Tinnitus Began First Week of June 2020 After Wim Hof Breathing

[Kran3050]

@sparrow1210, I think the retreat will be great fun, definitely go! And I think the breathing should be ok if you have all the information going in - don't do it as intensely as you can, don't push the air to create head pressure. If you notice anything at all going on with the ears then take it easy. But millions of people are doing it without the permanent side effect, we just got very unlucky here.

@MrC6688, oh man, sorry to hear all that. You must have it much worse than me then, I can easily hear TV or music over it. Only thing I can't really do like that is listen to something like a podcast with noise-cancelling headphones. Usually it doesn't disturb me when I'm sleeping, unless I've done a lot of inversions that day in which case it'll be louder and I'll need some sounds on. I find usually it's less noticeable in the morning when I wake up (not always but usually). Sometimes it starts as more of just a hissing and the high tone comes in later after a coffee or exercise or just being awake longer. I might just get some of that Saraswati Churna and try it out, see if I can repeat the results you had. Will update.

 

[Lukee]

In the morning I usually drink a cup of strong homemade tea of Turmeric, Ginger, Reishi, Chaga, Foti, Eleuthero, Dandelion, Maca, Moringa, Astragalus, Ashwagandha, and Oregano.

Hey Renfrey, how have you been? My ear issues are back and it feels like I have glue ear with slight pressure. So uncomfortable! I tried taking CBD again last night and some Magnesium and my tinnitus is definitely better today (it's been spiking for like 4 days). I don't know if it's the CBD, Magnesium (I have been taking it every night) or fasting (I started some IF two days ago).

I wanted to ask if you are still taking this tea. I think this might be one of the things helping you along to recovery. Let us know how you're doing.

@MrC6688, waiting for April 12! I've made an appointment with an Ayurvedic doctor too but won't see him until late next week. In anticipation I just ordered some Saraswati Churna. I hope we are on the right path.

 

[Renfrey]

Hey Renfrey, how have you been? My ear issues are back and it feels like I have glue ear with slight pressure. So uncomfortable! I tried taking CBD again last night and some Magnesium and my tinnitus is definitely better today (it's been spiking for like 4 days). I don't know if it's the CBD, Magnesium (I have been taking it every night) or fasting (I started some IF two days ago).

I wanted to ask if you are still taking this tea. I think this might be one of the things helping you along to recovery. Let us know how you're doing.

@MrC6688, waiting for April 12! I've made an appointment with an Ayurvedic doctor too but won't see him until late next week. In anticipation I just ordered some Saraswati Churna. I hope we are on the right path.

Hey Lukee. Have you tried any kind of natural ear drops? I think if I had any glue ear feeling still, I might look into that. Or maybe some of that Xlear natural nasal spray that Mr. C was talking about. Great to hear your tinnitus is better! Do you feel the effects of the CBD after you take it? How's your sound therapy going?

I'm doing alright I suppose. Still on the same steady course. Nothing seems to be worsening and there are times when things feel like they're improving. Still doing all the same stuff - multi vitamins, NAC, ALCAR, Brocco Max, Colon Cleanse (with probiotics), Magnesium, Melatonin, Mucuna (L-Dopa), CBD, fresh spinach, beet juice, KeVita Probiotic Drinks, watermelon, strawberries, meat, raw potatoes, sunflower seeds, pistachios, etc.

Yeah, I'm still doing the morning tea. But the ingredients vary a little as I run out of certain ones and add others that I've had for a while. I need to make another big herbal buy soon. Right now my tea is - Turmeric, Reishi, Fo-ti, Moringa, Tribulus, Cordyceps, Cinnamon, Echinacea, Hedyotis, Dan-Shen, and Skullcap.

Still pushing through the exercise and ice baths. I've been really getting into the neck/head/jaw/face exercising too. I feel like that whole area is getting stronger and healthier. The best part of the day with the least amount of ringing is usually after the exercise, ice bath, and CBD.

Still pushing through the sound therapy. I do Dave's Tinnitus Mix while sleeping and a few other ones during the day. I think they're helping. The tones in my head feel like they're changing and may be slowly cancelling out. Very slowly. I can relate to what Dave was saying about the tinnitus trying to "reform" after listening to these therapies. That's kind of what feels like is happening. So I guess we fight it back down with more neuromodulation. The battle rages on, ay? Trying to articulate the effects of these sound therapies seems a little difficult at times. I think that any improvement with this will only be gained through a very slow attrition.

I just got my first Pfizer shot last Thursday too. No side effects other than a sore arm for a couple of days. I don't think it has cranked up the ringing any yet.

 

[Lukee]

Hey Lukee. Have you tried any kind of natural ear drops? I think if I had any glue ear feeling still, I might look into that. Or maybe some of that Xlear natural nasal spray that Mr. C was talking about. Great to hear your tinnitus is better! Do you feel the effects of the CBD after you take it? How's your sound therapy going?

I'm doing alright I suppose. Still on the same steady course. Nothing seems to be worsening and there are times when things feel like they're improving. Still doing all the same stuff - multi vitamins, NAC, ALCAR, Brocco Max, Colon Cleanse (with probiotics), Magnesium, Melatonin, Mucuna (L-Dopa), CBD, fresh spinach, beet juice, KeVita Probiotic Drinks, watermelon, strawberries, meat, raw potatoes, sunflower seeds, pistachios, etc.

Yeah, I'm still doing the morning tea. But the ingredients vary a little as I run out of certain ones and add others that I've had for a while. I need to make another big herbal buy soon. Right now my tea is - Turmeric, Reishi, Fo-ti, Moringa, Tribulus, Cordyceps, Cinnamon, Echinacea, Hedyotis, Dan-Shen, and Skullcap.

