I spoke with the several people within the company, they said they are building capital to fund more research and eventually the price will come down, when they fabricate more units.
MuteButton
- Thread starter Jim
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I am very hopeful for that drug but I really don't see how a magic pill will bring us silence, they are trying to fit a 3 pin plug into a 2 pin socket, in other words; a drug is the incorrect tool for this particular job but it suits their investment model so they push it hard. Biotech is the only way out of this, just think, if they continue to fail, the patient body could bypass these "pharma" corps and directly head hunt their own competent investigators, tinnitus is an example (there are many others) of how a ceiling has already been reached in what drug therapies/medications can achieve. The best within the research arm have known this for quite some time, these folk are not waiting so why should we. http://www.reuters.com/article/2015/02/09/britain-crowdfunding-biotech-idUSL5N0VJ3K920150209
- Aug 21, 2014
- 5,049
- Tinnitus Since
- 1999
- Cause of Tinnitus
- karma
I'm curious why you think this -- the neurophysiological understanding of tinnitus that we have now is something which has only emerged from imaging studies within the last 10 years or so, and the first drugs to be custom designed based on that current model are only now starting to enter human trials. So, it may be safe to say that the ceiling of what can be achieved with current drugs based on an older understanding of tinnitus has been reached -- but AUT0063 and the SF molecule do not fit into that understanding, they are based on newer research. Likewise, the current understanding may be incomplete (or entirely incorrect), and further data may point the way towards yet more novel treatments, be they drugs, or otherwise.
I don't see how this is especially relevant?
* Autifony may not work at all, and even if it does it's unlikely to work for everyone, just as every drug for every condition does not work well for all people with that condition
* Given the choice between a pharmacologic pill which is inherantly a systemic treatment and comes with systemic side effects (meaning, in addition to hitting the handful of receptors related to tinnitus, AUT00063 will hit every Kv channel receptor in the body), and a technological treatment which is more specifically targeting, many people would opt for the technological solution.
Put differently, if I was convinced that AUT00063 and Mutebutton would both be exactly as effective for reducing my tinnitus, there's no way that I would take AUT00063 over mutebutton, because all drugs are inherently dangerous, and AUT00063 will inherently have some amount of significant side effects which will not be documented or understood until a large number of people have been on it for an extended period of time...
Let's see then? Trobalt lowers tinnitus and many people have reported a massive reduction. It was created partly by Doctor Charles Large who is the founder and CEO of Autifony. And secondly, they have investment from one of largest pharmaceutical giants in the world Pfizer and is partly owned by GSK also one of the largest in the world.
Also this is Doctor Charles Large
Charles H. Large, PhD
(Chief Executive Officer)
Charles Large received his first degree and PhD from the University of Bristol and has more than 20 years of experience of drug discovery and development in the pharmaceutical industry. Before founding Autifony, he was Director of Molecular and Cellular Biology within the Neuroscience Centre of Excellence for Drug Discovery at GlaxoSmithKline, and has worked on programs focused on schizophrenia, Alzheimer's disease, epilepsy, bipolar disorder, and major depression. He is an expert on drugs that modulate voltage gated ion channels and their application to neurological and psychiatric disorders. He has built up a reputation in the field of sodium channel blocking drugs, and has collaborated widely with academic groups. He has authored over 50 papers, book chapters and patents relating to ion channel modulators.
I agree with the side-effects part. But how do we know mutebutton even works? Nobody has came back with any postivive results. At least one person came back with a 75% decrease whilst taking Autifony's drug. Also, this costs what? 2600 dollars and Autifony's drug would be free on the NHS.
- Aug 10, 2015
- 28
- Tinnitus Since
- 1990s
- Cause of Tinnitus
- Rock Music and who knows what else...
Has anyone thought of putting together an "investor's pool" for something like this?
Even if you wanted it, you would need to go to Ireland and go through a consultation there. It's not available anywhere else other than Ireland. As I said, people who have used it haven't came back with any results. So I await their results.
