Having had T for so long, and knowing its ups and downs, I was never prepared for what began last October. Suddenly it became a level so loud there's no getting away from it. There seems to be no accustoming myself to it and it doesn't ever change. I visited a very famous doctor at NYU Langone, put me through a cerebral angiogram thinking I had a fistula. Terrifying, full of radiation and risks, and it was all for nothing when they got in my brain they saw nothing. Now I have no where to go with this noise. Sleep is so difficult, and my life is totally upside down. I will try the training sound therapy if anyone suggests , but would deeply appreciate help. What was in one ear is now both with different noises, one a loud vibrating engine, The other a high pitched squeal. What is happening.
7 Straight Months of High-Level "Squealing"
- Thread starter Luisa
- Start date
MemberStay strong, @Luisa. Have you tried any any medications at all? I ask because you mention that sleep is an issue, and medication can often help with that component of tinnitus. Assuming you are in the NYC area (based on the fact that you went to NYU Langone, where several of my doctors practice), PM me if you want the name of a good NYC doctor that has helped me with my tinnitus.
Best, Golly
@Rachel Murray also has an engine sound in her ear, maybe she can come by here and help you.
did you take any medicine at all back in October? Did you go to a concert or did anything that exposed your ears to noise?
hugs xx
did you take any medicine at all back in October? Did you go to a concert or did anything that exposed your ears to noise?
hugs xx
Thank you @ampumpkin for tagging me!
Yes, Luisa, I have exactly what you have: loud pitch in left ear, loud vibrating engine in the right ear. A total of 6 different sounds but the worst is, no doubt about it, the vibrating engine.
Sometimes my engine is very strong, and I call it the truck, sometimes is a little less strong and I call it the car. When I have the truck, I have difficultly on coping with it, when I have the car (most of the time) I try to pretend it's normal to live like this in order to keep my sanity.
We have a thread called "low frequency tinnitus" , take a look - several people have the engine sound.
@Luisa , we have to be strong and learn how to live with it - there is no other option.
Actually, I have a friend here at the Forum that also has the engine sound and that is better since she started seeing a chiropractor - would you be willing to try a chiropractor? I don't know if I have the courage.
@Luisa , low frequency tinnitus is not as common as high frequency tinnitus but there are a lot of people that have it in several forms - car motor, truck engine, vibration, drone, rumbling, roaring... You are not alone!
Yes, Luisa, I have exactly what you have: loud pitch in left ear, loud vibrating engine in the right ear. A total of 6 different sounds but the worst is, no doubt about it, the vibrating engine.
Sometimes my engine is very strong, and I call it the truck, sometimes is a little less strong and I call it the car. When I have the truck, I have difficultly on coping with it, when I have the car (most of the time) I try to pretend it's normal to live like this in order to keep my sanity.
We have a thread called "low frequency tinnitus" , take a look - several people have the engine sound.
@Luisa , we have to be strong and learn how to live with it - there is no other option.
Actually, I have a friend here at the Forum that also has the engine sound and that is better since she started seeing a chiropractor - would you be willing to try a chiropractor? I don't know if I have the courage.
@Luisa , low frequency tinnitus is not as common as high frequency tinnitus but there are a lot of people that have it in several forms - car motor, truck engine, vibration, drone, rumbling, roaring... You are not alone!
Golly I don't know where to private message you. My dr Maksim Shapiro is renowned for working with tinnitus
Hi @Luisa;
To PM, click on my name (where you see the pic of my boy) and select the "Start a Conversation" option. I'll start one with you right now. -Golly
How I'd love for some of us to get together. I see Chiropractors 3 times a week...I try to keep everything in alignment....your examples of car and truck are quite endearing. For years I had T in one ear, and had to always have a fan or some sort of noise on even on vacation. Suddenly in Oct...a few teeth needed root canal, but how do I blame the root canals as the noise began right before
I had a strange thing in Oct that 3 teeth had trouble at the same time. I did have root canal however, the noise suddenly became to this maddening change before the root canals but after the teeth started. Ive had Tinnitus for 25 years frankly. It was always troubling, I always needed sound machine at night, but it was tolerable. Since october my life is upside down
@Luisa I'm so sorry to hear that you are going through this. I'm in a similar boat... T for 15 years no problem just a fan on at night. Then 3 months ago had some medical stuff go on and wham bam here it is ramped up 10x.
