Why Does It Get Worse...

#31
JurgenG said:
Might I dare to get another round of prednison?
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Hi @JurgenG
I am quite surprised you are wanting take prednisone even though there is a risk of it raising blood sugar levels if taken regularly (diabetes)
I believe it is better that you pursue a course of tinnitus management with a Hearing Therapist/Audiologist. In time you will habituate.
All the best
Michael
 
#33
JurgenG said:
Thanks, do you think fluctuations are also possible without any loud noise exposures?
I keep wondering what "too loud" is as well.
Click to expand...
Fluctuations are absolutely possible without any noise exposure!! If anything unpredictable fluctuations are expected with new tinnitus. How many people here talk about daily fluctuations without any excessive sound exposure? Many. Some find their tinnitus is loudest upon waking up after sleeping in a quiet room.

As far as what is "too loud"? Well, we know the guidelines 85-90db, but beyond that, damaged hearing may be more vulnerable, but even in that case nobody here can tell you what is too loud, and in fact no professional can either. Ideally keeping things below 65db are recommended, in cases where people are doing LLLT, but how realistic it is I don't know. However you do have anxiety as well, so I mean if you are worried that putting your socks on is too loud (joking) nobody on here can sort it out for you.

My best advice would be to keep things as quiet as realistically possible, and not worry. If anything the fact that you posted alread in this thread that it got better shows that your fluctuations may be unrelated to sound exposure, but I'm sure you've come familiar with the fact that people can have reactive T, that reacts to ambient noise, but does not indicate permanent damage/increase.

What better choice do you have than to avoid excessive sound as best as you reasonably can while living your life. If your hearing is truly damaged by whatever daily things you do, then you will likely develop sever T+H and you will have NO CHOICE but to change your lifestyle. I understand why you would want to avoid this, but at the same time, I am quite sure there are several people with T louder than yours, who are waking up to work construction with powertools tomorrow (hopefully with protection though).

As far as prednisone, has it helped you at all previously? That should be a good indicator whether or not it will be useful to you again.
 
#34
JurgenG said:
My T has recently -doubled- in intensity. I can no longer mask it, having a lot of trouble dealing with this. Really having a dyingwish now. I don't understand what is wrong, or what I did wrong.

I avoid all loud places, and when I have to be in noise I protect myself. I wear a headset from time to time for my job but keep the volume low enough. Sometimes I do get a loud signal in it, but its always a short exposure than.
I've had one of these a couple of days ago, but I thought it wasn't even that loud.
Sometimes I have the normal loud noise spikes like a plate that falls or a car that makes too much noise.
I realised that these sounds can't hurt, but still I am starting to doubt if thats true.. Since I am actually getting worse.

I am on all the supplements mentioned here but planning on stopping to see if this changes anything...

Even my ear that was almost T free has some T again.
Don't know what to do..
Click to expand...

Hi JurgenG, I feel for you my friend as your post highlights the trappings of anxiety.

The mind has a significant influence on your wellbeing, from your perception of the world, to the perception of yourself. Once a seed of doubt is planted it will begin to grow with every negative association you attach to it. This is how phobias are created and it is also a key source of anxiety. You are creating your own stressful environment by turning inward and constantly monitoring your senses. It creates a feedback loop and an acuteness to the perceived concern. The more you think about it, the worse it will become, and it doesn't take long to spiral out of control. Catastrophic thinking takes over, your central nervous system becomes hypersensitive and you become trapped in your own mind/thoughts.

Many on this forum suffer from this. You only have to read the many threads to see that you are literally surrounded by anxiety. When a group of anxious people get together they start to bounce off one another which further intensifies everyones concerns.

I've had tinnitus for well over 10 years, and it intensified nearly 2 years ago after a stupidly loud gig (surrounded by brick). I've had many seriously dark days with this intrusive shit in my head, but you know what? I overcame it. My tinnitus is of no concern to me whatsoever any more, and I mean whatsoever. I literally couldn't care less about it anymore honestly.

I look back on my spike monitoring days (which bordered on OCD), especially after hearing certain noises, and see it for what it is: a seriously unhealthy relationship with sound that only made my symptoms a lot worse.

