Voluntary Assisted Dying / Euthanasia for Tinnitus Patients (Pegasos Swiss Association, Switzerland)

[TheDanishGirl]

@TheDanishGirl, have you heard about Svend Lings? I'm considering calling him.

Yep. I am following his work. He doesn't seem to be able to help with anything other than the manual on which drugs are effective for self-euthanasia, and that doesn't help much imo, because you still need a doctor to prescribe these medications and I think that would be impossible in most cases by far. As far as I know he cannot prescribe them to a person. I appreciate the man and his dedication to this subject though.

Just to make things clear. I am not wanting to go at this moment. I just want my exit plan ready, because I know tinnitus and hyperacusis are damn unpredictable and it can turn your life into a living hell from one moment to the next, so I want to prepare myself and have my exit plan ready at hand, if a disaster were to happen.

 

[TheDanishGirl]

I never asked them about that. We just sent the application and we attached the required documents / information. However, I remember they mentioned in their website that if VAD was not approved or even cancelled for whatever reason, you got the deposit back but they might charge you a fee. And I'm convinced fees out there are not cheap ones.

That's understandable. I think there must be a fee if rejected, but I am wondering how much it is. I guess I can contact them about that.

 

[danielthor]

Just to make things clear. I am not wanting to go at this moment. I just want my exit plan ready, because I know tinnitus and hyperacusis are damn unpredictable and it can turn your life into a living hell from one moment to the next, so I want to prepare myself and have my exit plan ready at hand, if a disaster were to happen.

Same.

 

[Pau Marti]

That's understandable. I think there must be a fee if rejected, but I am wondering how much it is. I guess I can contact them about that.

Check out their website, all the details should be shown there. The fee might differ depending on each case though.

 

[Pau Marti]

@TheDanishGirl, agreed. That's the thing. It's so unpredictable, so cruel, so unexpected, so unforgiving... I truly understand what you mean with this. Hope you get better.

@danielthor, i hope you get better too.

Regards.

 

[TheDanishGirl]

Another thing that worries me in terms of getting approved for VAD at Pegasos is what medical files they require.

I think tinnitus and hyperacusis are hardly mentioned, other than in very short sentences on my medical files. I haven't traveled around the world and gone to several doctors looking for treatment as that's kinda impossible with my kind of hyperacusis. I went to a hearing therapist for just therapeutic conversation (they didn't offer me any actual treatment), and there just isn't any tinnitus/hyperacusis experts I can go to in my country, who can properly assess my case and how much of a negative impact this has on my life.

My medical files, on the other hand, has a lot of writings about my mental illness throughout the years: depression, anxiety and a personality disorder. I am afraid that would work against my case for applying for the reasons of tinnitus and hyperacusis as nobody would be able to tell how much it's affecting me from looking at my medical files.

 

[Pau Marti]

Another thing that worries me in terms of getting approved for VAD at Pegasos is what medical files they require.

I think tinnitus and hyperacusis are hardly mentioned, other than in very short sentences on my medical files. I haven't traveled around the world and gone to several doctors looking for treatment as that's kinda impossible with my kind of hyperacusis. I went to a hearing therapist for just therapeutic conversation (they didn't offer me any actual treatment), and there just isn't any tinnitus/hyperacusis experts I can go to in my country, who can properly assess my case and how much of a negative impact this has on my life.

My medical files, on the other hand, has a lot of writings about my mental illness throughout the years: depression, anxiety and a personality disorder. I am afraid that would work against my case for applying for the reasons of tinnitus and hyperacusis as nobody would be able to tell how much it's affecting me from looking at my medical files.

I completely understand your concerns on the subject. However, you shouldn´t be too worried and I'm going to explain you why. As I mentioned before, medical files, albeit necessary, will not determine the final outcome in case you apply for VAD. They might work and be useful as a backup as long as they support your claims in terms of how debilitating your condition is, how badly you are suffering and how terrible your life has become since the initial onset. Not all medical files reflect that but it would be interesting and really helpful to gather at least one document providing clear evidence that you are suffering tinnitus & hyperacusis since xxxx and other one (recent one, preferably), attesting you are still enduring such awful conditions and how are you doing / coping at the minute.

