I Don't Believe 20% of People Have Tinnitus

[Sam Bridge]

Another thought: I noticed that the total member number here is around 26K and Tinnitus Talk is the most known tinnitus forum I have ever found, yet the American Tinnitus Association claims there's over 50M of tinnitus sufferers just in the US alone.

If that was really true then Tinnitus Talk would rival Facebook in member base! lol yeah right.

Maybe most people have very mild tinnitus?

 

[MuffinMan]

Maybe most people have very mild tinnitus?

Unnoticeably mild = normal.

All ears make a very gentle noise in total silence.

 

[Red]

Another thought: I noticed that the total member number here is around 26K and Tinnitus Talk is the most known tinnitus forum I have ever found, yet the American Tinnitus Association claims there's over 50M of tinnitus sufferers just in the US alone.

If that was really true then Tinnitus Talk would rival Facebook in member base! lol yeah right.

If tinnitus population is between 10%-20%... and I go with 15%... and then 3% of that 15% have bothersome tinnitus which is... 0.0045%

Now 26,000 of 50,000,000 would turn out to be... 0.05%. So not perfect but kinda in the ballpark here.

Please correct me if I'm wrong but seems to line up??

 

[MuffinMan]

If tinnitus population is between 10%-20%... and I go with 15%... and then 3% of that 15% have bothersome tinnitus which is... 0.0045%

Now 26,000 of 50,000,000 would turn out to be... 0.05%. So not perfect but kinda in the ballpark here.

Please correct me if I'm wrong but seems to line up??

I wonder how their guys define Tinnitus, if they only hear it in isolated silent room or only experienced for some minutes, then that's not tinnitus at all.

For example an ENT was like "Hey, in our country alone there are 1M out of our 4M population.".

By taking a quick look at the memberlist here I see no else from my country; hell even rarely from the whole middle east, I noticed only one member from UAE and he may be expat.

So where are they? I hardly believe that out of 1M I am the only one from Lebanon here. So I am the only one out of 1M who is a whiner about this lol?

It seems this number is an urban myth originated from a loosely done survey and all Doctors worldwide adopted it as a fact. ie. Like when they all thought that olive oil is bad for you ages ago.

 

[MuffinMan]

That's because most people think it's normal and they don't care about it enough to be bothered by it, I had T since i was a child and i always thought it was normal to have it...it wasn't until i went to a concert that totally unleashed my T that i understood the noise had a name. Lots of people have T they just don't realize they have it, and most just go about their normal days without caring about it. I only started caring when the noise was very noticeable and bothered me a lot.


When i talked about it with my brother or my friends...i found out 90% of my gamer buddies have it, and my brother has it too...he just told me to learn to live with it like everyone else...very annoying but that's what brothers will say

Did you use to game with headphones before you get your tinnitus?

 

[Sam Bridge]

Unnoticeably mild = normal.

All ears make a very gentle noise in total silence.

No I never heard any noise before I got tinnitus...

Why do you assume everyone with tinnitus will sign up here anyway?

 

[Jazzer]

So basically we need to stop living? Each day let tinnitus win? Compared to 30+ years ago, there is much much more awareness for tinnitus. Lots of work still needs to be done. I see your point of view about a cure being found and us finding silence again. BUT I also know that we NEED to live our lives.... no matter how mild, moderate or severe our suffering is.

I am on the last stage and the tinnitus is beyond HELL level. If I followed your advice, what good would it do me? How far would I get in my life? You are frustrated and I see that. At your stage of your tinnitus journey, I was probably frustrated too. I did eventually realize that the inner conflict that we can create will not do any good. Listen to what I say, I been in your shoes and have faced this demon for 30 years.

Plenty is being done for research and more is being done. Things hopefully shall get better and hopefully a cure will be found. Live your life, make your days count. It's never easy, life is never easy. It's all about getting back up WHEN we get knocked down.

