Unleashing the Power of the Mind to Manage Tinnitus?

[SonOfUhtred]

Hi all,

Have been on this forum for a long time but never posted.

I work in the construction industry which I guess is a tinnitus nightmare in itself. However, I am rarely around sounds louder than 90 dB and I always use my Peltor ear defenders onsite. I also try to take regular breaks, especially when using tools myself. Having a mortgage, family etc, it's hard for me to just get up and leave although I am on the lookout for a quieter job.

I was using a tool today which measured at 90 dB at machine level, around 75 dB at ear level. I was panicking, worrying it would make my tinnitus worse. I could feel the ringing getting louder and more intrusive as I was using it and have been concentrating on it ever since. I couldn't help but wonder how much of this was down to my mind and my brain. Was it really getting louder? Could that kind of sound really damage my ears further? Or was it the stress and downright fear of it all that is in fact the culprit here? I am under no illusion that loud sounds damage ears as my own ears are pretty ruined after years of abuse. I hear my tinnitus above everything, nothing will mask it. But again, could the power of the mind be unleashed to actually change all of that?

I read a lot of posts on here and notice a stark contrast between people who keep going, try to stay positive, eat healthy, exercise etc and those that are on the edge of suicidal despair. There is no doubt this is an awful condition and I still try to remain hopeful that things will get better.

 

[Vicki14]

I think when your tinnitus is unmaskable, as mine is too, we really need to unleash the power of our mind as it literally feels like sink or swim. What has been an invaluable source of reading for me is Joey Remini's Healing Tinnitus and Vertigo, an absolutely brilliant book which really helped me turn a corner and would highly recommend!

 

[SonOfUhtred]

I think when your tinnitus is unmaskable, as mine is too, we really need to unleash the power of our mind as it literally feels like sink or swim. What has been an invaluable source of reading for me is Joey Remini's Healing Tinnitus and Vertigo, an absolutely brilliant book which really helped me turn a corner and would highly recommend!

Hi Vicki,

Thanks for your reply and your recommendation, I've just looked it up and it looks really good. I will be making a purchase. Just things like this help to keep me on a more positive mindset.

 

[AnthonyMcDonald]

Hi all,

Have been on this forum for a long time but never posted.

I work in the construction industry which I guess is a tinnitus nightmare in itself. However, I am rarely around sounds louder than 90 dB and I always use my Peltor ear defenders onsite. I also try to take regular breaks, especially when using tools myself. Having a mortgage, family etc, it's hard for me to just get up and leave although I am on the lookout for a quieter job.

I was using a tool today which measured at 90 dB at machine level, around 75 dB at ear level. I was panicking, worrying it would make my tinnitus worse. I could feel the ringing getting louder and more intrusive as I was using it and have been concentrating on it ever since. I couldn't help but wonder how much of this was down to my mind and my brain. Was it really getting louder? Could that kind of sound really damage my ears further? Or was it the stress and downright fear of it all that is in fact the culprit here? I am under no illusion that loud sounds damage ears as my own ears are pretty ruined after years of abuse. I hear my tinnitus above everything, nothing will mask it. But again, could the power of the mind be unleashed to actually change all of that?

I read a lot of posts on here and notice a stark contrast between people who keep going, try to stay positive, eat healthy, exercise etc and those that are on the edge of suicidal despair. There is no doubt this is an awful condition and I still try to remain hopeful that things will get better.

Short answer - yes, it can damage your ears further. I strongly suggest a change in profession if you really don't want to get worse. This contrast you speak of is people with mild/moderate cases vs severe/catastrophic. I don't know what you mean by "power of the mind", but to me it sounds like malarkey.

I think when your tinnitus is unmaskable, as mine is too, we really need to unleash the power of our mind as it literally feels like sink or swim. What has been an invaluable source of reading for me is Joey Remini's Healing Tinnitus and Vertigo, an absolutely brilliant book which really helped me turn a corner and would highly recommend!

...You're not being serious, are you?