Still pushing through the exercise and ice baths. I've been really getting into the neck/head/jaw/face exercising too. I feel like that whole area is getting stronger and healthier. The best part of the day with the least amount of ringing is usually after the exercise, ice bath, and CBD.

Still pushing through the sound therapy. I do Dave's Tinnitus Mix while sleeping and a few other ones during the day. I think they're helping. The tones in my head feel like they're changing and may be slowly cancelling out. Very slowly. I can relate to what Dave was saying about the tinnitus trying to "reform" after listening to these therapies. That's kind of what feels like is happening. So I guess we fight it back down with more neuromodulation. The battle rages on, ay? Trying to articulate the effects of these sound therapies seems a little difficult at times. I think that any improvement with this will only be gained through a very slow attrition.

I just got my first Pfizer shot last Thursday too. No side effects other than a sore arm for a couple of days. I don't think it has cranked up the ringing any yet.

Great to hear you're on a steady course. Funny you mention Xlear, I tried it again today and a couple other things so hoping for some results. I also got back on the band wagon again with the sound therapy during work at computer and will try Tinnitus Mix again at night. I think you're right and it's a slow process but possibly works. As I mentioned I believe the yea you are making might have a positive effect. The Turmeric, Ashwagandha and mushrooms probably all help a bit to lower inflammation and support recovery. I have found that the best supplement for toning down the ringing has been Taurine. After 1g, I have almost had it go away completely. I hope my ears are slowly getting better from the glue ear perspective; I've started also taking Bromelain which is said to help with ETD as well as tinnitus (and eye floaters, which I've seemed to have developed more of after WHM).

Waiting on my Saraswati to show up and I'll try that for a couple days and see if my BP changes and if it has any effect on my tinnitus.

I also believe that the ice baths and exercise night really be helping too. It's getting blood to the ears and keeping inflammation down I would think.

@MrC6688, did you try the Vitamin B3? I think it's amazing that after a single dose I could pop my ears with almost no effort at all. It makes me believe that maybe after all we do have some form of ETD.

Another thing I wanted to mention was my tinnitus seemed to get better after I took some Mucinex. I don't know if that was coincidental but it did get a lot quieter. The other weird thing is the odd time I'll get a bout of fleeting tinnitus and everything just goes completely quiet for a few seconds and I hear complete silence. It's almost like putting on noise canceling earphones, it's an odd feeling almost. I didn't really notice that with the fleeting tinnitus prior to getting chronic tinnitus. It's very pronounced now, and though it only happens every few days or so, I welcome it very much as I get to remember what silence actually sound alike without this hiss.

As a last note, I've been in contact with Dr. La Torre. He seems like a nice and genuine guy. He's an Italian ENT living in Vietnam who specializes in hydrops and its treatment. I am running our situation by him to see what he thinks and if the pathology fits hydrops and/or if he thinks the damage is physical. His consultation is free and if he believes he can help you, he charges 150 euros for a program of medications, diet, etc and basically lifetime follow up support. If he doesn't think he can help, well, that's pretty self-explanatory. I found a thread on Tinnitus Talk and it seems like a few members felt he wasn't legitimate but I've looked him up and after speaking to him briefly he seems pretty legitimate. Ultimately, if he is able to help me I really don't care if he has a degree or not. His website is drlatorre.info. Let me know what you think.

Keep up the good work.

P.S. Good to hear no side effects form the shot. Trying to get my Pfizer shot myself, Canada in short supply at the moment so have to wait my turn.

 

[MrC6688]

Hey Renfrey, how have you been? My ear issues are back and it feels like I have glue ear with slight pressure. So uncomfortable! I tried taking CBD again last night and some Magnesium and my tinnitus is definitely better today (it's been spiking for like 4 days). I don't know if it's the CBD, Magnesium (I have been taking it every night) or fasting (I started some IF two days ago).

I wanted to ask if you are still taking this tea. I think this might be one of the things helping you along to recovery. Let us know how you're doing.

@MrC6688, waiting for April 12! I've made an appointment with an Ayurvedic doctor too but won't see him until late next week. In anticipation I just ordered some Saraswati Churna. I hope we are on the right path.

Awesome man! Let me know how your session goes and what the Ayurvedic physician prescribes for you. Yea, I can't wait to go back on the supplements. These past 2 weeks have been pretty bad, ringing wise.

What is your supplement regimen right now? I've not yet tried Taurine. Is there any side effect after taking it? I have taken Niacin in the past and didn't care for the Niacin flush I experienced. I felt like I was having a heart attack, lol. But I guess it goes away once you get used to it. Again, I also might be very sensitive to supplements.

I'm glad you guys are having positive effects with Xlear. I use the nasal wash (using the squeeze bottle) every day now, morning and night and it's helping with the ETD. I can feel it. The nasal spray is very good too.

I'm really curious to see what Dr. La Torre has to say. Definitely keep us posted. Coincidentally, I'd written to Dr. Thanos Tzounopoulos this week via email about our conditions from Wim Hof. If he writes back or has any insight I will definitely share it with you guys. You can check out his profile here: https://phrc.pitt.edu/people/thanos-tzounopoulos. I heard about him on a Tinnitus Talk Podcast and he's pretty well known.

 

[Lukee]

What is your supplement regimen right now? I've not yet tried Taurine. Is there any side effect after taking it?

I've been bouncing between all kinds of supplements. Right now I'm trying Vitamin A, Bromelain, Fish Oil and Taurine. I've taken CBD the last two nights. I've woken up with very low noise but it really does fluctuate throughout the day. I would say Taurine has been the best along with Fish Oil. I'm taking the Vitamin A and Bromelain to help with the ETD.

