently blood pressure can spike intensely but I do agree with some form of ischemic injury. I was thinking to take a course of that Vasobral stuff if I can get my hands on it.

 

[FGG]

I don't know if I love you or hate you for telling me this. Lol. Thanks for the info, what you say makes a lot of sense. What I can't seem to wrap my head around is the rebound of symptoms and even worsening and now I feel like I have some form of ETD and/or otitis media with effusion.

I hope you guys are doing better in BC than we are in Ontario. It's a bloody disaster over here!

Oh P.S. Do you think some crazy high blood pressure could cause a PLF? During WHM apparently blood pressure can spike intensely but I do agree with some form of ischemic injury. I was thinking to take a course of that Vasobral stuff if I can get my hands on it.

Weren't you getting better on mucolytic drugs before trying the Otovent? That sounds eusctachian tube. Maybe you just need time...

 

[Lukee]

Weren't you getting better on mucolytic drugs before trying the Otovent? That sounds eusctachian tube. Maybe you just need time...

I thought I was and maybe I was just not patient enough but after 5 or so days on Mucinex I didn't really see a huge improvement. I am now trialing Blexten (antihistamine), Montelukast and Sudafed for 5-10 days. I am on day 3 of the Sudafed and it's weird because while it doesn't rest alleviate the fullness in my ears, it's a different, maybe drier feeling and I do feel better. By the end of the day, once the Sudafed wears off (I'm taking 120mg in morning only) I feel like my ears have fluid in them again. If it doesn't resolve I may look to go the Myringotomy route depending on what ENT says in May. I have tried systemic steroids yet, maybe he will prescribe but I doubt it. Either way, this feeling of something always in my ears is debilitating.

Oh, I also have some Ambroxol lined up for after the Sudafed as per your other posts.

 

[Aaron91]

After reading this thread and the dedicated WHM thread, I'm now convinced that the WHM was almost certainly a co-factor in me getting my hyperacusis. I had been practising it in the hope it would help me deal with a very stressful period of my life and had done a session about an hour before my exposure to a loud motorbike. Ironically, hyperacusis has only caused me more stress and I look like I've aged 10 years in the last year alone.

I'm now convinced that the breath hold induced one of two things:

a) Oxidative stress on the ear that made it highly prone to damage from sound; and/OR
b) Activation of a dormant virus (such as EBV) in the ear due to inducing stress on the body (cold water therapy)

I intend on getting some viral tests done to rule out the latter. Either way, I struggle to see how those of us with tinnitus/hyperacusis induced by the WHM are in a different boat than most others with these conditions. I believe we have induced peripheral damage - I'm not sure I subscribe to the idea of us having messed with our vagus nerve (not saying we haven't, I just don't think it's the cause). While for others it may have been antibiotics or noise exposure, in our case it was self-induced hypoxia. It's perverse.

 

[Lukee]

After reading this thread and the dedicated WHM thread, I'm now convinced that the WHM was almost certainly a co-factor in me getting my hyperacusis. I had been practising it in the hope it would help me deal with a very stressful period of my life and had done a session about an hour before my exposure to a loud motorbike. Ironically, hyperacusis has only caused me more stress and I look like I've aged 10 years in the last year alone.

I'm now convinced that the breath hold induced one of two things:

a) Oxidative stress on the ear that made it highly prone to damage from sound; and/OR
b) Activation of a dormant virus (such as EBV) in the ear due to inducing stress on the body (cold water therapy)

I intend on getting some viral tests done to rule out the latter. Either way, I struggle to see how those of us with tinnitus/hyperacusis induced by the WHM are in a different boat than most others with these conditions. I believe we have induced peripheral damage - I'm not sure I subscribe to the idea of us having messed with our vagus nerve (not saying we haven't, I just don't think it's the cause). While for others it may have been antibiotics or noise exposure, in our case it was self-induced hypoxia. It's perverse.

Hey I think along the same lines as you. Funny you mention the EBV, I had it checked in December (the month before starting WHM) and I had reactivated EBV. Whether or not the virus could've damaged our inner/middle ear I don't know but I guess it's possible. I think like what Matchbox says, it's likely just damage due to hypoxia/ischemia.

If that's the case, what do you think about Vasobral, which is specifically indicated for tinnitus of ischemic origins? It could possibly help us.

I'll ask on the WH thread if anyone else came across loud noise while doing WH.