 

[emmalee]

I read a lot of posts on here and notice a stark contrast between people who keep going, try to stay positive, eat healthy, exercise etc and those that are on the edge of suicidal despair. There is no doubt this is an awful condition and I still try to remain hopeful that things will get better.

Keep your hope, @SonOfUhtred. Keep going, stay positive, eat healthy and exercise.

Suicidal despair is not for you.

 

[SonOfUhtred]

Short answer - yes, it can damage your ears further. I strongly suggest a change in profession if you really don't want to get worse. This contrast you speak of is people with mild/moderate cases vs severe/catastrophic. I don't know what you mean by "power of the mind", but to me it sounds like malarkey.

It's interesting as I woke up half an hour ago from a good sleep and feeling fairly positive. I know the ringing will always be here and I will forever have to be vigilant.

But as soon as I read your reply, the volume in my ear went up and has been since.

This time it can only be mental. I know I need to change professions and I will.

I notice from your avatar that you have 'the worst tinnitus in the world'. Well to me that sounds like malarkey.

 

[SonOfUhtred]

Keep your hope, @SonOfUhtred. Keep going, stay positive, eat healthy and exercise.

Suicidal despair is not for you.

Thanks emmalee. Don't get me wrong, I have more bad days than good but I have 3 young children who need me so I have no choice but to try my best and be positive. May we all find some kind of peace

 

[emmalee]

Short answer - yes, it can damage your ears further. I strongly suggest a change in profession if you really don't want to get worse. This contrast you speak of is people with mild/moderate cases vs severe/catastrophic. I don't know what you mean by "power of the mind", but to me it sounds like malarkey.

...You're not being serious, are you?

Don't be so quick to judge what may work for someone in their journey with tinnitus, @AnthonyMcDonald.

Seriously speaking, our minds are a very useful tool when dealing with tinnitus. It may not have the ability to physically lower the volume, but it can help us to cope.

Some may have low volume tinnitus which feels and sounds severe/catastrophic to them. Others may have severe/catastrophic tinnitus which they are able to accept. No-one hears another's tinnitus, this is a fact. Therefore no judgment is best. When it comes to coping with tinnitus, the word "malarkey" has no place. If something works and makes your life worth living again, then why on earth would it be considered malarkey?

There are coping strategies available, while a cure is not available.

At this moment I am enduring a severe spike. In the early days of my tinnitus, this would have destroyed me. Now, four years later, I am able to make my way through this episode, using coping techniques that have proved to be so very valuable to me.

 

[AnthonyMcDonald]

I notice from your avatar that you have 'the worst tinnitus in the world'. Well to me that sounds like malarkey.

Yeah, 15+ different tones minimum (the ones that I can count), ranging from 100-15,000 Hz, hissing, whooshing, rumbling, screeching, warbling, beeping, clicking, etc, etc.

Volume probably around 75-80 dB, can't hear my own/others voices over it. So yeah, I'd say I'm a tad bit worse than peope who have to focus on it for it to get "louder".

People like me are a bit beyond "being positive".

Don't be so quick to judge what may work for someone in their journey with tinnitus, @AnthonyMcDonald.

Seriously speaking, our minds are a very useful tool when dealing with tinnitus. It may not have the ability to physically lower the volume, but it can help us to cope.

Some may have low volume tinnitus which feels and sounds severe/catastrophic to them. Others may have severe/catastrophic tinnitus which they are able to accept. No-one hears another's tinnitus, this is a fact. Therefore no judgment is best. When it comes to coping with tinnitus, the word "malarkey" has no place. If something works and makes your life worth living again, then why on earth would it be considered malarkey?

There are coping strategies available, while a cure is not available.

At this moment I am enduring a severe spike. In the early days of my tinnitus, this would have destroyed me. Now, four years later, I am able to make my way through this episode, using coping techniques that have proved to be so very valuable to me.

From my experience people who preach positivity and meditation and other nonsense like that are almost always mild/moderate/stable, even if they say their tinnitus is "screaming". Whereas in some cases tinnitus can spike permanently from something like closing a door.