I have taken Niacin in the past and didn't care for the Niacin flush I experienced. I felt like I was having a heart attack, lol. But I guess it goes away once you get used to it.

After using it a few times, I can say without a doubt that it does something to the ears and ETs. I don't mind the flush, it feels like a sunburn for 20 minutes so I just pretend I'm away on vacation and close my eyes lol. Eventually you do get used to it and have to oversee dosage to get the same effect but I've only taken it a handful of times and I'm not there yet. If you take it less frequently, you don't develop the resistance. I would give it a go and see how it affects your ears popping out of curiosity.

Coincidentally, I'd written to Dr. Thanos Tzounopoulos this week via email about our conditions from Wim Hof.

I've read a lot about Dr. Tzounopoulos and that's a great idea. I'm pretty sure he gets bombarded by emails everyday so hopefully he can take a second to give his opinion. I know he has published several papers in the last year and has been very busy with his research. Fingers crossed he can give us some direction.

 

[Renfrey]

I have found that the best supplement for toning down the ringing has been Taurine.

Interesting. I haven't heard about Taurine for tinnitus yet. Thanks for bringing that up. On that same note, I think EAA's and BCAA's might be of synergistic benefit as well.

Waiting on my Saraswati to show up and I'll try that for a couple days and see if my BP changes and if it has any effect on my tinnitus.

Have you ever experimented with voluntarily manipulating BP readings? I think it's interesting that it can change so easily by doing things like changing your cuffed arm position, standing, sitting, deep slow breathing, and relaxation. I checked it one time after doing WHM breathing and it went below normal. Not dangerously low, but a low healthy reading.

The other weird thing is the odd time I'll get a bout of fleeting tinnitus and everything just goes completely quiet for a few seconds and I hear complete silence. It's almost like putting on noise canceling earphones, it's an odd feeling almost. I didn't really notice that with the fleeting tinnitus prior to getting chronic tinnitus. It's very pronounced now, and though it only happens every few days or so, I welcome it very much as I get to remember what silence actually sound alike without this hiss.

Yeah, I get a louder than normal fleeting ringing every few days or so too. I don't mind it either, because I'm familiar with it and know it's only gonna last a few seconds. I'm thinking it might be related to sound therapy and the changing tones. I can't say that everything goes quiet for me though when it happens.

As a last note, I've been in contact with Dr. La Torre. He seems like a nice and genuine guy. He's an Italian ENT living in Vietnam who specializes in hydrops and its treatment. I am running our situation by him to see what he thinks and if the pathology fits hydrops and/or if he thinks the damage is physical. His consultation is free and if he believes he can help you, he charges 150 euros for a program of medications, diet, etc and basically lifetime follow up support. If he doesn't think he can help, well, that's pretty self-explanatory. I found a thread on Tinnitus Talk and it seems like a few members felt he wasn't legitimate but I've looked him up and after speaking to him briefly he seems pretty legitimate. Ultimately, if he is able to help me I really don't care if he has a degree or not. His website is drlatorre.info. Let me know what you think.

Interesting. Lots of info on his website. I'm not too keen on his anti-depression medication regimen though. But it would be interesting to hear what he has to say about our situation. Keep us posted.

After using it a few times, I can say without a doubt that it does something to the ears and ETs. I don't mind the flush, it feels like a sunburn for 20 minutes so I just pretend I'm away on vacation and close my eyes lol. Eventually you do get used to it and have to oversee dosage to get the same effect but I've only taken it a handful of times and I'm not there yet. If you take it less frequently, you don't develop the resistance. I would give it a go and see how it affects your ears popping out of curiosity.

Niacin sounds like another logical supplement to take. I haven't taken it by itself in many years, but I do remember that marked flush and blood flow to the head. Also an itching sensation around the ears.

Definitely something I'd like to try again. Nice and cheap too. Thanks for the reminder!

 

[Renfrey]

My Easter diet most definitely didn't help, lol. All the cakes, sweets, chocolate, occasional beer. Pretty much everything that tinnitus sufferers are told to avoid. Yea man, this condition really sucks. I can't even watch a movie on tv because the tinnitus starts ringing over the movie. So I just shut it off. I can't stop exercising, I need to keep doing it. I know it'll make the ringing bad but if I don't workout I'll be miserable.

Hey Mr. C. Are you still doing sound therapy regularly? Have you tried sound therapy while sleeping?

Sometimes I like to listen to sound therapy while watching TV. I think it helps drown out the ringing even if it's playing in the background.

 

[Lukee]

Hi All,

I tried a new supplement yesterday. Tru Niagen NR. It's a form of B3 and there's a whole thread on Tinnitus Talk about it. I only took one dose yesterday at lunch. By the evening, my tinnitus was very, very low. Completely livable and almost non-existent. I have good days and bad days like everyone else but I haven't had this kid of reprieve in weeks. I can't directly attribute it to the NR but it's possible. In the thread and on the forums, there have been some miraculous recoveries from tinnitus using this stuff. I don't believe all of the posters (likely scam accounts) but some of the people posting about improvements are longstanding members in the forums. I am going to continue for the month and include Resveratrol as it's commonly stacked.

I still have this feeling of something in my ears and clicking when I swallow. It getting better and worse throughout the day but it's super annoying. Still glue ear type symptom. I feel like I. We'd a steroid to reduce the inflammation inside my ear and dry it out or something. It's driving me nuts.

I received my shipment of Saraswati last night but the bad news for me is that we are now in a lockdown for the next month and all non-essential is closed. While it's a grey area, this includes osteopaths and some alternative medicine providers, including the Ayurvedic doctor I booked. At the earliest I can only see her mid May if everything lifts here. Depending on how @MrC6688's appointment goes on Monday, I might just start taking it and try it out. Do you mind to share the dosing Mr C?

