Still No Proper Sleep, So Desperate — Does Deep Sleep Come Back with Habituation?

[Digital Doc]

I can help you with a sound mix I invented that has helped 446 people so far. It is free at https://tinnitusmix.com.

Download and put it on loop using Koss KTX-PRO1 headphones for 3 weeks all night every night.

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Why the headphones? If the T is from NIHL most recommend no headphones, and no earbuds.

 

[PeteJ]

30 mins-ish, but then I'm typically asleep. I think maybe my brain being in sleep mode helps lower it, however temporarily.

I think for me, too. I don't think I can sleep with plugs. I think that is wearing them too long as I already wear some at various times of the day.

But, the t is loud enough without plugs but even more unbearable when I wear earplugs. It seems to calm down a bit around 11 PM and coincidentally, if I get to sleep at all, that's when I fall asleep if I am lucky.

I would need an overall reduction in pitch, frequency, intensity and volume etc. to be able to sleep with ear plugs on. Although, I wish I could. It's noisy outside even at night. I hate that I can't protect while sleeping and it just makes this entire predicament and situation so hopeless and insane.

 

[OnceUponaTime]

Do you think deep sleep comes back with habituation?

It comes back. For me it was after about 5 months or so. Now I sleep 7 hrs. each night. You have to give it time and get the anxiety under control.

Once

 

[Lilah]

@Digital Doc @dellwas @Drone Draper When you first got tinnitus, did the sound bother you and cause sleep issues? If so, what changed that you can now wear ear plugs and sleep? Does the sound not bother you anymore (why?) or do you have mild tinnitus? Do you have high pitch sound, fluctuating tinnitus, etc?

Not sure if it will work for me since my tinnitus is loud, fluctuates, and very somatic (sound changes when I change positions).

 

[R. David Case]

Why the headphones? If the T is from NIHL most recommend no headphones, and no earbuds.

The Koss have titanium drivers and the coil size affects the results, the frequency range should be as high as possible too. The Koss go to 24 kHz. In other words the sounds and the electro-magnetic waves from headphones are what makes this work.

 

[Digital Doc]

@Digital Doc @dellwas @Drone Draper When you first got tinnitus, did the sound bother you and cause sleep issues? If so, what changed that you can now wear ear plugs and sleep? Does the sound not bother you anymore (why?) or do you have mild tinnitus? Do you have high pitch sound, fluctuating tinnitus, etc?

Not sure if it will work for me since my tinnitus is loud, fluctuates, and very somatic (sound changes when I change positions).

At this point my T is mild, although still can easily get worse with loud sound exposure. I also have some H, but again mild, and really for a specific pitch of sounds around 4k and is more irritating than anything else.

I find currently that the earplugs promote comfortable restful sleep, and my T is always just about gone in the AM, and again builds up during the day, even without any significant noise exposure.

When I first got the T, I could fall asleep from exhaustion, but the wake up a few minutes later to any small sound, often a car passing by the house. It would then take some time to fall asleep again and the process would repeat. Also, lack of sleep in general makes the T worse so this just feeds into it.

 

[Digital Doc]

The Koss have titanium drivers and the coil size affects the results, the frequency range should be as high as possible too. The Koss go to 24 kHz. In other words the sounds and the electro-magnetic waves from headphones are what makes this work.

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Not sure why these headphones go to 24 khz, which is beyond the range of normal hearing.

If this works for you, sure go for it, but consider me skeptical.

Not sure there is any evidence for the magnetic waves from headphones being therapeutic to any disease, and if this was the case, could just listen to any random CD.

 

[R. David Case]

Not sure why these headphones go to 24 khz, which is beyond the range of normal hearing.

If this works for you, sure go for it, but consider me skeptical.

Not sure there is any evidence for the magnetic waves from headphones being therapeutic to any disease, and if this was the case, could just listen to any random CD.

I have eliminated or reduced tinnitus in 446 people so there is no question it works. Every one is skeptical at first. It is free, you can try it or not, I have been tinnitus free for 18 years only from this Tinnitus Mix as have many others.

 

[Digital Doc]

Thank you for the links, and you are obviously enthusiastic for it.

Unfortunately, I do not see a randomized control trial in what you provided, so there is little evidence for it, except for some random testimonies in the form of letters. Remember that the natural history of T tends to get better in the majority of cases as the user habituated, and the placebo effect can be strong as well.

The pub med link you provided talks about the hypersonic effect, but in more recent research this is induced from high frequencies, not from electromagnetic, and needs to be presented "to the listener's entire body surface but not when presented exclusively to the listener's ear." (A Fukushima et al, PLoS One, 2014). Listening to a CD with headphones would not do that.