They really know there´s no cure for tinnitus and they are completely aware of how debilitating, torturous and implacable this nasty condition is. They have already helped tinnitus sufferers. Therefore they do not need a huge amount of medical reports redounding and overemphasizing on the condition. They need to know how you are being affected by those (tinnitus & hyperacusis) and medical reports might fall short to objectively transmit that. One of the things that touched me deep inside and had a profound effect on me was when one of their members told me that he cried when he read the details written by my brother when we submitted the VAD application. We couldn´t gather a great deal of reports though, and I'm still convinced that those sent to them hardly played a crucial role in the whole process. Given the fact that both your tinnitus & hyperacusis are taking a huge toll on you and in every single aspect of your life, you´ll be the only one capable of transmitting and reflecting that to them.

Definitely those reports on depression, anxiety and personality disorder will be detrimental in case you apply for VAD... and they even might reject it right off the bat, keep that in mind.

I hope you fully recover. I do not encourage applying for VAD but I feel compelled to provide as much information on this subject in case someone makes a decisive move and goes for it. I've just stumbled this threads by sheer luck and I couldn´t help but reflect my thoughts on this.

We didn´t know the existence of Tinnitus Talk either and I gotta admit there´s vital and useful information that I wished I had known earlier. I got emotional reading several posts as well. Hope I have clarified some points here.

Nice regards.

 

[TheDanishGirl]

I completely understand your concerns on the subject. However, you shouldn´t be too worried and I'm going to explain you why. As I mentioned before, medical files, albeit necessary, will not determine the final outcome in case you apply for VAD. They might work and be useful as a backup as long as they support your claims in terms of how debilitating your condition is, how badly you are suffering and how terrible your life has become since the initial onset. Not all medical files reflect that but it would be interesting and really helpful to gather at least one document providing clear evidence that you are suffering tinnitus & hyperacusis since xxxx and other one (recent one, preferably), attesting you are still enduring such awful conditions and how are you doing / coping at the minute.

They really know there´s no cure for tinnitus and they are completely aware of how debilitating, torturous and implacable this nasty condition is. They have already helped tinnitus sufferers. Therefore they do not need a huge amount of medical reports redounding and overemphasizing on the condition. They need to know how you are being affected by those (tinnitus & hyperacusis) and medical reports might fall short to objectively transmit that. One of the things that touched me deep inside and had a profound effect on me was when one of their members told me that he cried when he read the details written by my brother when we submitted the VAD application. We couldn´t gather a great deal of reports though, and I'm still convinced that those sent to them hardly played a crucial role in the whole process. Given the fact that both your tinnitus & hyperacusis are taking a huge toll on you and in every single aspect of your life, you´ll be the only one capable of transmitting and reflecting that to them.

Definitely those reports on depression, anxiety and personality disorder will be detrimental in case you apply for VAD... and they even might reject it right off the bat, keep that in mind.

I hope you fully recover. I do not encourage applying for VAD but I feel compelled to provide as much information on this subject in case someone makes a decisive move and goes for it. I've just stumbled this threads by sheer luck and I couldn´t help but reflect my thoughts on this.

We didn´t know the existence of Tinnitus Talk either and I gotta admit there´s vital and useful information that I wished I had known earlier. I got emotional reading several posts as well. Hope I have clarified some points here.

Nice regards.

I can't tell you how much I appreciate you taking the time to share you experience with Pegasos. Means more than you can imagine.

 

[rogerlee]

Having said that, after my own experience, I would definitely discourage anyone to act on these thoughts, as there's always a chance of achieving some compromise with the situation, it does take years though and having the distant thought of a "way out option" actually can help people calm down and not do anything impulsive on their own.

Hi, how did you get through the initial stage and did you try any helpful treatment or remedies?

 

[Johan001]

Hi, how did you get through the initial stage and did you try any helpful treatment or remedies?

Living day by day really. Lots of masking and anti-anxiety stuff, from meds to supplements. I benefit from hearing aids, but it's a complete package. I am still taking lots of anti-anxiety supplements.

 

[Daniel Lion]

Living day by day really. Lots of masking and anti-anxiety stuff, from meds to supplements. I benefit from hearing aids, but it's a complete package. I am still taking lots of anti-anxiety supplements.

Hi @Johan001,
can you recommend or let me know what kinds of supplements or drugs help with your anxiety?

Thanks,
Daniel

 

[Johan001]

Hi @Johan001,
can you recommend or let me know what kinds of supplements or drugs help with your anxiety?