Hope you guys are getting better, even if it's slowly.

 

[Lukee]

Ok. I want to change direction for a second. In the thread I created about the neurologist with possible tinnitus treatment using Sanexus, @FGG posed the question about what exactly is wrong with us. She mentioned a few conditions that we have already thrown around and our doctors have dismissed. I started to think about perilymph fistulas again and reviewed the symptoms. As per this site:

"The symptoms of perilymph fistula may include dizziness, vertigo, imbalance, nausea, and vomiting. Usually however, patients report an unsteadiness which increases with activity and which is relieved by rest. Some people experience ringing or fullness in the ears, and many notice a hearing loss. Some people with fistulas find that their symptoms get worse with coughing, sneezing, or blowing their noses, as well as with exertion and activity. This sort of symptom goes under the general rubric of "Valsalva induced dizziness", and it can also be associated with other medical conditions in entirely different categories --for example, the Chiari malformation, and a heart condition called "IHSS". Returning to fistula, it is not unusual to notice that use of ones own voice or a musical instrument will cause dizziness (this is called the "Tullio's phenomenon")."​

While the dizziness and hearing loss doesn't seem prevalent, a bunch of the members of this thread have mentioned most of the symptoms. I know for many of us, our tinnitus gets worse the more active we are. @MrC6688 complained of dizziness during a workout and @Kran3050 said his gets worse when inverting. One of the main causes of fistulas is barotrauma so there's a possibility; the only thing I'm not sure about is whether it could happen bilaterally. I believe we mostly have "head tinnitus" that is high pitched and bilateral, though I believe more and more I feel it dominant in my left ear. The other thing that struck me was "Tullio's Phenomenon" which is kind of what Mr C described happening to him with AudioNotch. @Renfrey and I have also had strange sensations when listening to neuromodulation tracks, not sure if it's related.

@FGG, do you think fistulas could be bilateral? Is hearing loss a big symptom? What about the other symptoms, do you think they match?

 

[Matchbox]

A fistula would take a lot of force to have happen, so think weight training, scuba diving, or labour.

That said, it's probably underdiagnosed... I think it's a case of "head in the sand" by ENTs.

I literally gave my ENT the playbook of fistula (barotrauma, unsteadiness/jerking/nighttime on the sea sway vertigo but not unable to walk or do things, tinnitus and what seems like low frequency hearing loss and wavering tinnitus/distortion unilaterally. Exaggerated tinnitus on yawning and ear canal pressure swings and sometimes induced unsteadiness) and he basically said no you'd have real hearing loss and be unable to walk.

I think that's complete garbage. Given that it would take a blood patch to test and there's a few other tests (though not accurate really) which are all minimal risk, I'm pretty confident I have doctors who see REALLY bad patients and so are biased and downplay my situation as not meeting criteria for pursuing treatment.

That or they really love saying you just have to live with it to all their patients to get through the day quick.

 

[FGG]

and he basically said no you'd have real hearing loss and be unable to walk.

You already recognize this but that doctor obviously sucks. How frustrating.

Ok. I want to change direction for a second. In the thread I created about the neurologist with possible tinnitus treatment using Sanexus, @FGG posed the question about what exactly is wrong with us. She mentioned a few conditions that we have already thrown around and our doctors have dismissed. I started to think about perilymph fistulas again and reviewed the symptoms. As per this site:

"The symptoms of perilymph fistula may include dizziness, vertigo, imbalance, nausea, and vomiting. Usually however, patients report an unsteadiness which increases with activity and which is relieved by rest. Some people experience ringing or fullness in the ears, and many notice a hearing loss. Some people with fistulas find that their symptoms get worse with coughing, sneezing, or blowing their noses, as well as with exertion and activity. This sort of symptom goes under the general rubric of "Valsalva induced dizziness", and it can also be associated with other medical conditions in entirely different categories --for example, the Chiari malformation, and a heart condition called "IHSS". Returning to fistula, it is not unusual to notice that use of ones own voice or a musical instrument will cause dizziness (this is called the "Tullio's phenomenon")."​

While the dizziness and hearing loss doesn't seem prevalent, a bunch of the members of this thread have mentioned most of the symptoms. I know for many of us, our tinnitus gets worse the more active we are. @MrC6688 complained of dizziness during a workout and @Kran3050 said his gets worse when inverting. One of the main causes of fistulas is barotrauma so there's a possibility; the only thing I'm not sure about is whether it could happen bilaterally. I believe we mostly have "head tinnitus" that is high pitched and bilateral, though I believe more and more I feel it dominant in my left ear. The other thing that struck me was "Tullio's Phenomenon" which is kind of what Mr C described happening to him with AudioNotch. @Renfrey and I have also had strange sensations when listening to neuromodulation tracks, not sure if it's related.

@FGG, do you think fistulas could be bilateral? Is hearing loss a big symptom? What about the other symptoms, do you think they match?

It wasn't my first thought in your case because you have "glue ear" and it sounds like it's already responding to mucinex (this seems more Eustachian Tube to me) but if it doesn't get better, would be a good differential to add to the list especially with the dizziness. It doesn't hurt to try to get a consultation either way though.

For the other cases you mentioned, "dizziness on inverting" and a work out trigger and tulios are all suggestive. They should consult a specialist to get an opinion.

@Backpacker knows a lot about 3rd window diseases and who the specialists are so hopefully she can chime in.

 

[JonW]

Hi everyone -
I don't have much to add at this point, but I seem to have a story similar to MrC, etc -- and I wanted to say "hello".

I dabbled with WHM in January; and noticed an incessant tinnitus "eeeeee" shortly thereafter. I didn't think to connect WHM with tinnitus, until I tried WHM again yesterday (3 rounds, including ~100 seconds breath hold each), and noticed the tinnitus was very loud for a few minutes afterwards. Then did a bit of Googling and found this forum.

