DIY Low-Level Laser Therapy for Tinnitus on a Budget — LLLT Under 100,-

[Bobby B]

@Tom Cnyc
No info on wavelengths
Can't say if this is useful

But if this lamp emits too much light over 1.5nm then it may get too hot too quickly and be ineffective and maybe even harmful to the inner ear fluids

 

[Tom Cnyc]

You making any progress @Bobby B ?

 

[Bobby B]

@Tom Cnyc
Doing pretty good I guess
Sound quality keeps improving very slightly every months and H is down
T has decreased a lot only noticeable in complete silence but not cured

It's really a 3-4 years project - I do it only once a week now

 

[Tom Cnyc]

That sounds great, @Bobby B

 

[Blue28]

I'm glad to hear that things are improving for you @Bobby B, are you using a laser unit?

@lymebite how are you getting in with your RLM mini?

 

[Bobby B]

@Blue28
I am using the more powerful filtered light unit I mentionned before

It's about 1800mw of optical power in the 600-1500nm range, peak at 1000nm

 

[lymebite]

lymebite how are you getting in with your RLM mini?

Still at it, nothing to report. I am expecting it will take many months before it helps, if it does at all.

 

[Bill Smith]

Hi, I'm happy to report my experiences with this 'laser-pillow'.
Blessed relief for me!

 

[Tom Cnyc]

Hi, I'm happy to report my experiences with this 'laser-pillow'.
Blessed relief for me!
View attachment 13208

One post. No avatar. No intro. Just sweet relief and a link to buy something.

RIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIGHT.

 

[Bill Smith]

Tom Cnyc

I'm sorry you found my message unhelpful. All I was trying to convey was that I had some positive experience in this area. I enclosed an image because I understand other laser applications are constructions you wear on the head? I find the 'pillow' convenient because you just sleep on it. Financially, it's nothing to do with me.

Kind Regards
'Bill'
Regina near London

 

[Kaivey]

Hi CityJohn

I haven't a clue on how to assemble that device. Have you got a picture of the finished project?

Did you ever get some of these devices made for sale?

I've had tinnitus for 30 years and I got entirely used to it. I think it softened in time and I could meditate and hear a gentle hush noise which wasn't too unpleasant. There was always a little bit of a whistle at 13 KHz, but that softened too. If I really listened I could hear a whole orchestra of noise and I marvelled at how the mind could filter it out.

I always took real care of my hearing but a few months ago I started making my own music on my PC. I would be working on the same track for weeks on ends and I didn't want to annoy the neighbours so I used headphones a fair bit too. I thought I was being careful with the headphones but I loved the music I was making so I would get wrapped in it. Last night I realised my tinnitus was now twice as loud as before and was intrusive. I hated myself for doing such a stupid thing when I knew I had tinnitus. I didn't think I would make my tinnitus worse with the way I was using headphones but I should have been more careful as I obviously have a vulnerability. I'm now beating myself up. Perhaps it will fade again over the next few weeks as I really don't feal that my recent headphone use could have caused much damage.

 

[mjroth]

I used the bulb http://a.co/gLRecJ2 and found it very good.

It's 660nm, good range for LLLT. No fan so silent, but never gets too hot to touch (does gets warm).
Nominally rate at 36W but closer to 25W. Still a lot of light.

I attached it to homedepot cord light and makes good handle and switch. Just remove the plastic guard.

https://www.homedepot.com/p/Woods-7...ble-Light-with-Hook-and-Switch-E237/301132958

I use it for treating MTP cased by TMJD so have no idea if effective for treating inner ear but as likely to work as any such light treatment and a lot cheaper.

 

[morgothaod]

Can someone post a video on how to assemble this contraption?

 

[Noise_sucks]

I used the bulb http://a.co/gLRecJ2 and found it very good.

It's 660nm, good range for LLLT. No fan so silent, but never gets too hot to touch (does gets warm).
Nominally rate at 36W but closer to 25W. Still a lot of light.

