I Just Don't Understand Why My Ears Are So Reactive

[Juan]

Believe me, I know this all to well. You're preaching to the choir. My initial acoustic (blast) trauma was a job related injury.

Were you entitled to compensation?

Yesterday I read this article that another poster linked, and it is quite interesting to see how views differ on tinnitus and hyperacusis when one is trying to treat them and when an ENT is acting for a company trying to deny compensation for job-related injury:

https://www.themonthly.com.au/issue/2018/may/1525096800/kate-cole-adams/when-sound-becomes-pain

 

[Alue]

Were you entitled to compensation?

Yesterday I read this article that another poster linked, and it is quite interesting to see how views differ on tinnitus and hyperacusis when one is trying to treat them and when an ENT is acting for a company trying to deny compensation for job-related injury:

https://www.themonthly.com.au/issue/2018/may/1525096800/kate-cole-adams/when-sound-becomes-pain

That ENT Hooper sounds like a real piece of work. He completely ignores glutamate excitotoxicity and cochlear nerve degeneration and any other pathological process that can cause people to have a delayed reaction to an acoustic trauma. It's like they ignore research in their own field so they can claim anyone injured on the job is just acting or imagining their symptoms.

As for me, doctors have overall agreed with causation, but it's still in process.

 

[Alue]

It's hard to say what caused your restaurant spike. One could be forward neck/head posture looking over your plate of food while chewing with or even without headphones. Threshold lowering with ear protection is possible as with keywords ears and hearing. An occlusion effect. Any of this can cause effect in a New York minute. The zygomatic process as we discussed above - maxillary sinus pressure from protection pressure of headphones may be cause of spike while moving head.

Consider trying a little warmth all over - a minute here and a minute there from the shoulders up. A warm wash cloth rinsed out from sink facet.

Update: Maybe too much salt or sugar in the food.

I'm still pretty sure it's noise level. It was uncomfortably loud, even with earplugs in. People near me that don't have tinnitus thought it was loud. It wasn't other tables, but my own table, people on the other end were drinking and all shouting at/over each other.

I will try a warm heating pad. My neck / upper back areas frequently get tense.

 

[Tom Cnyc]

The American Navy carried out a study on foam earplugs. They concluded that properly inserted, they provided 15 decibels or more in protection. Moreover, the occlusion effect is hampered if the earplugs are placed deep into the ear, getting down to 7 decibels.

You did everything right. It sure seems odd that your tinnitus is acting up. I can't explain it, but I'm thinking to myself that aggravated nerve damage doesn't sound like a plausible explanation.

I am not sure I understand your post.

Are you saying that the occlusion effect is a 15 dB or 7 dB INCREASE with plugs in?

Can you rephrase this please?

 

[Juan]

That ENT Hooper sounds like a real piece of work. He completely ignores glutamate excitotoxicity and cochlear nerve degeneration and any other pathological process that can cause people to have a delayed reaction to an acoustic trauma. It's like they ignore research in their own field so they can claim anyone injured on the job is just acting or imagining their symptoms.

As for me, doctors have overall agreed with causation, but it's still in process.

It would be great if you let us know how your compensation process ends. I dont know if there is a specific post on tinnitustalk on legal issues like compensation, but it is a point where some of us are likely to end too, so it would be awesome to learn from your experience.

 

[Vincent R]

I am not sure I understand your post.

Are you saying that the occlusion effect is a 15 dB or 7 dB INCREASE with plugs in?

Can you rephrase this please?

Sure.

15 DB = the protection level provided by foam earplugs. (Decrease of external sound.)
7DB = the occlusion effect created by foam earplugs. (Increase of internal sound, i.e. your own voice.)

This applies if the earplugs are properly inserted. (I am too lazy google down the studies where I read this, so the numbers are from my memory.)

 

[Fally]

@Alue did your spike go down? I am dealing with much the same issue. Went into the city for therapy came home and Tinnitus has majorly spiked and I was wearing double protection. I dont know why its so reactive. I am wondering if I have made my ears just too over sensitive.

 

[Alue]

@Alue did your spike go down? I am dealing with much the same issue. Went into the city for therapy came home and Tinnitus has majorly spiked and I was wearing double protection. I dont know why its so reactive. I am wondering if I have made my ears just too over sensitive.

It did. Now I'm deliberating about keeping my MRI appointment on Monday... I thought about it for two weeks, found an open (quieter) but not quiet MRI and scheduled it for Monday, but now I'm having major second thoughts. I know for normal people double protection would be more than enough for an MRI. I hate this!