Anger rants and vents simply in the end make us more frustrated and where does that really get us? Does it make a cure come faster? I am someone that has intrusive crap tinnitus and close to profound hearing loss. So TRUST ME.....I get it and I face it. ALSO, I am positive about it......I have no time for negativity in my life.

My 2 cents....

Fishbone - you are a battler - no question.
Your stoical approach is the only attitude to have if we wish to survive this {{{ SHIT !!! }}}.

Every single person with severe Tinnitus is a battler! - to have battled their way through to whereever they are now!
Accepting the extreme severity of our condition is not negative - it is the only place to start.
"Know thine enemy."
Reality is all we've got - unfortunately.

Unreality = insanity.

With this piece of {{{ SHITE !!! }}} it is no wonder we vear from despair to anger to hope to sadness, and back again.

 

[MuffinMan]

No I never heard any noise before I got tinnitus...

Why do you assume everyone with tinnitus will sign up here anyway?

Not everyone would sign up, but even if we take 5% of 50M, you will get 2.5M, that's from the US alone.
If the numbers were true TT would surely have way more than 26K(i am not saying all necessarily would be active, some may sign up to ask one question only).

 

[coffee_girl]

Not everyone would sign up, but even if we take 5% of 50M, you will get 2.5M, that's from the US alone.
If the numbers were true TT would surely have way more than 26K(i am not saying all necessarily would be active, some may sign up to ask one question only).

Because most people see no reason to sign up, most do not like to use forums or are uncomfortable doing so. I frequent dog forums a lot and lurk on there... I can find answers to everything I want... No need to make an account. Also, I'm sure lots of T sufferers have it very mild and don't feel the need to come here

 

[Tinker Bell]

Not everyone would sign up, but even if we take 5% of 50M, you will get 2.5M, that's from the US alone.
If the numbers were true TT would surely have way more than 26K(i am not saying all necessarily would be active, some may sign up to ask one question only).

Not everyone seeks online support. Some find adequate support through family or friends. Older generations typically do not seek out online support, and I suspect most of the reported tinnitus cases are in individuals age 65 and older. The 75 year olds I met with tinnitus are rarely online. They're certainly not going to seek out an online tinnitus forum. They talk to their friends and family.

Then there are likely many people who have been living with tinnitus for decades. Why join a support forum for a condition you can already manage? I know several people with hearing loss and very loud tinnitus. They have lived with it for 20+ years.

I was born with a health condition. I have never sought out a support forum. I am sure they exist but I see no need to frequent one. I already know how to live with my condition.

 

[coffee_girl]

Not to mention there are millions of people globally with no access to the web, do not speak English, do not know how to use the computer, they don't find forum support helpful, they habituated and don't need the forums, or they eventually get cured (T goes away on its own).

 

[MuffinMan]

Not to mention there are millions of people globally with no access to the web, do not speak English, do not know how to use the computer, they don't find forum support helpful, they habituated and don't need the forums, or they eventually get cured (T goes away on its own).

That's why I mentioned US only, but Tinker Bell's age argument makes sense though.

So maybe only the "young" (less than 60) T sufferers who are very rare.

 

[Red]

I wonder how their guys define Tinnitus, if they only hear it in isolated silent room or only experienced for some minutes, then that's not tinnitus at all.

For example an ENT was like "Hey, in our country alone there are 1M out of our 4M population.".

By taking a quick look at the memberlist here I see no else from my country; hell even rarely from the whole middle east, I noticed only one member from UAE and he may be expat.

So where are they? I hardly believe that out of 1M I am the only one from Lebanon here. So I am the only one out of 1M who is a whiner about this lol?

It seems this number is an urban myth originated from a loosely done survey and all Doctors worldwide adopted it as a fact. ie. Like when they all thought that olive oil is bad for you ages ago.

The criteria was people that have "ever experienced tinnitus in their life."
Think about that wording. It means temporary tinnitus from a club or earwax blockage. It means fleeting tinnitus. It means acute tinnitus.
Why would they make the criteria for that so wide.

