New University of Michigan Tinnitus Discovery — Signal Timing

#1,142
Jack Straw said:
Meaning that the stimulation devices help drive plasticity?
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That is exactly what is happening in some people. Researchers are trying to learn why plasticity is being driven more in certain individuals. One theory relates the level of cortisol at the time of stimulation. We are probably a few years before anything on this gets published, however.
 
#1,143
Bart said:
Seems to only work for some forms of tinnitus
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I read it differently.
Seems to me, this therapy has the potensial to help all kinds of reasons for T that affects/over-activates/de-sequencing the Dorsal Cochlea Nucleus.
And I can´t think of any form of subjective T, that doesn´t?

Also, this manipulation of your T, through different movements of your neck/jaw/spine(somatic response), is very relative in my view. I mean, I can´t manipulate it and get a quick response, but physical therapy can definitely have an effect over time. Quite dramatically in fact. Also, I get a high pitch sound when I bend my neck forward, but I don´t see that in relation to my original T. Maybe I should? It has some of the same feel to it.

Maybe those who get an immediate alleviating effect, can share some of their experiences?

Agree, there is a lot of if and maybe´s here.

Hopefully, Shore will figure some of the mysteries of T out. If someone can, it´s her.
 
#1,145
There is a disproportionate amount of interest in this stupid non cure machine and other regenerative medicine based emerging technologies on this forum.
 
#1,150
As a follow-up -- long-time lurker, first-time poster. Wanted to publicly thank @kelpiemsp for all the posts on this thread and the Minnesota thread. I'd been largely avoiding monitoring these boards because that's what a bunch of specialists/audiologists advised (better not to dwell!), but after a bad setback last month I gave in. After following the AM-101 mess and its disappointment years ago, to see some actual promise with these new signal timing treatments has given me optimism with this illness/issue for the first time in years!
 
#1,151
JohnAdams said:
This won't even hit the market until when exactly?
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We have a member on here who posted in the Minnesota thread about being able to sleep with their head on a pillow and no masking for 10 straight days. That, to me, is anecdotal evidence that this type of treatment could be potentially life-changing for a lot of us. I don't see how anyone could see that as anything but good. I'm no expert because I only recently waded back into these waters but it looks like one of these signal-timing devices could be out in a year or two. Which would be amazing.

When this first happened to me and my life changed forever, the only hope on these boards was the magical AM-101 trials. Which turned out to be complete crap. Useless, never to even be considered a possibility again. Now we've got some evidence of something actually working, which is awesome. Like I said I hadn't checked these boards in forever and to see these new promising developments is really encouraging.
 
#1,153
kelpiemsp said:
That's the hope. But so far it's proving easier to drive plasticity.
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To Bart's good points, seems complicated to drive plasticity if say the hearing loss deficit continues which I presume would continuously drive plasticity toward tinnitus. Won't the signal timing stimulus machine end up being a tug of war between the two prevailing stimuli?...hearing deficit filling in the blanks with non hearing related neurons excited...versus the machine trying to bend the arc of plasticity back the other way?

So permanency and maintenance comes into question which may in fact vary by the individual. How much does the machine have to be used to create a state of lowered tinnitus?

To me, as a therapy, this machine seems on the right track in lieu of being able to regress cells back to a time of greater wellness and hearing which could be addressed possibly with more learning about stem cell treatment.
 
#1,154
Mathew Gould said:
I have reactive tinnitus. Does this or the Minnesota device work on reactive tinnitus?
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There's some anecdotal evidence from the Minnesota trial that this technology could potentially reduce or eliminate spikes at least.

kelpiemsp said:
I am at the stage where we are working with different timings. So far the 15 offset was my best. I learned that is was plus 15, and I had thought previously it was a negative 15. Anyways, my T is becoming less intrusiveness and definitely, atleast in my case, the further I get in the trial the more I begin to feel an accumulative effect. I also went to several areas and had no spike. For example the state fair had a beer tent and they were blasting music... it was too loud. I thought about complaining (it was 110 dB) but I don't buy the whole damaged ears are compromised theory. I just made sure to not be in longer than a few minutes and not stress.
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#1,155
stophiss said:
To Bart's good points, seems complicated to drive plasticity if say the hearing loss deficit continues which I presume would continuously drive plasticity toward tinnitus. Won't the signal timing stimulus machine end up being a tug of war between the two prevailing stimuli?...hearing deficit filling in the blanks with non hearing related neurons excited...versus the machine trying to bend the arc of plasticity back the other way?