Some other items I'll mention about my experiences:

• I've experienced some 'ringing in the ears' in the past, but it never lasted more than an hour. But now it's 24x7, for 4 months solid.
• I don't notice the 'glue ear', stickiness; or 'fullness' type symptoms.
• I do hear a crackling in my ears when I perform a 'swallowing' motion; or do certain motions with my jaw. Seems to be related to forcing a small amount of pressure/air into my ETs.
• I regularly wear active noise-cancelling headphones (work from home, need to cancel noises of my kids!). I was worried that the headphones had contributed to the tinnitus; but after reading your accounts I'm more inclined to assume it's related to the extended breath holding.
• I did not do any kind of "force air into your head" part of WHM -- just basically the hyperventilation & breath holding.

My GP doctor suggested Prednisone, but after a 7-day course, I found no relief from this.

I have not yet tried any other treatments -- but I eagerly read through most of the 400 (!) posts in this thread.

I also don't have any bad things to say about WHM -- it seems to be a great method with many benefits. There's just a group of us who have this rather unfortunate side effect.

It's very interesting to hear the same stories from so many other people. Your detailed descriptions of symptoms, attempted treatments, etc are all very helpful! Doing this on a public forum is very helpful for others (like myself) to find.

I'll be following along, and if I find anything helpful for me, I'll be sure to chime in.

Thanks for being here!!

-Jon

 

[Lukee]

@MrC6688, it's D-day! Give us some good news man.

 

[Lukee]

You already recognize this but that doctor obviously sucks. How frustrating.

It wasn't my first thought in your case because you have "glue ear" and it sounds like it's already responding to mucinex (this seems more Eustachian Tube to me) but if it doesn't get better, would be a good differential to add to the list especially with the dizziness. It doesn't hurt to try to get a consultation either way though.

For the other cases you mentioned, "dizziness on inverting" and a work out trigger and tulios are all suggestive. They should consult a specialist to get an opinion.

@Backpacker knows a lot about 3rd window diseases and who the specialists are so hopefully she can chime in.

Hi @FGG and @Backpacker.

I wanted to get your take on this: soon after onset and for about the first two months, I started to get some mild headaches and pressure in my head, mostly near my temporal lobes. Most of the others on this thread didn't seem to get those same symptoms but I did notice that they resolved mostly when I stopped doing the Valsalva maneuver (I was using it to treat the ETD/glue and milk the steroid spray into the Eustachian Tubes).

Yesterday I bought an Otovent to try for my potential "glue ear" and immediately after I noticed the mild head pressure. I also started to get what seems like TTTS or MEM, a very low frequency, subtle hum that is still with me this morning. I can only hear it or feel it if I'm very still and it's only in my right ear. It certainly feels like a muscle spasm. Additionally, my ears feel fuller again, like they did at the onset of the tinnitus but not as bad. The "hyperacusis" I had to certain sounds is also back and I can feel my eardrums react to my kids' voices. Also, my daughter touched my chin and cheek last night lightly and I felt it in my ear. Strangest feeling, it was like ear rumbling when clenching my eyes/face but it was happening on its own by her touching my face lightly. This all came about after the Otovent.

What do you think would cause these spasms after using the Otovent? I'm wondering if maybe we are dealing with perilymph fistula like you suggested since it seems that pressure is exacerbating these symptoms.

Thanks for your help!

 

[FGG]

Hi @FGG and @Backpacker.

I wanted to get your take on this: soon after onset and for about the first two months, I started to get some mild headaches and pressure in my head, mostly near my temporal lobes. Most of the others on this thread didn't seem to get those same symptoms but I did notice that they resolved mostly when I stopped doing the Valsalva maneuver (I was using it to treat the ETD/glue and milk the steroid spray into the Eustachian Tubes).

Yesterday I bought an Otovent to try for my potential "glue ear" and immediately after I noticed the mild head pressure. I also started to get what seems like TTTS or MEM, a very low frequency, subtle hum that is still with me this morning. I can only hear it or feel it if I'm very still and it's only in my right ear. It certainly feels like a muscle spasm. Additionally, my ears feel fuller again, like they did at the onset of the tinnitus but not as bad. The "hyperacusis" I had to certain sounds is also back and I can feel my eardrums react to my kids' voices. Also, my daughter touched my chin and cheek last night lightly and I felt it in my ear. Strangest feeling, it was like ear rumbling when clenching my eyes/face but it was happening on its own by her touching my face lightly. This all came about after the Otovent.

What do you think would cause these spasms after using the Otovent? I'm wondering if maybe we are dealing with perilymph fistula like you suggested since it seems that pressure is exacerbating these symptoms.

Thanks for your help!

I can't speak to the PLF possibility here but you were improving on mucus thinning drugs and worsened on the Otovent (I had to look this up, it seems like it puts pressure on the Eustachian tube to open it up?). I think at minimum you have also or possibly primarily have Eustachian Tube inflammation and you might have made it worse with the Otovent.

I have TTTS and it is very sensitive to ET function. The cheek sensation and the temple pain/mild headache goes along with mine as well because I have secondary trigeminal nerve irritation from the middle ear inflammation.

This could take months to settle unfortunately. You have to be very patient. Since you have hyperacusis, protect your ears from sounds diligently, the people who recover well tend to be those that don't try to rush recovery and expose themselves to much noise again too soon. Keep taking the mucus drugs. I find Ambroxol (can get it on Amazon if not available in your country OTC) helpful with both the nerve pain and the mucus thinning.

 

[MrC6688]

Hey Mr. C. Are you still doing sound therapy regularly? Have you tried sound therapy while sleeping?

