Lenire — Bimodal Stimulation Treatment by Neuromod

[Gb3]

@Toby1972, I think you are confusing tinnitus intensity with perception.

 

[Toby1972]

@Toby1972, I think you are confusing tinnitus intensity with perception.

Why?

 

[Gb3]

Why?

I think when most people say their tinnitus is a 9/10 or 8/10 it has more to do with the intensity or volume. I hear my tinnitus all day non-stop 24/7 but that means it's constant, not intermittent tinnitus. I can hear it at work right now when I'm busy or preoccupied and it's like a 4/10 but when I get home and I'm in a more quiet environment or less busy it's a 7/10.

 

[Gb3]

Further distribution expansion. Pity the product is not that great.

How can they expand if Lenire truly is not helping anyone?

 

[Gee82]

How can they expand if Lenire truly is not helping anyone?

Because people are so desperate for relief that they buy it anyway.

 

[EDDTEKK]

Yes desperate people will invest in Lenire like I did. It didn't help me.

Now I heard that you can rent the device for 6 weeks. At least from the audiologists here in Germany.

 

[Sironketchup]

I still think Lenire works, but it's not an instant cure.
I've been using it for 1.5 years non-stop.

 

[Julian Hoogstra]

Lenire has now been available in several clinics over the last few months and years and will soon be available in more countries. Does anyone know if any further statistics have been accumulated to validate the results of the trial that led Neuromod to launch Lenire?

 

[missingsilence]

I'm seriously considering trying Lenire. I have a clinic nearby and if it doesn't work they offer a partial refund. From what I have seen it is not as effective as we have all hoped but it has helped some.

Any advice?

@Sironketchup, has the improvement been permanent or does it go away after a while? Did the sound of your tinnitus itself change or just your reaction to it?

 

[GlennS]

How can they expand if Lenire truly is not helping anyone?

Because capitalism.

I still think Lenire works, but it's not an instant cure.
I've been using it for 1.5 years non-stop.

I was not supposed to take nearly that long to have an effect. I think you're waiting for the Great Pumpkin at this point. Kind of reminds me of the Tinnitus Mix mindset. If it doesn't work--just keep using it. It can shift final judgment off indefinitely, really.

 

[Toby1972]

Why are they expanding?

Because they will find reasonably wealthy people everywhere who want to try it out, like I did, and who see the device as the only chance that could seem semi-serious.

Yes, more and more hearing care professionals in Germany are offering it, and of course they are pushing sales. I think my hearing care professional was very honest. He mentioned that one customer's tinnitus had completely disappeared, and that perhaps a few had their THI score improve a little bit. But he also honestly said that "some don't respond so well". Like me.

I found a German YouTuber whose rather low-frequency tinnitus had decreased significantly. But he deleted his channel. There were probably too many questions and critical questions for him, whether he might be sponsored by Neuromod etc.

 

[Martin69]

Why are they expanding?

Because they will find reasonably wealthy people everywhere who want to try it out, like I did, and who see the device as the only chance that could seem semi-serious.

Yes, more and more hearing care professionals in Germany are offering it, and of course they are pushing sales. I think my hearing care professional was very honest. He mentioned that one customer's tinnitus had completely disappeared, and that perhaps a few had their THI score improve a little bit. But he also honestly said that "some don't respond so well". Like me.

I found a German YouTuber whose rather low-frequency tinnitus had decreased significantly. But he deleted his channel. There were probably too many questions and critical questions for him, whether he might be sponsored by Neuromod etc.

If I can borrow the device in my area in Germany, I will give it a try. But I won't spend money on it.

But the problem is that my tinnitus fluctuates. It can be better some days, even weeks and then catastrophic again. So I won't even know after 6 weeks if Lenire had any effect.

Still waiting for Susan Shore's device. But I am not that optimistic - since it takes decades to get released.

 

[Toby1972]

If I can borrow the device in my area in Germany, I will give it a try. But I won't spend money on it.

That will not be possible I think. At the moment: You can try it out for 6 weeks, if no improvement, you can give it back and pay €900 EUR instead of €2,750 EUR when you keep it.