It isn't uncommon for people to get tinnitus from dental procedures but it is rare that it would stick around for so long. Were you on any medications that could explain your increase? Antibiotics or antidepressants?
I also noticed you said you were having issues with your teeth at around the same time too. Do you have any pain around the jaw or neck? Any clicking sounds or popping in your jaw when you open it wide? TMJD could be part of your issue and I do understand it can start following dental procedures too.
I finally got around to seeing a TMJD specialist and while they said I do have the problem they couldn't guarantee it was causing the ringing. Still - it's worth a shot at this point.
Other than that there are a few other things you can run down. Blood work is never a bad idea. I'm not sure how old you are but thyroid problems are known to cause tinnitus and are also more common in women. Other vitamins can be imbalanced too but these are long shots... magnesium for example.
You also mentioned you saw a great doctor before. Were they an ENT? Sometimes it takes a while to find that right doctor that will run down every possible cause for you. Or it's quite possible that I'm giving you information you already know which I do apologize if that's the case.
Either way, I think it's time to see another ENT in your area that specializes in tinnitus. A full exam with an audiogram that tests above 8khz and looks at everything would be good too if you haven't already.
I finally found a doctor that does TRT in my area and I've started the treatment. It can't hurt at this point and so far it has actually been quite helpful. While you are considering it you can do start sound enrichment therapy yourself to "take the edge off." Basically that means listening to calming music and keeping your environment from being silent at all times.
It isn't uncommon for people to get tinnitus from dental procedures but it is rare that it would stick around for so long. Were you on any medications that could explain your increase? Antibiotics or antidepressants?
I also noticed you said you were having issues with your teeth at around the same time too. Do you have any pain around the jaw or neck? Any clicking sounds or popping in your jaw when you open it wide? TMJD could be part of your issue and I do understand it can start following dental procedures too.
I finally got around to seeing a TMJD specialist and while they said I do have the problem they couldn't guarantee it was causing the ringing. Still - it's worth a shot at this point.
Other than that there are a few other things you can run down. Blood work is never a bad idea. I'm not sure how old you are but thyroid problems are known to cause tinnitus and are also more common in women. Other vitamins can be imbalanced too but these are long shots... magnesium for example.
You also mentioned you saw a great doctor before. Were they an ENT? Sometimes it takes a while to find that right doctor that will run down every possible cause for you. Or it's quite possible that I'm giving you information you already know which I do apologize if that's the case.
Either way, I think it's time to see another ENT in your area that specializes in tinnitus. A full exam with an audiogram that tests above 8khz and looks at everything would be good too if you haven't already.
I finally found a doctor that does TRT in my area and I've started the treatment. It can't hurt at this point and so far it has actually been quite helpful. While you are considering it you can do start sound enrichment therapy yourself to "take the edge off." Basically that means listening to calming music and keeping your environment from being silent at all times.
@Luisa My truck / car engine noise got much worse after going to the dentist for a cleaning - this was on the 1st of June and never got better again, except for one single day (no idea why - I almost wish I hadn't had that silent day - the disappointment when everything came back was huge).
Today my truck is worse than ever. I feel very down and just hope it gets a bit better again.
It is strange to think that nothing can help us - you just have to get used to it - it's very tiring and it really ruins your life - but we have no option, we have to be strong!
I got my low frequency tinnitus (I already had a little of high frequency T, the ringing - although never thought seriously about it) after putting some ear drops because I had pain in my ear - it was the very young trainee of my GP that gave them to me, saying I had an infection in my ear drum - I am now sure I had a perforation in my ear drum and that the ear drops made an ototoxic effect. All the doctors say it's impossible but I read something at the American Association of Tinnitus saying precisely this: ear drops can be ototoxic if you have an ear drum perforation.
I will hate that young doctor for the rest of my life and also my GP for letting her decide so delicate matters alone (meanwhile I have changed GP, of course).
Luisa, would you say that the chiro sessions don't work? My friend is very happy with the effects but she has started just some weeks ago.
What about acupuncture? Have you ever tried it before? I'm open to anything that someone says it gives good results!
Let's keep in touch, we have exactly the same T so we understand each other!
Today my truck is worse than ever. I feel very down and just hope it gets a bit better again.
