What's Your Opinion on Assisted Suicide?

[awbw8]

Hi @NiNyu. Yes, I understand, and did think of what you said when you referred to "getting the picture." If a terminal patient is not suffering, then I would be very happy for them, though I can't imagine that many terminally ill patients experience an especially peaceful or painless death at the end.

I said I think it should be for terminally ill patients because there is no hope of recovery for them. A patient with T, no matter how unhappy, has hope, they have time and with time, change can happen. Change that the person cannot necessarily see in the depth of their suffering. As you said, "ending yourself is freakin' hard" and I think it should be, it is a big deal, especially when you are technically full of life.

This is all just my opinion, ours seem to differ, but I do not imagine my opinion is going to have much bearing on whether or not T or anything else becomes approved for assisted suicide.


@Craig in Cali

I am not sure comparing the right to eat and the right to die really works. You can be prevented from eating in numerous ways, but in almost any circumstance, you can kill yourself. Also, assisted suicide is legal in some states, you have to take the medication which would kill you, yourself - the "assistance" is the doctor giving you the lethal drugs. I think that should be available in every state. (This is the assisted suicide to which I was referring, not the person A helps person B.) I actually do not have a problem with that being legalized (with proper regulations around it) in the same way assisted suicide is legal in Oregon. It is the "for what conditions" that I question.

How do we quantify the suffering? How long is long enough? Do they have to have a terminal illness, really, or can they just have some horrible neuropathy?

I think what you stated there is exactly the problem with allowing T on the "assisted suicide" list. If you're saying we should just offer assisted suicide to everyone, no matter what, then that's another thing, but otherwise, what makes T more worthy than depression etc. or are they both adequate reasons? People commit suicide over both.

Finally, I certainly do not propose that anyone be forced to live - no one is. Anyone may end their life at any moment and, thought I do not like to say it, it's not that hard or necessarily painful to do. I do not like the idea of having assisted suicide as an option for someone experiencing suffering that could be temporary. As you said above, "how do we quantify the suffering? How long is enough?" If someone who is depressed and wants to die, but otherwise has nothing wrong asks for assisted suicide, then do they get it? What are the qualifications? Is it still this person's right to die? Yes, but should a doctor have to help them do it? I am not sure. I have to imagine from a doctor's perspective, writing a script for death weighs heavily.

I acknowledge the complexity of the issue and I do not claim my opinion is right or better than anyone else's. I do not want to force anyone to live and I cannot, happily. It is simply that, for me, when I think of the issue, the greatest divide is between those who have time, and those who do not have time. A terminal patient has done everything that can be done, literally, death is coming, soon, and that is it. They may not want it, but it is around the corner. Someone with T, someone with depression or whatever other non-terminal condition, has time, has options, has hope for change. No doctor can look at them and say without question that they will never feel better. That is the difference for me.

What I wrote are just my feelings, I am in no way looking to get into an argument with anyone or get anyone heated. I didn't realize I wrote such an especially controversial post. I was just sharing my own, personal opinion as part of the conversation. My views are not set in stone forever, I am exploring this issue as I write about it - polite, respectful conversation is how changes of mind and of reality, happen.

For the record, if assisted suicide were legalized for T tomorrow, I wouldn't necessarily be happy about it, but I wouldn't stand in anyone's way either - which I think is a difference from what you seem to have read in my post.


*I do have to add one amendment to this: If someone is actually physically incapable of ending their own life, who truly wants to die (someone who is irrevocably paralyzed, for example) then I absolutely think they should be able to have some assist them, as, essentially, their right to die has been taken away by their circumstance.

 

[Craig in Cali]

@awbw8

You go back to the fact that anyone can kill themselves anytime: "in almost any circumstance". That really isn't true, especially if you want a painless way and guarantee you'll be dead...not just end up in a coma or with destroyed livers. I'll let Wikipedia take it from here:

"Nonfatal suicide attempts can result in serious injury. 300,000 (or more) Americans survive a suicide attempt each year. People who attempt hanging and survive or charcoal grill carbon monoxide poisoning can face permanent brain damage due to cerebral anoxia. People who take an overdose and survive can face severe organ damage (e.g., liver failure). Individuals who jump from a bridge and survive may face the rupture of multiple organs and severe damage to the spine. While a majority sustain injuries that allow them to be released following emergency room treatment, a significant minority—about 116,000—are hospitalized, of whom 110,000 are eventually discharged alive. Their average hospital stay is 10 days and the average cost is $15,000. Some 19,000, (17%) of these people are permanently disabled, restricted in their ability to work, each year, at a cost of $127,000 per person.[9]"

Freedom to get assistance can offer painlessness and simple relief knowing that, if things get too difficult to cope, you can leave peacefully.