 

[MuffinMan]

The criteria was people that have "ever experienced tinnitus in their life."
Think about that wording. It means temporary tinnitus from a club or earwax blockage. It means fleeting tinnitus. It means acute tinnitus.
Why would they make the criteria for that so wide.

In other term, the number comes from a BS survey.

 

[coffee_girl]

Well lots of people with T don't know their condition has a name... Plenty of the people on the forums didn't know what T was before they even got it. I definitely did not

 

[Red]

Well lots of people with T don't know their condition has a name... Plenty of the people on the forums didn't know what T was before they even got it. I definitely did not

I wish someone would have told me I could have gotten tinnitus from using headphones. (Never listened to loud music btw! Always on low volume) Not only is there no cure/treatment but there's no awareness/education.

 

[MuffinMan]

I wish someone would have told me I could have gotten tinnitus from using headphones. (Never listened to loud music btw! Always on low volume) Not only is there no cure/treatment but there's no awareness/education.

I occasionally used headphones but on low volume; but like 99% of modern humans. Sigh.

Hell, I was never into nights clubs and concerts; always avoided loud events.

The reason probably why there's not much awarness because only the unlucky few are that much sensitive to loud volume; I believe there's a genetic predisposition to that; my brother has it too.
Coffee girl said her brother has it too, if i recall right.

Hmm.

 

[GregCA]

I wish someone would have told me I could have gotten tinnitus from using headphones. (Never listened to loud music btw! Always on low volume)

How do you know that it's headphones used at low volume that is the culprit?

 

[kelpiemsp]

How do you know that it's headphones used at low volume that is the culprit?

Because if you say something enough times it will become true.

 

[Red]

I occasionally used headphones but on low volume; but like 99% of modern humans. Sigh.

Hell, I was never into nights clubs and concerts; always avoided loud events.

The reason probably why there's not much awarness because only the unlucky few are that much sensitive to loud volume; I believe there's a genetic predisposition to that; my brother has it too.
Coffee girl said her brother has it too, if i recall right.

Hmm.

Yep! Same here. My SO has reminded me multiple times that I've been sensitive to sound as long as he's known me whenever I talk about my hyperacusis.

How do you know that it's headphones used at low volume that is the culprit?

I didn't say the full story. It's a bit more than that of course. I was never a big music listener but I was watching videos with them. People use airhorns as a sound effect for putting someone in their place or to accompany something ridiculous. So watching a YouTube video with low volume and a person using airhorn SX = tinnitus and hyperacusis. And yes, there was an immediate response. One ear felt full and liquidy with things 'sounding weird' and the other ear was in pain. I continued using headphones in these early days vowing to never watch another video with headphones.

However the one hobby that I have (had?) and loved I used headphones for because it requires voice chat. I had negligible 'only hear in a very silent room or while trying to sleep' type tinnitus. I habituated in only a month and forgot I had it.

Then while I was in voice chat some idiot screamed very loudly for a sustained period. (Think 4 seconds vs. 1 second as an example) This event made my T and H permanently worse and is what lead me here.

Perhaps headphones might be safe if the sound didn't vary at all. But it does for anything besides perhaps white noise. So human speech, music, movies...these all have a chance to have a dangerous rise in volume. I will never trust sound in or near my ears again. Not even a phone. I use exclusively speaker.

 

[GregCA]

I didn't say the full story. It's a bit more than that of course. I was never a big music listener but I was watching videos with them. People use airhorns as a sound effect for putting someone in their place or to accompany something ridiculous. So watching a YouTube video with low volume and a person using airhorn SX = tinnitus and hyperacusis. And yes, there was an immediate response. One ear felt full and liquidy with things 'sounding weird' and the other ear was in pain. I continued using headphones in these early days vowing to never watch another video with headphones.

However the one hobby that I have (had?) and loved I used headphones for because it requires voice chat. I had negligible 'only hear in a very silent room or while trying to sleep' type tinnitus. I habituated in only a month and forgot I had it.