I'm now fighting other problems which have seriously affected my mental health once more. I'm trying to apply the same philosophy to get through this but it's extremely hard, but no different to when my tinnitus nearly destroyed me.

Positive stories sometimes get smashed to pieces and I completely understand why. Coming from a place of suffering can make happy, positive stories hard to swallow. I realise we all have our own individual T as well, but I can assure you through my own experience that you can completely overcome it. To be honest, I used to get pissed off with the constant posts stating my tinnitus must be mild, simply because I found a way to cope and live again (refers back to negativity feeding negativity).

With the right outlook, help and support, you too can change the way you think and start living a normal life again.
 
#35
Ed209 said:
Hi JurgenG, I feel for you my friend as your post highlights the trappings of anxiety.

The mind has a significant influence on your wellbeing, from your perception of the world, to the perception of yourself. Once a seed of doubt is planted it will begin to grow with every negative association you attach to it. This is how phobias are created and it is also a key source of anxiety. You are creating your own stressful environment by turning inward and constantly monitoring your senses. It creates a feedback loop and an acuteness to the perceived concern. The more you think about it, the worse it will become, and it doesn't take long to spiral out of control. Catastrophic thinking takes over, your central nervous system becomes hypersensitive and you become trapped in your own mind/thoughts.

Many on this forum suffer from this. You only have to read the many threads to see that you are literally surrounded by anxiety. When a group of anxious people get together they start to bounce off one another which further intensifies everyones concerns.

I've had tinnitus for well over 10 years, and it intensified nearly 2 years ago after a stupidly loud gig (surrounded by brick). I've had many seriously dark days with this intrusive shit in my head, but you know what? I overcame it. My tinnitus is of no concern to me whatsoever any more, and I mean whatsoever. I literally couldn't care less about it anymore honestly.

I look back on my spike monitoring days (which bordered on OCD), especially after hearing certain noises, and see it for what it is: a seriously unhealthy relationship with sound that only made my symptoms a lot worse.

I'm now fighting other problems which have seriously affected my mental health once more. I'm trying to apply the same philosophy to get through this but it's extremely hard, but no different to when my tinnitus nearly destroyed me.

Positive stories sometimes get smashed to pieces and I completely understand why. Coming from a place of suffering can make happy, positive stories hard to swallow. I realise we all have our own individual T as well, but I can assure you through my own experience that you can completely overcome it. To be honest, I used to get pissed off with the constant posts stating my tinnitus must be mild, simply because I found a way to cope and live again (refers back to negativity feeding negativity).

With the right outlook, help and support, you too can change the way you think and start living a normal life again.
Click to expand...
Hey Ed, thanks for your kind and uplifting words! Really brightens my day.
I hope, that one day, even if I would recover completly I can forgive my misstakes that led me in this mess in the first place.

I also don't like to feel sorry for myself, but I do. These "suicide thoughts" really scared me. I never thought I'd dare to say that I wished I wouldn't wake up. That's a long fall for someone who wished for eternal life.
 
#36
JurgenG said:
Hey Ed, thanks for your kind and uplifting words! Really brightens my day.
I hope, that one day, even if I would recover completly I can forgive my misstakes that led me in this mess in the first place.

I also don't like to feel sorry for myself, but I do. These "suicide thoughts" really scared me. I never thought I'd dare to say that I wished I wouldn't wake up. That's a long fall for someone who wished for eternal life.
Click to expand...

Jurgen, I blamed myself for going to that gig and the hideous guilt just added to the trauma. The secret to good mental health is to let go of all the unnecessary baggage. It is the key principle to counselling/psychotherapy.

I've been having suicidal thoughts for the last 3 weeks; that's why I haven't been on here. I'm in a seriously dark and unhealthy place, so I'm with you on a very real level. It's just my concern is no longer tinnitus related.

We can get through this bud.

The journey only ever feels arduous whilst you are walking it. Looking back at the journey often reveals insight and power.
 
#38
JurgenG said:
Hey Ed, thanks for your kind and uplifting words! Really brightens my day.
I hope, that one day, even if I would recover completly I can forgive my misstakes that led me in this mess in the first place.