I would say a fair price for it would be about €119 EUR - it is just an MP3 player, that plays random sounds with a tongue tip that gives some electrical stimulations. I think the cost of mass production would be about €49 EUR.

They should think about that price. Many many would buy it and just give it a try, if 10% have improvement, that would be a success for thousands. No one would resell the device because I don't think that anyone would buy a used tongue tip.

 

[GBB]

On a serious note I think this illustrates a difference in two concepts I'm not sure are apparent for everybody; masking level and intensity, which are not the same. My tinnitus is audible 100% of the time but the intensity can vary tremendously. A 10 for me is like speakers taped to my ears, but I might hear a gentle tinnitus even in a very loud environment that I would not rate a 10. The concept of tinnitus for me is like an auditory overlay, but the intensity can be radically different day to day.

 

[El BUZZ]

I have to say that I feel really concerned about people who have spent their money, hopes, energy and time in this device and have seen no improvement.

Thankfully I don't see myself among the many that have failed in obtaining positive results from Lenire and that's due to the people who have dared to try it. Thanks!

I hope you/we all see something solid coming soon to alleviate our struggle.

 

[El BUZZ]

You do know what floaters are right?

Physical particles in the vitreous of the eye.

No way a stimulation device like Lenire can fix them Needs surgery.

Absolutely right!

I've read tons of BS posts here stating floaters improvement/worsening due to Lenire as well as many other causes that in no way can affect protein clusters in our retina.

That DOESN'T happen and the sooner we understand that simple fact, the sooner we will stop people from thinking and taking for granted huge loads of senseless garbage.

 

[GlennS]

huge loads of senseless garbage.

Goes with the territory. Those with a more rigorous/skeptical approach to their condition are no longer engaged with Lenire, leaving the discussion to degrade like this.

 

[Toby1972]

I returned my Lenire device back to the healthcare professional. Lenire did nothing for me. There is no more to say except that I wish it had helped.

I would have posted it here in detail to give you some hope. I promise.

Why is nobody reporting here reporting success with Lenire? Is it because the device is a failure, or do people leave this forum as soon as possible if they have success?

 

[GlennS]

do people leave this forum as soon as possible if they have success?

I doubt it. Those who posted success only described subtle improvements.

I don't know how much this forum is representative of the greater population but for those who do hang around here, the jury is in that it isn't worth it, hence you're not seeing recent reports.

I think Neuromod's main market going forward are those who are not doing their due diligence and have yet to stumble on threads like these.

 

[Gb3]

I returned my Lenire device back to the healthcare professional. Lenire did nothing for me. There is no more to say except that I wish it had helped.

I would have posted it here in detail to give you some hope. I promise.

Why is nobody reporting here reporting success with Lenire? Is it because the device is a failure, or do people leave this forum as soon as possible if they have success?

How long did you use Lenire for?

 

[Toby1972]

How long did you use Lenire for?

I used Lenire for 6.5 weeks.

 

[Lilah]

Neuromod has a job opening for Director, Government Sales in the U.S., to anyone interested. Apply via LinkedIn.

About the job
Job description:

The director, government sales oversees Neuromod USA's sales activities to the Veterans Administration, Department of Defense and other government agencies. The main duties include identifying a winning channel-specific value proposition, developing and implementing plans to reach sales targets, developing and cultivating relationships with clients, creating sales reports and building the company's presence within the assigned customer segment.

Job responsibilities:

• Develop, execute and oversee strategies and plans to achieve the segment business targets
• Collaborate with Neuromod leadership to establish the segment-specific value proposition, as well as the overarching go to market approach
• Own and reach/exceed annual sales targets
• Build and maintain strong, long lasting customer relationships
• Partner with customers to understand their business needs and objectives
• Effectively communicate the value proposition through proposals and presentations
• Understand category-specific landscapes and trends
• Reporting on forces that shift tactical budgets and strategic direction of accounts. Create and maintain KPIs and sales reports.

