Trigger Point Injection Treatment for Tinnitus

[Markku]

Marja Estola is a Finnish doctor and researcher. Specialized in tinnitus. Yearly goes to the TRI meetings worldwide and is one of the top notch "tinnitus doctors" here in Finland.



Her Academic dissertation was titled "Muscular tension and tinnitus. An experimental trial of trigger point injections on tinnitus"


You can read it from here: http://acta.uta.fi/pdf/951-44-4972-X.pdf

 

[exodus]

hi do you have any contact number for her , i m in uk and have also muscles issue ,maybe she can help me

 

[joe]

I am in the u.k also, I think this will just give you temporary relief, as the magic injection was lidocaine, this substance yes makes the tinnitus go away for a period but it's back soon as it wares off. Markuu I think you will agree ??

 

[exodus]

in the video i ve heard that she has make disapear a 20 year tinnutis or did i misunderstood?

 

[joe]

I think she says she's been treating the patient 20 years, which I can believe as lidocaine was discovered to alieviate tinnitus over a century ago, it's just an anaesthetic, and it wares off after a few hours

 

[exodus]

ok i didn t knew the use of lidocaine for treating tinnitus,by the way joe is there anything in uk for us?i m in the west midlands.thanks

 

[Markku]

Hmm that's a good question.

I actually emailed Marja a little bit under two years ago and asked about whether she still does TPI treatments. (the answer was yes and she also gave some additional information).

But for some reason I forgot to ask how long the effect lasted for this patient in the video, or patients in general. From the video it's clear that the patient has been treated with these injections for 20 years and these injections have helped, but it's not said how long the effect lasts. Generally speaking I agree with joe; from what I've found lidocaine injections can alleviate tinnitus but it's oftentimes temporary until it wears off.

From her dissertation you find this:

So basically:
"because the effects of lidocaine were mostly under 3 days (in the Goodey 1981 study) and considerable amount of effects in the present study lasted longer than 3 days, the explanation by the effect of lidocaine seems unlikely."
"the effect of lidocaine injections on trigger points overlasted the duration of drug influence and could not be explained with the usage of lidocaine alone."
"the treatment effects were mostly temporary and partial but a few permanent improvements occured."
"after 6 months the treated patients had statistically better outcome with their tinnitus than the control group."

Interestingly also females had better outcome of the treatment and chirping type of tinnitus responded better.


This is an interesting read also: http://yts.se/english/tinnitus.htm

 

[joe]

Hello myself, the clear answer is, no there is no known drug / cure thats going to help us at this point, however due to the age of i pods, i phones and more of the younger generation getting Tinnitus there is more focus in finding treatment fast!!!!, I think its going to be stem cells, the Koreans are probably the ones who will develop it first. I think we have to just sit tightly until it happens. Has anyone Tried Piracetam and choline?? theres a post on this forum, thats having some good results

 

[exodus]

hi joe and markku

i understand that at this time there is no cure for it but at least we can try something wich can give some relief even temporary.

so i m asking markku if you have any contact for her so i can come and try her injections.

and for joe,do you know any systems worth be tried in uk? as this t is driving me crazy and it s getting worse with the cold weather.

let me know if you find anything helpful

thanks

 

[joe]

exodus, try this its available in London the company is set to roll out in USA second Quarter this year, Speak to Susan http://www.thetinnitusclinic.co.uk/tinnitus-treatment/acoustic-neuromodulation/

 

[exodus]

ok joe i ll call them tomorrow

thanks

 

[joe]

Your welcome, It's backed with a clinical trial so it should help, as long as your tinnitus is tonal, however an hour and a half consultation for £185 is quite reasonable at this clinic as they are Tinnitus specialist, in harley street london they will evaluate you and put you on the right tracks. This will be my next port of call if the HBOT treatment is unsuccessful for me. Good luck and keep the group posted.

 

[Markku]

exodus: can you change the pitch / volume of your tinnitus by moving your jaw, head or opening your mouth wide open?

Overactive touch-sensing nerve cells explain common "ringing in the ears"

Anyway, if you are truly interested in traveling to Finland to try out trigger point injections, then I could ask Marja Estola whether or not she could treat patients from abroad. You should remember that Marja is located in Imatra (B), which is about 260km from Helsinki (A).

I'd be surprised though if there were no willing doctors in the UK to try and administrate these injections.
Since Marja Estola has attended at least some of the Tinnitus Research Initiative's yearly meetings, maybe she knows of some doctor performing this in the UK.

I'll let you know.

 

[joe]

I can change my pitch of my Tinnitus when I open and close my mouth, what does it mean Markku, ?? Does it happen with u ??

 

[Markku]

Head, Neck, and Eye Movements That Modulate Tinnitus

Careful evaluation of 45 members of our tinnitus support group, using a comprehensive neurological test battery that assesses the involvement of CN III, IV, V, VI, VII, XI, and XII and cervical nerves 1 and 2 showed that 78% of tinnitus subjects could modulate their tinnitus. The high percentage of patients who could modulate their tinnitus with this test battery is consistent with more recent surveys of tinnitus patients involving similar but not identical evaluation schemes.

It's common, so nothing to worry about.

There is an emanating scientific evidence that the mechanism is a crosstalk between the Trigeminal and the Chochlear nerv pathways in the brainstem that causes the tension signals to be experianced as a sound phenomenon by the patient.

http://yts.se/english/tinnitus.htm
On that site you could also check "treatment outcome" and "research/publications".


I too can alter my tinnitus by moving my jaw, head, neck.

I'm just thinking aloud that maybe these trigger point injections might work better for those who can alter their tinnitus by these movements (78% in that study I posted at the beginning of this post).