I also don't like to feel sorry for myself, but I do. These "suicide thoughts" really scared me. I never thought I'd dare to say that I wished I wouldn't wake up. That's a long fall for someone who wished for eternal life.
Click to expand...
Eternal life is pretty much overrated. Wouldn't fancy it myself even if I didn't have T
 
#39
Ed209 said:
I've been having suicidal thoughts for the last 3 weeks; that's why I haven't been on here. I'm in a seriously dark and unhealthy place, so I'm with you on a very real level. It's just my concern is no longer tinnitus related.
Click to expand...

I'm curious. You wanna tell whats going on?
 
#42
Aaron123 said:
Could you please provide the scientific references for this statement?
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People often ask for scientific evidence about what makes tinnitus worse or better. I don't know how long you have had tinnitus, but I would like to you give my opinion on this condtion and the so called tinnitus professionals. ENT doctors are physcians and know all about the anatomy of the ear. They can treat it medically or surgically. However, many of them have never experienced tinnitus and if they have, I doubt it is to the severity of the many members of tinnitus talk. Therefore, I don't regard them as tinnitus experts.

I don't believe anyone can be a tinnitus expert unless they've experienced the condtion. It is for this reason you will find, most Hearing Therapists/Audiologists, that treat tinnitus patients ie: counselling etc also have tinnitus. Either they were born with it or acquired it at sometime in their life.

My statement is based on my own research having talked to many people with tinnitus, that find using headphones even at low volume can make tinnitus worse. It is true not everyone with tinnitus will be adversely affected so it's up to the individual whether they choose to use headphones/headset. My research and experience is dealing with people whose tinnitus was caused by loud noise exposure. Since tinnitus can be caused by many things I cannot say for certain whether the same applies to them.

Michael
 
#43
@SilverSpiral,
I find your post to @Michael Leigh totally disrespectful, insulting and a personal attack against a lovely person giving great advice.
Your first sentence to put your point across over your views on headsets would have been enough with out the rest of your disrespectful post.

All posters views are welcome and a member will take out of advice what they want out of each members own opinion......
This is a supportive forum ....
My angry hat is off now and said my peace.....lots of love glynis
 
#48
Michael Leigh said:
People often ask for scientific evidence about what makes tinnitus worse or better.
Click to expand...

It seems like a reasonable approach to weed out dogma, hearsay, anecdotal evidence, or other statements that lack logic, discipline, objectivity and reliability.

It's not like science has all the answers and is flawless, but I'd still rank it higher than all the other sources in terms of trust. I do understand and accept that not everyone sees it this way.
 
#49
glynis said:
@SilverSpiral,
I find your post to @Michael Leigh totally disrespectful, insulting and a personal attack against a lovely person giving great advice.
Your first sentence to put your point across over your views on headsets would have been enough with out the rest of your disrespectful post.

All posters views are welcome and a member will take out of advice what they want out of each members own opinion......
This is a supportive forum ....
My angry hat is off now and said my peace.....lots of love glynis
Click to expand...
I didn't see you crying foul when Michael disrespected me.
 
#51
I do agree to some extent with Silverspiral here, it's unnecessary to make Jurgen fearful about his job only because he has to use a headphone for a couple of hours per week.
 
#52
Rubenslash said:
I do agree to some extent with Silverspiral here, it's unnecessary to make Jurgen fearful about his job only because he has to use a headphone for a couple of hours per week.
Click to expand...
With all due respect @Rubenslash . If someone asks for my opinion then I am going to tell the truth as I see it. It was never my intention to make @JurgenG fearful, only to be candid and succinct to the best of my ability and given the experience that I have in tinnitus. Tinnitus is not a joke. I believe it is better to point out potential risks and let that person make a choice, at least then they are aware.

Back in 2010 I asked my consultant to be candid with me about my condition as I felt I had reached a plateau in my TRT treatment and wasn't making anymore progress for the 2nd time in almost 20 years. She said, I was the 2nd worst tinnitus patient she had ever met. I wanted the floor to open and swallow me whole. She explained in a calm and precise manner. I asked for her opinion and I got it. I have a very good rapport with my doctor. She followed this up by saying: I will never give up on treating you.

Michael

PS: There are many people in this forum that have habituated to their tinnitus and it has remained low. They resume listening to music through headphones (at low level) only to find their tinnitus becomes worse and stays that way. It is also true some people with tinnitus are not affected by headphone use.
 
