Suicide Is NEVER an Option

[Michael Leigh]

It can't be THAT precious when one has debilitating tinnitus.

I don't condone suicide but I understand the reasons a person can be driven to it. Loud debilitating tinnitus is exactly what it says. Under these circumstances a person is unable to withstand the torment they are enduring. Unfortunately, this type of tinnitus is almost impossible to habituate to.

Michael

 

[Bobbie7]

It can't be THAT precious when one has debilitating tinnitus.

There are those people who have multiple serious illnesses and yet... THEY want to live!

 

[Bill Bauer]

There are those people who have multiple illnesses and yet... THEY want to live!

Why should someone who is not like those people, want to be like those people? There are people who are into dangerous "base jumping". So what does that have to do with anything?

 

[Michael Leigh]

There are those people who have multiple serious illnesses and yet... THEY want to live!

I agree with you @Bobbie7 Barbara. With the utmost respect I want to say this: loud intrusive tinnitus is a different kind of beast and that's the only way to describe it. It is mental torture that goes far beyond what most people understand. I have been there and somehow survived but I assure you there were days I felt I couldn't go on. When a person's mental wellbeing is adversely affected to this degree they will almost do anything including suicide (sadly) to get relief.

I say again, I have counselled many people with tinnitus and to hear the emotional anguish that they are going through, unless one has experienced something similar it can be difficult to understand.

Michael

 

[valeri]

There are those people who have multiple serious illnesses and yet... THEY want to live!

That's because they don't have severe tinnitus!

 

[Michael Leigh]

That's because they don't have severe tinnitus!

Sad but very true Valeri. The majority of the people that come to this forum and "post" please remember that "post" They are not at that time experiencing loud intrusive tinnitus. I know this because anyone that is affected in this way is unable to think clearly, boot-up their computer and construct sentences. When a person is having a severe attack of tinnitus the last place they want to be is in front of a computer. Anyone that doesn't agree with this then in my opinion, has never experienced loud intrusive tinnitus.

Michael

 

[Bill Bauer]

There are those people who have multiple serious illnesses and yet... THEY want to live!

As someone joked about the above: "People who have to blink to communicate are leading happier and more satisfying lives than me."

 

[fishbone]

That's because they don't have severe tinnitus!

I consider my tinnitus very severe (high pitched/not maskable and great amount of hearing loss). I also have fibromyalgia, and my body is in pain 247 and i have horsechit ringing that is on 247

YET:

I still smile and live my life and i do full contact martial arts.

So please DON't ever assume, that someone doesn't have it severe here and I sure as hell WANT to live!

And on top of that i have a date with a beautiful gal on Saturday

This Ringing has never ended my passion for living. Yes, it makes it much harder but that's ok i am a warrior and i like challenges..

 

[Lex]

@Bill Bauer, in your post, it says:

"... suicidal thoughts and requests of euthanasia are rare and their frequency is correlated with the presence of physical pain."

Pain makes an illness harder to bear. The cases I read on T suicides almost always mentions H but only in passing. I believe H plays a major role in the T suicide cases but it's hardly given focus.

When I commit suicide, I will emphasize H over and over again in my note to make sure I won't get lumped with the T cases.

 

[Bill Bauer]

When I commit suicide, I will emphasize H over and over again in my note to make sure I won't get lumped with the T cases.

Several days ago you wrote that you had experienced improvement. Are you living through a new spike?

 

[Lex]

Several days ago you wrote that you had experienced improvement. Are you living through a new spike?

No. I got better. Not back to baseline yet but loads better since setback. But I can feel that I don't have enough patience for living this kind of life. It's full of limitations, sacrifices, risks. It's full of isolation, loneliness, fear, and stress. Most of social activities involve noise.

Every day, a part of me dies. Every day, I know what I lost, and it's getting increasingly difficult to see the point of moving forward. There will come a time when I'll be chipped down to nothing. But I still want another Christmas, another birthday, another Valentine's Day. Let's see if my outlook improves after February.

 

[Bill Bauer]

As you know, I am not opposed to suicide. But if your condition is improving, it would seem that there is a reasonable chance that within a year or two a day might come when your ear problems stop bothering you so much...