Hey, I'm glad it works for some people, but the fact that there's people who preach it as a "one size fits all" approach is ridiculous.

 

[MindOverMatter]

Seriously speaking, our minds are a very useful tool when dealing with tinnitus. It may not have the ability to physically lower the volume, but it can help us to cope.

Some may have low volume tinnitus which feels and sounds severe/catastrophic to them. Others may have severe/catastrophic tinnitus which they are able to accept. No-one hears another's tinnitus, this is a fact. Therefore no judgment is best. When it comes to coping with tinnitus, the word "malarkey" has no place. If something works and makes your life worth living again, then why on earth would it be considered malarkey?

There are coping strategies available, while a cure is not available.

Well put! Couldn't agree more.

 

[emmalee]

Hey, I'm glad it works for some people, but the fact that there's people who preach it as a "one size fits all" approach is ridiculous.

Thanks for not using the term "malarkey." "Ridiculous," though?

Nobody in this discussion referred to a "one size fits all" approach. Meditation, yoga, mindfulness, medications and talk therapy, etc. can all be used together. It is all about trial and error.

Thanks for your input, @AnthonyMcDonald. We are all entitled to an opinion and any discussion about tinnitus and coping or not coping is positive. This is how we learn, after all.

Yeah, 15+ different tones minimum (the ones that I can count), ranging from 100-15,000 Hz, hissing, whooshing, rumbling, screeching, warbling, beeping, clicking, etc, etc.

Volume probably around 75-80 dB, can't hear my own/others voices over it. So yeah, I'd say I'm a tad bit worse than peope who have to focus on it for it to get "louder".

People like me are a bit beyond "being positive".

Sorry that you have to deal with all of this, @AnthonyMcDonald. I can see how positivity can be a stretch for you.

 

[Lane]

Seriously speaking, our minds are a very useful tool when dealing with tinnitus.

Hi @emmalee -- Thanks for your thoughts on this thread. Are you by any chance familiar with the the following adage?

"The mind is a very good servant, but a very bad master".

 

[Mister Muso]

Mindfulness (not quite the same as "mind over matter") can certainly be a useful tool for managing mild/moderate or stable tinnitus. It can even reduce the actual perceived level of tinnitus in my experience.

What it can't do is reduce hyperacusis or reactiveness to noise that could cause spikes.

 

[SonOfUhtred]

Don't be so quick to judge what may work for someone in their journey with tinnitus, @AnthonyMcDonald.

Seriously speaking, our minds are a very useful tool when dealing with tinnitus. It may not have the ability to physically lower the volume, but it can help us to cope.

Some may have low volume tinnitus which feels and sounds severe/catastrophic to them. Others may have severe/catastrophic tinnitus which they are able to accept. No-one hears another's tinnitus, this is a fact. Therefore no judgment is best. When it comes to coping with tinnitus, the word "malarkey" has no place. If something works and makes your life worth living again, then why on earth would it be considered malarkey?

There are coping strategies available, while a cure is not available.

At this moment I am enduring a severe spike. In the early days of my tinnitus, this would have destroyed me. Now, four years later, I am able to make my way through this episode, using coping techniques that have proved to be so very valuable to me.

I am glad to hear that you are mentally stronger as time has gone by.

 

[SonOfUhtred]

Yeah, 15+ different tones minimum (the ones that I can count), ranging from 100-15,000 Hz, hissing, whooshing, rumbling, screeching, warbling, beeping, clicking, etc, etc.

Volume probably around 75-80 dB, can't hear my own/others voices over it. So yeah, I'd say I'm a tad bit worse than peope who have to focus on it for it to get "louder".

People like me are a bit beyond "being positive".

From my experience people who preach positivity and meditation and other nonsense like that are almost always mild/moderate/stable, even if they say their tinnitus is "screaming". Whereas in some cases tinnitus can spike permanently from something like closing a door.

