DIY Low-Level Laser Therapy for Tinnitus on a Budget — LLLT Under 100,-

[Bobby B]

@Tom Cnyc
For me LLLT didn't cure my tinnitus - yet - it's still here 24/7 pretty constantly but the sound level has decreased form being very Loud to being softer and if I'm busy enough I can forget about it at times
But I do feel T is getting even very slightly softer every blocks of a few months by steps so let's see in 2 years time .

I think the expectation if you had accoustic trauma a while ago - longer than the acute phase of a few weeks or less, is that it won't cure your T but you may get some improvements.

As for sound quality and H yes I got pretty much cured - how much is due to LLLT we will never know but for H due to accoustic trauma it's a valid Treatment.

If you are In the few days after trauma and do LT like the study they did then yes maybe it's a cure for T, similar to prednisone or am-101 did in the studies

This being said - I'm older , I had a lot of loud sound exposure including army time , recreational shooting , loud motorcycles and cars , clubbing and portable music for a long , long time and my T came from a recent long shooting range session so each ear injury is different ...

A younger person with a milder ear damage may get much better results on LT who knows..

The cost for LT is 12 dollars it's worth a try to say the least if you had acoustic trauma T - or ear infection, ototoxic drugs as a clear cause

Won't work for unknown / depression T

 

[Tom Cnyc]

@Bobby B I'm 35 and have been active in the music community for 20 years. probably enough to do some real damage, but I still believe most my damage came from one night.

you still going to the clinic for that high power laser or you going the 12 dollar route?

 

[Bobby B]

@Tom Cnyc
I'm not going to that clinic anymore

And it wasn't a laser they used - it's a filtered polarized light wide range visible to IR device , high power, medical grade etc.. much better and safer than laser

But no need to go anymore - it's much more convenient and cheaper to do it at home

 

[Tom Cnyc]

@Tom Cnyc
I'm not going to that clinic anymore

And it wasn't a laser they used - it's a filtered polarized light wide range visible to IR device , high power, medical grade etc.. much better and safer than laser

But no need to go anymore - it's much more convenient and cheaper to do it at home

You use that $12 laser currently? Any instructions? That's an investment I'm willing to risk.

 

[Bobby B]

@Tom Cnyc
It's not a laser man , it's a high power 5000mw LED much better and safer than laser
I use my home polarized IR device which I bought for 2000 dollars yes - didn't know about those cheaper solutions back then

I ordered a bunch of different LED lamps yesterday but those haven't arrived yet will take longer as I'm in Japan.

Will update you guys on it but frankly at 12 bucks for 5000mw of 850nm you cannot go wrong

 

[Tom Cnyc]

So basically just make sure the focus isn't on and point it at your ear? 5-10 mins at a time, careful to not get hot.... A few times a week?

@Cityjohn - thoughts?

 

[BDJ]

@Bobby B Thank you for your reply. To clarify, you are suggesting that I purchase this flashhlight (https://www.amazon.com/ilauke-Zooma...e+5W+Infrared+Flashlight+Night+Vision+Hunting)-or something with more power- and use it for LLLT therapy for an immediate solution. You believe this is comparable to the power, etc. of some of the things offered at clinics?

 

[Bobby B]

Yes that's the one
5000mw is perfect I think
Don't really need more

 

[BDJ]

Thanks @Bobby B.

Ordered. If nothing else, it is a cool flashlight.

I also see talk of the 650nm wave length. Any quick and easy suggestions for that one. Sorry, but am trying to piece together lots of info quickly.

"So, you should buy this flashlight, shine it in your ears, because it might help with this weird ringing sound."

I hope everyone can see the humor in that. I couldn't imagine having written that sentence a few weeks ago.

 

[Tom Cnyc]

Thanks @Bobby B.

Ordered. If nothing else, it is a cool flashlight.

I also see talk of the 650nm wave length. Any quick and easy suggestions for that one. Sorry, but am trying to piece together lots of info quickly.

"So, you should buy this flashlight, shine it in your ears, because it might help with this weird ringing sound."

I hope everyone can see the humor in that. I couldn't imagine having written that sentence a few weeks ago.

I spent most my life being the biggest cynic, and yeah, I'm willing to try it. lol

 

[Zechariah]

Thanks @Bobby B.

Ordered. If nothing else, it is a cool flashlight.

I also see talk of the 650nm wave length. Any quick and easy suggestions for that one. Sorry, but am trying to piece together lots of info quickly.

"So, you should buy this flashlight, shine it in your ears, because it might help with this weird ringing sound."