It is strange to think that nothing can help us - you just have to get used to it - it's very tiring and it really ruins your life - but we have no option, we have to be strong!
I got my low frequency tinnitus (I already had a little of high frequency T, the ringing - although never thought seriously about it) after putting some ear drops because I had pain in my ear - it was the very young trainee of my GP that gave them to me, saying I had an infection in my ear drum - I am now sure I had a perforation in my ear drum and that the ear drops made an ototoxic effect. All the doctors say it's impossible but I read something at the American Association of Tinnitus saying precisely this: ear drops can be ototoxic if you have an ear drum perforation.
I will hate that young doctor for the rest of my life and also my GP for letting her decide so delicate matters alone (meanwhile I have changed GP, of course).
Luisa, would you say that the chiro sessions don't work? My friend is very happy with the effects but she has started just some weeks ago.
What about acupuncture? Have you ever tried it before? I'm open to anything that someone says it gives good results!
Let's keep in touch, we have exactly the same T so we understand each other!
I would so Love to stay in touch with you! Im very confused by this site so Im going to send you my email and we can write that way. Much less confusing. Your hatred of your doctor...do I have a s tory...a Neurosurgeon put me thru brain surgery thinking my noise was a fistula that could burst in my head. He wouldnt be safe around me now. I got his bills and I tear them up weekly. Lets write directly Daynarose@aol.com...Im considering starting a Tinnitus support group here on Long Island.....Luisa
- Sep 11, 2013
- 14
- Tinnitus Since
- 07/2013
- Cause of Tinnitus
- Stress/Medication/Chronic Pain (now recovered)
Hi all, I have researched so much on the internet about T, seen the TMJ and ENT specialists, been to an Audiologist and had tests, taken medication, herbs, vitamins and so on, when your desperate you do these things to find what might work. All T sufferers seem to go through these stages, like a dog chasing its tail really, Ive had high pitch T around the 13khz level which is high pitch since July 2013, there are two other frequencies that I hear which are lower and way less bothersome. My audiologist had me listening to my actual frequency using an ipod as a treatment, which seemed to dull the tone for a while, I just gave up on that as it did nothing. Ever since I found Audio Notch I haven't looked back, its an inexpensive treatment that you tailor yourself online and download to an ipod/mp3 player, if any of you want to know more just post a reply here, or look up my other posts on this website. The ridiculous cost of Neuromonics is just inasne and is companies monopolising on peoples desperation for a cure. Audio Notch is almost the same as Neuromonics only you do it yourself.
Here's to future where a cure is found for this debilitating disorder of the brain and ears.
Here's to future where a cure is found for this debilitating disorder of the brain and ears.
Two dental bridges, put on ages ago, required a great deal of grinding to prep the areas by the dentist. He was someone I picked because the location was close to home. Maybe I should have asked around for recommendations. That was perhaps fifteen years ago, and I still recall how reactive the T became. The volume was loud and it seemed beyond control. It took a good deal of sound therapy to get me back to being the normal "special needs" person I am. That's what a friend's daughter calls me.
I have several sounds in my head, knocking, roaring, ringing, tapping, but not a car sound. Still, I empathize with you, Luisa. This whole adventure isn't much fun at times. May you soon find at least partial relief.
David
I have several sounds in my head, knocking, roaring, ringing, tapping, but not a car sound. Still, I empathize with you, Luisa. This whole adventure isn't much fun at times. May you soon find at least partial relief.
David
Hi @tintin31:
Does AudioNotch simply mask your tinnitus; or does it somehow reduce the volume (presumably through a mechanism such as residual inhibition)? In other words, once you stop listening, is your tinnitus reduced for an extended period of time?
-Golly
FounderI assume you know this, but:
AudioNotch is a commercial service that is based on the principles of Notched Sound/Music Therapy.
You can achieve the same yourself (for the tech savvy folks it isn't that difficult, and we have some guides here for automatically notching all the music you listen to on your computer) for free, but some people prefer the simplicity of a service like AudioNotch.
http://www.audionotch.com/faq#science
Nicely enough they have also posted a link to a critical review about it:
http://www.uwo.ca/fhs/csd/ebp/reviews/2011-12/Bennett.pdf
And they state:
AudioNotch.com said:
From what I've understood, it can offer longer lasting relief than the more common residual inhibition.
But...