 

[Lukee]

After reading this thread and the dedicated WHM thread, I'm now convinced that the WHM was almost certainly a co-factor in me getting my hyperacusis. I had been practising it in the hope it would help me deal with a very stressful period of my life and had done a session about an hour before my exposure to a loud motorbike. Ironically, hyperacusis has only caused me more stress and I look like I've aged 10 years in the last year alone.

I'm now convinced that the breath hold induced one of two things:

a) Oxidative stress on the ear that made it highly prone to damage from sound; and/OR
b) Activation of a dormant virus (such as EBV) in the ear due to inducing stress on the body (cold water therapy)

I intend on getting some viral tests done to rule out the latter. Either way, I struggle to see how those of us with tinnitus/hyperacusis induced by the WHM are in a different boat than most others with these conditions. I believe we have induced peripheral damage - I'm not sure I subscribe to the idea of us having messed with our vagus nerve (not saying we haven't, I just don't think it's the cause). While for others it may have been antibiotics or noise exposure, in our case it was self-induced hypoxia. It's perverse.

@Aaron91, are you getting the same symptoms of headaches, ear and head pressure as well as tinnitus and hyperacusis? I can barely bend over these days as the pressure is too great and causes a lot of discomfort. I now wake up with pressure in my head which feels almost like a sinus infection but I know it's not.

Also, just want to revive this thread and see if anyone is willing to try out this treatment. Anyone on Tinnitus Talk in Tulsa?

 

[Aaron91]

@Aaron91, are you getting the same symptoms of headaches, ear and head pressure as well as tinnitus and hyperacusis? I can barely bend over these days as the pressure is too great and causes a lot of discomfort. I now wake up with pressure in my head which feels almost like a sinus infection but I know it's not.

Also, just want to revive this thread and see if anyone is willing to try out this treatment. Anyone on Tinnitus Talk in Tulsa?

I count the number of headaches I've had in the last year on one hand, so I don't think I can put those down to hyperacusis. I wouldn't say I have much ear or head pressure these days either - I wouldn't say I had much in the beginning. My major complaint is just the instant pain from sound as well as the delayed trigeminal neuralgia, although thankfully that is not as bad as it used to be. I had terrible TTTS symptoms in the beginning in addition to my hyperacusis, but those have improved too.

 

[Cher2]

Also, just want to revive this thread and see if anyone is willing to try out this treatment. Anyone on Tinnitus Talk in Tulsa?

I read through the posts and wished I lived closer to the doctor.

However, I got curious to see if there were any doctors in my area that used the RST Sanexas machine. I didn't find what I was looking for. I was trying to think of a workaround where the doctor you refer to gets credit for the discovery, but the trial is more convenient in terms of location.

 

[Lukee]

I read through the posts and wished I lived closer to the doctor.

However, I got curious to see if there were any doctors in my area that used the RST Sanexas machine. I didn't find what I was looking for. I was trying to think of a workaround where the doctor you refer to gets credit for the discovery, but the trial is more convenient in terms of location.

I've reached out to him but haven't heard back. I would really like to see this trialed even if it's just members from the forum. If he gives me his approval, I will post his info.

 

[Cher2]

I've reached out to him but haven't heard back. I would really like to see this trialed even if it's just members from the forum. If he gives me his approval, I will post his info.

I hope he does give his permission - if it helps the way he has indicated, seems like it would be good for his practice and good for people with tinnitus.

 

[Lukee]

I hope he does give his permission - if it helps the way he has indicated, seems like it would be good for his practice and good for people with tinnitus.

OK, hear me out on this...

I have read a few reports of people getting better after ultrasound-type treatments.

The Tinnitus Mix thread's founder, @R. David Case claims that his mix produces ultrasound signals that heal the ear/brain. I recently read an article about Brian Johnson of AC/DC and his "treatment" of tinnitus and hearing loss over 3 years. For whatever reason he is keeping his treatment a secret. Many articles say the same thing but here is an excerpt:

"The first time he came down he brought this thing that looked like a car battery," Johnson explained. "I went, 'What in the hell is that?' He said, 'We're going to miniaturize it.' It took two and a half years. He came down once a month. We'd sit there and it was boring as shit with all these wires and computer screens and noises. But it was well worth it."