 

[Bobbie7]

I completely understand what you are saying @Michael Leigh - Michael and can appreciate the torment that some who experience loud intrusive tinnitus must endure. I simply feel life is precious and everything possible must be done for people in this situation. I don't actually know how comprehensive the psychological evaluation must be before assisted suicide can proceed but perhaps the gentleman who we spoke about previously had not gone that route. When you get right down to it... how many members here who have intrusive tinnitus really want to die? Of course, they are filled with despair and overwhelmed by a sense of helplessness and speak about their wanting to die often.. but.. if they were actually given the opportunity to be helped to their exit... how many would?? Probably none.

I have a friend with Parkinson's... hers is quite advanced and believe me... her lot is very far from an easy one and she wants to live yes... with all her difficulties. Grant it, she does not have tinnitus but what she has to deal with day in and day out requires tremendous inner strength and courage and still, she does not wish to die.

Is it so wrong of me to wish people would/could do anything to help ease a person who is suffering other than condoning their self-destruction. Again... if I may... point to some members with whom we are all familiar who had the darkest thoughts at one time... and yet some how triumphed over this affliction and went on to live and have productive and happy lives. I understand suicide ideation very well ... years ago when I was suffering from major unipolar depression I, too, had such dark thoughts. My then young son had no contact with his father and had I succeeded, he would have had no mother as well. The glimmer of hope was sparked in me and I did not carry though.

Some times even horrendous situations can dissipate to some tolerable degree and if not... there must be something which would make life more bearable but it takes times and patience to investigate all constructive options. Many times people become irrational, don't have any support or guidance and completely lose their way.
I am only saying that they should be dissuaded - if at all possible - from self-destructing.

Many members here are young and they have this idea about "perfection" because they are young. Well... life is not easy and if they can deal with their tinnitus now it will serve to strengthen them for the future when many situations will not go their way. Illnesses can strike at any time... they may actually be the best they will be in the present for the future holds no guarantees.

Again @Michael Leigh - Michael I have great respect for you as you are well aware and I understand.. I do.. what you are saying. I have my own opinion and those who wish to end their lives surely do not have to ask for my approval to do so and for anyone ever to suggest (as a few have) that I "offend" them in any way is absurd. Their choice need not be validated by my expression.

Wishing you a pleasant and peaceful day.
Best wishes,
Barbara

 

[Lex]

@Bill Bauer February is still four months away anyway. If I feel better then, I can make another deadline for June so that I can have another summer from March to May. Then in June, if I feel better, I can have another deadline for another reason. These shorter deadlines make it easier for me to move forward. Delay and delay until I finally kill myself or I die of other causes, whichever comes first. I believe that's how many suicidal people go on. "If I could just get it through this hour/day/week/month ..."

 

[Bill Bauer]

@Bill Bauer February is still four months away anyway. If I feel better then, I can make another deadline for June so that I can have another summer from March to May. Then in June, if I feel better, I can have another deadline for another reason. These shorter deadlines make it easier for me to move forward. I believe that's how many suicidal people go on. "If I could just get it through this hour/day/week/month ..."

I sincerely hope that this will have a happy ending.

 

[Bobbie7]

@Bill Bauer - Do you think I and other people are blind here???? Is there really a need to have your font so large??

By the way... how old are you? I know you are young.

 

[Michael Leigh]

Dear Barbara @Bobbie7

Thank you for writing such a poignant post and I fully understand where you are coming from. As you know, most of my posts are written to help people to think more positively about life and tinnitus because getting to grips with this condition and to be able to move on has much to do with a person's positive mindset. Get that right which takes time, one usually can go on to lead a fulfilling life with tinnitus doing everything that they want to.

Fortunately the majority of people do habituate to tinnitus and are able to carry on as I've mentioned above. However, there is a serious and dark side to tinnitus that some people to not like talk about but it is very real. The sobering truth about this condition is this. Unlike many health conditions even the sad case of your friend with Parkinson's and I know this is an awful condition. Often times medication can be given to suppress or alleviate the symptoms to some degree but must still be difficult to endure.

With tinnitus I'm sorry to say, there is nothing that can reduce the noise when it is severe unless the intensity reduces on its own accord. Some things can help but there is no guarantee. The treatments are: counselling, ant-depressants, sound therapy, relaxation techniques benzodiazepine medication like clonazepam.