Not sure.

 

[exodus]

exodus: can you change the pitch / volume of your tinnitus by moving your jaw, head or opening your mouth wide open?

Overactive touch-sensing nerve cells explain common "ringing in the ears"

Anyway, if you are truly interested in traveling to Finland to try out trigger point injections, then I could ask Marja Estola whether or not she could treat patients from abroad. You should remember that Marja is located in Imatra (B), which is about 260km from Helsinki (A).

I'd be surprised though if there were no willing doctors in the UK to try and administrate these injections.
Since Marja Estola has attended at least some of the Tinnitus Research Initiative's yearly meetings, maybe she knows of some doctor performing this in the UK.

I'll let you know.

yes it s changing when i m cracking my neck i have cervical,back and generally speaking muscles issues (from neck to feet),got that since a mistreated motorcycle accident when i was young.but tinnutis is quiet recent(since may 2008).

let me know if she has some colleague of her in uk who can treat me here

thanks

 

[Sound Wave]

I visited her yesterday. A very nice lady. She had just got back from the annual T conference in New Zealand, so she seems to be still active with T research and treatmeants. She takes T patients once a week through this company: http://www.itte.fi (in Finnish)

 

[Markku]

I visited her yesterday. A very nice lady. She had just got back from the annual T conference in New Zealand, so she seems to be still active with T research and treatmeants. She takes T patients once a week through this company: http://www.itte.fi (in Finnish)

Did you have the injection treatment? Have you noticed any results yet? Will you see her again?

Sorry for the third degree...

 

[carlover]

Ive watched the youtubes , .....its worked ...but...shes been going for 20 years.???? Thats some working lol.

 

[Sound Wave]

No, we didn't have time to do the injection. She scanned my head, jaw and neck for TPs and found several sore areas. She did perform the cold-hot-stretching also seen in the video to my neck and shoulders. That felt quite effective. We also explored Benign Paroxysmal Positional Vertigo (BPPJ) which I opened a thread of it's own. She said she has been the most successful with somatic T through BPPJ, which can cause muscle strain totally without the actual vertigo.

I might visit her in the future. Don't know yet. I am trying to find TP specialists in the Helsinki region, but I haven't had luck so far...

 

[Codaz]

@Sound Wave

Any updates on this? I'm going to do Triggerpoint therapy soon. I can manipulate the tinnitus by pressing my face, and turning my head into the furthest position possible (left or right).

So far, after 6 months of physiotherapy there is still improvement. Triggerpoint therapy is one of the things I'm trying before I consider any drugs in 2015.

 

[Sound Wave]

No, I didn't see her again. Normal PT has helped me so that if my neck is stiff, the T is higher. When she manipulates the neck back to normal, T goes down (after a spike).

 

[Codaz]

Seems comparable to me, but you said your T is because of headphones?

 

[stacey]

That procedure looks way too scary........ I wouldn't do it.

 

[Lebber]

Hey everyone,

Does anyone know which doctor can give trigger point injections for tinnitus? A neurologist, ent,...? And does someone knows which hostpital in belgium performs this procedure?

I was discussing this with my doctor the other day, but he admitted he had no idea which doctor is specialized in injections for tinnitus.

 

[Lebber]

Hey everyone,

Does anyone know which doctor can give trigger point injections for tinnitus? A neurologist, ent,...? And does someone knows which hostpital in belgium performs this procedure?

I was discussing this with my doctor the other day, but he admitted he had no idea which doctor is specialized in injections for tinnitus.

Anyone?

 

[Greg Sacramento]

@Lebber In the States, the best choice is a pain management doctor where most hospitals have one on staff or has practicing rights.

https://paindoctor.com/treatments/trigger-point-injections/

 

[Lebber]

@Lebber In the States, the best choice is a pain management doctor where most hospitals have one on staff or has practicing rights.

https://paindoctor.com/treatments/trigger-point-injections/

Thank you!

 

[DirM]

I have T caused by TMJ and the my TMJ doctor did this twice. I am pretty sure my TMJ is caused my inflammation around the joint which has improved in 18 months but not gone away (T has come down from a 7 to a 1, sometimes a 2). I believe the injection helps with the inflammation and I had one positive and one *very* negative experience with this procedure:

- When my T started it would in increase when I turned my head to the right. After the first injection this stopped, and to this day my T level does not change when I turn my head to the right (no luck on left side - still increases when I do that.

- The second time I did this I had acute hyperacusis start in my right ear about an hour after the injection. My T has brought sound sensitivity, but this was like any sort of noise was so painful that I couldn't go in public. It was absolutely horrible - I have real sympathy for H sufferers after that. Luckily it was gone in a couple days, and that was the last time I did this.

So decide carefully if you want to do this.

 

[Codaz]

I have T caused by TMJ and the my TMJ doctor did this twice. I am pretty sure my TMJ is caused my inflammation around the joint which has improved in 18 months but not gone away (T has come down from a 7 to a 1, sometimes a 2). I believe the injection helps with the inflammation and I had one positive and one *very* negative experience with this procedure:

- When my T started it would in increase when I turned my head to the right. After the first injection this stopped, and to this day my T level does not change when I turn my head to the right (no luck on left side - still increases when I do that.

- The second time I did this I had acute hyperacusis start in my right ear about an hour after the injection. My T has brought sound sensitivity, but this was like any sort of noise was so painful that I couldn't go in public. It was absolutely horrible - I have real sympathy for H sufferers after that. Luckily it was gone in a couple days, and that was the last time I did this.

So decide carefully if you want to do this.

It's so terryifing that all sorts of things can happen with the human body if you try either this or that.