Treatment Prospects: Vagus Nerve Stimulation

Honestly I'm not sure how it's different from the TENS machine. My friend from England read a newspaper article on this particular machine and I thought it would be worth trying. I know certain TENS machines can be upwards of the same price. Granted, there are cheaper ones- but as with any technological product, the more it costs, the higher quality it is. Unfortunately there are a lot of marketing schemes out there ready to take advantage of tinnitus sufferers, but because of my improvement thus far, I honestly don't think this product is one of those 'schemes'. I am curious as to, when I stop the treatment, how long the improved condition will last.

Oh well then that's great if it's working for you. Could you say more about how it works? Where do you place the electrodes, is it just one on each ear or do you have to place pads somewhere too?
 
Hi Chris,

I have been in contact with TTC and they have said that they want you to contact them immediately, as what you are doing is extremely dangerous. Sorry about this, but I just thought I would ask them about the other units and electrode placements etc.

They make a clear distinction between their device, being specifically designed to stimulate the Vagus Nerve, and other cheaper TENS devices which are not designed for this purpose and are very dangerous when attempted. I don't think this distinction between TENS and TVNS is as simple as it looking the same.

I bought my device from TTC, because they are in the UK arm of the Helsinki Ear Institute (who are a world leading research centre for tinnitus research). I think trying to recreate their work with a device that looks the same, in a sort of similar way, is akin to having a nurse do your surgery because they are wearing blue like the surgeon. I chose TTC because of their reputation, and after speaking with them about the other devices, I'm glad I did.
 
Hi Chris,

I have been in contact with TTC and they have said that they want you to contact them immediately, as what you are doing is extremely dangerous. Sorry about this, but I just thought I would ask them about the other units and electrode placements etc.

They make a clear distinction between their device, being specifically designed to stimulate the Vagus Nerve, and other cheaper TENS devices which are not designed for this purpose and are very dangerous when attempted. I don't think this distinction between TENS and TVNS is as simple as it looking the same.

I bought my device from TTC, because they are in the UK arm of the Helsinki Ear Institute (who are a world leading research centre for tinnitus research). I think trying to recreate their work with a device that looks the same, in a sort of similar way, is akin to having a nurse do your surgery because they are wearing blue like the surgeon. I chose TTC because of their reputation, and after speaking with them about the other devices, I'm glad I did.
Ok thanks. I haven't done anymore since.
 
I have had tinnitus since 1980. It has progressively worsened from then. I recently discovered that my alma mater, The University of Texas @ Dallas' Callier Center for hearing impairment et.al. participated in a research study a year ago about our affliction. They apparently has some success. They may have another research study upcoming this year. It has to do with stimulating the 'Vegus Nerve'. You can Google UT Dallas Tiinitus Research and find the correct link. I have emailed Dr. Kilroy for more info about the possible upcoming new study to be a volunteer for the research.
 
I think this is very interesting. Can this be had somewhere in Europe?

But it is invasive...
 
Can this be had somewhere in Europe?
I think actually Finland are on the forefront of this, still they are trailing this many place for epilepsy, tinnitus and other conditions I think. My audiologist actually said I was a good candidate to enable me in such I trial, but I guess he was BS-ing me.
 
I think actually Finland are on the forefront of this
What makes you say that?
My audiologist actually said I was a good candidate to enable me in such I trial
Who isn't? Do they have some inclusion criteria?
but I guess he was BS-ing me
I don't know about that. But I personally don't trust audiologists at all. Have you heard of that latest scandal in Sweden concerning Audika and hearing aids? Not sure it was covered in news in Norway, but it was a big thing here just a few days ago.
 
What makes you say that?
Cause a finish members were on here saying he/she started with this and I got the impression it was kind of common practice there. I dont know how it went though.

But I personally don't trust audiologists at all. Have you heard of that latest scandal in Sweden concerning Audika and hearing aids?
Well, he has talked about both neuro-modulation and VNS, but when I try to contact him about its like he is forgotten all about it. He runs a tinnitus-clinic far from where I live and is always unreachable. He is a strong believer in hearing aids with NG though.
Hav´nt heard about the scandal, What was that about?
 
Cause a finish members were on here saying he/she started with this and I got the impression it was kind of common practice there.
I seem to recall reading something like that... I will have to look that up.

He runs a tinnitus-clinic far from where I live and is always unreachable. He is a strong believer in hearing aids with NG though.
An audiologist?

Hav´nt heard about the scandal, What was that about?