Thanks,
Daniel

Hey Daniel,

As far as the pharmaceuticals are concerned, I can honestly say none have really helped me. Even benzos, which surprised me. Apparently the anxiety was too high.

I have tried pretty much everything I could find in herbal shops, but what did help was:

- high doses of Inositol. About 14 grams I believe daily. There's a link to a medical study on Inositol on this forum and it actually did have an effect on me.

- L-Theanine is my standard supplement. I sometimes exceed the daily limit of 400 mg but it helps. I only take extra when I'm very anxious.

- Valerian for sleep. Either in pill form or liquid.

- L-Tryptophan for sleep. Not sure if it helps massively, but I just take it regardless, as a routine. My sleep is much better though than a year ago, I'm not sleep deprived.

- Agar-35 helps me too. It's a Tibetan herb and there was a whole thread on it on this forum too.

When I have elevated anxiety, I then take high dosages of L-Theanine and Valerian.

This is probably not really much, but I've selected those because they help me personally.

Hope you find your remedies too.

 

[Daniel Lion]

Hey Daniel,

As far as the pharmaceuticals are concerned, I can honestly say none have really helped me. Even benzos, which surprised me. Apparently the anxiety was too high.

I have tried pretty much everything I could find in herbal shops, but what did help was:

- high doses of Inositol. About 14 grams I believe daily. There's a link to a medical study on Inositol on this forum and it actually did have an effect on me.

- L-Theanine is my standard supplement. I sometimes exceed the daily limit of 400 mg but it helps. I only take extra when I'm very anxious.

- Valerian for sleep. Either in pill form or liquid.

- L-Tryptophan for sleep. Not sure if it helps massively, but I just take it regardless, as a routine. My sleep is much better though than a year ago, I'm not sleep deprived.

- Agar-35 helps me too. It's a Tibetan herb and there was a whole thread on it on this forum too.

When I have elevated anxiety, I then take high dosages of L-Theanine and Valerian.

This is probably not really much, but I've selected those because they help me personally.

Hope you find your remedies too.

Hi @Johan001, thanks for getting back to me. I appreciate the advice!

You take care of yourself and it will be nice when we cross paths on the forum again.

Hugs,
Daniel

 

[Johan001]

Hi @Johan001, thanks for getting back to me. I appreciate the advice!

You take care of yourself and it will be nice when we cross paths on the forum again.

Hugs,
Daniel

Thanks Daniel, likewise. Hope you get better soon!

 

[pleasejuststop]

How much documentation is needed for Pegasos? I'm applying with both tinnitus and a disease that keeps me from walking. I have lots of records but most of them involve my history of mental illness. Only a few don't mention it. I'm very young so I can't risk being denied. I can't walk so I have no other way out.

 

[Frayact]

Check out a documentary on YouTube called "The Suicide Tourist."

 

[Pau Marti]

How much documentation is needed for Pegasos? I'm applying with both tinnitus and a disease that keeps me from walking. I have lots of records but most of them involve my history of mental illness. Only a few don't mention it. I'm very young so I can't risk being denied. I can't walk so I have no other way out.

First of all, I feel so sorry for all the awful conditions you are enduring and for all the suffering. Tinnitus alone can be incredibly debilitating so I truly understand your current situation in which you are seriously considering applying for VAD. Think thoroughly about that. How long have you been suffering tinnitus?

Age in your case might be a factor and your parents' consent might be needed as well. Forget about those medical records involving your mental illnesses. Being young and sending those records won't help at all and your chances will be extremely low. Send those medical records strictly related to tinnitus (onset, diagnosis, severity, hearing loss, etc) and the other condition. In case they need more documents they'll let you know.

Wishing all the best.

 

[pleasejuststop]

First of all, I feel so sorry for all the awful conditions you are enduring and for all the suffering. Tinnitus alone can be incredibly debilitating so I truly understand your current situation in which you are seriously considering applying for VAD. Think thoroughly about that. How long have you been suffering tinnitus?

Age in your case might be a factor and your parents' consent might be needed as well. Forget about those medical records involving your mental illnesses. Being young and sending those records won't help at all and your chances will be extremely low. Send those medical records strictly related to tinnitus (onset, diagnosis, severity, hearing loss, etc) and the other condition. In case they need more documents they'll let you know.

Wishing all the best.

I'm trying to figure out how many records I need. I emailed them, waiting for a response.