Sometimes I like to listen to sound therapy while watching TV. I think it helps drown out the ringing even if it's playing in the background.

Hey @Renfrey, I have not tried those sound tracks that you guys use. I think I'll try them actually. Can you reply with the link? Thanks man!

 

[MrC6688]

@MrC6688, it's D-day! Give us some good news man.

@Lukee ok, I spoke with this new Ayurvedic doctor and got her take on all the supplements I've been taking. We'll see man... she said the reason why my blood pressure might have gone up from the Saraswati Churna was because traditional Ayurvedic medicine might be too powerful for those raised on Western diets so we need a formulation that is catered to our diets, as to lessen the side effects we experience. At least, this is what her Ayurvedic teacher taught her (an Indian doctor who was made famous for bringing it to the U.S.). She said the ingredients in the Saraswati Churna, namely the long pepper, black pepper, and rock salt might be the culprits in the blood pressure raising by forcing the liver to "over heat". She's sending me a new formulation of the Saraswati Churna that will still have the powerful essence of the Saraswati Churna and other herbs I'm taking but without the side effects. She said we'll try that and see if it reduces the ringing. If it does not, it's on to step 2 which will include other Ayurvedic herbs that will be aimed specifically at healing the auditory nerves until we eventually heal the tinnitus. If that doesn't work I'm going back on the pills and dealing with the raise in blood pressure because without a doubt, the Saraswati Churna was definitely helping.

Once I get the medicinal drops from her (she's sending drops that I'm supposed to add to 32 oz of water and drink it throughout the day) I will share the info with you guys and I will absolutely keep a daily record of my progress. I swear... this whole thing sometimes feels like one foot forward, one step back, one forward again, pause, go back again, lol. I just want to get a program going that starts working for me. I'm hoping this is it.

 

[MrC6688]

I tried a new supplement yesterday. Tru Niagen NR. It's a form of B3 and there's a whole thread on Tinnitus Talk about it. I only took one dose yesterday at lunch. By the evening, my tinnitus was very, very low. Completely livable and almost non-existent. I have good days and bad days like everyone else but I haven't had this kid of reprieve in weeks. I can't directly attribute it to the NR but it's possible. In the thread and on the forums, there have been some miraculous recoveries from tinnitus using this stuff. I don't believe all of the posters (likely scam accounts) but some of the people posting about improvements are longstanding members in the forums. I am going to continue for the month and include Resveratrol as it's commonly stacked.

I still have this feeling of something in my ears and clicking when I swallow. It getting better and worse throughout the day but it's super annoying. Still glue ear type symptom. I feel like I. We'd a steroid to reduce the inflammation inside my ear and dry it out or something. It's driving me nuts.

I received my shipment of Saraswati last night but the bad news for me is that we are now in a lockdown for the next month and all non-essential is closed. While it's a grey area, this includes osteopaths and some alternative medicine providers, including the Ayurvedic doctor I booked. At the earliest I can only see her mid May if everything lifts here. Depending on how @MrC6688's appointment goes on Monday, I might just start taking it and try it out. Do you mind to share the dosing Mr C?

Hope you guys are getting better, even if it's slowly.

Ahh, you're the other member here seeing an Ayurvedic doctor, very cool. Sure, my first doctor prescribed 500 mg of Saraswati Churna to be taken in the morning. If you can handle it after 1-2 weeks, you can up it to two pills but I would try 500 mg first and see how you feel.

 

[Renfrey]

Hey @Renfrey, I have not tried those sound tracks that you guys use. I think I'll try them actually. Can you reply with the link? Thanks man!

I usually use this one while sleeping:
https://tinnitusmix.com/download

And here are a few others that I use while awake:







In my opinion, listening to sound therapies while sleeping is the most effective way to listen. I think it seeps into the head better while sleeping.

Here's more on sound therapy while sleeping:

https://www.tinnitusjournal.com/articles/tinnitus-treatment-with-sound-stimulation-during-sleep.pdf

 

[Ana 112358]

Hi everybody.

My name is Ana and I would like to share with you my frightening experience with WHM. English is not my mother tongue, so I hope you excuse me if my expression is poor or inadequate.

First of all, I have a asymptomatic mitral valve prolapse.

I am mostly a fit person. Last year, during lockdown, I was practicing the Buteyko Breathing Method with good results, my heart rate was 65.

I got to know about the WHM some years ago, and I decided to put it into practice in August 2020, out of curiosity (I feel very stupid about it now, as Buteyko was working ok for me). I had experienced with cold water (not too cold, about 15ºC) and the results were amazing.

I started with WH breathing August the 22th, I went on with it and took cold showers till the 24th. That day things went wrong, I suffer palpitations, dizziness and a very high heart rate. And a pulsating tinnitus.

So I stopped practicing.

My heart rate didn't slow down to my usual rate, and it went worse with time. Most of the time it was highest than 100bpm. This scared the Bejesus out of me (hahaha, I love this expression, I hope is not inadequate).

I made an appointment with a cardiologist and the echocardiogram and electrocardiogram were ok. But I was feeling worse by the days.

One morning my pulse was 127 bpm, and since then my minimum heart rate was 105.

I was so desperate that I made an appointment with an angiologist, because my chest and abdominal palpitations at night were so scaring that I was starting to thing about an aneurysm...

On April the 3th it downed on me that I should reduce my breathing to reverse all the adverse effects that hyperventilations had caused me. I remembered Buteyko method. I started reading about it and finally I came to the conclusion that my problem was chronic hyperventilation.

I realized that WHM triggered my sympathetic system. Hyperventilation provokes hypocapnia, low CO2 in the blood, which reduces oxygenation in the body, so the heart has to overwork to get the proper oxygenation.