Then while I was in voice chat some idiot screamed very loudly for a sustained period. (Think 4 seconds vs. 1 second as an example) This event made my T and H permanently worse and is what lead me here.

Perhaps headphones might be safe if the sound didn't vary at all. But it does for anything besides perhaps white noise. So human speech, music, movies...these all have a chance to have a dangerous rise in volume. I will never trust sound in or near my ears again. Not even a phone. I use exclusively speaker.

From your description, it's not headphones at low volume that caused you trouble: you're actually correlating your T/H to very specific events that were loud while you were wearing headphones.

 

[Red]

From your description, it's not headphones at low volume that caused you trouble: you're actually correlating your T/H to very specific events that were loud while you were wearing headphones.

I don't know what you're getting at. I can only get two different things out of this:

1. You're specifying that it wasn't listening to headphones at low volume because it was loud SX that caused it. I am saying that such a distinction is irrelevant because sharp increases in volume are inevitable.

or..

2. You are doubting that headphones actually caused my T/H.

 

[Red]

Because if you say something enough times it will become true.

That is rather rude of you to say. I don't go around the forum questioning the ways in which people got their tinnitus. Should I go up to Jazzer and question him and say "Maybe you just think you got tinnitus from someone blasting his instrument at you point blank?"

I understand the conversation on how much headphones can harm tinnitus is controversial. But unless you've stood in my shoes, do not presume to know what did or didn't cause my tinnitus.

 

[coffee_girl]

I don't know if low volume head phone use causes T but I'll tell you guys a true story:

Once upon a time (2 weeks after the concert that caused my T to erupt), I discovered that my T was slowly going away...fading to the point of not hearing it over everyday sounds. So stupidly I decided to listen to an E-book with headphone plugs loosely lodged in my ear. It was set to 10/100 in volume...very low...a slight breeze would mask it.

The next thing I knew, coming home...i could hear a louder buzz. I don't know if it was a coincidence or what.

Later on...about a year later...i was habituated to my T and decided to use head phones again (actual head phones and not plugs)...I set the volume to very low when gaming ....i never got any spikes. Used headphones for about 2 months every day, then stopped. I felt i was playing with fire so i never went back to it.

I think using them too close to the initial exposure is very dangerous, your ears are still trying to heal. But perhaps after many many years...it may be safe?

OMG i don't recommend it !!!

 

[GregCA]

I don't know what you're getting at. I can only get two different things out of this:

1. You're specifying that it wasn't listening to headphones at low volume because it was loud SX that caused it. I am saying that such a distinction is irrelevant because sharp increases in volume are inevitable.

If you hear a loud sound in your headphones, then it doesn't fit the definition of using them at low volume, does it?

I hope the following doesn't sound patronizing: it's not intended to be, and it is not as obvious as it seems (the last paragraph before the next quote will show why): perhaps you are not familiar with how the volume setting of your headphones works, but it is generally a slider that is either physical (embedded in the hardware) or logical (as software), which will essentially limit the amplitude of the voltage that ends up feeding the actual drivers (ie the speakers that sit near your ears).

So if you were to listen at low volume, that max voltage would have been set such that even the loudest signal being fed to your headphones would be clamped down by the voltage limiter, and not cause an acoustic trauma.

The danger happens when you listen to soft sounds (which are represented by low amplitude voltages) on headphones that do NOT have the volume slider down (ie they are not being set to "low volume"). You do perceive those sounds at fairly low volume, but the volume slider does not protect you from surges. If you have a high voltage "surprise" in your content, then you will actually feel it as loud through your headphones. I suspect that is what caused your acoustic traumas.

I think you are confusing "I'm hearing something softly through my headphones" and "my headphones are set to a low volume": you can be listening to soft music on headphones that are set to max volume. That is dangerous!