It is for this reason tinnitus can be so debilitating when it is severe and none of the above therapies or medicines work.

Take care
Michael

 

[valeri]

From sane.org (5 myths about suicide):

Suicide is a big issue. While it only accounts for a small percentage of deaths (around 1.9%), more people lose their lives to suicide than to road accidents, industrial accidents, and homicides combined. Around 2800 Australians take their own life each year; an average of almost 8 suicides a day.

While suicide awareness and prevention has come a long way over the past decade, many myths still exist.

As well as being incorrect, theses myths can stop us recognising when someone is at risk and in need of support. So here are five common misconceptions and the facts you can use to bust these myths.

Myth # 1: Talking about suicide might put the idea in their head
There's no harm in asking. If anything, for someone who is thinking about suicide, talking about it can come as a great a relief, and help them feel less afraid and more in control.

Avoiding or tiptoeing around the issue can be isolating and leave people feeling unheard. The best policy is to try and help someone talk openly about how they are feeling and encourage them to seek help.

Myth #2: People who attempt suicide want to die
People who attempt suicide are often quite ambivalent about it. They may not really want to die – they may even be afraid of death – but see suicide as the only way to bring an end to their pain.

Providing emotional support, helping them consider positive coping methods, can be helpful to someone who is feeling unsafe.

Myth #3: Suicidal behaviour is manipulative or 'attention-seeking'
Sometimes people may threaten or attempt suicide as a desperate plea to let others know they are not coping and need help.

They may not know how to tell others how they are feeling, they may think that no one cares, or that nobody can help them.

However these actions may come across, they should never be treated as trivial or manipulative. All suicidal talk and behaviour is serious and requires a compassionate and immediate response.

Myth #4: Most suicides happen unexpectedly
There are often warning signs prior to suicide. Some may be obvious, talking about suicide or death. Others less so, such as withdrawing from friends or family, or misusing alcohol and drugs.

People who are thinking about dying usually try to seek help. In fact, many people who attempt suicide visit a doctor in the months and weeks prior.

Myth #5: Suicide is a selfish act
Many people who attempt suicide feel they are a burden to others, and that their friends and family would be better off without them. While some people recognise that their death will cause their loved one's pain, they may also believe they are causing more pain by being alive and rationalise suicide as a way to protect those they care about.

 

[Dana]

The majority of the people that come to this forum and "post" please remember that "post" They are not at that time experiencing loud intrusive tinnitus. I know this because anyone that is affected in this way is unable to think clearly, boot-up their computer and construct sentences. When a person is having a severe attack of tinnitus the last place they want to be is in front of a computer. Anyone that doesn't agree with this then in my opinion, has never experienced loud intrusive tinnitus.

Michael

So so so so true.
I have been in this situation only two weeks ago.
You know what you are talking about.

 

[Bill Bauer]

While it only accounts for a small percentage of deaths (around 1.9%)

Wow, I never realized that 1 in 50 people commit suicide(!)

Myth #2: People who attempt suicide want to die

It is clear that the sample is biased. Those who survive a suicide attempt are more likely to just want attention than those who don't. And we can't interview the ones who were successful.

This myth makes as much sense as saying: "Myth: people who eat are hungry"

 

[Dana]

@valeri
Thank you, Valeri, for sharing this article with us and my gratitude to the people who wrote this article on sane.org. With each paragraph that i read (or with each horrible myth that was dismantled and exposed for what it is -another unfair blow to a hurting human being) was like a layer of balm on my wounds.

 

[Michael Leigh]

So so so so true.
I have been in this situation only two weeks ago.
You know what you are talking about.

Indeed @Dana Having had tinnitus for 21 years I consider myself a veteran of the condition and believe I have experienced nearly all manifestations of it. From complete silence, mild moderate severe and extremely severe. One can never know it all because there's always something new to learn. Like others in this forum, I know the dark and very sinister side of tinnitus and I am never afraid to talk about it. I have been there and come out the other side and hopefully help others that are having difficulty coping with it.