I hope everyone can see the humor in that. I couldn't imagine having written that sentence a few weeks ago.

It's not even a flashlight, it just beams thermal radiation into your ear. 650nm wavelength is mostly just red light.

I'm suprised that Bobby made someone actually buy something

 

[bill 112]

What exactly does Zazzio recommend as his protocol?

I have my laser here and I use it now and again but as I'm not sure of a specific protocol it makes it rather hard to commit to.Anyone please help me with this?

 

[GregCA]

I spent most my life being the biggest cynic, and yeah, I'm willing to try it. lol

Before realizing that you were in NYC, I thought that your forum name Cnyc meant "cynic" actually. That's how I was reading it to myself.

 

[BDJ]

It's not even a flashlight, it just beams thermal radiation into your ear. 650nm wavelength is mostly just red light.

I'm suprised that Bobby made someone actually buy something

To clarify, you mean 850nm, not 650nm?

 

[Bobby B]

According to Hamblin - who is the LLLT authority as a Ph.D. Harvard professor not some anonymous dude on the internet , the best therapeutic effects of light therapy are between 800nm and 1200nm.

That's because the light rays can penetrate deep enough . Yes they have less photons per time unit compared to the shorter wavelength so you may have to increase exposure time but those photons are able to get much deeper into tissue .

The also use 810nm for brain injury LLLT. I posted a few links on that as well.

I suggest anyone interested in this to watch the recent Hamblin interview on YouTube - the link is posted on these forums.

He also said there is nothing special about lasers and high power LED lamps had a great postive effect on the brain.

The cochlea is cast in bone we are not irradiating stuff on a lab table .
In addition - we now know that nerve damage is also key and neves are located even deeper behind the cochlea so the only way to reach this spot is by using a wavelength that does not get absorbed by superficial tissue .

Or remove stuff from your head and place it on a table so you can use 600nm...

 

[Bobby B]

The 3 separate independent studies on living rats cochlea showing hair cells regeneration vs a control group all used 810nm.

850nm is close enough to expect similar results.

 

[Bobby B]

What exactly does Zazzio recommend as his protocol?

I have my laser here and I use it now and again but as I'm not sure of a specific protocol it makes it rather hard to commit to.Anyone please help me with this?

@bill 112
dr Zazzio protocol and that's explained in his published H study, is to use high power for short time like 10min per ear and to do it once or twice a week and not more as more often produced diminished results based on his experience with patients .

 

[bill 112]

@bill 112
dr Zazzio protocol and that's explained in his published H study, is to use high power for short time like 10min per ear and to do it once or twice a week and not more as more often produced diminished results based on his experience with patients .

What kind of power are we talking about Bobby?I'm currently using the Konftec laser 40 minutes every day with a one day break every 3rd day.I have the laser a few months now but have failed to get into a reliable routine.

Also thanks for the reply.

 

[Bobby B]

He uses around 650 mw
That's 10 times the power of the konftec

When using LED vs Laser a lot more light is scattered obviousely - which makes it also safer - still when you have 5000mw to start with even with all the scattering and wasting you still have plenty light left to get inside at the desired spot and around

 

[Tom Cnyc]

Before realizing that you were in NYC, I thought that your forum name Cnyc meant "cynic" actually. That's how I was reading it to myself.

Ha. It's actually an intentional mix of both.

 

[VRZ78]

What exactly does Zazzio recommend as his protocol?

I have my laser here and I use it now and again but as I'm not sure of a specific protocol it makes it rather hard to commit to.Anyone please help me with this?

He uses 810 at 500mw for 10 minutes and 650 at 30 mw for 20 minutes.

 

[BBApple]

He uses around 650 mw
That's 10 times the power of the konftec

When using LED vs Laser a lot more light is scattered obviousely - which makes it also safer - still when you have 5000mw to start with even with all the scattering and wasting you still have plenty light left to get inside at the desired spot and around

No offence but how do you know the LED will work as well as the laser? Can you really be sure enough energy reaches the cochlea with so much scattering? I suppose with the negligible cost it's worth a shot. I'm about to order my lucky laser. Sure hope it's lucky for me.

It sounds to me like your T is so mild you can forget about it a lot of the time. If that's the case, why are you still here? I don't think any of us are delusional enough to think we will be "cured". I would certainly be overjoyed with bringing the volume down to where it was for 9 years up until about 2 months ago when it started to become intrusive. Don't get me wrong. I appreciate your enormous contributions to LT but I know I wouldn't be anywhere near these forums if T wasn't slowly chipping away at my life.