I attached it to homedepot cord light and makes good handle and switch. Just remove the plastic guard.

https://www.homedepot.com/p/Woods-7...ble-Light-with-Hook-and-Switch-E237/301132958

I use it for treating MTP cased by TMJD so have no idea if effective for treating inner ear but as likely to work as any such light treatment and a lot cheaper.

Hi mjroth, can you tell something about your experiences with using that device? Did it have any effect on your condition?

 

[Anima]

I'm sorry, but I don't quite agree with you. Led and laser lights are a bit different, so led light shouldn't be used to treat tinnitus because it won't work. It works for growing plants, but fails when is used for certain medical purposes.

Please, have a look at this link:
LASER vs. LED: What's the Difference? - Acupuncture Technology News

Regards

 

[Noise_sucks]

Please, have a look at this link:
LASER vs. LED: What's the Difference? - Acupuncture Technology News

Says a Laser-Manufacturer..

@Bobby B provided an excellent Link in the depth of this Thread where Michael R. Hamblin himself (the "Godfather" of LLLT) says that the source of Light (Laser, LED) does not matter. It's all about wavelength, Power and penetration depth.

 

[Jan64]

I used the bulb http://a.co/gLRecJ2 and found it very good.

It's 660nm, good range for LLLT. No fan so silent, but never gets too hot to touch (does gets warm).
Nominally rate at 36W but closer to 25W. Still a lot of light.

I attached it to homedepot cord light and makes good handle and switch. Just remove the plastic guard.

https://www.homedepot.com/p/Woods-7...ble-Light-with-Hook-and-Switch-E237/301132958

I use it for treating MTP cased by TMJD so have no idea if effective for treating inner ear but as likely to work as any such light treatment and a lot cheaper.

One question: when you place the bulb on your hand, does light go through your hand?

 

[mjroth]

@Anima you are correct, there are difference between laser and LEDs, but @Noise_sucks is also right, the linked you refereed to is also just marketing hype. Lasers by definition are coherent, monochromatic and columnated. LEDs are not. But none of this matters. The bioactive range of the body is fairly large (about 1000nm to to almost 500nm) so as long as most of the enegy is in that range, monochromatic doesn't impact effectiveness. Since the angle is incidences has very little impact on how many photon a cell absorbs, calumniation has little impact. That only leaves coherent. Since light scatters almost very quickly upon layer of almost opaque skin, coherence is almost instantly lost upon entering the body. although many people, like this marketer, have claimed laser are better than leds, no one has come up with a coherent [haha] to explain why. LEDs on the other hand are much cheaper and efficient and provide a much more bang for the buck and much safer and easier to handle. It turn out that plants are photosensitive to the same frequency range as animal flesh and the mechanisms involved are very similar. Bobby is right penetration depth is very important but as far as I can tell is is strictly a function wavelength and power, and i'm not even sure about power (q: if a hold a low power long enough, can I get the same energy at a given depth?)

 

[mjroth]

@Jan64 yes. A lot through the finger but less as my hand gets thicker.

 

[mjroth]

@Noise_sucks Short answer is YES!

That said, I don't know anything about your condition so can't say if it will help you. My T is somatosensory and caused 100% by myofascial trigger points on my face, neck and back (include these caused by TMJD). Light therapy has had a tremendous impact on relieving trigger points all over my body. including those that cause my T, more so than anything else I have tried-diet, supplements and other therapies.

 

[Anima]

Says a Laser-Manufacturer..

@Bobby B provided an excellent Link in the depth of this Thread where Michael R. Hamblin himself (the "Godfather" of LLLT) says that the source of Light (Laser, LED) does not matter. It's all about wavelength, Power and penetration depth.

Noise sucks, thanks for the information. I'm sorry if the link I provided was not reliable for you. I Wonder what would Dr. Wilden, Bäckman, Harila, and the rest of the laser therapy gurus, have to say about led light to treat tinnitus. It would be very interesting to know.