 

[Fally]

It did. Now I'm deliberating about keeping my MRI appointment on Monday... I thought about it for two weeks, found an open (quieter) but not quiet MRI and scheduled it for Monday, but now I'm having major second thoughts. I know for normal people double protection would be more than enough for an MRI. I hate this!

I am glad it went down. Hoping that mine might but its rare for my spikes to go down. Oh dear, I wouldnt know what to do in your position. I am a bit like that regarding the dentist, know I need to go but putting it off. Do you need to go fully into the MRI?

 

[Alue]

I am glad it went down. Hoping that mine might but its rare for my spikes to go down. Oh dear, I wouldnt know what to do in your position. I am a bit like that regarding the dentist, know I need to go but putting it off. Do you need to go fully into the MRI?

No, not a head MRI, but it's a long exam (over an hour) and it's still loud. I'm really stressed. I don't know what to do, but I know nobody can tell me. Of course MRI techs etc. vow that it's safe.

 

[Fally]

No, not a head MRI, but it's a long exam (over an hour) and it's still loud. I'm really stressed. I don't know what to do, but I know nobody can tell me. Of course MRI techs etc. vow that it's safe.

Yikes, do you really need to have it? Because to them it is safe, to us it is not.

 

[Alue]

Yikes, do you really need to have it? Because to them it is safe, to us it is not.

No that's the thing. I don't absolutely need it. I wanted to rule out something bad that's a possibility but not likely. doctor agreed that an MRI was the only thing that could rule it out, but that it wasn't absolutely necessary at this point.

The location has been very helpful, allowing me to listen to the MRI before hand, putting me on cancellation notice, and moving my appointment up to an earlier spot. Now I'm seriously contemplating cancelling the same day. I feel bad, but I shouldn't let that come into consideration. I have indecision paralysis right now. I scheduled time off my busy job too.

 

[Fally]

No that's the thing. I don't absolutely need it. I wanted to rule out something bad that's a possibility but not likely. doctor agreed that an MRI was the only thing that could rule it out, but that it wasn't absolutely necessary at this point.

The location has been very helpful, allowing me to listen to the MRI before hand, putting me on cancellation notice, and moving my appointment up to an earlier spot. Now I'm seriously contemplating cancelling the same day. I feel bad, but I shouldn't let that come into consideration. I have indecision paralysis right now. I scheduled time off my busy job too.

Wow that is a tough one, maybe you need more time to figure it out until your absolutely sure? I know what it's like to be indecisive. I am terrified to go to work tomorrow in case my ears get worse given how sensitive they currently are.

 

[Alue]

Wow that is a tough one, maybe you need more time to figure it out until your absolutely sure? I know what it's like to be indecisive. I am terrified to go to work tomorrow in case my ears get worse given how sensitive they currently are.

Yeah, I over analyze everything, but in certain situations like this where there is no good option I have a hard time.

I know what you mean about going into work. Do you work in a noisy environment? I have a trip scheduled a week from Monday that I'm nervous about too. It's an uncommon part of my job, but it may require working with very noisy equipment that I've already explained is too loud for me. I cannot afford to make my hearing worse now. If things got worse, it would affect my ability to do my job. Then again, in the unlikely chance an MRI would reveal what I fear most, that would affect my ability to keep my job as well.

 

[Fally]

Yeah, I over analyze everything, but in certain situations like this where there is no good option I have a hard time.

I know what you mean about going into work. Do you work in a noisy environment? I have a trip scheduled a week from Monday that I'm nervous about too. It's an uncommon part of my job, but it may require working with very noisy equipment that I've already explained is too loud for me. I cannot afford to make my hearing worse now. If things got worse, it would affect my ability to do my job. Then again, in the unlikely chance an MRI would reveal what I fear most, that would affect my ability to keep my job as well.

Your preaching to the choir here I over analyze everything and it just causes anxiety, hence why i see two therapists. One for generalized anxiety and one for tinnitus lol.

I work in a library, which yes is quiet but I work in a main library so it can get quiet noisy, its four levels and the desk is next to the childrens section so there is constantly children running around screaming. Then there is the noisy teens that come in during the afternoon to do there homework. So i end up wearing my earplugs for most of the day. I am ment to be on the desk for six hours tomorrow and I just dont know if i can handle dealing with people for that long with how bad my anxiety is.

Yikes that is not good! They arent accommodating in not letting you use it? Across the street from my work there using this massive jack hammer and i had to wear muffs around the library to the point my boss sent me to another library because they were worried about me. The entire four story building was shaking. There always really understanding with what im going through which makes things easier. It doesnt sound good with what you think the MRI might reveal. I do hope you are okay.