 

[awbw8]

@Craig in Cali

I did not say anyone can end their life in almost any circumstance painlessly, but that it can be done. I stand by that.

I do not enjoy talking about how easy it is to die or not. Suffice to say it is certainly possible to end one's life, certainly, in many ways, not all of them necessarily painful. For those who "fail", consider that many who attempt suicide are not 100% intent on dying and many who survive are later glad they lived. Some attempt suicide, change their minds and try desperately to save themselves in the midst of the attempt. This is why I have a cautious stance on the issue. It is very, very complex and very sad.

That said, picking at this particular sentence in my last post seems a bit beside my point. It's not about whether or not someone can physically die, it's when it is ethical to "assist" and for whom? I think those are more interesting and difficult questions to ponder.

 

[Craig in Cali]

@awbw8

Let us hope these are just philosophical chats and neither of us has to make real considerations of such a thing. Good luck with your healing. Here's to better hearing.

 

[awbw8]

@Craig in Cali

You, too, Craig. It's a chilling topic. Here's to good health and healing for all of us here and gratitude for the support this place has provided.

 

[Ricky81]

Sorry for your troubles christian78. Wish we could all help you.

 

[Christian78]

Anyone who is alone in this world is then not harming anyone by committing suicide. However anyone who has close friends or close relatives ie parents or siblings aunts uncles cousins with whom they are in touch --then is indeed hurting someone if he or she commits suicide.
Remember that even if the person or persons left behind agree to the act of suicide of their relative or friend, they are still left with the emotional damage of the act and will carry it with them for the rest of their lives.

That is all I think about it apart from deep deep sadness to read christians post and urge him to re think his decision -- please.

Does this means that simple as it is , one should live in pain and torture because my parents are alive, so i should amuse them with my wretched life so they feel ok while i stay in pain. One has to have to know i have progressive tinnitus, that is is i got is from Wellbutrin, then after 8 months 200% worsening from either very low dosage of Lyrica or 800 slow release of Ibuprofen, and last is feb worsening up some 30% that is huge ao all of before because i got corticosteroids shut in backside (one whom many like Markku got better for some short time) i got worsening.

So NOW my doctor can not give me anything because she is afraid anything will worsen condition where i walk on silverlining and anything can trigger worsening. So i am actually just waiting for a day i might get kidney stone as i do have them and i get stronger pain killer and i get new tinnitus.

So do you i have to live to entertain my parents.

NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!

Those who want to entertain their parent can do it. As my friend said to me last night what would he do if his brother was tormented and tortured and tied to bed so he does not hurt himself he would personally go and relieve him of his torture, and his brother is person he loves the most.

I wish i had hiv or cancer, man can be even blind and have peace, or deaf i would accept it, tinnitus is too much for me, i would like to have 2 years of life and just to wanish, but as situation is i would just like to go away.

and yes I am applying for assisted suicide

Dear Mr Davidson


Thank you for your e-mail and your interest in Dignitas. Attached please find our brochure as a pdf-file. Please read it carefully, thank you.

You can find the pre-requisites for an assisted suicide on page 6 of the attached brochure.

Please, be aware that with the only diagnosis "Tinnitus" you might not get the provisional Green Light for an assisted suicide. Even if we can understand that this is unbearable; we never find a doctor who prescribes the lethal medication for a patient who "just" has as diagnosis Tinnitus. Sorry, we are being honest with you.

Yours sincerely

----------------------------------------

Dignitas

To live with dignity

To die with dignity

 

[Brianna]

Christian78: Up goes the roar in my head and you were painfully aware this might happen. I think it's ludicrous and while not in your shoes, I have an enormous amount of sadness, pain, and empathy for you. I am so very sorry. This is where those of us who are sympathetic with your situation wrap our energy around you and likely cry together.

 

[NiNyu]

Fair, I can't imagine that many T patients experience an especially peaceful or painless death at the end either. Also, I would be very happy if a T patient is not suffering 24/7. Unfortunately those with extreme T do.

Is there really hope of recovery for T sufferers?
You could ask those who have been suffering for years (10, 20, 30 or 50 years).

