New University of Michigan Tinnitus Discovery — Signal Timing

[Gb3]

@linearb, what is the cause of your tinnitus?

 

[Suaimhneach]

If you listen to some of Dr. Shore's comments, I think it was in the ATA Podcast, back in the times before everything was pushed back by a year, she said that she hoped to push it rapidly to market when the study was completed.

I wonder in a university study like this, when can they be unblinded?

I am wondering if Neuromod's rapid expansion has anything to do with this announcement from Auricle. Lots of news in the Irish news about Neuromod lately expanding to America and also doubling its total workforce over the coming year and expanding to other European markets.

 

[Sironketchup]

The hope is what keeps me going!

Maybe 1-2 more years with Lenire until I can change to this one. Yeea!

 

[Suaimhneach]

Maybe 1-2 more years with Lenire until I can change to this one. Yeea!

Is Lenire helping you currently?

 

[DaveFromChicago]

I even cry with joy to see that Dr. Shore's device says "treats root cause of tinnitus"

I also cried with joy upon hearing about the Dr. Shore - based Auricle (and ever so many thanks to the person who located and posted this).

This is frankly the best news I have received since I started posting on Tinnitus Talk.

It was what was necessary to give me the fortitude to achieve a state of habituation that was founded on the expectation of eventually receiving a truly, legitimately science-based device.

Amazingly, just yesterday I posted that various individuals were not going to deter me from requesting actual science-based analyses and treatments, and the very next morning I encounter just what I asked for.

I'm so hoping that this device renders obsolete all of the poseurs, charlatans, crank purveyors of the lamest, amateurish pseudoscience, etc. and that they disappear exactly the way Horse and Carriage did when the Automobile was invented.

 

[Gb3]

One earbud probably means it's just for unilateral tinnitus, right?

 

[Rb86]

This is exciting news guys... but I warn to you all, as us tinnitus veterans know, guard your heart here.

The video says the science is proven in animal models - this is only the first baby step barrier to entry - lots of medicine works in the animal model but not humans.

Note the video also says it was validated in humans to be safe. You can drop olive oil in your ears and that's safe, but it doesn't mean it works.

I'm hoping for more proof and trials, but I'm just saying everyone - slow your roll!

Great news nonetheless.

 

[Lukee]

One earbud probably means it's just for unilateral tinnitus, right?

My understanding is you must do 1 ear at a time.

 

[Gb3]

This is exciting news guys... but I warn to you all, as us tinnitus veterans know, guard your heart here.

The video says the science is proven in animal models - this is only the first baby step barrier to entry - lots of medicine works in the animal model but not humans.

Note the video also says it was validated in humans to be safe. You can drop olive oil in your ears and that's safe, but it doesn't mean it works.

I'm hoping for more proof and trials, but I'm just saying everyone - slow your roll!

Great news nonetheless.

She has been working on this for more than 20 years. I'm sure there is more than just safety results.

 

[Bambam0]

The pivotal trial has been running since November of 2018 with 300 people. No way in hell they move to commercialization if they had not had positive results. I heard they're going to do a Reg CF raise beginning middle of next month. I anticipate all investor material + website will be out by then. Yum yum.

 

[Mathew Gould]

My understanding is you must do 1 ear at a time.

My tinnitus is only bad when it's in my head, not so much when it goes to my ear(s)... I hope this device helps.

 

[AfroSnowman]

heard they're going to do a Reg CF raise beginning middle of next month. I anticipate all investor material + website will be out by then

What is Reg CF?

 

[hopes]

I'm afraid Dr. Shore's device will be a repeat of Lenire.

In my opinion, I think neuromodulation can't cure tinnitus but maybe reduce symptoms at best. If it does reduce symptoms, I hope it will have way better results than placebo and that it will be peer reviewed etc.

For a complete cure, I think we need to go way deeper into understanding all the tinnitus processes and repairing what is wrong or damaged if it's possible :/

 

[PortugalTheMan]

What is the difference between Dr. Shore's device and Lenire?

From what I understand the electrode, instead of being in the tongue, is in another place. Will the results be the same as with Lenire?

 

[Damocles]

I'm afraid Dr. Shore's device will be a repeat of Lenire.

In my opinion, I think neuromodulation can't cure tinnitus but maybe reduce symptoms at best. If it does reduce symptoms, I hope it will have way better results than placebo and that it will be peer reviewed etc.

For a complete cure, I think we need to go way deeper into understanding all the tinnitus processes and repairing what is wrong or damaged if it's possible :/

I can't speak for other members in this thread, but I was never banking on this being a "cure".

This device falls under the small branch of treatments I expect will emerge now and in the future, that will make mine and other people's lives with tinnitus much less unpleasant (and hopefully save a lot people here, currently on the brink of suicide).