- Aug 10, 2015
- 28
- Tinnitus Since
- 1990s
- Cause of Tinnitus
- Rock Music and who knows what else...
- Aug 10, 2015
- 28
- Tinnitus Since
- 1990s
- Cause of Tinnitus
- Rock Music and who knows what else...
I only get out of bed to hear things like this from people like you.
Sorry, not sure I follow.
- Aug 21, 2014
- 5,049
- Tinnitus Since
- 1999
- Cause of Tinnitus
- karma
Oh, yeah, I've got low confidence that this actually works until there's some more data. I also haven't read the clinical trial that they did with 60 people, so I have no idea if I'd think it sounds valid or not. There were a lot of ifs in my prior comment
Oh, yeah, I've got low confidence that this actually works until there's some more data. I also haven't read the clinical trial that they did with 60 people, so I have no idea if I'd think it sounds valid or not. There were a lot of ifs in my prior comment
Well, people have asked for the actual trial study but they haven't disclosed. So I await some kind of indication it works. Just wonder where the people who have used it has gone? Must've totally 'muted' them.
- Aug 21, 2014
- 5,049
- Tinnitus Since
- 1999
- Cause of Tinnitus
- karma
haha, it cures tinnitus by killing the patient, works in 100% of cases.
There's something to it, I guess! A guy on another forum I read who had tinnitus, just died of a heroin/benzo OD. I bet his ringing stopped!
- Aug 10, 2015
- 28
- Tinnitus Since
- 1990s
- Cause of Tinnitus
- Rock Music and who knows what else...
Ah, cheers. Well, thing is, there are a lot of "ifs" and other caveats, but crowd-funding could be something to explore, depending on what the the most promising treatment is. As it is, we certainly are at at the mercy of big pharma, in general, and these "next big thing" inventions, specifically.Your idea is a good one.
I'm sure it did!
Also this mistake is actually rather funny!
"The mutebutton® controler is handheld device designed to integrate into a modern lifestyle. The treatment is non-surgical and self-administered. The treatment makes use of a natural phenomenon that occurs within the brain called multi-sensory integration (MSI). The mutebutton® device uses MSI to gradually aid the brain in better distinguishing between false and genuine sounds."
Can't they spell 'controller' haha!?
It's hard enough getting people to sign petitions for tinnitus, let alone crowdfunding.
https://www.facebook.com/pages/Autifony-Therapeutics-Limited/1613600998914391?fref=ts
Even getting likes on their facebook is hard enough!
- Aug 10, 2015
- 28
- Tinnitus Since
- 1990s
- Cause of Tinnitus
- Rock Music and who knows what else...
Yeah, not sure that likes make a difference really. And as for crowd-funding, it'd need more than "we." Think people like Chris Martin and Pete Townsend--high-profile celebs who suffer from T? Just thinkin' on a Sunday...
Well thats the thing! "The most promising treatments" is a subjective perspective. Danny above me is backing autifony, I think pharma are sending us on a wild goose chase and that otic progenitors are the key, some believe tinnitus is irreversible and that compensatory techniques are what we should focus on. Many opinions, but if we could cover them all ie spread the bet, thats what the HHF are doing. Imagine we actually funded these trials ourselves with patient collected money, the pharma boys would sh*t themselves. We would essentially be jumping over them. There is something very powerful in that.
Well, Autifony has already raised $36.6m (£23.5m). Don't think they need crowdfunding.
http://www.globaluniversityventurin...y-sounds-out-investors-for-series-a-extension
Crowdfunding is getting out of control...Some woman is getting people to crowdfund her masters degree! Issue with that type of funding is if things go tits up, then they aren't held accountable.
- Aug 10, 2015
- 28
- Tinnitus Since
- 1990s
- Cause of Tinnitus
- Rock Music and who knows what else...
Right. I do think there's real potential here. As it is, people (like Danny, others) are making themselves guinea pigs without any proper protocols and a "let's see what happens" approach. Brave, yes. But doesn't make for a realistic trial. It's blue-sky thinking, to be sure, but with soooo many people suffering, one would think that there'd be demographic enough to help bring something/some things to fruition via trials.