There are plenty of terminally ill patients technically full of life. Are they all happy, I doubt it. For what it's worth, I talked to a kidney dysfunctional patient who's suffering greatly of pain (waiting for a donor). He pops plenty of opiates, but he also has breaks.
When I first told him about T he took aback in total disbelieve that there is absolutely nothing to treat this ailment. I did open his eyes. Learning about T totally changed his mindset. He told me that he thought his ailment was fuc*ed up and the worst you could get, but know being aware of T he is utterly grateful that he does not have to suffer an ailment like this.

I told him I'd love to trade with him. He declined.

No, no your voice about euthanasia is as important as any other! Certainly, we can agree to disagree but think about it your attitude would exclude people that do suffer, which doesn't mean that every T patient is suffering 24/7 -- same for terminally ill patients.

We are all human beings and how can we judge the pain and misery of our fellow men objectively? And how many false diagnoses have been made were people somehow miraculously recovered from their terminal disease?

what makes T more worthy than depression etc. or are they both adequate reasons? People commit suicide over both.

T is a physical ailment whereas depression is a mental ailment, which can be treated easily with psychology. Hence killing yourself due to depression is a little bit shortsighted 'cause there is hope. We should differentiate between mental and physical ailments. Unfortunately most incompetent doctors regard T as a mental issue -- 'cause it's brain related. So if I put a bullet into someones skull it might be a mental thing for some doctors.

*I do have to add one amendment to this: If someone is actually physically incapable of ending their own life, who truly wants to die (someone who is irrevocably paralyzed, for example) then I absolutely think they should be able to have some assist them, as, essentially, their right to die has been taken away by their circumstance.

I like that statement of you. And I totally agree!

 

[NiNyu]

Please, be aware that with the only diagnosis "Tinnitus" you might not get the provisional Green Light for an assisted suicide. Even if we can understand that this is unbearable; we never find a doctor who prescribes the lethal medication for a patient who "just" has as diagnosis Tinnitus. Sorry, we are being honest with you.

Yours sincerely
----------------------------------------
Dignitas

This is just a slap in the face. 'Just' diagnosed with T.. that shows how uneducated most doctors are.
Probably they never find a doctor who prescribes the lethal medication for a patient suffering extreme T because those doctors usually have offed themselves already.

 

[Brianna]

We should differentiate between mental and physical ailments.

If I mess this up, I know you'll correct me. Depression and anxiety can and do create physical ailments. I noticed that for the first time when I was 13 years old and dreading going to a doctor - my back was in spasms. I went and I was okay and was amazed at what my anxiety did to me. I could go on giving personal examples but I'll stop. In that sense T, anxiety, and depression create physical ailments.

 

[Brianna]

Christian78: Where for art thou mentally, physically, and bodily?

 

[Stink]

why cant doctors prescribe barbiturates to everyone if they want to end their life?

I hate the society can make suicide so difficult!

if you go meet a train, you leave the driver and other people traumatized. and you will be in pieces

if you want peaceful death with barbiturates... you have to raid a veterinatry clinic!

people suck for making others lives so difficult to end. don't you all think so?

 

[Brianna]

why cant doctors prescribe barbiturates to everyone if they want to end their life?

I hate the society can make suicide so difficult!

if you go meet a train, you leave the driver and other people traumatized. and you will be in pieces

if you want peaceful death with barbiturates... you have to raid a veterinatry clinic!

people suck for making others lives so difficult to end. don't you all think so?

Stink:
I'll take an educated guess but with the forewarning that I'm very cynical and untrusting of what goes on in the gov't in the U.S. My opinion will be based on that mistrust.

1. In our country, there's still a large population (no clue what %) of religious people. They would raise an uproar if allowed. That's why Terri ... in FL was kept on life-support long after I believe she was declared brain dead. It ended up in Congress (flippy to me). There are other cases like this. And, of course, the only doc who helped people - terminally ill ... was Kervorkian and he paid for his assistance with his life in jail.
2. If we are left alive, we pay taxes (maybe not a lot but we do) and we buy prescriptions and we pay into the erroneously labeled healthcare system, etc. - You get my drift.

To me, almost every issue in the US can be traced to money and power. I believe that's really why the Gov. of Indiana wanted clear statements in the religious rights bill. There was a backlash. I envision that guy and the Gov. of Arkansas wanting bills that add to their economy not take $$ from them.