#53
Ed209 said:
Jurgen, I blamed myself for going to that gig and the hideous guilt just added to the trauma. The secret to good mental health is to let go of all the unnecessary baggage. It is the key principle to counselling/psychotherapy.

I've been having suicidal thoughts for the last 3 weeks; that's why I haven't been on here. I'm in a seriously dark and unhealthy place, so I'm with you on a very real level. It's just my concern is no longer tinnitus related.

We can get through this bud.

The journey only ever feels arduous whilst you are walking it. Looking back at the journey often reveals insight and power.
Click to expand...
Michael Leigh said:
With all due respect @Rubenslash . If someone asks for my opinion then I am going to tell the truth as I see it. It was never my intention to make @JurgenG fearful, only to be candid and succinct to the best of my ability and given the experience that I have in tinnitus. Tinnitus is not a joke. I believe it is better to point out potential risks and let that person make a choice, at least then they are aware.

Back in 2010 I asked my consultant to be candid with me about my condition as I felt I had reached a plateau in my TRT treatment and wasn't making anymore progress for the 2nd time in almost 20 years. She said, I was the 2nd worst tinnitus patient she had ever met. I wanted the floor to open and swallow me whole. She explained in a calm and precise manner. I asked for her opinion and I got it. I have a very good rapport with my doctor. She followed this up by saying: I will never give up on treating you.

Michael

PS: There are many people in this forum that have habituated to their tinnitus and it has remained low. They resume listening to music through headphones (at low level) only to find their tinnitus becomes worse and stays that way. It is also true some people with tinnitus are not affected by headphone use.
Click to expand...

I hate to admit it but I've seen way too many posts about T increasing after using headphones on low volume. I don't understand why this happens but in my opinion headphones are a risky choice for tinnitus sufferers.

Ans btw guys, @Michael Leigh had tinnitus for longer than I'm alive, and during those years he formed some opinions - based on what he was told by doctors or based on his own experience. All he is trying to do is to stop others from worsening their situation.

You're not going to change his view on headphones. Is there 0 science behind his statement? In my opinion, yes. (100dB is 100db, as @Alue said)

Is there a plenty of anecdotal evidence to support Micheal? Yes. Yes. Yes.

At the end of the day, it's your ears. Do what you want, but I think headphones are not worth the risk.

Take care.


PS please don't murder me for having an opinion
 
#54
@JurgenG Can I ask you, do you still have hope that your T will completely go away? When I was in the month you are I still was, and I have lots more than plain T.

I know you mentioned you planned to stop taking supplements? I'm still trying supplements, all to no avail over the past year... I don't suppose you've ever hoped that your "spikes" are actually the sign of some healing process?
 
#55
The heaphone theory makes plenty of sense...the freaking thing is in your ear !! Sound travels in waves...when they have no space other than the room in your ear what the hell do you think is going to happen when your ears are already messed up. Nothing goes in my damb ear but a plug...its not worth it at all. Do what you want but i will take 20 yrs of experience from Michael over the dumb ass doctors out there. Especially when they tell you that you know more than them !! Smh
 
#56
Jomo said:
The heaphone theory makes plenty of sense...the freaking thing is in your ear !! Sound travels in waves...when they have no space other than the room in your ear what the hell do you think is going to happen when your ears are already messed up. Nothing goes in my damb ear but a plug...its not worth it at all. Do what you want but i will take 20 yrs of experience from Michael over the dumb ass doctors out there. Especially when they tell you that you know more than them !! Smh
Click to expand...
I agree headphones are dangerous territory for compromised hearing systems, but so are a lot of things, some we can avoid some we can't. If headphones are dangerous for the reasons you are stating, then the in ear white noise generators that michael promotes should post a risk as well as you believe headphones do. I find it presumptuous and inconsistent, and kind of irksome.
 
#57
Jomo said:
The heaphone theory makes plenty of sense...the freaking thing is in your ear !! Sound travels in waves...when they have no space other than the room in your ear what the hell do you think is going to happen when your ears are already messed up. Nothing goes in my damb ear but a plug...its not worth it at all. Do what you want but i will take 20 yrs of experience from Michael over the dumb ass doctors out there. Especially when they tell you that you know more than them !! Smh
Click to expand...