Hey, I'm glad it works for some people, but the fact that there's people who preach it as a "one size fits all" approach is ridiculous.

I was going to come back with all the struggles with my tinnitus and also in my life but have decided against it. It's not a competition and I am not here for sympathy, rather for support and to speak to like minded people. Sounds like you have given up and that's your choice. Each to their own.

 

[SonOfUhtred]

Mindfulness (not quite the same as "mind over matter") can certainly be a useful tool for managing mild/moderate or stable tinnitus. It can even reduce the actual perceived level of tinnitus in my experience.

What it can't do is reduce hyperacusis or reactiveness to noise that could cause spikes.

I have a book on mindfulness that I have not properly delved into yet. I do have hyperacusis so it is interesting you say it cannot help with that. I am hoping sound enrichment will continue to help in some way. I guess mine is slightly better than it was a year ago. When you add kids into the mix, it's like trying to mix oil and water!

 

[emmalee]

Hi @emmalee -- Thanks for your thoughts on this thread. Are you by any chance familiar with the the following adage?

"The mind is a very good servant, but a very bad master".

You are welcome, @Lane, it is nice to hear from you, as always.

No, I have not heard this adage, unfortunately. May I ask what your thoughts are on it?

 

[emmalee]

I am glad to hear that you are mentally stronger as time has gone by.

Thank you, @SonOfUhtred. Also, thank you for this discussion, we can never get enough information. It is so important to share our experiences with tinnitus. Not everyone will always agree, yet the discussion is sorely needed.

 

[emmalee]

Well put! Couldn't agree more.

Thank you, @MindOverMatter. Your username is quite appropriate for this discussion.

 

[AnthonyMcDonald]

I was going to come back with all the struggles with my tinnitus and also in my life but have decided against it. It's not a competition and I am not here for sympathy, rather for support and to speak to like minded people. Sounds like you have given up and that's your choice. Each to their own.

Just saying, mild/moderate/stable people who preach positivity and mindfulness wouldn't last a day with what I have. I had moderate/stable tinnitus most of my life, it was easy as hell to get accustomed to. But, as you said, it's not a competition. If I had given up I'd be dead, so, not yet.

 

[SonOfUhtred]

Thank you, @SonOfUhtred. Also, thank you for this discussion, we can never get enough information. It is so important to share our experiences with tinnitus. Not everyone will always agree, yet the discussion is sorely needed.

Indeed. It's always good to talk, especially to like minded people. Long may it continue.

 

[SonOfUhtred]

Thank you, @MindOverMatter. Your username is quite appropriate for this discussion.

Ha, so true!

 

[Pitseleh]

Just saying, mild/moderate/stable people who preach positivity and mindfulness wouldn't last a day with what I have. I had moderate/stable tinnitus most of my life, it was easy as hell to get accustomed to. But, as you said, it's not a competition. If I had given up I'd be dead, so, not yet.

I'm sorry, but I believe you are wrong.

Actually, you say it yourself: "I had moderate tinnitus". And you also say "people with moderate tinnitus wouldn't last a day with what I have (now)". Well... didn't you have it moderate before it got loud? So... you lasted more than a day, didn't you?

You mention loads of tones (15, right ?) that you have and I am 100 % sure you have them in your ears and head 24/7. You range them 75 dB, unmaskable, louder than your voice.

I don't have 15 tones, I have 7/8. It's getting louder months after months, with no underlying medical condition. Most of the tones I have are unmaskable and raging 24/7 too. Some are louder than my own voice too and my spikes are always permanent. Driving 30 minutes spike me permanently. I had to modify everything in my existence to bear with tinnitus.

Yet, I'm in a better place mentally now than I was when I used to have moderate tinnitus 10 years ago (or even last years) because I finally learned to dissociate pain from emotion. It took years of practice, years of adapting what I loved in life. I had to renew myself, be a new person. I had to let go of the old me with moderate tinnitus.

I won't go into the details here, because that would mean talking A LOT about myself (as a hypnologist mostly, but not only) and the long journey to "mastering your mind".