The exact science behind the treatment is something of a mystery, with Johnson willing to divulge only minimal information: "The only thing I can tell you is that it uses the bone structure in the skull as a receiver. That's as much as I can tell you."​

I find this very suspicious, he talks about bone structure in the skull as a receiver. The neurologist who proposed this treatment to me made very similar comments about his treatment using bone conduction to access the cochlea and auditory nerves. The article even mentions the device looking like a car battery and having wires and computer screens and noises. That is really the only part that throws me off, is it more akin to a Susan Shore device? Either way, I believe this is something to investigate further.

 

[Lukee]

UPDATE:

The doctor I have been referring to in this thread has recently updated his website to include the treatment of tinnitus and trigeminal neuralgia. At this point, I feel it is appropriate to release his information to the forums.

Tulsa Neuro Specialists

His name is Dr. Gonzalez. Feel free to contact at your own discretion.

 

[Uklawyer]

@Lukee, can't you contact him again and ask why he has now updated his website to include tinnitus treatment?

Has he tried his machine on tinnitus sufferers with positive results? Can he ask them (or those that suffered from neuropathy who experienced remission of tinnitus) if they would be willing to provide more details of their tinnitus and their improvements?

If this thing really works and his results could be conveyed with a bit of detail to some on this thread, it could be huge for him...

 

[Lukee]

@Lukee, can't you contact him again and ask why he has now updated his website to include tinnitus treatment?

Has he tried his machine on tinnitus sufferers with positive results? Can he ask them (or those that suffered from neuropathy who experienced remission of tinnitus) if they would be willing to provide more details of their tinnitus and their improvements?

If this thing really works and his results could be conveyed with a bit of detail to some on this thread, it could be huge for him...

Honestly, I don't want to get involved. I left his details here for anyone to do their own homework. My initial conversations with him were good and I felt like he was being honest about the treatment. I'm not affiliated with him and I'm not even in the same country. I was able to get acquainted with him through my network.

 

[Sentinel]

I'm going to call them and follow up on this. It may be something I can try after the OTO-313 trial is done.

I'll report back.

 

[Sentinel]

Well that was quick, bit of a whirlwind. I called them and went through the directory and was eventually transferred directly to Dr. Gonzalez. He told me that he used a electrical device from Germany and was treating patients with neuropathy like was already mentioned and that some experienced "improvement" to a degree of 60-70% in their tinnitus. The word cure or remission never came up. He indicated he wanted to try it on more patients or design some sort of study to see if it could be useful. He said it was not covered by insurance due to the experimental nature of the treatment but that the price was "reasonable" but I was never given a figure. He transferred me to a scheduling lady but I declined an appointment as I was just looking for info. I should have asked her about pricing but the whole thing ended abruptly before I could do so.

He led with a short speech about how the ancient Egyptians and Romans would bathe in waters that had certain fish that had electrical currents or something that were beneficial. That was a tad over my head and a little kooky but he quickly moved on from that.

Seems reasonably reputable and honest to me if not a little eccentric. He was open and stressed the experimental nature of the treatment. He didn't talk much about how it worked, but he said it seemed to work better on people who hadn't had tinnitus for years on end.

If anybody calls or inquires further, try and see if you can get info on a treatment schedule or pricing. I'm going to wait and see if this develops more/additional info comes out.

 

[Uklawyer]

Well done @Sentinel. It seems like it needs to be tried by some more people.

I still wonder if some formal approach could be made on the part of Tinnitus Talk seeking some more info in order to encourage tinnitus sufferers to try it out.

 

[Lukee]

Well that was quick, bit of a whirlwind. I called them and went through the directory and was eventually transferred directly to Dr. Gonzalez. He told me that he used a electrical device from Germany and was treating patients with neuropathy like was already mentioned and that some experienced "improvement" to a degree of 60-70% in their tinnitus. The word cure or remission never came up. He indicated he wanted to try it on more patients or design some sort of study to see if it could be useful. He said it was not covered by insurance due to the experimental nature of the treatment but that the price was "reasonable" but I was never given a figure. He transferred me to a scheduling lady but I declined an appointment as I was just looking for info. I should have asked her about pricing but the whole thing ended abruptly before I could do so.

He led with a short speech about how the ancient Egyptians and Romans would bathe in waters that had certain fish that had electrical currents or something that were beneficial. That was a tad over my head and a little kooky but he quickly moved on from that.