Yeah, it's a bit all over the map, to be sure. But Autifony is going after big money and (if successful) they will eventually be purchased by big pharma. That's how that game works, almost inevitably. They have a Hep C drug available here in the states. It's yours for the low, low cost of $1,000/pill.
Nope, don't trust 'em.
Right. I do think there's real potential here. As it is, people (like Danny, others) are making themselves guinea pigs without any proper protocols and a "let's see what happens" approach. Brave, yes. But doesn't make for a realistic trial. It's blue-sky thinking, to be sure, but with soooo many people suffering, one would think that there'd be demographic enough to help bring something/some things to fruition via trials.
Yeah, it's a bit all over the map, to be sure. But Autifony is going after big money and (if successful) they will eventually be purchased by big pharma. That's how that game works, almost inevitably. They have a Hep C drug available here in the states. It's yours for the low, low cost of $1,000/pill.
Well, I wouldn't expect it to cost that much, since there's already been potassium channel modulators on the market.
- Aug 21, 2014
- 5,049
- Tinnitus Since
- 1999
- Cause of Tinnitus
- karma
Autifony is already owned by GSK.Yeah, it's a bit all over the map, to be sure. But Autifony is going after big money and (if successful) they will eventually be purchased by big pharma. That's how that game works, almost inevitably. They have a Hep C drug available here in the states. It's yours for the low, low cost of $1,000/pill.
In theory, insurance infrastructure should offset R&D costs for patients, and patients shouldn't have to shoulder the significant part of the burden. Unfortunately, the insurance model in this country is fairly broken, and if you aren't lucky enough to have unusually good insurance then you're up shits creek. And -- I do have good insurance, so, if AUT00063 works and comes out with a drug which is, say, $1000 a month, then I'm probably personally responsible for $100 of that or something. But that $900 isn't "free", it's paid for by the (expensive) plan offered by my employer, and therefore that money represents a cost which my employer offset with salary. So I'm still paying for it, it's just fairly invisible.
- Aug 21, 2014
- 5,049
- Tinnitus Since
- 1999
- Cause of Tinnitus
- karma
$1000 a pill ends up being reserved for very niche things, but, Trobalt is pretty expensive. $2-300 a month if you do the Air Canada thing, probably close to $500 a month otherwise. Compared to diazepam or something, which is like a penny a pill.
Trobalt in the UK costs 159 pound for a box of 400mgx84 enough for a month on 400x3 a day. Or it's free on the NHS. That's for a private prescription.
I think its best summarized like this: Discovery science does go well with the profiteering venture capitalist model. There is an inherent danger in letting a profit making company decide the avenue of research for incurable illnesses. Its not their disease, its OURS. The research arm is the neck of the wilder beast, take the neck and you can control the whole body that being the eventual patient outcome, as it stands they have the keys to the gates (the keys being cash/capital investment access to the peer review system etc) If the patient body could collect its own source it could hunt a treatment based on efficacy and not profit. From where I stand, the fox is indeed in charge of the henhouse.
- Aug 10, 2015
- 28
- Tinnitus Since
- 1990s
- Cause of Tinnitus
- Rock Music and who knows what else...
It's always amazed me: we're animals. Yes, we dress, have cultural activities, use thumbs and a bicamberal brain, but at the core of it, we're animals. Animals survived by collaborating. But as "evolved" beings, we've decided that somehow it's every human for themselves. This is inherently not organic, but made very possible by the monetary and political systems that govern us. I do like the idea of collaborating on a "guerilla" approach to this, considering that, frankly, brave souls like Danny Boy are already doing this. That said, it'd quite an undertaking. A few helpful souls might include: a) chemist (or PhD chemist) b) auditory specialist c) kindly expert in conducting trials. I think we have the volunteers. Of course, the legalities involved in such an endeavor could kill it outright, considering how litigious our world has become. Litigious apes with hearing issues. Worst. Hair band. Ever.
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