 

[Zechariah]

To clarify, you mean 850nm, not 650nm?

Nope, I mean 650nm

https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/f/f1/EM_spectrum.svg/787px-EM_spectrum.svg.png

@Markku or some admin, can you move this Off-topic spam of Bobby B to some other thread? Maybe you could create own thread for him and people interested in light therapies?

 

[MikeGreen]

I wouldnt recommend this.

 

[Bobby B]

@Zechariah
Well this is the thread of the LLLt therapy on a budget for under 100 dollars right ?

My T isn't mild and LLLT hasn't cured it either but it has helped for sound quality and H

I had painful H for months

I Also bought the lucky laser but now with these high power LED light source available We don't even need it .
certainly not worth spending 1500 dollars on light therapy if you can do it for 12 and get a much more powerful light source.

I don't have any agenda in this - I am not selling anything contrarly to some others here.

 

[BBApple]

@Zechariah
Well this is the thread of the LLLt therapy on a budget for under 100 dollars right ?

My T isn't mild and LLLT hasn't cured it either but it has helped for sound quality and H

I had painful H for months

I Also bought the lucky laser but now with these high power LED light source available We don't even need it .
certainly not worth spending 1500 dollars on light therapy if you can do it for 12 and get a much more powerful light source.

I don't have any agenda in this - I am not selling anything contrarly to some others here.

If these cheap, high powered LEDs were enough, why do people like Wilden still use lasers? Something tells me it's just not that simple.

I can definitely relate to the H. I don't have pain but any minimal noise sends the T blaring. The sound of the fridge, TV, etc. all ramp up the T. Even if the laser removes this reactivity, I will be far better off.

 

[Tom Cnyc]

If these cheap, high powered LEDs were enough, why do people like Wilden still use lasers? Something tells me it's just not that simple.

If you've read this thread, you'll see that the lasers aren't expensive either. That's the raison d'etre of the thread. CityJohn has indicated he could build Wilden's HeNe laser for under a grand.

The lasers used in the lucky laser cost about 12 bucks. The power supply can be purchased for around 50.

 

[Zechariah]

@Zechariah
Well this is the thread of the LLLt therapy on a budget for under 100 dollars right ?

My T isn't mild and LLLT hasn't cured it either but it has helped for sound quality and H

I had painful H for months

I Also bought the lucky laser but now with these high power LED light source available We don't even need it .
certainly not worth spending 1500 dollars on light therapy if you can do it for 12 and get a much more powerful light source.

I don't have any agenda in this - I am not selling anything contrarly to some others here.

Please, don't promote your light treatments in LLLT-related threads. Please create own thread for them. I can only beg you to do the right thing.

 

[Bobby B]

@Zechariah
How many separate low budget LLLT threads do we need ?

You need to chill out - This is simple info sharing , i am not promoting any of my treatment because I don't own any ...

I whish someone told me there were high power 850nm LED lamps ready before I spent the money on the lucky laser

Wilden uses a 20,000 watts pulsed laser at his office with broad coverage - coverage is key .

He had it built a long time before high power affordable LED were available and this must be using a set of expensive lenses to avoid tissue injury at these high power settings.

The small lasers he sells are very underpowered and will not yield similar results by far...

High power and broad coverage is key for LLLT and to do it safely and cheaply can only be done by LED - again refer to Doc Hamblin interview

I used two much more powerful and wide coverage device besides the lucky laser and felt that this is the way to go in terms of results and ease of use - 10 min twice a week.

I am not using the laser much these days

 

[Zechariah]

@Zechariah
How many separate low budget LLLT threads do we need ?

You need to chill out - This is simple info sharing , i am not promoting any of my treatment because I don't own any ...

I whish someone told me there were high power 850nm LED lamps ready before I spent the money on the lucky laser

Wilden uses a 20,000 watts pulsed laser at his office with broad coverage - coverage is key .

He had it built a long time before high power affordable LED were available and this must be using a set of expensive lenses to avoid tissue injury at these high power settings.

The small lasers he sells are very underpowered and will not yield similar results by far...

High power and broad coverage is key for LLLT and to do it safely and cheaply can only be done by LED - again refer to Doc Hamblin interview

I used two much more powerful and wide coverage device besides the lucky laser and felt that this is the way to go in terms of results and ease of use - 10 min twice a week.

I am not using the laser much these days

I believe that this thread is about LLLT meaning Low Level Laser Therapy. Can you please create your own thread for this LED Light therapy?