Requirements:

• Ability to create one's own playbook.
• Proven ability to successfully manage very large, key accounts. Prior experience with US government/Veterans administration selling strongly preferred
• Experienced with the development and administration of national contracts
• Well-developed analytical competencies
• Ability to build rapport at all levels within large, complex accounts
• Bachelor's degree in business or marketing, or advanced degree in audiology
• Hearing health industry experience strongly preferred
• Travel requirement is approximately 50% (overnight); some international

Reports to:

Chief Executive Officer, Neuromod USA.

 

[missingsilence]

As the team at Neuromod is busy working on publishing the TENT-A2 study which will have new and more fine tuned timings (from what I understood), I have a feeling Lenire will be getting an update. The question is, will the device simply get new software or will they launch a completely revised version of Lenire (call it per se Lenire 2)?

What are your thoughts on this? As someone considering trying Lenire, I am thinking of holding off on it until the TENT-A2 results are out.

 

[AfroSnowman]

As the team at Neuromod is busy working on publishing the TENT-A2 study which will have new and more fine tuned timings (from what I understood), I have a feeling Lenire will be getting an update. The question is, will the device simply get new software or will they launch a completely revised version of Lenire (call it per se Lenire 2)?

What are your thoughts on this? As someone considering trying Lenire, I am thinking of holding off on it until the TENT-A2 results are out.

Is this just personal conjecture? If not, where are you getting information about updates to Lenire or that it is related to TENT-A2?

 

[missingsilence]

Is this just personal conjecture? If not, where are you getting information about updates to Lenire or that it is related to TENT-A2?

Here's a quote from the Clinical Trials page on Lenire's website:

"Treatment Evaluation of Neuromodulation for Tinnitus Stage 2 (TENT-A2)
Double-Blinded Randomized Trial
2019, 191 participants

In TENT-A2, optimised settings of Lenire were applied. Preliminary results are consistent with TENT-A1 and show a higher proportion of patients. The results are currently being peer-reviewed for publication."

https://www.lenire.com/clinical-trials​

Note they state "optimised settings" were applied. They also say a higher proportion of patients found it helpful, hence I wonder how it will be implemented into the actual treatment. TENT-A2 results haven't been published in a journal yet. Hence the question.

 

[EDDTEKK]

I think they mean the 2nd parameter/setting. Stimulation and sound synchronized in a different way. After 6 weeks they switch the parameters to boost the effect.

I don't believe they have something different to that.

 

[Codaz]

Not a strong point since those white noise generators are also a scam.

If it wasn't for the white noise generators, I wouldn't have any relaxation at all. They do not help to lower the tinnitus, but give a more comfortable sound than the BEEEEEEP which is annoying. They are not a cure, but they help to keep the mind of the beep which in my book is a helpful tool. It masks it, nothing more or less.

 

[AfroSnowman]

I just finished watching the Tinnitus Talk Podcast/video of Hazel interviewing Prof. De Ridder (got to be a patron to get the early release - it is completely worth supporting), he describes the Lenire as a habituation device. As an early adaptor who had pretty typical modestly positive results, this really tracks.

It would explain the sort of handwaving, I'm slightly better in an indescribable way, response that many people gave. Doesn't mean it is worthless, hell if it would magically make me fully habituated (it didn't) I would have paid twice the price.

Anyway if anyone is on the fence about this, thinking of it as a habituation device is probably the best way to imagine it.

 

[Sironketchup]

@AfroSnowman, have you had a program change? I did and I think the new program gives me even more habituation. On many days I am hardly aware of my severe tinnitus. It only flares up once or twice a week, with bad sleep or when I take drugs.

I often manage to get 6-7 hours of sleep with 7.5 mg Mirtazapine. This is a major step forward for me.

 

[AfroSnowman]

@AfroSnowman, have you had a program change? I did and I think the new program gives me even more habituation. On many days I am hardly aware of my severe tinnitus. It only flares up once or twice a week, with bad sleep or when I take drugs.

I often manage to get 6-7 hours of sleep with 7.5 mg Mirtazapine. This is a major step forward for me.

No, unfortunately due to COVID-19 and distance I never did. Congrats. There haven't been many reviews here that have claimed the programming change made a big difference.