A common trap is to use apps on computers that have their own volume slider: let's say you have your music app with its slider set at 10%, which you rightfully feel is soft. What this doesn't show you is that the computer itself may still have its own volume set to the max! So you're happily listening to your music, and all of a sudden some other program makes some sound (for example, an incoming email notification sound), which isn't being clamped by your 10% setting on the music app! Instead it'll come out full blast!
This is a trap that is easy to fall into: I admit I've gotten a few close calls myself.

2. You are doubting that headphones actually caused my T/H.

I don't doubt that the headphones were the tool by which your T/H came about, but I think the loud noise that you fed your ears through your headphones are the problem, not the headphones themselves.

 

[kelpiemsp]

That is rather rude of you to say. I don't go around the forum questioning the ways in which people got their tinnitus. Should I go up to Jazzer and question him and say "Maybe you just think you got tinnitus from someone blasting his instrument at you point blank?"

I understand the conversation on how much headphones can harm tinnitus is controversial. But unless you've stood in my shoes, do not presume to know what did or didn't cause my tinnitus.

I'm sorry you feel that way. I was under the assumption you were listening at low levels of volume. I don't doubt that headphones did it, but I don't believe that sound played quietly through headphones does. @GregCA post previously explains my thinking.

 

[Honky]

rock stars ...don't want to be seen as wimps. ...I would be very interested to know if Chris Cornell for example had 'ringing ears'.

All musicians have it. Most don't want to admit they damaged their own ears. Musicians that wore ear plugs all the time except the day that the stupid truck air horn blew right into an ear...well, there's no excuses!!!

Think of the military. Nearly 3/4 have the condition. With all these gangs and cops shooting guns without hearing protection there has to be a high percentage there as well.

 

[PDodge]

All musicians have it. Most don't want to admit they damaged their own ears. Musicians that wore ear plugs all the time except the day that the stupid truck air horn blew right into an ear...well, there's no excuses!!!

Think of the military. Nearly 3/4 have the condition. With all these gangs and cops shooting guns without hearing protection there has to be a high percentage there as well.

Probably true. Makes me wish I never played music!

 

[Red]

I'm sorry you feel that way. I was under the assumption you were listening at low levels of volume. I don't doubt that headphones did it, but I don't believe that sound played quietly through headphones does. GregCA post previously explains my thinking.

When I wrote my original post about getting T from headphones on low volume, I knew I wasn't posting the full story and that there was more to it than that. I was fine with explaining despite being aware of the oxymoron. I was not intending to mislead anyone. Posting about it, I did not and do not have an agenda nor do I particularly have an inclination to 'be in the right.'

I've considered you an interesting and intellectual person so I'm both surprised and disappointed that you would make a passive aggressive dig at me and offer up a non-apology. If you're not sorry then you don't need to offer up the illusion that you are.

@GregCA

Thank you for setting the time aside to explain all that. It made your previous posts make more sense to me and explained something I did not know. Perhaps if I would have I might not have T&H today. I see a lot of talk about headphones on the forum, for and against but I have never seen anyone mention or explain this both on and off the site. Seems like an important talking point, though.

 

[kelpiemsp]

When I wrote my original post about getting T from headphones on low volume, I knew I wasn't posting the full story and that there was more to it than that. I was fine with explaining despite being aware of the oxymoron. I was not intending to mislead anyone. Posting about it, I did not and do not have an agenda nor do I particularly have an inclination to 'be in the right.'

I've considered you an interesting and intellectual person so I'm both surprised and disappointed that you would make a passive aggressive dig at me and offer up a non-apology. If you're not sorry then you don't need to offer up the illusion that you are.

@GregCA

Thank you for setting the time aside to explain all that. It made your previous posts make more sense to me and explained something I did not know. Perhaps if I would have I might not have T&H today. I see a lot of talk about headphones on the forum, for and against but I have never seen anyone mention or explain this both on and off the site. Seems like an important talking point, though.

@Red I'm sorry. And for the record, my passive aggressive dig/ micro-aggression wasn't directed at you or your situation but was more a general comment against the crowd that says headphones are bad no matter what and refuses to have an open debate about the differences.