I'm not saying I'm completely "there". Of course that would be nice to get a few things back I had to put aside due to severe and intrusive tinnitus. But I feel happy to be alive and I enjoy living.

 

[emmalee]

If I had given up I'd be dead, so, not yet.

You are stronger than you give yourself credit for, I feel.

Those who suffer with catastrophic tinnitus and continue on, doing their best to navigate through their lives, are so much stronger than they even realize. How could they be anything but?

I hope you never give up, @AnthonyMcDonald.

"Oh but that's the irony, broken people are not fragile."

 

[SonOfUhtred]

I'm sorry, but I believe you are wrong.

Actually, you say it yourself: "I had moderate tinnitus". And you also say "people with moderate tinnitus wouldn't last a day with what I have (now)". Well... didn't you have it moderate before it got loud? So... you lasted more than a day, didn't you?

You mention loads of tones (15, right ?) that you have and I am 100 % sure you have them in your ears and head 24/7. You range them 75 dB, unmaskable, louder than your voice.

I don't have 15 tones, I have 7/8. It's getting louder months after months, with no underlying medical condition. Most of the tones I have are unmaskable and raging 24/7 too. Some are louder than my own voice too and my spikes are always permanent. Driving 30 minutes spike me permanently. I had to modify everything in my existence to bear with tinnitus.

Yet, I'm in a better place mentally now than I was when I used to have moderate tinnitus 10 years ago (or even last years) because I finally learned to dissociate pain from emotion. It took years of practice, years of adapting what I loved in life. I had to renew myself, be a new person. I had to let go of the old me with moderate tinnitus.

I won't go into the details here, because that would mean talking A LOT about myself (as a hypnologist mostly, but not only) and the long journey to "mastering your mind".

I'm not saying I'm completely "there". Of course that would be nice to get a few things back I had to put aside due to severe and intrusive tinnitus. But I feel happy to be alive and I enjoy living.

What an incredible post. Just reading this has given me a massive boost of energy so to speak. You're an admirable person and I am so glad you have managed to get on with life and adapt to this cruel condition. I'm going to have an ice bath and raise a rum to you.

 

[Juan]

I was using a tool today which measured at 90 dB at machine level, around 75 dB at ear level. I was panicking, worrying it would make my tinnitus worse. I could feel the ringing getting louder and more intrusive as I was using it and have been concentrating on it ever since.

It sounds pretty bad. If I were you, I would stop using tools like that. In the long run, if you have hearing problems and work around noise, your hearing will get worse. An option is accepting that and keeping on doing your current job. Another option, as you said, is looking for another job.

If your tinnitus reacts to a certain sound, even wearing ear defenders, it means your ears are not happy around those decibel levels. There is not much more about it... it has nothing to do with being positive or not.

 

[UKBloke]

@DaveFromChicago posted a Hubert Lim video on the Lenire thread the other day. I clicked on the link but didn't watch much of it as I quickly realised I've seen enough of Lim for now. However, on the list of videos that YouTube offered up on the right hand side of the screen was the video below of Dr. Rahul Jandial in conversation with Lewis Howes.

Haven't yet managed to watch all of it but straight away there were some real eye-opening statements about things like neuroplasticity etc. I had a look around to see if this guy has been involved in any tinnitus research. It would seem he hasn't. Nevertheless, a lot of what he's talking about (like implanting mesh into the brain to read and correct malfunctioning neuronal firing in epilepsy for example) feeds into tinnitus research. Maybe there are some 'unleashing the power of the mind to manage tinnitus' elements to take away from it too.

 

[Chinmoku]

I'm sorry, but I believe you are wrong.

Actually, you say it yourself: "I had moderate tinnitus". And you also say "people with moderate tinnitus wouldn't last a day with what I have (now)". Well... didn't you have it moderate before it got loud? So... you lasted more than a day, didn't you?

You mention loads of tones (15, right ?) that you have and I am 100 % sure you have them in your ears and head 24/7. You range them 75 dB, unmaskable, louder than your voice.