I certainly don't expect it will be "just another Lenire". Read through the thread a little more.

 

[Suaimhneach]

What is the difference between Dr. Shore's device and Lenire?

From what I understand the electrode, instead of being in the tongue, is in another place. Will the results be the same as with Lenire?

Pretty sure the soundscape is also tailored to the user rather than the generic soundscape with Lenire, open to correction here though or any other differences!

 

[Suaimhneach]

What is Reg CF?

I think it is regulated crowdfunding, where the average person can fund the project. Open to correction though.

 

[KotaDomowa]

What is Reg CF?

Regulation Crowdfunding. That is, they don't have enough money?

 

[Kam75]

I'm afraid Dr. Shore's device will be a repeat of Lenire.

In my opinion, I think neuromodulation can't cure tinnitus but maybe reduce symptoms at best. If it does reduce symptoms, I hope it will have way better results than placebo and that it will be peer reviewed etc.

For a complete cure, I think we need to go way deeper into understanding all the tinnitus processes and repairing what is wrong or damaged if it's possible :/

Why is your nickname "hopes" if you are not a bearer of hope? (just kidding).

Personally I have a little more hope in Susan Shore's device than in Lenire.
Susan is an ENT specialist and has been working on her device for over 20 years.
By the way, let's not forget that during the first phase of testing which included 21 subjects, 2 had their tinnitus completely eliminated!

So maybe this device won't do miracles for everyone, but if it can greatly reduce tinnitus, that would be a good thing. It is quite possible to live normally with mild tinnitus as I have said many times (this was my case when I first had tinnitus many years ago).

It is also to be hoped that this device does not produce too many side effects.

Wait and see.

 

[AnthonyMcDonald]

So maybe this device won't do miracles for everyone

In my personal opinion, the group of people who can fully benefit from this device (e.g. have tinnitus completely eliminated) would have very somatic tinnitus, and have a very good understanding of their tinnitus modulations. I believe the placement of the electrodes would be extremely important for maximum results, e.g. on the neck if your neck modulates it, on the jaw, etc.

Or have some modulations that remove tinnitus completely. That would suck, though. Almost everyone has modulations that can make tinnitus louder, but not everyone has modulations that can make tinnitus quieter...

 

[ColinUK]

I'm afraid Dr. Shore's device will be a repeat of Lenire.

In my opinion, I think neuromodulation can't cure tinnitus but maybe reduce symptoms at best. If it does reduce symptoms, I hope it will have way better results than placebo and that it will be peer reviewed etc.

For a complete cure, I think we need to go way deeper into understanding all the tinnitus processes and repairing what is wrong or damaged if it's possible :/

I think the principles, while similar, are quiet different. As I understand, Lenire works by basically overexciting all the stuff in your auditory brain so that the tinnitus cells get drowned out and have less focus, whereas Dr. Shore's device works by looking to turn off the overactive cells which are generating the noise. Also, from reading, Dr. Shore and her team have done lots of efforts to make sure that the device doesn't cause any worsening. To me, if you got something that is tested and won't make you worse but got a chance of making you better, that's great.

And I would take a reduction of my tinnitus. I would take any improvement at all. If something can reduce the tinnitus by me plugging in everyday, then I will take that until we have some proven medications. Of course we all want to switch it off, but if there's a single treatment out there that could offer improvement and a decrease in volume... well how good would that be to help until we can take a pill or injection to get rid of the thing altogether.

 

[PortugalTheMan]

I think the principles, while similar, are quiet different. As I understand, Lenire works by basically overexciting all the stuff in your auditory brain so that the tinnitus cells get drowned out and have less focus, whereas Dr. Shore's device works by looking to turn off the overactive cells which are generating the noise. Also, from reading, Dr. Shore and her team have done lots of efforts to make sure that the device doesn't cause any worsening. To me, if you got something that is tested and won't make you worse but got a chance of making you better, that's great.

And I would take a reduction of my tinnitus. I would take any improvement at all. If something can reduce the tinnitus by me plugging in everyday, then I will take that until we have some proven medications. Of course we all want to switch it off, but if there's a single treatment out there that could offer improvement and a decrease in volume... well how good would that be to help until we can take a pill or injection to get rid of the thing altogether.

We have to start with improvements. Once there is a way to really get the tinnitus volume down, the cure will come fast.

The hardest thing is to lower the tinnitus, to know which way to go for the cure!

 

[Fatih]

its enough if it reduce my t even a little bit.
making any changes is an improvement

 

[Bambam0]

What is Reg CF?

Regulation Crowd Funding. I imagine they're going this route to generate hype. If you imagine the mindshare on this site translating into the rest or majority of tinnitus sufferer population, there will be many interested in participating in the possible upside of a device like this.