It carries the cardiac rhythm over the roof. Hyperventilations feeds back into itself. Moreover, when my pulsations were so high, I could heard my heart in my right ear.

Hyperventilation is never a good idea, I learned it the hard way.

I measured my breathing frequency and it was about 17 times/minute, while the average in a healthy person is 6-12.

Buteyko method is based in the opposite: if you want to reduce your heart rate you must reduce your breathing. It is also based in holding back your breathing.

Since I started Buteyko breathing (11 days ago) my heart beats are going down. Most nights I do not feel the terrible palpitation that concerned me so much. I sleep with my mouth taped in order to avoid hyperventilation.

I had some migraines these days, I felt badly sometimes. But the interesting thing is that my average heart beat right now is currently around 90, palpitation are rare now and I don't feel my heart in my ear anymore.

This morning my pulse rate was 74, which is the lowest since August.

So when I read your stories I thought I should talk to you about Buteyko breathing. It is the best way to calm the sympathetic system down that I have found. I am not a doctor, I do not know if it could help you with your tinnitus, but you could investigate this. It really saved my life.

I am using a book called "Close your mouth" by Patrick McKeown.

Good luck to everybody and thank you.

 

[Lukee]

I usually use this one while sleeping

You think you are doing better now because of it? Has the tinnitus started to quiet down?

 

[Lukee]

Hi everybody.

My name is Ana and I would like to share with you my frightening experience with WHM. English is not my mother tongue, so I hope you excuse me if my expression is poor or inadequate.

First of all, I have a asymptomatic mitral valve prolapse.

I am mostly a fit person. Last year, during lockdown, I was practicing the Buteyko Breathing Method with good results, my heart rate was 65.

I got to know about the WHM some years ago, and I decided to put it into practice in August 2020, out of curiosity (I feel very stupid about it now, as Buteyko was working ok for me). I had experienced with cold water (not too cold, about 15ºC) and the results were amazing.

I started with WH breathing August the 22th, I went on with it and took cold showers till the 24th. That day things went wrong, I suffer palpitations, dizziness and a very high heart rate. And a pulsating tinnitus.

So I stopped practicing.

My heart rate didn't slow down to my usual rate, and it went worse with time. Most of the time it was highest than 100bpm. This scared the Bejesus out of me (hahaha, I love this expression, I hope is not inadequate).

I made an appointment with a cardiologist and the echocardiogram and electrocardiogram were ok. But I was feeling worse by the days.

One morning my pulse was 127 bpm, and since then my minimum heart rate was 105.

I was so desperate that I made an appointment with an angiologist, because my chest and abdominal palpitations at night were so scaring that I was starting to thing about an aneurysm...

On April the 3th it downed on me that I should reduce my breathing to reverse all the adverse effects that hyperventilations had caused me. I remembered Buteyko method. I started reading about it and finally I came to the conclusion that my problem was chronic hyperventilation.

I realized that WHM triggered my sympathetic system. Hyperventilation provokes hypocapnia, low CO2 in the blood, which reduces oxygenation in the body, so the heart has to overwork to get the proper oxygenation.

It carries the cardiac rhythm over the roof. Hyperventilations feeds back into itself. Moreover, when my pulsations were so high, I could heard my heart in my right ear.

Hyperventilation is never a good idea, I learned it the hard way.

I measured my breathing frequency and it was about 17 times/minute, while the average in a healthy person is 6-12.

Buteyko method is based in the opposite: if you want to reduce your heart rate you must reduce your breathing. It is also based in holding back your breathing.

Since I started Buteyko breathing (11 days ago) my heart beats are going down. Most nights I do not feel the terrible palpitation that concerned me so much. I sleep with my mouth taped in order to avoid hyperventilation.

I had some migraines these days, I felt badly sometimes. But the interesting thing is that my average heart beat right now is currently around 90, palpitation are rare now and I don't feel my heart in my ear anymore.

This morning my pulse rate was 74, which is the lowest since August.

So when I read your stories I thought I should talk to you about Buteyko breathing. It is the best way to calm the sympathetic system down that I have found. I am not a doctor, I do not know if it could help you with your tinnitus, but you could investigate this. It really saved my life.

I am using a book called "Close your mouth" by Patrick McKeown.

Good luck to everybody and thank you.

Hi Ana,

Welcome and sorry to hear of your troubles. I believe one of the earlier posters here was having similar issues because he complained of what I describe as POTS. It's very possible that our ANS is out of sync and we are stuck in a sympathetic mode. I have been monitoring my heart rate and HRV and they have both normalized shortly after stopping WHM. I don't believe I'm still hyperventilating but it's possible I guess. My heart rate is typically in the mid to high 50s and it has remained there for the last several months after a short increase from WHM.

Ironically, kind of like you, I was actually going to start Buteyko Breathing for my asthma. I read McKeown's book The Oxygen Advantage and was intrigued with it. For some stupid reason, I decided on pursuing WHM instead . Either way, we are here now and hopefully we can help each other. I might consider practicing the Buteyko method but I'm going to do a little more research this time. Also, in terms of taping mouth at night, I know there are several ways to do this, some safer than others. Please be careful with this as I have read a few stories of issues with taped mouths.

 

[Lukee]

Ahh, you're the other member here seeing an Ayurvedic doctor, very cool. Sure, my first doctor prescribed 500 mg of Saraswati Churna to be taken in the morning. If you can handle it after 1-2 weeks, you can up it to two pills but I would try 500 mg first and see how you feel.

Ya unfortunately like I said, it's going to be a while to see one up here. The Saraswati I ordered came in a bulk bag as loose powder so I will have to weigh it myself (maybe I'll cap it). I guess I'll start with 500 mg and see how it goes.