Carry on as you are doing @Jomo and you will save yourself a lot of heartache and misery. If certain people on this thread were to read my post: Headphones and Tinnitus, which is also in my article: Tinnitus, A Personal View, they will understand why it's not a good idea to wear headphones with noise induced tinnitus. I also explain the distinct difference between headphones use and white noise generators.

ENT doctors are physicians not tinnitus experts. They treat the ear, nose and throat medically or surgically and I believe do this very well. My ENT doctor is an Audiovestibular consultant and someone that I have a lot of respect for. Anyone that doesn't know, this is more highly qualified than an ENT doctor. One day she mentioned to me completely out of the blue: "You know more about tinnitus than me". I was surprised and asked for her reasons for saying this and the reply: "Because I have never experienced tinnitus".

I have said my piece and won't be commenting further on this subject in this thread. I wish you well @JurgenG in the choices you make regarding headphone/headset use.
Michael
 
#58
Thanks for all insights guys, what I surely will do is never ever use headphones for recreational reasons.
My work is almost equal to my life, so I am afraid I will need to use some amount of headphones there. Unless I make a promotion and start as a "Director of Photography" on filmsets.
I will take all counter measures from now on.
-Like before, using it as silent as possible.
-Maybe use some wats like Michael mentions.
-Investing in a system that limits anything above 80 dB, has to be wearable and on batteries.
-Using it as little as possible.
Thanks for the wake up call, there most be some issue with long term headphone use.

SilverSpiral said:
@JurgenG Can I ask you, do you still have hope that your T will completely go away? When I was in the month you are I still was, and I have lots more than plain T.

I know you mentioned you planned to stop taking supplements? I'm still trying supplements, all to no avail over the past year... I don't suppose you've ever hoped that your "spikes" are actually the sign of some healing process?
Click to expand...
Well, I hoped it would be gone around month 2, I am 2,5 in now.
I did hope that some spikes are part of the process, but I never found any evidence of this here, so I guess its incorrect.
I stopped some supplements I was taking when the peak hit me hard, I just switched from Zinc to VIT B & VIT C.
Probably unrelated but I stopped with B & C.
Still taking: NAC, MAG, Ginkgo, ZINC.
Gonna switch to this though: https://www.tinnitustalk.com/threads/supplements-—-interesting-results-for-me.20479/

Do you think I still can have some hope?
 
#59
@SilverSpiral,
Its a case of wtitten words that have no voice or face signals can betaken differently as I read them.
@Michael Leigh and myself go way back many years with a dear friend and talk most days.
Hes one in a million and so proud to know him and we dedicate our free time supporting people with ear problems .
You seem a nice person and supporting members in a positive way is the way to go .
As I say ,we are all as important as eachother and if we disbelieve what advice a member gives its up to the person what they take out of a post or friendly debate....
Hope we can put this to rest now and do what we do best.....................
Any further replies can be done by pm off the forum if needed......
Lots of love glynis
 
#60
JurgenG said:
Thanks for all insights guys, what I surely will do is never ever use headphones for recreational reasons.
My work is almost equal to my life, so I am afraid I will need to use some amount of headphones there. Unless I make a promotion and start as a "Director of Photography" on filmsets.
I will take all counter measures from now on.
-Like before, using it as silent as possible.
-Maybe use some wats like Michael mentions.
-Investing in a system that limits anything above 80 dB, has to be wearable and on batteries.
-Using it as little as possible.
Thanks for the wake up call, there most be some issue with long term headphone use.


Well, I hoped it would be gone around month 2, I am 2,5 in now.
I did hope that some spikes are part of the process, but I never found any evidence of this here, so I guess its incorrect.
I stopped some supplements I was taking when the peak hit me hard, I just switched from Zinc to VIT B & VIT C.
Probably unrelated but I stopped with B & C.
Still taking: NAC, MAG, Ginkgo, ZINC.
Gonna switch to this though: https://www.tinnitustalk.com/threads/supplements-—-interesting-results-for-me.20479/

Do you think I still can have some hope?
Click to expand...
Yes I think you should still have hope, certainly for upwards of 6 months...
Spikes are apparently a positive indicator for people doing LLLT, so can in some cases be a good indication of some sort of healing process I guess.
 

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