 

[Ela Stefan]

Hey Daniel,

As far as the pharmaceuticals are concerned, I can honestly say none have really helped me. Even benzos, which surprised me. Apparently the anxiety was too high.

I have tried pretty much everything I could find in herbal shops, but what did help was:

- high doses of Inositol. About 14 grams I believe daily. There's a link to a medical study on Inositol on this forum and it actually did have an effect on me.

- L-Theanine is my standard supplement. I sometimes exceed the daily limit of 400 mg but it helps. I only take extra when I'm very anxious.

- Valerian for sleep. Either in pill form or liquid.

- L-Tryptophan for sleep. Not sure if it helps massively, but I just take it regardless, as a routine. My sleep is much better though than a year ago, I'm not sleep deprived.

- Agar-35 helps me too. It's a Tibetan herb and there was a whole thread on it on this forum too.

When I have elevated anxiety, I then take high dosages of L-Theanine and Valerian.

This is probably not really much, but I've selected those because they help me personally.

Hope you find your remedies too.

Do they help in making your tinnitus lower, please?

 

[Johan001]

Do they help in making your tinnitus lower, please?

I don't think so, in terms of volume, but hearing aids definitely helped me.

 

[Meliora]

Did anyone here recently apply for VAD or is in the process of doing so?

 

[momus]

Trust me, I thought about this when I first got my tinnitus. Even bought a book and joined what is called The Hemlock Society. Unfortunately, all their methods were pretty awful and not at all reliable. This was before there was assisted suicide.

So that's the good news, I didn't do that and the tinnitus volume eventually went down. Or I got acclimated to it, same thing. I've told this story here before but it bears repeating. The Cliff Notes version is: as I was considering this subject for what seemed like the 100th time, I walked over a small bridge that had water running under it, and for the first time since I got the tinnitus I didn't hear it!

That's still my method, masking it w/ sounds. I have a fan by me right now, and if my tinnitus is really bothering me I always bring it into the bedroom. A small room A/C works better, the sound is more complex and you don't have to turn it on Cold, just have the fan run. A little waterfall in a home or apt is another good way to mask it. Otherwise, stay busy, and get outside as much as possible even if it means moving to a warmer climate. Everything in my life sorta centers on keeping it under control, and I'm sure I'm not the only one that does this.

Coming here or talking about it makes it more noticeable though.

 

[Meliora]

Trust me, I thought about this when I first got my tinnitus. Even bought a book and joined what is called The Hemlock Society. Unfortunately, all their methods were pretty awful and not at all reliable. This was before there was assisted suicide.

So that's the good news, I didn't do that and the tinnitus volume eventually went down. Or I got acclimated to it, same thing. I've told this story here before but it bears repeating. The Cliff Notes version is: as I was considering this subject for what seemed like the 100th time, I walked over a small bridge that had water running under it, and for the first time since I got the tinnitus I didn't hear it!

That's still my method, masking it w/ sounds. I have a fan by me right now, and if my tinnitus is really bothering me I always bring it into the bedroom. A small room A/C works better, the sound is more complex and you don't have to turn it on Cold, just have the fan run. A little waterfall in a home or apt is another good way to mask it. Otherwise, stay busy, and get outside as much as possible even if it means moving to a warmer climate. Everything in my life sorta centers on keeping it under control, and I'm sure I'm not the only one that does this.

Coming here or talking about it makes it more noticeable though.

I don't need your patronizing attitude, making this about yourself and pretending to know better when you literally don't know anything about me or my situation.

As you can see, this is not a thread started by me where I tell my story and ask for emotional support regarding a decision to apply for VAD.

If you can't help your drive to "save desperate souls", I suggest you find appropriate posts/threads for doing so if that's what's pleasing you.

In my case you don't know anything about me and all I am asking is having someone tell me if they are also in the process with a VAD application to clarify some formalities, not to discuss about motivation, reasons etc.

I hope it's more clear now.

 

[BrysonKingMe]

I don't need your patronizing attitude, making this about yourself and pretending to know better when you literally don't know anything about me or my situation.

As you can see, this is not a thread started by me where I tell my story and ask for emotional support regarding a decision to apply for VAD.

If you can't help your drive to "save desperate souls", I suggest you find appropriate posts/threads for doing so if that's what's pleasing you.