I think your doctor might be correct about the pepper causing the increase in BP but I also think that's what might be helping the tinnitus. Let us know how the new formulation turns out.

My tinnitus is almost the quietest it's been in a long while. Sometimes it's down to almost zero and I have to really listen for it. I think NAC at the beginning was helping and I might get back on it but at the moment I'm taken Tru Niagen which is Nicotinamide Riboside, a precursor to NAD+. Check out the thread on NAD+ and you'll see some people have had success with it. I'm really, really hoping that we might find ourselves in that subset.

More than anything this clicking is bothering me the most when I swallow. It's so uncomfortable.

 

[Renfrey]

You think you are doing better now because of it? Has the tinnitus started to quiet down?

Yeah, overall I think it has quieted down. I'm noticing that the better sleep I get while listening, the quieter it is when I wake. And the quieter it remains for longer periods of time.

I'm also finding that I don't sleep well with headphones on. So I just found a way last night to listen through speakers without having to run my computer all night.

Anyway, it was a good night. It was extremely quiet when I woke, and it still is now.

My tinnitus is almost the quietest it's been in a long while. Sometimes it's down to almost zero and I have to really listen for it. I think NAC at the beginning was helping and I might get back on it but at the moment I'm taken Tru Niagen which is Nicotinamide Riboside, a precursor to NAD+. Check out the thread on NAD+ and you'll see some people have had success with it. I'm really, really hoping that we might find ourselves in that subset.

Do you get any flushing with Tru Niagen? I like Niacin flushes into the head. I think it feels like something tangible and beneficial is happening.

I bought 3 different Niacins last week, because I was unsure which one to get. I didn't realize there were so many different types till I got to the store. I'm currently using the standard flushing type. But I'm noticing now that I don't feel the flushing as strong as I did during the first few days.

 

[Lukee]

Yeah, overall I think it has quieted down. I'm noticing that the better sleep I get while listening, the quieter it is when I wake. And the quieter it remains for longer periods of time.

I'm also finding that I don't sleep well with headphones on. So I just found a way last night to listen through speakers without having to run my computer all night.

Anyway, it was a good night. It was extremely quiet when I woke, and it still is now.

Do you get any flushing with Tru Niagen? I like Niacin flushes into the head. I think it feels like something tangible and beneficial is happening.

I bought 3 different Niacins last week, because I was unsure which one to get. I didn't realize there were so many different types till I got to the store. I'm currently using the standard flushing type. But I'm noticing now that I don't feel the flushing as strong as I did during the first few days.

Thanks for the update.

Tru Niagen (NR) doesn't cause a flush. With regular Niacin, you become used to the flush and the effect becomes less prominent over time but it shouldn't happen so quickly. I haven't been taking it lately, just the NR and it seems like promising results so far. Outside of my right ear vibrating now, I think it's TTTS, after using Otovent, things are getting better in general. I would suggest you try the NR and see if it works. I have had terrible sleep the last few nights because of anxiety of this low base in my ear and still the tinnitus is pretty low and manageable.

 

[Renfrey]

Tru Niagen (NR) doesn't cause a flush. With regular Niacin, you become used to the flush and the effect becomes less prominent over time but it shouldn't happen so quickly. I haven't been taking it lately, just the NR and it seems like promising results so far. Outside of my right ear vibrating now, I think it's TTTS, after using Otovent, things are getting better in general. I would suggest you try the NR and see if it works. I have had terrible sleep the last few nights because of anxiety of this low base in my ear and still the tinnitus is pretty low and manageable.

Thanks for the suggestion. The price of Tru Niagen seems a little steep though, especially considering that according to the chart on their website, it appears to essentially do the same thing as regular Niacin, minus the flushing.

 

[Lukee]

Thanks for the suggestion. The price of Tru Niagen seems a little steep though, especially considering that according to the chart on their website, it appears to essentially do the same thing as regular Niacin, minus the flushing.

No it's definitely not the same as regular Niacin. Read up a bit on Nicotinamide Riboside and you'll see its different altogether. With that being said, you can try NMN which is also a precursor to NAD+.

NR -> NMN -> NAD+.

I think Tru Niagen owns the patent on NR so all other brands pay them royalties.

There is a Thorne version that has Resveratrol already added in. I think it's a little more economical. Either way, let us know if you decide to try it.

 

[Renfrey]

No it's definitely not the same as regular Niacin. Read up a bit on Nicotinamide Riboside and you'll see its different altogether. With that being said, you can try NMN which is also a precursor to NAD+.

NR -> NMN -> NAD+.

I think Tru Niagen owns the patent on NR so all other brands pay them royalties.

There is a Thorne version that has Resveratrol already added in. I think it's a little more economical. Either way, let us know if you decide to try it.

Roger that.

 

[MrC6688]

No it's definitely not the same as regular Niacin. Read up a bit on Nicotinamide Riboside and you'll see its different altogether. With that being said, you can try NMN which is also a precursor to NAD+.

NR -> NMN -> NAD+.

I think Tru Niagen owns the patent on NR so all other brands pay them royalties.

There is a Thorne version that has Resveratrol already added in. I think it's a little more economical. Either way, let us know if you decide to try it.

Do you feel any increase in heart rate or dizziness by taking the Tru Niagen? What side effects do you feel from it, if any? This sounds really interesting.

I'm still waiting for my new Ayurvedic meds to show up. Hopefully they will in the next few days.

I'm very interested to hear about your experiences with Tru Niagen.

I have had terrible sleep the last few nights because of anxiety of this low base in my ear and still the tinnitus is pretty low and manageable.

"Low base" in your ear? I've had that happen on occasion before. It's more like a low frequency humming that comes on strong and then fades. It only happened once or twice. Is that what you're experiencing or is it a constant low hum?