I don't have 15 tones, I have 7/8. It's getting louder months after months, with no underlying medical condition. Most of the tones I have are unmaskable and raging 24/7 too. Some are louder than my own voice too and my spikes are always permanent. Driving 30 minutes spike me permanently. I had to modify everything in my existence to bear with tinnitus.

Yet, I'm in a better place mentally now than I was when I used to have moderate tinnitus 10 years ago (or even last years) because I finally learned to dissociate pain from emotion. It took years of practice, years of adapting what I loved in life. I had to renew myself, be a new person. I had to let go of the old me with moderate tinnitus.

I won't go into the details here, because that would mean talking A LOT about myself (as a hypnologist mostly, but not only) and the long journey to "mastering your mind".

I'm not saying I'm completely "there". Of course that would be nice to get a few things back I had to put aside due to severe and intrusive tinnitus. But I feel happy to be alive and I enjoy living.

I'm really impressed by your story. I have a similar situation, I'm worsening very often permanently but I'm not wired to find it tolerable. I have an insane broadband electric scream that is almost unbearable and getting worse. I'm quite incapacitated, so probably we are wired differently. I did try CBT and Mindfulness rigorously but they didn't help.

May I ask you if you are still on Clonazepam? I didn't manage to stay off after the taper.

 

[Pitseleh]

I'm really impressed by your story. I have a similar situation, I'm worsening very often permanently but I'm not wired to find it tolerable. I have an insane broadband electric scream that is almost unbearable and getting worse. I'm quite incapacitated, so probably we are wired differently. I did try CBT and Mindfulness rigorously but they didn't help.

May I ask you if you are still on Clonazepam? I didn't manage to stay off after the taper.

I've been off Clonazepam for 1 year now. The hardest part was when I was somewhere between 0.3 mg and 0.5 mg. After that, it was easy to go lower until I couldn't titrate more.

The only thing I can say about it is that it is an amazing molecule if you take it on rare occasions, as it works wonders and it should stay like this.

When you get addicted to it, as you are and I was during 5 years, the only effect you get is possible depression but worse, unfightable suicidal thoughts.

I only realized that a few months after I quit. Suicidal thoughts just vanished. My tinnitus condition wasn't better, but my mental state became different.

I believe the magic lies somewhere in between "mastering your mind" and using medication in a very cautious and strategic way. I haven't used any benzo since I quit Rivotril (Clonazepam), but I still have a few Valium pills somewhere in the house. I should give them a try once in a while, to see if, combined with an OK state of mind, they do help reduce the volume.

CBT and Mindfulness I don't precisely know how they work, I work with hypnosis.

 

[Chinmoku]

I've been off Clonazepam for 1 year now. The hardest part was when I was somewhere between 0.3 mg and 0.5 mg. After that, it was easy to go lower until I couldn't titrate more.

The only thing I can say about it is that it is an amazing molecule if you take it on rare occasions, as it works wonders and it should stay like this.

When you get addicted to it, as you are and I was during 5 years, the only effect you get is possible depression but worse, unfightable suicidal thoughts.

I only realized that a few months after I quit. Suicidal thoughts just vanished. My tinnitus condition wasn't better, but my mental state became different.

I believe the magic lies somewhere in between "mastering your mind" and using medication in a very cautious and strategic way. I haven't used any benzo since I quit Rivotril (Clonazepam), but I still have a few Valium pills somewhere in the house. I should give them a try once in a while, to see if, combined with an OK state of mind, they do help reduce the volume.

CBT and Mindfulness I don't precisely know how they work, I work with hypnosis.

Thanks for this. I tried hypnosis too in the early stages, with a very experienced hypnotherapist. After 20 sessions zero benefits so I left. I trusted him and abandoned myself to the process but no improvement. Do you apply hypnosis to yourself? Is all hypnosis self-hypnosis? I wish I could use it effectively. The fact that our cognitive mind is a tiny percentage of our brain activity is fascinating.