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#1,801
dayma said:
I am being told that Neuromod themselves will be the one dispensing the device and not audiologists themselves.
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All I can say about this is while it's good to cut out the middleman, it will not scale if this really takes off. So I don't think that method of delivery will last that long.

We don't want to see people have to take numbers and sit in a queue as if they're Tesla Model 3 reservations.
 
#1,802
Greg Sacramento said:
@Paulmanlike

Yes and it probably will be helpful for those with subjective tinnitus.

We once had a frequent flyer 20 years ago, who came to the ER once or twice a week. He would come in saying that his brain hurt. He also had oral facial muscular imbalance and tongue dysphagia. One of the nurses said why don't you get him some treatment for this. He was given outpatient tongue and facial stimulation treatment. He told us afterwards that his ring in his head is gone caused by Cal Expo fireworks.
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So what kind of treatment was that? Anything like MuteButton?
 
#1,803
Greg Sacramento said:
I'm inclined to think that the Michigan and Minnesota programs will benefit physical tinnitus more.
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I'd like to speculate that if you split Neuromod's tongue wire into two sticky pads on the back of the neck, you'll effectively have the equivalent of Susan Shore's device.

What do you think Greg?
 
#1,805
Guys I'm seriously counting the days. This is going to be double or quits. Either it works and we get our lives back, or it doesn't, and it's back to square one, with practically no hope in the short term... fingers crossed for everyone...
 
#1,806
Greg Sacramento said:
@Paulmanlike

Yes and it probably will be helpful for those with subjective tinnitus.

We once had a frequent flyer 20 years ago, who came to the ER once or twice a week. He would come in saying that his brain hurt. He also had oral facial muscular imbalance and tongue dysphagia. One of the nurses said why don't you get him some treatment for this. He was given outpatient tongue and facial stimulation treatment. He told us afterwards that his ring in his head is gone caused by Cal Expo fireworks.
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You had a frequent flyer in the OR - are you a doctor/other health professional?
 
#1,807
_Patrick_ said:
Guys I'm seriously counting the days. This is going to be double or quits. Either it works and we get our lives back, or it doesn't, and it's back to square one, with practically no hope in the short term... fingers crossed for everyone...
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Exactly. And there were big letdowns before.

However, the signs are better now than they ever were. I believe that such a late-stage (commercial-ready) treatment with such good credentials (large-scale clinical trial) has never before happened.

We'll know very soon, now.
 
#1,808
hans799 said:
Exactly. And there were big letdowns before.
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Yes, I know too well unfortunately...

hans799 said:
However, the signs are better now than they ever were. I believe that such a late-stage (commercial-ready) treatment with such good credentials (large-scale clinical trial) has never before happened.
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I agree, I really want to be optimistic, and I think we have all the reasons to be, but past experiences have taught us caution. So let's wait and see.

hans799 said:
We'll know very soon, now.
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Not soon enough, it never is, but yes we're closer than ever it seems.
 
#1,809
hans799 said:
Exactly. And there were big letdowns before.

However, the signs are better now than they ever were. I believe that such a late-stage (commercial-ready) treatment with such good credentials (large-scale clinical trial) has never before happened.

We'll know very soon, now.
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As I'm pretty new to tinnitus, would you say that out of all these years we are seeing much more activity in the tinnitus space? From what it looks like, up until now there has not been as much activity. But it looks like a ton of stuff is going on. Am I right about this? Even beyond Neuromod, there seems to be a lot of stuff happening now.
 
#1,810
We had high hopes in different molecules in the past, some had promising results in first stage studies, but then revealed themselves ineffective or too dangerous in following stages.

I'm not sure about other promising activities that are happening apart from Neuromod and Susan Shore's device (but here studies are taking ages to complete), but probably someone more knowledgeable than me can tell us!
 
#1,811
TimmyC said:
As I'm pretty new to tinnitus, would you say that out of all these years we are seeing much more activity in the tinnitus space? From what it looks like, up until now there has not been as much activity. But it looks like a ton of stuff is going on. Am I right about this? Even beyond Neuromod, there seems to be a lot of stuff happening now.
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Three different promising treatments all focusing on the same base theories. So hopefully the basis of all their treatments work or.....
 
#1,812
I would also like to add ACRN had promise and to me, it was a failure. But I'm more optimistic about this, but I won't part with cash before an evidence base builds up beyond their trials.
 
#1,816
TimmyC said:
As I'm pretty new to tinnitus, would you say that out of all these years we are seeing much more activity in the tinnitus space? From what it looks like, up until now there has not been as much activity. But it looks like a ton of stuff is going on. Am I right about this? Even beyond Neuromod, there seems to be a lot of stuff happening now.
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People are seeing there is huge money to be made.
 
#1,817
With the high prevalence of tinnitus and the high unmet need for an effective treatment is only going to drive the development of new treatments by private enterprise. I hope they get filthy rich if it works though, and this will also create competition. More competition = cheaper prices = more products on market.
 