 

[Anima]

@Anima you are correct, there are difference between laser and LEDs, but @Noise_sucks is also right, the linked you refereed to is also just marketing hype. Lasers by definition are coherent, monochromatic and columnated. LEDs are not. But none of this matters. The bioactive range of the body is fairly large (about 1000nm to to almost 500nm) so as long as most of the enegy is in that range, monochromatic doesn't impact effectiveness. Since the angle is incidences has very little impact on how many photon a cell absorbs, calumniation has little impact. That only leaves coherent. Since light scatters almost very quickly upon layer of almost opaque skin, coherence is almost instantly lost upon entering the body. although many people, like this marketer, have claimed laser are better than leds, no one has come up with a coherent [haha] to explain why. LEDs on the other hand are much cheaper and efficient and provide a much more bang for the buck and much safer and easier to handle. It turn out that plants are photosensitive to the same frequency range as animal flesh and the mechanisms involved are very similar. Bobby is right penetration depth is very important but as far as I can tell is is strictly a function wavelength and power, and i'm not even sure about power (q: if a hold a low power long enough, can I get the same energy at a given depth?)

Mjroth, thank you for the information. I wish someone had the answer to your question.

 

[Greg Sacramento]

@mjroth Interesting. How far do you keep it from your neck and how long in time do you keep it in one place? Where are the places that you use it? Thanks

 

[Noise_sucks]

I Wonder what would Dr. Wilden, Bäckman, Harila, and the rest of the laser therapy gurus, have to say about led light to treat tinnitus. It would be very interesting to know.

I guess they would be in denial about any therapeutic benefits. But only because it is extremely bad to their business.
Imagine every potential paying customer having an serious alternative available they could get for just around ~100 Bucks and use that thing anytime and anywhere they want. Oh, Lord!

 

[Jan64]

LED's and laser diodes are cheap. I ordered a laser module (diode + electronics + lens, 60 mW, 660 nm) from Alibaba for $50,-. Then just add a switch and a battery pack (2 * 1,5 V).

For your information: I once opened the probe (where the diode is, and the beam comes out) of the Konftec EmLas 520 (808 nm and 660 nm). The main components are the diode, a steel cooler and some electronic components attached to a small printed circuit board. The diode is soldered on the circuit board.
Two wires (a '+' and a '-' wire) come out of the 'probe' (what is the right English word?) and are attached to a battery pack with 2 rechargable batteries (2 * 1,5V), a timer, and an on/off switch.

 

[Bobby B]

60mw is much too weak

Get a 20w LED

Safer than laser as well

 

[Jan64]

60mw is much too weak

Get a 20w LED

Safer than laser as well

Light is light, oké. But the light has to delivered in the cochlea. With laser you get a coherent light, which is targeget on the cochlea. LED is non-coherent. But I also bought a LED device (same as @Noise_sucks ) so I can compare in the future...

 

[Bobby B]

wilden is using a 20w laser at his office

the light we use for ears has been defocused just like a LED is, using lenses its not the regular laser beam

 

[Jan64]

wilden is using a 20w laser at his office

the light we use for ears has been defocused just like a LED is, using lenses its not the regular laser beam

I do not think so: to my information dr. Wilden uses lasers of between 200 and 500 mWatt. Depends on the wave length. But I think that people who have been treated by dr. Wilden can give the best information.

On his website:

• The low level laser light is applied by means of three lasers with a total dosage of at least 4000 joule. Every laser emits 830 nm and 630-700 nm at the same time. The low level laser light is distributed extensively to transfuse the whole surroundings of the organ with photon energy and thus ensure the best possible biostimulative effect.
  This is the prerequisite for an enduring positive long-term effect of the low level laser therapy.

• The duration of the tinnitus treatment is 60 minutes.

60 minutes of 20W would be 3600*20= 72.ooo J. On his website (see above) he states that the dose is 4000 J per treatment. So it is not plausible that dr. Wilden uses lasers of 20W.

 

[Bobby B]

Wilden uses a 20w pulsed laser not continuous

Your maths would be correct if the cells you are trying to irradiate are lying on a table - unfortunately the cochlea is cast deep in the thickest bone of the skull

Read these studies on the issues of using mw range light sources on the head

http://www.laserfocusworld.com/arti...ates-skull-to-aid-traumatic-brain-injury.html