Well, there are a couple of things to cover. In Sweden, you can get state reimbursed hearing aids. In other words free hearing aids for people that need them. There are selected models and price ranges for these of course. These are usually the ones you get when you go to a hearing clinic at a state funded public hospital. But like with all areas of healthcare in Sweden, the latest development is that you can receive healthcare at a private clinic and not pay more than you normally do at a public hospital. These clinics are connected to the public healthcare system, so all the same rules and prices apply. In theory!

This may seem like a good thing, that you can have this kind of "choice". But it's really a forced choice, the way I see it. The public hospitals are understaffed, overbooked and overcrowded, so they find this type of "choice in healthcare" as a perfect excuse to push you off to a private establishment where you are supposed to get the same treatment anyway. In theory!

So instead of having your hearing checked at the hospital, you are referred to a private clinic. It's not too unlikely that you will end up at one of the Audika owned audiologist clinics. Audika is a French audiologist chain that consists of more than 800 clinics throughout Europe.

What's the problem? There is no conflict of interest and you can expect the highest standard for hearing exam if you do it at the hospital. Besides, in Sweden, audiologists don't do the "advanced" hearing tests like OAE and ABR. They will send you back to the hospital to deal with you if you need that sort of test.

If you do your hearing exam at a private clinic, you can only expect to get the standard audiometry. For me, that's hardly any surprise! All they care for is not your hearing, but selling you devices and gadgets. As it has been revealed just now, there is a big conflict of interest here. It has been uncovered that patients that have been referred to the private clinics have been sold the more expensive hearing aids. This would have been normal if it was America. But this is Sweden, where people can get hearing aids for free.

It turns out the audiologists downplayed the quality of the state provided hearing aids, seeing them as inferior. In some cases, they didn't even tell the patients that they can get the hearing aids for free if they go for the state approved models. Reason why? Because they would get a hefty bonus for selling the more expensive brand and model!

Choice in healthcare? What a joke! This is what happens when a state funded, public healthcare system is undermined by private conglomerates and business groups, and when you take in more immigrants than you can handle.

Don't trust audiologists!

Audiologists + Hearing aid makers = True :love:

If you can, make sure you do all your tests at a hospital. Hopefully there will be no conflict of interest. I wish more than anything that there was a biological means of restoring hearing, so that we can rid ourselves of these clowns and their expensive gadgets.

Some relevant articles in Swedish:
https://hrf.se/hard-kritik-mot-horselcheckar-ny-utredning/
https://hrf.se/debatt-satsa-pa-riktig-valfrihet-horselskadade/
https://hrf.se/audionomer-far-bonus-varje-horapparat-de-saljer/
https://hrf.se/6657-2/
 
It turns out the audiologists downplayed the quality of the state provided hearing aids, seeing them as inferior.
Wow, that makes me very angry to hear. Just one other examples of how us T sufferers are being exploited through out the world through overpricing, stupid promises of things that will cure you ranging from supplements to band-aids behind your ear. (The latter was a Swedish product too, right?)

We got a great public healthcare system in Norway too, but regarding T all they really do is push you a HA with a NG. I think its about time they explore other ways to go. I can´t wait for Frequency TX to make all this shit history.

An audiologist?
Yeah, he is considered Norway´s leading expert on the subject. He is very knowledgeable indeed.
Here is a lecture he has held if you are interested and since you will probably understand the language(even though he has a very southern norwegian dialect;)


Btw, his clinic is incorporated at a hospital.
 
Just one other examples of how us T sufferers are being exploited through out the world through overpricing, stupid promises of things that will cure you ranging from supplements to band-aids behind your ear.
That's inevitable when there is not a lot of real research in the condition and no established national guidelines on diagnosis or treatment.

The latter was a Swedish product too, right?
Yes, regrettably.

but regarding T all they really do is push you a HA with a NG
That sounds familiar. I was going to ask this, are there national guidelines in Norway on how to treat tinnitus? But I guess that answers that.

He is very knowledgeable indeed.
Yes, his presentation is very technical. I just skipped through it for now. I will have to watch it at some later time, since it's very long. This reminds me a lot of the James Hudspeth video I posted earlier.

I can´t wait for Frequency TX to make all this shit history.
I also think that their approach is best positioned to be a success. Do you know of any inner ear regeneration work taking place in Norway?
 