 

[BuzzyBee]

I use 5HTP, natural serotonin. Works better than Melatonin by putting you into REM quicker. I also suffer from chronic anxiety and tried them all, Xanax, Atavan, you name it. This by far has worked better than any of them. Also available over the counter at Walmart, Costco, etc.

Hey, thanks for mentioning that. I've been curious about the 5HTP, but I've read that serotonin makes tinnitus worse and am scared to try it. How often do you take the 5HTP and how much?

Just saw that @Jazzer addressed this.

I really wish there were more positive posts regarding serotonin, but so far everything is negative.

 

[dellwas]

Hey, thanks for mentioning that. I've been curious about the 5HTP, but I've read that serotonin makes tinnitus worse and am scared to try it. How often do you take the 5HTP and how much?

Just saw that @Jazzer addressed this.

I really wish there were more positive posts regarding serotonin, but so far everything is negative.

I only need it occaisonally, maybe once a week, only one or two 25mg capsules. All I know is that it works for me, and a helluva lot better than prescrition meds. Won't go through that hell again. YMMV.

 

[dellwas]

@Digital Doc @dellwas @Drone Draper When you first got tinnitus, did the sound bother you and cause sleep issues? If so, what changed that you can now wear ear plugs and sleep? Does the sound not bother you anymore (why?) or do you have mild tinnitus? Do you have high pitch sound, fluctuating tinnitus, etc?

Not sure if it will work for me since my tinnitus is loud, fluctuates, and very somatic (sound changes when I change positions).

For me no, managed to sleep no matter how loud it was, perhaps 90% of the time. Don't ask me how, no idea.

 

[Digital Doc]

I used melatonin gummies for the first few days to get sleep patterns back reestablished.

 

[BuzzyBee]

I only need it occaisonally, maybe once a week, only one or two 25mg capsules. All I know is that it works for me, and a helluva lot better than prescrition meds. Won't go through that hell again. YMMV.

I'm glad you've found something that helps, and thanks for sharing how much and how often.

 

[MartinNYC]

Hi guys and girls!

I'm 4.5 months into this ringing in my head / both ears.

Still I don't now what caused it, one evening there came a buzz in one ear with some pain, really strange feeling (SSHL?).

After that the electric ringing in my head begun. The ENT could not find hearing loss, but only up to 8 kHz.

The first months were really hard, I sometimes did not sleep for 3 days and was in full panic.

I'm not in full panic mode anymore, but it's still SO hard to sleep. If I manage to fall asleep, I'll wake up after maybe 2 hours, I get maybe 4 hours per night of bad sleep. Last night I did not sleep at all, my tinnitus was so loud and I could not fall asleep. So today I feel like shit, don't know how to go on. It just feels so pointless and never ending, I can't imagine living like this forever, and I'm only 28, this happened without me doing anything!

I hate my life at the moment, can't find any joy.

I have also heard that those with tinnitus have different brain waves than normal people, so your brain is more aroused all the time. Does that mean I'm not gonna have deep sleep ever again? That would cost me maybe 10 years of life expectancy! What's the point of living without proper sleep?

I can't sleep with masking, I'm sleeping with ear plugs.

I'm thinking about the tinnitus all the time and my life is just wasted.

Do you think deep sleep comes back with habituation?

Did your ENT consider TMJ as the possible cause of your tinnitus? If not, go to one who's knowledgeable. My ENT doc dismissed my ears as causing my tinnitus and figured out it was my TMJ, subsequently verified by my physical therapist.

 

[R. David Case]

Thank you for the links, and you are obviously enthusiastic for it.

Unfortunately, I do not see a randomized control trial in what you provided, so there is little evidence for it, except for some random testimonies in the form of letters. Remember that the natural history of T tends to get better in the majority of cases as the user habituated, and the placebo effect can be strong as well.

The pub med link you provided talks about the hypersonic effect, but in more recent research this is induced from high frequencies, not from electromagnetic, and needs to be presented "to the listener's entire body surface but not when presented exclusively to the listener's ear." (A Fukushima et al, PLoS One, 2014). Listening to a CD with headphones would not do that.

Thanks for advice, the brain does not have to process Tinnitus Mix (ultrasonics) but with that being said the subconscious can perceive way above 20 kHz. The Tinnitus Mix I invented is interfering with a feedback loop that is in the tinnitus structure, once that breaks down the tinnitus leaves for 2-3 weeks and then tries to reform. Some report it never comes back.

By the way the posts and letters are not random, Brian Douglas is moderator of the largest tinnitus group on Facebook (21,000 members) and he and 2 others in Europe have formed a test group of 700 just to test my system and are getting good results, hear are some posts from there and a document talking about the feedback loop.