I agree with you 100%. Terminally ill patients are allowed a that special luxury of dying with less pain. We aren't dying in the real sense of the world but many people here are critically debilitated by it. So we and others with various diseases remain alive to pay into the system.

 

[awbw8]

Fair, I can't imagine that many T patients experience an especially peaceful or painless death at the end either. Also, I would be very happy if a T patient is not suffering 24/7. Unfortunately those with extreme T do.

Is there really hope of recovery for T sufferers?
You could ask those who have been suffering for years (10, 20, 30 or 50 years).

There are plenty of terminally ill patients technically full of life. Are they all happy, I doubt it. For what it's worth, I talked to a kidney dysfunctional patient who's suffering greatly of pain (waiting for a donor). He pops plenty of opiates, but he also has breaks.
When I first told him about T he took aback in total disbelieve that there is absolutely nothing to treat this ailment. I did open his eyes. Learning about T totally changed his mindset. He told me that he thought his ailment was fuc*ed up and the worst you could get, but know being aware of T he is utterly grateful that he does not have to suffer an ailment like this.

I told him I'd love to trade with him. He declined.

No, no your voice about euthanasia is as important as any other! Certainly, we can agree to disagree but think about it your attitude would exclude people that do suffer, which doesn't mean that every T patient is suffering 24/7 -- same for terminally ill patients.

We are all human beings and how can we judge the pain and misery of our fellow men objectively? And how many false diagnoses have been made were people somehow miraculously recovered from their terminal disease?

Hi @NiNyu there are a lot of T patients not suffering 24/7, self included. Although I did suffer greatly at one point. I very seriously considered ending my life, clearly without assistance. I, too, envied patients with terminal illnesses as I thought, "Well, at least there is an end in sight to their suffering." However, two years later, things are much better for me. I really do not suffer from T at all, although I still definitely have it. The thought of wanting to trade my T for something terminal now seems ludicrous to me, though I still remember the suffering me who quite sincerely wanted that.

So, yes, there is hope of recovery for T suffers. whether you mean recovery from suffering (very common) or recovery from the T itself (less common, but it also happens). I personally know and have corresponded with someone whose noise-induced T went away after a decade. He did suffer, but he adjusted and then it went away, now he is living a gloriously full, happy life. Though, I still have T and I am, too. I know a lot of people with T that was once diagnosed as severe, who are not very happy.

When I refer to a terminally ill patient who would be in line for assisted suicide, I mean the way Oregon defines it, 6 months left to live. There is no hope for recovery there, because there is no time. Even if they are "full of life" emotionally, that is of course not the case for long when one has 6 months to live. Assisted suicide in this case is expediting something that is going to come naturally, and very soon.

T, while often terrible for a time, is not going to kill anyone. I'm not even against anyone who wants to die not being able to die how they want to, but allowing T, as opposed to something which is truly going to physically kill someone, onto a list, almost means we have to allow anything onto the list. Speaking of which:

T is a physical ailment whereas depression is a mental ailment, which can be treated easily with psychology. Hence killing yourself due to depression is a little bit shortsighted 'cause there is hope. We should differentiate between mental and physical ailments. Unfortunately most incompetent doctors regard T as a mental issue -- 'cause it's brain related. So if I put a bullet into someones skull it might be a mental thing for some doctors.

T and depression are equally physical ailments. T can start off in the ear, but can start or end up in the brain as well. Depression is in the brain, both are a result of physical things happening up there. To someone with depression who wants to die, I'm sure they would take equal offense to your saying their wanting to die is shortsighted as you would if someone said wanting to die because of T is shortsighted, because there is hope. There is hope for both and the suffering caused by both are physical, real and painful. However, there is hope for recovery in both cases. Neither T, nor depression with kill anyone, even if they cause enough agony for people to want to die and to commit the act.

To me, this is why this is such a complicated conversation. I'm not against people making their own choices, but asking someone (anyone - a society, a doctor etc.) to help, makes it complex. It is called "assisted" for a reason. It makes me sad, but to have something in place where doctors prescribe medication which kills people, it's complex and almost has to be opened to everyone if we're expanding it to anyone who isn't already at death's door. For me, right now, the only reasonable line I can see if between someone who is truly about to die, with or without assistance, and someone who is not. Saying anyone who is suffering opens a huge can of worms, because all humans suffer and suffering is relative. Who suffers more, a grieving mother who has lost her child, a rape victim, a soldier with PTSD, a depressed teenager, a T patient? No one can say.