In my case you don't know anything about me and all I am asking is having someone tell me if they are also in the process with a VAD application to clarify some formalities, not to discuss about motivation, reasons etc.

I hope it's more clear now.

God forbid someone tries to help you and talk you out of suicide!

You can easily find all of this information on their website or by emailing them. I suggest you do that instead of jumping down someone's throat here.

 

[tpj]

@Meliora, people here only mean well but your point is taken.

 

[just1morething]

I don't need your patronizing attitude, making this about yourself and pretending to know better when you literally don't know anything about me or my situation.

As you can see, this is not a thread started by me where I tell my story and ask for emotional support regarding a decision to apply for VAD.

If you can't help your drive to "save desperate souls", I suggest you find appropriate posts/threads for doing so if that's what's pleasing you.

In my case you don't know anything about me and all I am asking is having someone tell me if they are also in the process with a VAD application to clarify some formalities, not to discuss about motivation, reasons etc.

I hope it's more clear now.

Sorry you are in a such a bad state of mind. I have TMJ & cervical spine issues as well. I did have my left TMJ fixed with a stomach fat transfer. I have upcoming injections to my C2 & C3 area to see if that helps with my tinnitus. Pain and noise is not a good combination to have.

 

[Meliora]

God forbid someone tries to help you and talk you out of suicide!

You can easily find all of this information on their website or by emailing them. I suggest you do that instead of jumping down someone's throat here.

1. I posted questions about the application for "voluntary assisted dying" not the broad term "suicide".
2. No, some information cannot be found online, that's why I'm asking here and people who have applied know what I am talking about.
3. I haven't jumped on anyone's throat. I have asked for information. If I needed support I would have posted in the "Suicidal" thread.

Sorry you are in a such a bad state of mind. I have TMJ & cervical spine issues as well. I did have my left TMJ fixed with a stomach fat transfer. I have upcoming injections to my C2 & C3 area to see if that helps with my tinnitus. Pain and noise is not a good combination to have.

I'm sorry you have to deal with all of these issues. It's a nightmare. I hope the injections will help you.

 

[RCP1]

I am approaching my 10-year anniversary with tinnitus. It has been a long decade. I have had a blast in that decade. I travelled the world, watched my daughter grow up and graduate. I made many new friends and had wonderful nights out and vacations.

I knew from the beginning of onset that it was only a question of when, not if, the journey and the party ended.

During that time I have had multiple spikes but managed to ride them out or accept the new worsening. I have extremely reactive tinnitus and it is affected by all noise. I have good dental hygiene and have not needed to see a dentist for 10 years. Knowing that any drilling would push me over the edge in terms of a worsening, I have lived the last 10 years like a man squeezing a tube of toothpaste for every last drop. I have truly had a wonderful 10 years despite all the tinnitus goings on. I love my wife to bits, my mother, my 14-year-old son and 22-year-old daughter.

The initial target was to get my daughter to 18 when she would have completed her schooling. That was a huge target of 6 years when this started. I didn't think there was a chance I could make it but I did and she not only finished school but also college and is settled with her boyfriend now. So I exceeded my original target.

Last week when I was paying for coffee in a coffee shop, the coffee machine they were using let out a huge sound and blew my ear out fully. The tinnitus has shot up around 300% louder and the reactivity has increased. I instinctively know that my run has come to an end now.

I have no energy left to fight this disease and I am grateful for the 10 years I had to say goodbye to my loved ones. I will give this a couple of months and then make an appointment with Pegasos if things don't improve. My wife has said she wants me to do this as opposed to jumping in the river or hanging myself. I am wondering now, although sad, that maybe this could be a happy dignified end to a gentleman that did his best and tried his hardest to stay around for as long as he could for his family and friends. It sure feels like the end of the road now but as I said, I always knew it was only a matter of time and to be honest I am amazed I made it this far.

I am writing this here as you are aware, no one understands this condition apart from the afflicted. That is my testament.

With love to you all,
Rob

 

[Jammer]

I've considered this as a means to end suffering as well. But just the thought of air travel to Pegasos has inhibited my desire.

I'm now planning to die of my resistive blood pressure or kidney disease, whichever occurs first. Not a good way to go for me, but we'll all get there in the end.

 

[Pinhead]

I wish there were public statistics for this. Of course, presented in a way that respected those who chose this path. I think that having a metric for how many choose this option because of tinnitus would be helpful in framing just how insufferable it can be.