#1,818
TimmyC said:
As I'm pretty new to tinnitus, would you say that out of all these years we are seeing much more activity in the tinnitus space? From what it looks like, up until now there has not been as much activity. But it looks like a ton of stuff is going on. Am I right about this? Even beyond Neuromod, there seems to be a lot of stuff happening now.
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I've been in this "business" for a long time and yes I think the recent years have seen an unprecedented increase in funding into the hearing loss/tinnitus space, which lead to several very promising treatments on the horizon (the three signal timing devices and FX-322 come to mind, but there are many others on the Research subforum).

I believe it's a combination of
1. an increased awareness among health companies that the hearing market is HUGE (see all those young people with earbuds surgically implanted into their heads 7/24),
2. a large amount of money sloshing around and looking for investments after 10 years of quantitative easing and a bull market,
3. scientific studies coming out show that the issue is tractable, there are viable solutions,
4. a lower barrier of entry into the health space and a burgeoning startup culture - "medtech" and "fintech" weren't even words 5-10 years ago, back then there were only "big pharma" companies and "too big to fail" banks, now we have small outfits competing in both spaces.

All of this leads to small, agile companies actively scouting out underserved populations and then getting busy researching using venture capital. As opposed to risk-averse giants sticking to tried-and-true cash cows. Neuromod itself is a small independent company, not an offshoot of big pharma.
 
#1,819
hans799 said:
4. a lower barrier of entry into the health space and a burgeoning startup culture - "medtech" and "fintech" weren't even words 5-10 years ago, back then there were only "big pharma" companies and "too big to fail" banks, now we have small outfits competing in both spaces.

All of this leads to small, agile companies actively scouting out underserved populations and then getting busy researching using venture capital. As opposed to risk-averse giants sticking to tried-and-true cash cows. Neuromod itself is a small independent company, not an offshoot of big pharma.
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You make a great point here. I read in an article (I need to find it) that a ton of startups are getting into the medical device space because of the untapped profits in there. Heck, even apple is trying to get into the market with the EKG on the Apple Watch 4. I'm very upset about my tinnitus, but I'm at least grateful that, if it had to happen, it at least started in a time where people are actually taking medical technology serious. Thanks for responding. I love your positive attitude!
 
#1,820
PDodge said:
People are seeing there is huge money to be made.
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Medical marijuana has taken over the pain sector. Now thankfully lovely greedy people are waking up to the billions to be made from a tinnitus cure. God bless them. Neuromod are getting more investment and could conceivably turn 24million of investment into 24 billion while Susan Shore is still dicking about with hamsters.

But it needs to work......or collectively we will be their worst nightmare. This forum will make or break any new device within a year.
 
#1,822
Helheim said:
Lol do we really have that much influence?
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We're #1 if you Google for tinnitus forums/communities, and word of mouth is very powerful. ]I'm not sure we can literally make or break a device but this forum most definitely has a lot of influence.

Just imagine that you're deciding whether to invest €2500 in a new device, decide to search for reviews and the very first hit you get is a thread on an active, well-designed forum where people with lots of posts are talking trash about your device. Or conversely, being jubilant about how much it has helped them. Wouldn't this sway your purchasing decision?
 
#1,827
Hi Bam,

They clearly said it will not work for everyone. Why not? We and they probably don't know the reasons.

I don't think either this forum will make or brake the device within a year. Just look to ACRN or LLLT. Still huge number of fellows are trying it because they are so desperate (like I am by the way).

We just can pray to belong to the 80% responder group.
 
#1,828
Paulmanlike said:
@Greg Sacramento why are you so sure this will work for subjective tinnitus?
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It may work for subjective tinnitus because cranial nerves and other sensory input mostly cranial and trigeminal are not damaged. The vestibulocochlear nerve is adverse.
https://www.kenhub.com/en/library/anatomy/the-12-cranial-nerves

General somatosensory pathway may interfere if cranial damage exist.
A somatosensory pathway will typically have three long neurons: primary, secondary and tertiary. The first associates with tinnitus. It's cell body is in the dorsal ganglion of the spinal nerve. Also association to the trigeminal nerve ganglia. This is one area that one never wants to see messed up. Electrical stimulation of the tongue must follow a direct route to cranial nerves and brain stem.
The hypoglossal nerve innervates the tongue with signals from the brain.

It travels at the C1 close to the vagus nerve and not as close to the spinal division of the accessory nerve.
Then it curves down from behind the vagus nerve, passing between the internal carotid artery and internal jugular vein on the carotid sheath.

Back in 1974 -75 MIT and Harvard had thoughts that stimulation of the trigeminal and facial nerves via the tongue may activate directly to the brainstem of neural impulses and make changes to neural networks and new channels for the release of neurotransmitters to boost neuroplasticity. They sold their MS research to a private company and more research study failed. MIT and Harvard had to raise capital for other neuro same principle research that included tinnitus, but was unable.
 
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