Should we all be able to walk into clinics and ask for the quiet death pill if we want? Perhaps, but at present I'm not comfortable saying I support that.

 

[NiNyu]

There are different forms of T. We need to differentiate. Unfortunately, the uneducated one throws them all in the same basket. Debilitating T, mild T, faint T, average T.. all the same. T is T. Just like cancer is cancer. Benign or malign who cares?

I really do not suffer from T at all,

Really? So when there should ever be a treatment for T, let alone a cure you would gratefully decline the offer, right?

T, while often terrible for a time, is not going to kill anyone.

You mean for a lifetime.

T and depression are equally physical ailments.

That's a utter BS statement! But if you really go that far and put depression in the same basket as T you have to put pain in there as well 'cause that happens in the brain too. Essentially everything involves the brain. So by that close-minded definition all ailments are essentially the same. Why am I even going to the dentist for dental work and not to a psychiatrist?

Someone with depression but a completely healthy body taking offense by my statement that suicide might be a little bit shortsighted in their case is simply too depressed to see reality.

No! Depression does NOT cause physical pain. If that was the case the patient would get painkillers instead of antidepressants. Though I wouldn't recommend taking them 'cause the side effects are definitely going to damage your body in the long run. That being said, depression can cause psychosomatic effects like stomach ache, sweat, anxiety and whatnot. However, once the depression is being treated those effects resolve in no time. But to compare that with T is ludicrous! You cannot talk T away!

For me, right now, the only reasonable line I can see if between someone who is truly about to die and someone who is not.

So it's not about who's suffering the most but who is dying first?

Who suffers more, a grieving mother who has lost her child, a rape victim, a soldier with PTSD, a depressed teenager, a T patient?

The T patient suffers the most; if he has extreme debilitaing T 24/7. Then comes the rape victim, the soldier and the mother who lost her child, last but not least the depressed teenager.

Why? It's pretty simple, T is a physical painful ailment that often causes mental problems like depression etc. Whereas all the other have mental problems (PTSD and depression) which psychology addresses perfectly. But again, if you were to put them all in the very same basket you could as well send them all to the dentist.

 

[awbw8]

@NiNyu

It's clear that you are presently suffering a great deal, I am so, so very deeply sorry for that.

Everything I said, I did mean and have thought about prior to writing it. I do not really appreciate having my statements referred to as "utter BS" and "closed-minded," but I do absolutely and always invite respectful disagreement and surrounding conversation. Different opinions are part of what make TT special and nurturing.

I think my feelings and why I feel them are probably clear enough at this point (and if they're not, I'm not sure my elaborating further is going to interest anyone.) Additionally, I think most of the things you pulled out to talk about would result in many different and long conversations. I'd be happy to talk more through messaging if you like, but I think for this thread it's gone to a point where it's no longer enriching anyone's experience.

However, I will say that I do not suffer from my T, truly. I would take a risk-free cure, (not one that might hurt my hearing or anything else, that would not be worth it to me at present.) But that doesn't mean I'm suffering. If someone said I could take a pill and wake up tomorrow in my 20-year-old body, I would sure do that, too! But, I'm not suffering in my current body, I'm pretty happy, I'm healthy-ish, but sure, it would be nice to have fewer grey hairs and more energy. It's not a flawless analogy perhaps, but it has my feelings about right.

I really do hope you find some relief from your suffering sooner rather than later, Ninyu. You're still early in your T from what your profile says, maybe it will go, but even if it doesn't, that doesn't mean your suffering has to last forever. There's hope, and I'm glad you found TT and all the wonderful people here for support, I'm glad you're here.

 

[Calories]

After suffering tinnitus, Suicide seems the only hope! No God, No Science, No Person can help one.

 

[Brianna]

After suffering tinnitus, Suicide seems the only hope! No God, No Science, No Person can help one.

Calories, all I can do is say I'm sorry. When my responses are seen at early hours, it means my T is rip-roaring enough so I cannot sleep. Lately, it's most earlier mornings. It's always when I remove my only filter to allow sound to my head (= night when I have to removed a pseudo bionic attachment from my head).

I would just offer that science is remains influx. Facts change as more is discovered. I'm not discounting your intense suffering. I'm also not providing a false, "You'll be fine, give it time." I can't do that anymore because I don't know if you'll be fine. I know you're currently not.

Please stay in touch as you go through this intensely-complicated disease.