They're currently raising convertible debt at a pretty attractive valuation for the investor. However, it is only available to accredited investors. That it's convertible debt is a little odd but I only know typical VC fundraising and medical devices are out of my scope. That said, I'll absolutely be contributing to the Reg CF campaign.

 

[BigNick]

Lenire improved my symptoms but wasn't the cure I'd hoped for. I had 7 or 8 sounds prior to the treatment. Now I have two. One of the two can still be bothersome at times but I'm about 50% habituated.

There's a group of posters on here that routinely label Lenire a failure. Well, that wasn't my experience, but I do understand the frustration. I think a more reasonable evaluation is that it helps 20-30% of people in a meaningful way.

I would hope that Susan Shore's device helps more people than Lenire due to the amount of time it's taken to develop and her approach to basic science.

I'm in the UK but will definitely fly over to the U.S to get it, if that's allowed.

Also wanted to add that, I had a little bit more improvement from Will Sedley's sound therapy trial and a little bit from supplements (Magnesium L-Threonate, Apigenin and L-Theanine). I tried these after Andrew Huberman suggested they can aid sleep.

My attitude now is to keep trying to chip away at my tinnitus, so if something can improve symptoms 10-20% then I take that and keep trying other things.

I have a pulsatile element as well but there are now a couple of guys in the UK from Addenbrooks that can diagnose and treat it now with stenting, so when my GP practice opens up properly again, I'll fight to get referred down there.

As Dirk de Ridder said, there are a few things that can help 20-30% of tinnitus patients but that's way too low to be prescribed in a clinical setting, but 20-30% chance is better than nothing.

I would personally disregard the view that nothing can be done to help tinnitus, in my experience that's not true. Anecdotal accounts aren't valid science but that doesn't mean there isn't some truth in them.

Anyway, I'm 100% going for this new device.

 

[AfroSnowman]

Lenire improved my symptoms but wasn't the cure I'd hoped for. I had 7 or 8 sounds prior to the treatment. Now I have two. One of the two can still be bothersome at times but I'm about 50% habituated.

There's a group of posters on here that routinely label Lenire a failure. Well, that wasn't my experience, but I do understand the frustration. I think a more reasonable evaluation is that it helps 20-30% of people in a meaningful way.

I would hope that Susan Shore's device helps more people than Lenire due to the amount of time it's taken to develop and her approach to basic science.

I'm in the UK but will definitely fly over to the U.S to get it, if that's allowed.

Also wanted to add that, I had a little bit more improvement from Will Sedley's sound therapy trial and a little bit from supplements (Magnesium L-Threonate, Apigenin and L-Theanine). I tried these after Andrew Huberman suggested they can aid sleep.

My attitude now is to keep trying to chip away at my tinnitus, so if something can improve symptoms 10-20% then I take that and keep trying other things.

I have a pulsatile element as well but there are now a couple of guys in the UK from Addenbrooks that can diagnose and treat it now with stenting, so when my GP practice opens up properly again, I'll fight to get referred down there.

As Dirk de Ridder said, there are a few things that can help 20-30% of tinnitus patients but that's way too low to be prescribed in a clinical setting, but 20-30% chance is better than nothing.

I would personally disregard the view that nothing can be done to help tinnitus, in my experience that's not true. Anecdotal accounts aren't valid science but that doesn't mean there isn't some truth in them.

Anyway, I'm 100% going for this new device.

Do you still use Lenire?

 

[Piney]

let's not forget that during the first phase of testing which included 21 subjects, 2 had their tinnitus completely eliminated!

So maybe this device won't do miracles for everyone, but if it can greatly reduce tinnitus, that would be a good thing.

Did those 2 people have hearing loss as well?

 

[Kam75]

Did those 2 people have hearing loss as well?

They did not mention that in any of the articles. It was just an anecdotal information for them but it means a lot for us.

 

[BigNick]

Do you still use Lenire?

No, I did persevere for a long time but didn't get any further benefit than I got in the early stages.

It knocked out some of my sounds in the first week. It's been over two years now and they never came back, not even temporarily.

Obviously it's frustrating because what I've got left still gets me down at times but I'm definitely in a better place because of Lenire.

As we all know there's so much fear around tinnitus and, if like me, you have the kind that fluctuates it can be a pretty nerve wracking treatment to go through and I know there are people it did nothing for, but in fairness to Neuromod, they tell you before you buy it that it might not help.

Anyways, I'm very optimistic that this new device will be better and help more people.

I'm 100% going for it if it's available to non-Americans.

 

[Piney]

They did not mention that in any of the articles. It was just an anecdotal information for them but it means a lot for us.

Neuromod claimed Lenire cured 1 patient that had no hearing loss. If the other 2 people who these devices cured had no hearing loss, that may say something about neuromodulation.