AudioNotch.com said:
The bad part is that it seems to require a bit of a persistence, i.e. to have the willingness to listen to the notched files on a continual basis for several months, up to a year, and that should your tinnitus frequency change, re-notch the sound files to suit the new frequency.
We have more about this here: https://www.tinnitustalk.com/threads/notched-music-therapy.61/
Yep.
AudioNotch.com said:
Seems headphones are recommended.
Earbuds and regular open headphones can pose a risk to hearing, especially when you use them in noisy situations where you have to increase the volume quite significantly to block out the external sounds.
But if you use noise-cancelling headphones and/or in-ear buds that block the external sound, you don't need to keep the actual volume very loud at all.
Still struggling for a long time to get a proper answer if that's true or not - assuming of course we're ALWAYS talking about a low volume.
In your quote, you took away the part where I said: "especially when you use them in noisy situations where you have to increase the volume quite significantly to block out the external sounds."
Actually, in my post, I should have used "but only" instead of "especially".
Because open headphones / ear buds definitely will not damage your hearing if you keep the volume in check.
But as I described, noise-cancelling earphones are great for outdoors/airplanes etc. where with non-noise blocking phones/buds you would possibly have to keep your volume at a somewhat dangerous level to block the external unwanted noises in order to enjoy the music and to not have it drown out in the external noises. Everyone probably agrees with this.
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/22712926
"Subjects tended to increase their PLLs as the background noise level increased. Compared with ear buds, PLLs obtained from NCHs-on in the presence of background noise were reduced up to 4 dB. Therefore, proper selection and use of NCHs appears beneficial in reducing the risk of hearing damage caused by high music listening levels in the presence of background noise."
According to the above study the preferred listening level was up to 4 dB higher in the ear buds group.
"Physics tells us that for every doubling of acoustical energy, there is a 3dB increase."
Yet...
"Sound studies tell us time and again that a 3dBA increase in sound level is barely noticeable to the human ear. In fact, you have to raise a sound level by 5dBA before most listeners report a noticeable or significant change. Further, it takes a 10dBA increase before the average listener hears "double the sound." That's a far cry from 3dB."
http://www.acousticsbydesign.com/acoustics-blog/perception-vs-reality.htm
That's kind of interesting. 4 dB is not much of a difference perception wise, but the 4 dB difference in the aforementioned study between the groups is kind of significant regardless: A 4dB reduction represents a bit more than a halving of the sound pressure level, and in the long run that can only be beneficial.
I'm curious to hear what others think?
- Sep 11, 2013
- 14
- Tinnitus Since
- 07/2013
- Cause of Tinnitus
- Stress/Medication/Chronic Pain (now recovered)
Hi Golly, no it doesnt mask your tinitus, well it kind of does when your listening, however it does reduce the perceived volume over a few weeks, after the initial volume drop it slowly reduces, painstakingly slowly, but it does work. I was sceptical at first but was desperate for some kind of effective treatment. Go to www.audionotch.com the site is full of detail on how it all works, for me my T was sudden onset just started one night and hasnt left me since. I have been listening to the notched white noise sound for about 9 months, as time goes on I dont have to listen as often/everyday. I have adjusted the frequency slightly using the tools provided at Audionotch, its really easy to use. As for the volume of the nothced white noise that I listen to, its only at the volume of my actual T, on my iPod the volume indicator is only just on ( alomost the lowest possible setting) when I first started it was about a quarter of the way up.
I listen for about 30 minutes per day using bud headphones, I get the best results if I wear earmuffs. I have had days recently where the T is almost not there at all, I went for 4 days not having to listen to the notched sound as my T was literally gone. I will keep listening for as long as it takes, in the begining I needed to use sleeping tablets as the T was so disturbing/annoying, I havent had to do this for about that last 5 months. Definately noticing changes, its a very slow process, but it seems to work, what other choice do I (we) have.
Regards....
- Sep 11, 2013
- 14
- Tinnitus Since
- 07/2013
- Cause of Tinnitus
- Stress/Medication/Chronic Pain (now recovered)
Thanks Markku, yes persistence and patience is what is required, thanks for all that detail (above) saved me writing it all.
Thanks @tintin31! That's inspiring news; I will certainly give this treatment option further consideration.
Best, Golly
i understand its tough to match your personal frequency, so i tried today but the sounds made me feel like it was going to aggravate my T! is it worthwhile to listen to notched white noise without headphones or are they a must?