 

[NiNyu]

It's clear that you are presently suffering a great deal, I am so, so very deeply sorry for that. I really do hope you find some relief from your suffering sooner rather than later, Ninyu

I do gravely. Thank you. You know, it is the first time I'm genuinely on the verge of suicide. I think that says it all.

I'm kinda sorry if my last post offended to you. But I am very emotionally lately..


@Calories , I feel you.

 

[awbw8]

I do gravely. Thank you. You know, it is the first time I'm genuinely on the verge of suicide. I think that says it all.

I'm kinda sorry if my last post offended to you. But I am very emotionally lately..


@Calories , I feel you.

Hi @NiNyu, no need to be sorry at all. It's a very sensitive topic and I remember being in a place where it was the first time I was genuinely on the verge of suicide, because of T, too. If anyone texted me in those early days all I could write was "I want to die." or "this is hell." I wrote that to my poor mom, 3,000 miles away, so many times she flew to take care of me. Even with her there I was barely eating and sleeping - it was just a constant panic attack, but she pulled me through the very worst of the worst. I'm lucky I had her. I hope you have someone, but if you don't, we'll all try to be your person.

Habituated or not, we've all been there, and it is really the worst thing I've yet dealt with, without question. It makes me cry to think of it, and to think that you and others are currently feeling those terrible feelings and I can't really do much other than type. I have only compassion for you.

Please don't give up, and you either @Calories. I know I don't know you, but I would hate to lose either of you. If I were just surviving, I might not want to fight so hard to convince you to hold out hope, but I never thought I'd be able to have my life and my self back, and I didn't even want to habituate, the thought of getting used to T made me feel so angry and so sad. But, it wasn't what I thought it would be, life is just life again. T is a traumatic event, and like any trauma it takes time to adjust and to heal, but there is hope. Don't give up.

*hugs*

 

[1MW]

The only sure bet to stop T is suicide. Not assisted i can do it myself.
Before suicide i will try some more things more meds & surgeries .
But if all fail for sure i will suicide because with T & H i die every day.

 

[dan]

 

[Brianna]

That's a utter BS statement!

Everything I said, I did mean and have thought about prior to writing it. I do not really appreciate having my statements referred to as "utter BS" and "closed-minded," but I do absolutely and always invite respectful disagreement and surrounding conversation. Different opinions are part of what make TT special and nurturing.

awbw8: Thanks for stating what I could not (and that apparently is happening more to me these days as my noise level is high and my irritability is somewhat controlled). It's especially ironic that most of us in this particular thread know T increases with thoughtless, derogatory comments or it does for me.

The only sure bet to stop T is suicide. Not assisted i can do it myself.
Before suicide i will try some more things more meds & surgeries .
But if all fail for sure i will suicide because with T & H i die every day.

I'm glad you're trying to work on alleviating your pain. It's critical. While I believe in physician-assisted suicide (as well as suicide ... suicide (no matter how well planned) comes with inherent and a high-level of risk), that's your last stop. It appears you have a ways to go before reaching that point. My only "eeek" is to remind you not to be fooled into a cochlear implant as one of your surgeries.

Please stay in touch.

 

[Danny Boy]

I believe that society needs to stop allowing people to suffer, if someone wishes to die and they are in the right state of mind, they should be allowed the right to die. Right to die should be enforced worldwide, however silly religious beliefs prevent this. Anyway, any righteous person should agree to right to die, so I would assume god would too.

 

[Joe P. Tamborra]

Don't you know that you are the temple of God, and that the Spirit of God lives in you? If any man destroy the temple of God, him shall God destroy; for the temple of God is holy, which temple you are. (1Cor.3:16-17) What? Don't you know that your body is the temple of the Holy Ghost which is in you, which you have of God, and are not your own? For you are bought with a price: therefore glorify God in your body, and in your spirit, which are God's.(1Cor.6:19-20) You shall not murder. (Ex.20:13) If we leave holy scripture out of the equation it would seem this was a reasonable option for a suffering human; however if we consider ourselves to be followers of God we must obey His holy word. This being said, being people of faith, we must maintain a faith walk until our last breath. Suffering,affliction,and pain are not fun; but if we really believe in the God of the bible, and have a good understanding of His character, then we should see Him as compassionate,merciful,gracious,kind,good,and long-suffering. Going through hard times is never easy, but God will not give His people more than they can endure, and through their trials will make a way of escape that they can bear up under the trial. (1Cor.10:13) If God is our God, than He also needs to be Lord. And a lord is a ruler, if God is the Lord of our lives,then He is the ruler of our lives. Not even a sparrow can fall to the ground and die without God's permission (Matt.10:29). We have no idea if we will recover from any sickness, people have made miraculous recovery's in the past. Taking ones own life is giving up on faith, and without faith we cannot please God.(Heb.11:6) So to the people of God this is not an option if we wish to inherit eternal life. Sometimes the word of God seems hard, but personally I saw my own dad die from terminal cancer. My dad died in faith without even taking pain medication. He consoled me as I was crying right before he died, and told me I have two days left. Who knows such things without God revealing it to him. Two days later my dad went home to glory. The way he died left a lasting impression upon me his son. He died like a champion of faith. And it was an honor to be his child. He left a lasting legacy, a heritage of faith.