All the best
Michael

 

[Raphael7713]

Indeed @Dana Having had tinnitus for 21 years I consider myself a veteran of the condition and believe I have experienced nearly all manifestations of it. From complete silence, mild moderate severe and extremely severe. One can never know it all because there's always something new to learn. Like others in this forum, I know the dark and very sinister side of tinnitus and I am never afraid to talk about it. I have been there and come out the other side and hopefully help others that are having difficulty coping with it.

All the best
Michael

So this should be motivation enough that if you experience severe tinnitus it can go away and become milder. I think it's good to hear.

 

[Michael Leigh]

So this should be motivation enough that if you experience severe tinnitus it can go away and become milder. I think it's good to hear.

If my experience helps someone to have a more optimistic and positive outlook on life and tinnitus then I'm pleased. I do not believe in sugar coating the truth about it. It can be ruthless and unforgiving and this is the reason, one must treat it with the utmost respect, especially someone that has "noise induced" tinnitus. Go out and have a nice time but also be prudent and use good judgment when around loud sounds.

Michael

 

[Raphael7713]

If my experience helps someone to have a more optimistic and positive outlook on life and tinnitus then I'm pleased. I do not believe in sugar coating the truth about it. It can be ruthless and unforgiving and this is the reason, one must treat it with the utmost respect, especially someone that has "noise induced" tinnitus. Go out and have a nice time but also be prudent and use good judgment when around loud sounds.

Michael

What is the big difference between noise inducted tinnitus and tinnitus that is not?

 

[Michael Leigh]

What is the big difference between noise inducted tinnitus and tinnitus that is not?

In my opinion. Noise induced tinnitus in most cases (but not all) is more severe and temperamental than other types of tinnitus not caused by loud noise. A person with noise induced tinnitus will often have hyperacusis which makes the condition more problematic. With noise induced tinnitus the cochlea is usually affected long term. By this I mean it's like a cut - although it heals a scar remains. Similarly, when one habituates the auditory system will usually be more sensitive than before. People that have tinnitus which wasn't caused by "loud noise" their auditory system is not so easily affected by sound. I am in no way implying that their tinnitus cannot be severe as someone with noise induced tinnitus.

Michael

 

[butterfly75]

A quote by David Foster Wallace: "Make no mistake about people who leap from burning windows. Their terror of falling from a great height is still just as great as it would be for you or me standing speculatively at the same window just checking out the view; i.e. the fear of falling remains a constant. The variable here is the other terror, the fire's flames: when the flames get close enough, falling to death becomes the slightly less terrible of two terrors. It's not desiring the fall; it's terror of the flames. And yet nobody down on the sidewalk, looking up and yelling 'Don't!' and 'Hang on!', can understand the jump. Not really. You'd have to have personally been trapped and felt flames to really understand a terror way beyond falling."

 

[GregCA]

Wow, I never realized that 1 in 50 people commit suicide(!)

The claim is that it's 1 in 50 deaths.
According to this site:

"Suicide has a global mortality rate of 16 per 100,000 people."​

 

[TheDanishGirl]

A quote by David Foster Wallace: "Make no mistake about people who leap from burning windows. Their terror of falling from a great height is still just as great as it would be for you or me standing speculatively at the same window just checking out the view; i.e. the fear of falling remains a constant. The variable here is the other terror, the fire's flames: when the flames get close enough, falling to death becomes the slightly less terrible of two terrors. It's not desiring the fall; it's terror of the flames. And yet nobody down on the sidewalk, looking up and yelling 'Don't!' and 'Hang on!', can understand the jump. Not really. You'd have to have personally been trapped and felt flames to really understand a terror way beyond falling."

As much as I find this thread gloomy and depressing, I must say that this is the greatest metaphor for tinnitus I have ever heard.

 

[attheedgeofscience]

Why don't you try to conduct some sort of survey or find information on the percentage of those who have tinnitus who have actually gone and committed suicide???

That I have already shared... right here, in fact:

www.tinnitustalk.com/threads/why-you-shouldnt-be-afraid-of-suicide-stories.23862/#post-275711

Contrary to the myths that sometimes get circulated on tinnitus boards, suicide is actually higher among those with tinnitus (particularly those with severe tinnitus - which requires study of subgroup populations and therefore a large data set).

Suicide is also higher among those with chronic illnesses in general (not surprisingly, really). Attached is a study on COPD and suicide.