So permanency and maintenance comes into question which may in fact vary by the individual. How much does the machine have to be used to create a state of lowered tinnitus?

To me, as a therapy, this machine seems on the right track in lieu of being able to regress cells back to a time of greater wellness and hearing which could be addressed possibly with more learning about stem cell treatment.
Click to expand...

So, I have thought about this at great length, I don't think it is a continuous war between tinnitus and plasticity.

(This is a very general explanation)

When we are born, our brains aren't mapped 1-1 with our ears. That is...we don't have a fully formed cortical map between our ears and brain. There is a general outline.. say hearing usually occurs between frequencies a,b,c....z.When we actually start hearing for a purpose, our brain map more fully forms. Say a,b,c......y (never used z in today's world). As the years go by you quit using your higher end frequencies (in the organ and in the brain map) Use it or lose it. There isn't really much to gain by hearing from 16,000 to 20,000. Maybe our ancestors used this to hear prey better. But it seems to me we are just evolving our hearing apparatus to focus more on speech.

Anyways, the point being the brain maps are mapped to the input of the ear. It isn't expecting anything other that what it has been told to expect. Tinnitus arises when the brain doesn't relearn or remap. It still expects, say, frequency d even though frequency d is damaged (in this example). In reality many people have reduced input, that varies across their whole spectrum of hearing. Say the alphabet is a frequency they may here something like: a,b,c,d,...f....h....i..k..l... etc.) but the plastic brain quits seeking feedback for e..g...j. In our brains that isn't happening. Whether its because e..g..j are sending damaged signals (immediately following an acoustic trauma), reduced signals (NIHL), or too many signals (stress) our brain isn't tuning it out. This IS NOT habituation. When the plastic brain tunes these out... you don't hear them.

Anyways...signal timing helps move the brain towards ignoring this signals by reducing the fusiform activity. I think...
 
#1,156
kelpiemsp said:
So, I have thought about this at great length, I don't think it is a continuous war between tinnitus and plasticity.

(This is a very general explanation)

When we are born, our brains aren't mapped 1-1 with our ears. That is...we don't have a fully formed cortical map between our ears and brain. There is a general outline.. say hearing usually occurs between frequencies a,b,c....z.When we actually start hearing for a purpose, our brain map more fully forms. Say a,b,c......y (never used z in today's world). As the years go by you quit using your higher end frequencies (in the organ and in the brain map) Use it or lose it. There isn't really much to gain by hearing from 16,000 to 20,000. Maybe our ancestors used this to hear prey better. But it seems to me we are just evolving our hearing apparatus to focus more on speech.

Anyways, the point being the brain maps are mapped to the input of the ear. It isn't expecting anything other that what it has been told to expect. Tinnitus arises when the brain doesn't relearn or remap. It still expects, say, frequency d even though frequency d is damaged (in this example). In reality many people have reduced input, that varies across their whole spectrum of hearing. Say the alphabet is a frequency they may here something like: a,b,c,d,...f....h....i..k..l... etc.) but the plastic brain quits seeking feedback for e..g...j. In our brains that isn't happening. Whether its because e..g..j are sending damaged signals (immediately following an acoustic trauma), reduced signals (NIHL), or too many signals (stress) our brain isn't tuning it out. This IS NOT habituation. When the plastic brain tunes these out... you don't hear them.

Anyways...signal timing helps move the brain towards ignoring this signals by reducing the fusiform activity. I think...
Click to expand...
So is this trial reducing your tinnitus loudness/frequency? Just asking what everyone's thinking.
 
#1,162
Paulmanlike said:
Yeah but how exactly, lots of questions and loads of unanswered answers that he may have - like has the volume reduced or has it just changed frequency for example.
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Seriously, he tried to cover it all earlier. Let's be content knowing that he has seen personal improvement of his tinnitus. He wasn't panicking over it before but now he seriously cares less.
 
#1,163
Otana said:
There's some anecdotal evidence from the Minnesota trial that this technology could potentially reduce or eliminate spikes at least.
Click to expand...

I don't get many spikes, if I do they last 10 seconds. I would rate my tinnitus as mild 60% of the time and barely noticeable 40% of the time. My reactive tinnitus doesn't seem as bad as it was, meaning sounds don't bother me as much or increase my tinnitus as much.
 
#1,165
Willing to settle for tinnitus in silence, just dont want to hear it over the TV during my down time or at work when I'm trying to make a living. If this technology can get me there, I'm happy.
 

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