 

[Danny Boy]

Don't you know that you are the temple of God, and that the Spirit of God lives in you? If any man destroy the temple of God, him shall God destroy; for the temple of God is holy, which temple you are. (1Cor.3:16-17) What? Don't you know that your body is the temple of the Holy Ghost which is in you, which you have of God, and are not your own? For you are bought with a price: therefore glorify God in your body, and in your spirit, which are God's.(1Cor.6:19-20) You shall not murder. (Ex.20:13) If we leave holy scripture out of the equation it would seem this was a reasonable option for a suffering human; however if we consider ourselves to be followers of God we must obey His holy word. This being said, being people of faith, we must maintain a faith walk until our last breath. Suffering,affliction,and pain are not fun; but if we really believe in the God of the bible, and have a good understanding of His character, then we should see Him as compassionate,merciful,gracious,kind,good,and long-suffering. Going through hard times is never easy, but God will not give His people more than they can endure, and through their trials will make a way of escape that they can bear up under the trial. (1Cor.10:13) If God is our God, than He also needs to be Lord. And a lord is a ruler, if God is the Lord of our lives,then He is the ruler of our lives. Not even a sparrow can fall to the ground and die without God's permission (Matt.10:29). We have no idea if we will recover from any sickness, people have made miraculous recovery's in the past. Taking ones own life is giving up on faith, and without faith we cannot please God.(Heb.11:6) So to the people of God this is not an option if we wish to inherit eternal life. Sometimes the word of God seems hard, but personally I saw my own dad die from terminal cancer. My dad died in faith without even taking pain medication. He consoled me as I was crying right before he died, and told me I have two days left. Who knows such things without God revealing it to him. Two days later my dad went home to glory. The way he died left a lasting impression upon me his son. He died like a champion of faith. And it was an honor to be his child. He left a lasting legacy, a heritage of faith.

So you're saying the right to die shouldn't be allowed, because some bible told people to not allow it? So people should be tortured daily, 24/7 because a book said so? Sorry I don't buy it. I'd advocate the right to die and religion is what stands in my way of achieving people not suffering.

 

[Brianna]

So you're saying the right to die shouldn't be allowed, because some bible told people to not allow it? So people should be tortured daily, 24/7 because a book said so? Sorry I don't buy it. I'd advocate the right to die and religion is what stands in my way of achieving people not suffering.

I consistently agree with our decision about the right-to-die (and here, we're talking about assisted suicide. My guess is most of us knew the thread would be mixed with results from those who are religious and those who aren't (add morality or ethics to it and you get another set of ideas). We all try to follow our own paths in life. If someone opts to follow the way through religion, I don't knock their belief because it's their right as it is our right to push for something different because we don't believe in the bible. But I agree with that blockades to what "we" desire are often set by religion (and in the U.S., it's a powerful lobby). Stem cell research rings loudly in my head as a major battle to allow it because it was fought against by religious groups (or so we were told). When that occurred, I looked outside the U.S. for what I call the rational and right solution through research.

Danny Boy: We can pretty much say what we want on this forum unless it becomes offensive. In your response here, you're definitely not offensive in any way. But if you see that you're responding to someone who is at the pulpit especially, it will fall on deaf ears and not mine . David is more flexible. He quotes passages from the bible but is somehow able to look beyond. It's a fairly rare trait.

I have a question for you. You're in England. When I refer to the U.K., is that politically correct? If not, I'll change it in future posts.

 

[attheedgeofscience]

 

[Brianna]

@attheedgeofscience: I so enjoy your quotes/posters (literally, I'd like to take them off an hang them up). Thanks. Nothing more need be said from me other than keep them going, please.