Do you know of any inner ear regeneration work taking place in Norway?
Well, there are many brilliant researchers in Norway. Recently a woman discovered a cure for rheumatism I think it was. But regarding regeneration I think the last place to look would be Norway. But, to be honest, I would not know a thing about it. I´m not in any way as knowledgable as you, when it comes to this!:bag:
 
I'm going to try Parasym but most people in the forum who tried it found it didn't help. I'll report my findings in the forum
 
Pairing vagus nerve stimulation with tones drives plasticity across the auditory pathway (Borland, M., et al, 2019)

''The study demonstrated that pairing VNS and tones increased both cortical and subcortical plasticity. "Stimulation of the vagus nerve activates neuromodulator release in the brain, and this neuromodulator release paired with sound presentation generates plasticity throughout the auditory system, both cortically and subcortically," said the study's senior author, Crystal T. Engineer, PhD, a research assistant professor at The University of Texas at Dallas. "In the current study, we paired vagus nerve stimulation with the presentation of tone and found that the neural representation of the paired sound was enhanced in four auditory fields: the inferior colliculus, the primary auditory cortex, the anterior auditory field, and the posterior auditory field."

''Although the results are preliminary, the authors suggest that the multiple changes in the auditory pathway found after VNS-tone therapy in their rat model provides a framework for future preclinical and clinical studies.''

''According to Dr. Engineer, the novelty of this research is that pairing VNS and sound presentation has the ability to alter both early and late levels of the auditory pathway. "By pairing VNS with a sound, we are able to manipulate auditory responses specifically to the paired sound, which opens doors to a variety of new therapeutic tools for individuals with auditory processing disorders," she said.''

Link text: https://www.enttoday.org/article/using-the-vagus-nerve-to-help-hearing/
Link study: https://journals.physiology.org/doi/pdf/10.1152/jn.00832.2018@apsselect.2019.6.issue-8
 
Study Shows Positive Results In Stopping Tinnitus (Deep House Amsterdam, 22/03/2020)

''Researchers Dr. Michael Kilgard and Dr. Navzer Engineer from The University of Texas at Dallas and University-affiliated biotechnology firm MicroTransponder report that sounds paired with stimulation of the vagus nerve (VNS) eliminated tinnitus in rats. A clinical trial in humans is due to begin in the next few months.''

''Kilgard reported that: "Brain changes in response to nerve damage or cochlear trauma cause irregular neural activity believed to be responsible for many types of chronic pain and tinnitus. But when we paired tones with brief pulses of vagus nerve stimulation, we eliminated the physiological and behavioral symptoms of tinnitus in noise-exposed rats."

''In essence, what the UT Dallas researchers are doing is 'retraining' the brain to ignore the signals coming from the nerve system that simulate the ringing you think you hear. After weeks of monitoring the lab rats, the improvements have been shown to persist [study in 2011].''

Link: https://www.deephouseamsterdam.com/study-shows-positive-results-in-stopping-tinnitus/

I find it interesting that they mentioned a new clinical trial, which should begin in the next few months. VNS has already been used in human trials before (with moderate success) but there is apparently room for improvement.
 
Study Shows Positive Results In Stopping Tinnitus (Deep House Amsterdam, 22/03/2020)

''Researchers Dr. Michael Kilgard and Dr. Navzer Engineer from The University of Texas at Dallas and University-affiliated biotechnology firm MicroTransponder report that sounds paired with stimulation of the vagus nerve (VNS) eliminated tinnitus in rats. A clinical trial in humans is due to begin in the next few months.''

''Kilgard reported that: "Brain changes in response to nerve damage or cochlear trauma cause irregular neural activity believed to be responsible for many types of chronic pain and tinnitus. But when we paired tones with brief pulses of vagus nerve stimulation, we eliminated the physiological and behavioral symptoms of tinnitus in noise-exposed rats."

''In essence, what the UT Dallas researchers are doing is 'retraining' the brain to ignore the signals coming from the nerve system that simulate the ringing you think you hear. After weeks of monitoring the lab rats, the improvements have been shown to persist [study in 2011].''

Link: https://www.deephouseamsterdam.com/study-shows-positive-results-in-stopping-tinnitus/

I find it interesting that they mentioned a new clinical trial, which should begin in the next few months. VNS has already been used in human trials before (with moderate success) but there is apparently room for improvement.
tVNS by parasym.co has been available for years already, with poor results. I don't understand what do they want to test more.
 
tVNS by parasym.co has been available for years already, with poor results. I don't understand what do they want to test more.
There's a difference that Parasym is a non-intrusive machine and the MicroTransponder is a wireless machine that needs to be surgically placed in the chest & attached to the vagus nerve. Does Parasym also do timed pulses & auditory stimulation (paired tones) in the same way as MicroTransponder @Mentos?
 
There's a difference that Parasym is a non-intrusive machine and the MicroTransponder is a wireless machine that needs to be surgically placed in the chest & attached to the vagus nerve. Does Parasym also do timed pulses & auditory stimulation (paired tones) in the same way as MicroTransponder @Mentos?
Ah ok, I didn't know they implant the device. Yes Parasym does timed pulses and auditory stimulation
 

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