- Sep 11, 2013
- 14
- Tinnitus Since
- 07/2013
- Cause of Tinnitus
- Stress/Medication/Chronic Pain (now recovered)
Hi Rube, yes it is difficult, I test mine using ear bud(head phones) and wear ear muffs to block any external sound, I close my eyes and relax and between looking at the computer screen and testing frequencies, do this on and off until your really close to discovering the frequency. As for aggravating it, yes, that's exactly what it seems to do, this is called the zwicker tone, its all detailed on the website. The zwicker tone is your T at a slightly louder volume, this actually lowers in volume after a few hours, it is alarming, but with a positive outlook that this is going to do something to improve your T over time, then I say its worth it. I hardly get this zwicker tone anymore, I take the ear buds out after listening for up to an hour sometimes and the T is still there but its very much in the background. I still get what I would say are spike days, but there are other days like today for example where its only just there and its so easy to ignore. I honestly believe now, that the spike days I have, are what my T was like before I started Audio Notch.
You must wear noise reducing head phones for best effect, you only have the volume of the white noise at the volume of what you think your T is at, this is very important.
Its worth persisting with.........
- Sep 11, 2013
- 14
- Tinnitus Since
- 07/2013
- Cause of Tinnitus
- Stress/Medication/Chronic Pain (now recovered)
Hi Lisa88, I have 3 different T tones (Multitonal), I simply target the tone that is the most bothersome, for me its the really screechy one at 14khz, there are different tuning functions at AudioNotch, I use the one that encompasses what seems to be all my tones rolled into one......
I have thought about what the trigger for my T was, I strongly believe the catalyst for it was when I was taking ibuprofen for a month (at the recommended dose) I was suffering from Chronic Pelvic Pain Syndrome, which happens to be a stress related disorder.....!! I had stopped taking the ibuprofen for about 2 weeks when the symptom of my condition eased, the T just started one night and has been with me ever since. I went and spoke with an ENT specialist and she was useless, said I just have to learn to ignore it, that I'd probably had for years and my brain was probably just ignoring it, I was totally gutted when I walk out of her consulting rooms and felt very alone. Anyway my journey has led me to here, Im glad to share my experiences anyway, hopefully they will inspire others to try what Im doing, I must stress that its taken me about 10 months of listening to the notched sound to be where Im at today.....
Take Care........!!
Thanks @tintin31
Just a couple more questions:
Can you tell audionotch is specifically working on your t, or do you think it could be the passage of time? i.e. it would have faded for you anyway.
Lastly, doesn't audionotch work on the principle opposite from residual inhibition? Not sure how they could both be correct. It continues to puzzle me.
Cheers!
Just a couple more questions:
Can you tell audionotch is specifically working on your t, or do you think it could be the passage of time? i.e. it would have faded for you anyway.
Lastly, doesn't audionotch work on the principle opposite from residual inhibition? Not sure how they could both be correct. It continues to puzzle me.
Cheers!
- Sep 11, 2013
- 14
- Tinnitus Since
- 07/2013
- Cause of Tinnitus
- Stress/Medication/Chronic Pain (now recovered)
Hi Lisa88, your first question is anyone's guess really, I honestly believe that its helped.
Your second question is a good one, ummm I think it works on both levels, that being it helps you get used to the tone consciously while subconsciously training your brain/auditory cortex to ignore the frequency.
All I can say is that my T is slowly and surely getting better, I found that if I don't listen to the notched sound for say 5 days then the volume increases ever so slightly again, I then listen for a while and wake up the next day with the T undetectable.
Its quite amazing and has taken me a year of daily listening to be at this point. Its such a pity that there (as far as I know) is no proper research into the audio notch participants. Without it though I don't know where Id be.
Your second question is a good one, ummm I think it works on both levels, that being it helps you get used to the tone consciously while subconsciously training your brain/auditory cortex to ignore the frequency.
All I can say is that my T is slowly and surely getting better, I found that if I don't listen to the notched sound for say 5 days then the volume increases ever so slightly again, I then listen for a while and wake up the next day with the T undetectable.
Its quite amazing and has taken me a year of daily listening to be at this point. Its such a pity that there (as far as I know) is no proper research into the audio notch participants. Without it though I don't know where Id be.
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