Seems reasonably reputable and honest to me if not a little eccentric. He was open and stressed the experimental nature of the treatment. He didn't talk much about how it worked, but he said it seemed to work better on people who hadn't had tinnitus for years on end.

If anybody calls or inquires further, try and see if you can get info on a treatment schedule or pricing. I'm going to wait and see if this develops more/additional info comes out.

Your experience echos my post about Dr. Gonzalez with one difference: he clearly mentioned cure to me and I was never given 60-70% figure. He said after each session it got better and better until it was gone but also mentioned that some had a "significant" improvement. Like for you, he did not give me a price but said it would be reduced/reasonable given that it's not covered by insurance and since it was still experimental and he wanted to get some data from it.

He never mentioned the Roman baths but did talk at length about why he believes it works (via bone conduction since the cochlea is encased in bone). He is a little eccentric but generally seems like he is well-intentioned. I would be skeptical about making this a Tinnitus Talk "thing" and just encourage anyone who is interested in the treatment to contact him and try it. I tried to bring this to the forums without revealing Dr. Gonzalez, as those were his wishes, but I was not well supported by the general community. I believe the best way to see if it works is to try it and that's all.

The good news is I doubt that it will be very much investment before results are/aren't noticeable, I would say by 2-3 sessions you should notice a difference as this is what he has told me. As mentioned, I have talked to him at length and if what he is saying is accurate, he has something very special on his hands.

 

[Uklawyer]

Any takers? @GBB?

 

[GBB]

Any takers? @GBB?

As time goes on I am weighing my options between multiple radical modalities. I don't think this is at the top of my list only because I can't shower, let alone drive, so the prospect of flying is quite daunting. I'll likely need to begin with something closer - I could have a permanent worsening with flight so it's not an easy decision.

 

[Uklawyer]

@GBB apologies - it was a little tongue-in-cheek, given that you appear to be the brave person on here that tries so many approaches mooted on here to help your tinnitus. Well done for the efforts and I hope they pay dividends at some point.

Are you unable to get out at the moment?

Best wishes.

 

[GBB]

@GBB apologies - it was a little tongue-in-cheek, given that you appear to be the brave person on here that tries so many approaches mooted on here to help your tinnitus. Well done for the efforts and I hope they pay dividends at some point.

Are you unable to get out at the moment?

Best wishes.

No worries, but no I'm not able to get out much, unfortunately.

 

[Exit]

No worries, but no I'm not able to get out much, unfortunately.

Hey GBB

I've been ghosting you since your new life started. Have you had any improvements at all?

Do you have tinnitus in both ears or also in "head"?

 

[GBB]

Hey GBB

I've been ghosting you since your new life started. Have you had any improvements at all?

Do you have tinnitus in both ears or also in "head"?

I've had changes in tone from high to low, but my reactivity is the same or perhaps worse than at the start, and I still find my overall condition an existential challenge.

 

[Exit]

I've had changes in tone from high to low, but my reactivity is the same or perhaps worse than at the start, and I still find my overall condition an existential challenge.

After your tone changed from high to low, do you still hear it outdoors? My high pitch tone is only masked by running water. The other sounds are much easier to live with.

My high pitch tone is reactive so that makes it even worse to try ignore.

Does your reactivity sometimes go constant? After listening to a fan or other noise, does it keep going a while after the fan is off? Mine does often these days, I find it better, because then I can move around or use a keyboard without reactivity.

Does your hyperacusis increase when you're indoors a lot in close to silence?

 

[SHHHH]

I have been doing Sanexas treatment for weeks to try and help with a very rare type of peripheral neuropathy. I have not noticed any changes in tinnitus.

 

[Lukee]

I have been doing Sanexas treatment for weeks to try and help with a very rare type of peripheral neuropathy. I have not noticed any changes in tinnitus.

Thanks for the update; however, my understanding is it must be applied in a certain area/certain method.

Maybe you can ask to try on neck, ear area?

 

[ceeleebee]

Hi! I have used the RST Sanexas for treatment of neck pain. I started treating my feet and got good results so I started with my neck. The tinnitus was off and on but got persistent when my neck issues started.

I noticed after the first one, my tinnitus was gone, then slowly came back after two weeks but less persistent. After the second treatment, it was gone again. So far it has been a happy accident that treating my neck pain is also resolving my tinnitus.

I am a firm believer in this treatment for pain and have gotten great results.