Transdermal Scopolamine Patches Give Me Relief

[Cheza]

Benadryl does neither of these things.

I'm going to buy some Benadryl and maybe test it on a moderate day, so I'll know for sure if the tinnitus goes up or down.

If Benadryl is an anti-histamine and it works, then wouldn't taking quercetin be a better alternative for long-term use (with occasional breaks)? My vet recommended it for my dog who developed a mast cell tumor. MCTs are caused, or contributed to, by massive histamine release.
Excerpt: "Quercetin can also help stabilize the cells that release histamine in the body and thereby have an anti-inflammatory and antihistamine effect."

Edit to add: If Benadryl is useless, I'll try the scop patches.

 

[linearb]

I'm going to buy some Benadryl and maybe test it on a moderate day, so I'll know for sure if the tinnitus goes up or down.

If Benadryl is an anti-histamine and it works, then wouldn't taking quercetin be a better alternative for long-term use (with occasional breaks)? My vet recommended it for my dog who developed a mast cell tumor. MCTs are caused, or contributed to, by massive histamine release.
Excerpt: "Quercetin can also help stabilize the cells that release histamine in the body and thereby have an anti-inflammatory and antihistamine effect."

Edit to add: If Benadryl is useless, I'll try the scop patches.

if the problem is histamine, maybe? It's important to remember/be aware that the older generations of anticholinergic drugs exhibit serotonin activity in addition to their choline/histamine action. So, to the extent that these drugs seem to modulate tinnitus in some people... is it because they're basically suppressing histamine, or is it because they'e serotonergic?

 

[Cheza]

if the problem is histamine, maybe? It's important to remember/be aware that the older generations of anticholinergic drugs exhibit serotonin activity in addition to their choline/histamine action. So, to the extent that these drugs seem to modulate tinnitus in some people... is it because they're basically suppressing histamine, or is it because they're serotonergic?

I wish I knew the answer to that. I just did some research indicating that diphenhydramine inhibits serotonin reuptake similar to SSRI meds, but it's possibly a weak effect and only affects a limited number of serotonin receptors. It's interesting that one rare side effect of Benadryl is seizures. Maybe there's some relation there as to why it can modulate tinnitus, although that seems counterintuitive. (When you mention "drugs," I don't know if you mean anything that affects body chemistry or if you're limiting it to only prescription drugs.)

I'll have to be my own guinea pig in this experiment. I'm not on any meds, and none of my supplements affect serotonin to the best of my knowledge, so it's worth trying.

The scop patch interests me more than the Benadryl. I hope @just1morething can update this thread on whether, and to what extent, he got any relief from it.

Edit to add: If Benadryl is anticholinergic, isn't that non-helpful for tinnitus? I thought tinnitus was improved by release of acetylcholine.

 

[linearb]

Also complex -- one side effect of acetylcholine inhibition, is decreased histamine output...

 

[Bobby B]

I did try again - one patch and then I was wearing my protective ear muffs in the office most of the day to gauge any changes - if I wear my ear muffs or plugs the T is very constant and rather loud all the time
Well even 6 and 12 hours later absolutely no changes at all .

Maybe it works only once or maybe I got a bad one ?
Maybe it was placebo

I May try once more when I feel like it
But my t and overall condition has improved greatly after I tried my LLLt light device at higher power settings so I am quite satisfied right now Wiht the way things are moving and not desperate anymore to try these temporary relief solutions

 

[Cheza]

But my t and overall condition has improved greatly after I tried my LLLt light device at highe power so I am leery satisfied right now wiht the way things are moving

LLLt is only good for NIHL, right? I don't know if over time the neighbor's maniacal loud high-pitched barking dogs triggered a constant fight-or-flight response that initiated the tinnitus, or if they actually inflicted cumulative acoustic trauma. Probably both.

There's so much controversy about LLLt; it's good to know people are actually getting benefit from it.

 

[Cheza]

Also complex -- one side effect of acetylcholine inhibition, is decreased histamine output...

But is acetylcholine inhibition something that isn't good for tinnitus, makes it worse? (That's not an artful question, please excuse my inability to communicate effectively today.)

 

[Bobby B]

LLLT not a t cure ! but can help
Improve noise damage if its recent and mild enough to be healed by the body as its proven to increase ATP in the cells and also help nerve regeneration And also protect hair cells from future acoustic trauma

Need sufficent power to even each the inner ear

The controversy is when people confuse it as a T treatment

 

[DebInAustralia]

Chez ... have a look at james kaltenbachs research on ach

 

[Cheza]

have a look at james kaltenbachs research on ach

Thanks, Deb. I found one article, The Mechanisms of Tinnitus, December 2008, that was written in laymen's language.
Excerpt:
"It is generally believed that in subjects with tinnitus, the change in neuronal activity is caused by a shift in the balance of excitatory and inhibitory impulses.

First, research shows that damage to the inner ear, such as that resulting from noise or aging, is associated with a reduction in inhibitory transmitters, especially glycine (at the brainstem level) and γ-amino butyric acid (GABA, in the midbrain and auditory cortex). Depleting these inhibitory neurotransmitters thus causes a disinhibitory effect: Neural activity increases and leads to tinnitus.

The second component causing neuronal changes is the increase in excitatory neurotransmitters, most notably glutamate and acetylcholine, in some structures."

So if I'm understanding this correctly, acetylcholine is an excitatory neurotransmitter and what I need to do is tamp it down, but VNS stimulates acetylcholine and norepinephrine release and that helps the tinnitus condition. This is confusing.

Excerpt:
"Dr. Kilgard, along with co-principal investigator Navzer Engineer, M.D., Ph.D., of MicroTransponder, Inc., and others on the research team first sought to induce changes in the auditory cortex of a group of rats by pairing stimulation of the vagus nerve, a large nerve that runs from the head and neck to the abdomen, with the playing of a single tone. When the vagus nerve is stimulated, it releases acetylcholine, norepinephrine, and other chemicals that help encourage changes in the brain."

@linearb - Can you tell me what I'm missing here? It looks like Benadryl would be useful because it tamps down acetylcholine, at least based on Kaltenbach's research. Maybe greater acetylcholine release is only helpful in conjunction with stimulation of the vagus nerve and the playing of tones?

 

[linearb]

I think this is all really speculative and I'm not qualified to comment; that said I think we'd know it by now if benadryl was an effective tinnitus treatment. I only brought up the serotonin connection to highlight how complex all of this is.

 

[Vickie waller]

Btw!! I've used these transdermal scope patches for cruises in 2015 and just last week and they REALLY TAKE THE "T" FROM 10 TO A 2 !! No kidding.. someone in the med. Field really need to research this all the way thru and HELP all of us. They work!! I promise!!

 

[Bobby B]

I tried a few times with no effect
Id say I'd if you have noise induced T it won't work
Maybe for other T

 

[jeannie]

Any new updates on this patch??