 

[David Dorci]

Why is it important? Does the outside noise train the brain somehow?

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B075QKQL4M/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_asin_title_o02_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1

I use these works great. Play noises from YouTube that run for hours. Birds, rain , etc.
also there is some good sound therapy mixes on YouTube

 

[LunarRXA]

I've been getting about 5-6 hours on average. It's alright. It'd be nice to get 8 hours, but it's been than 2-3.

 

[Brenda in NJ]

I'm in the same boat. About 3 months in for me and I can't sleep. I have to take a med that completely knocks me out. Which I am sure does not help the tinnitus since it's a side effect of so many of these meds. I also take meds for anxiety, which I am already trying to get off of. Just weaning off one of the meds is ramping up the tinnitus. It's a no win situation. My point is just try and avoid too much medication, but if you need something to sleep you have to take it. Sleep is very important and without it, tinnitus will be worse. I am a very anxious person and I suffer with OCD, so I get where you are coming from.

 

[Lilah]

I have to take a med that completely knocks me out.

My medication alone (Trazodone 50mg) does not always work; there have been a few nights where I have not slept at all or just a couple of hours. I can only sleep when the tinnitus is masked almost completely or is a bit lower volume or a more hissy tone. It all comes down to how the sound is that night.

 

[Brenda in NJ]

My medication alone (Trazodone 50mg) does not always work; there have been a few nights where I have not slept at all or just a couple of hours. I can only sleep when the tinnitus is masked almost completely or is a bit lower volume or a more hissy tone. It all comes down to how the sound is that night.

so frustrating I know. my problem is that I also have hyperacusis, so anything too loud is annoying. and I swear that my tinnitus gets louder and tries to out do the masker I use.

 

[COYS]

I seriously struggled with sleep for about 8-10 weeks. 3-4 hours a night sometimes less. I have mild H too.

I'm not sure what changed at the 3 month mark but sleep just became easier. I use waterfall sounds on my phone that distracts me from the ringing

 

[TWK]

Since getting tinnitus ~15 months ago, my sleep has been seriously affected. Generally, my T doesn't bother me too much these days, although certain days it is much louder. I have no problem at all falling asleep, but I tend to wake up after 4-6 hours. Some days I can get back to sleep fairly easily, other days I never get back to sleep.
Seems to be related to a larger, system-wide nervous system hyper-activation since when I wake up during the night, it tends to be accompanied by night sweats.
If I get just the right amount of exercise, it helps. Too little, and I don't sleep well. Too much, even if performed at 6am, and my sleep that night is totally broken. It's hard because I'm a former competitive athlete, and I want to workout hard every day.
I've tried everything including regular and time-release melatonin (actually makes my sleep much worse), mirtazipine (knocks me out, but feel like a complete zombie throughout the next day), benzos (just so bad for you on so many levels), and tryptophan (crazy dreams and jittery next day), and have found nothing that works for me.

 

[Sironketchup]

Hey guys, I have lived with severe tinnitus for over 2 years.

Habituating to it during the day is one thing, but honestly, I have not slept properly since getting tinnitus. I often manage to fall asleep somehow, but after 3-4 hours I wake up with loud tinnitus and just can't fall asleep again.

I just can't habituate to no sleep.

I take Valerian root in high doses every night, and often Mirtazapine or Zopiclone. But even this stuff can't get me to sleep properly.

I am so desperate. The simple fact of not being able to sleep ever again makes me suicidal. I'm trying to survive every day...

 

[Lilah]

Hey guys, I have lived with severe tinnitus for over 2 years.

Habituating to it during the day is one thing, but honestly, I have not slept properly since getting tinnitus. I often manage to fall asleep somehow, but after 3-4 hours I wake up with loud tinnitus and just can't fall asleep again.

I just can't habituate to no sleep.

I take Valerian root in high doses every night, and often Mirtazapine or Zopiclone. But even this stuff can't get me to sleep properly.

I am so desperate. The simple fact of not being able to sleep ever again makes me suicidal. I'm trying to survive every day...

While not ideal, have you tried masking?

 

[Simon85]

just can't habituate to no sleep.

Sorry to hear the sleep is still an issue. Insomnia makes everything more difficult.

What does your average day look like? I'd suggest getting some solid exercise during the day if you aren't already, being careful with your eating (particularly in the late afternoon / evening). Sleeping pills, while useful at times, are not a good long term solution unfortunately.

 

[livewire77]

Where are you from? If you live in US , you can try some orexin blocker. Dayvigo for example.