 

[Contrast]

Reactive tinnitus and pain hyperacusis are not the same thing. debate me

 

[Fally]

Reactive tinnitus and pain hyperacusis are not the same thing. debate me

I agree. I was told I had hypercausis but I never get any sort of pain. My Tinnitus also reacts to sounds like the flipping air con and computer fan.

 

[Contrast]

I agree. I was told I had hypercausis but I never get any sort of pain. My Tinnitus also reacts to sounds like the flipping air con and computer fan.

How long have you had abnormal amplification of noise?

 

[Fally]

How long have you had abnormal amplification of noise?

I noticed the abnormal amplification last two weeks. With my ear plugs in everything sounds loud and crystal which I know it shouldnt.

 

[Contrast]

I noticed the abnormal amplification last two weeks. With my ear plugs in everything sounds loud and crystal which I know it shouldnt.

So you've had tinnitus for 6 years, but the "amplification hyperacusis" just began two weeks ago?

 

[Fally]

So you've had tinnitus for 6 years, but the "amplification hyperacusis" just began two weeks ago?

My doctors think ive always had it hence why my tinnitus continues to get worse because my ears are so oversensitive. I always just assumed i had really good hearing. But ive really noticed it in the last two weeks.

 

[Alue]

Reactive tinnitus and pain hyperacusis are not the same thing. debate me

You bring this up a lot. No they aren't the same, there are likely different types of hyperacusis each with different etiologies, but I don't get your motivation in correcting everyone that says they have reactive tinnitus or uses hyperacusis as an umbrella term when talking about a collapse in noise tolerance. Sometimes they can be comorbid.

 

[Contrast]

You bring this up a lot. No they aren't the same, there are likely different types of hyperacusis each with different etiologies, but I don't get your motivation in correcting everyone that says they have reactive tinnitus or uses hyperacusis as an umbrella term when talking about a collapse in noise tolerance. Sometimes they can be comorbid.

no the problem is Michael Leigh is spreading mal-information.

 

[Contrast]

You bring this up a lot. No they aren't the same, there are likely different types of hyperacusis each with different etiologies, but I don't get your motivation in correcting everyone that says they have reactive tinnitus or uses hyperacusis as an umbrella term when talking about a collapse in noise tolerance. Sometimes they can be comorbid.

It isn't proper to call reactive tinnitus and the same thing as hyperacusis, even if they share pathologies.

The only person saying that reactive tinnitus is hyperacusis is Michael Leigh

 

[Contrast]

I personally believe some cases of tinnitus and preceived loudness amplification are connected, but not "noise induced pain" That is something else.

 

[Marko Nakovski]

Reactive tinnitus and hyperacusis are completely different symptoms. One can have hyperacusis and spiked tinnitus which is normal as the pain can cause the tinnitus to go through the roof. Also one can have reactive tinnitus without hyperacusis and any pain from sounds but tinnitus can still spike even after some low level sound.

I don't understand these things very well but I'm sure they are different. But some people can have both of them at the same time.

 

[Contrast]

Reactive tinnitus and hyperacusis are completely different symptoms. One can have hyperacusis and spiked tinnitus which is normal as the pain can cause the tinnitus to go through the roof. Also one can have reactive tinnitus without hyperacusis and any pain from sounds but tinnitus can still spike even after some low level sound.

I don't understand these things very well but I'm sure they are different. But some people can have both of them at the same time.

Yes and there are at least these subtypes of hyperacusis.

Pain hyperacusis (noxacusis)
Loudness hyperacusis
and possibly trigeminal nerve irritability hyperacusis.


There needs to be research focused on these issues, I can guarantee in the future the word "hyperacusis" won't be used to describe everything people here are experiencing, Jastreboff's model held back research so much and now it's all about catching up.

 

[Marko Nakovski]

@Contrast I have all of them. I know this because I have pain even if I stay in silence, my ear pain is triggered from other factors too... Terrible condition.

 

[Mystery Reader]

@Alue
I hope things are on the upswing. Did you opt to have the MRI? (If you'd rather keep that private, I understand!) Regardless -- I hope all is well with you.

Mystery Reader

 

[Alue]

@Alue
I hope things are on the upswing. Did you opt to have the MRI? (If you'd rather keep that private, I understand!) Regardless -- I hope all is well with you.

Mystery Reader

I did another imaging exam instead of the MRI. It was actually a little more expensive and not as specific, but it's quieter and mostly ruled out what I was most worried about. The symptoms that caused me to want the MRI have subsided as well (at least for the time being).

I'm doing alright at the moment, thanks.