2020 US Presidential Election

[Lane]

Just 10 Republicans showed to the American public that they belief in these democratic values on which the country is founded

@Christiaan -- I think something important to keep in mind: My understanding is many more Republican house members would have voted to impeach, but didn't do so because of the serious security concerns they have for themselves and their families. I think those concerns are legitimate, as I've heard many times of people falling out of favor with Trump having their names and addresses posted online by some of his rabid followers, with family members then becoming targets of their threats.

 

[Born To Slay]

@Christiaan -- I think something important to keep in mind: My understanding is many more Republican house members would have voted to impeach, but didn't do so because of the serious security concerns they have for themselves and their families. I think those concerns are legitimate, as I've heard many times of people falling out of favor with Trump and some of his rabid followers regularly have their names and addresses posted online, with family members then becoming targets of their threats.

Then they should resign from Congress if they aren't brave enough to vote their convictions. They're paid generous salaries and given benefits better than anyone else in America and they're compensated to do the work of the American people. If they vote a certain way because they're intimidated, they should resign.

 

[FGG]

@Born To Slay -- dat @FGG did a great job, didn't she? I sure wouldn't want to start making claims that she disagrees with. Thankfully, I don't think that's going to happen!

Dude, no. Please disagree with me. That's how I learn things . And it forces me to look stuff up in more detail.

You can even get your brain to enjoy the feeling of being wrong (but learning), more than being right.

This is my favorite Ted Talk of all time.

 

[Lucifer]

Jake Tapper just said on CNN that we need an exorcist to drive away the demons in the GOP. I couldn't agree more.

In all my years of studying political history and cross party systems on a global scale, the contemporary Republican Party is without a doubt one of the worst parties that ever existed IMHO. The cult-like culture, the uncritical support for someone who clearly lost his mind, the one sided media framing of fox news and other pro trump alt right news outlets, political opportunism of trump enablers & the embrace of authoritarianism to take power away of democratic institutions is a direct threat to American democracy.

Just 10 Republicans showed to the American public that they belief in these democratic values on which the country is founded, and for that, they deserve respect. Still, 90 percent of these representatives deny that Trump lost deservedly or that he shouldn't be impeached, despite evidence to the contrary. This is just a sad moment in democracy that such a party exists. It's so stunning, as you would normally see this kind of behaviour in authoritarian 3rd world states. I feel for you people in America. This country deserves better than this so called 'democratic' party

That's the problem with the 2 party system in America. What happens is that those smaller parties don't get a say on what happens. It would be nice if there was a way for those lesser parties to contribute. Maybe some type of coalition agreement would be something America could implement. I think it's time for America to get rid of the 2 party system.

 

[Tanni]

@Christiaan -- I think something important to keep in mind: My understanding is many more Republican house members would have voted to impeach, but didn't do so because of the serious security concerns they have for themselves and their families. I think those concerns are legitimate, as I've heard many times of people falling out of favor with Trump having their names and addresses posted online by some of his rabid followers, with family members then becoming targets of their threats.

I sympathise with that for sure, but they've been elected by the people and they have a duty to serve them. If they are asking the police and military to risk their lives to protect democracy, they have to be prepared to do the same. So I hope that isn't the reason.

Almost all of them mentioned perceived hypocrisy as part of their reasoning for not supporting impeachment - BLM was mentioned a lot. They very much echoed the sentiments of the conservatives in this thread on that front.

What they didn't do was continue with the stolen election claims; that seems to have been abandoned. And almost none of them supported Trump himself.

 

[just1morething]

@Lane,

Did you watch the President on Newsmax? Did you watch any of the Georgia election hearings?

 

[Born To Slay]

I sympathise with that for sure, but they've been elected by the people and they have a duty to serve them. If they are asking the police and military to risk their lives to protect democracy, they have to be prepared to do the same. So I hope that isn't the reason.

Almost all of them mentioned perceived hypocrisy as part of their reasoning for not supporting impeachment - BLM was mentioned a lot. They very much echoed the sentiments of the conservatives in this thread on that front.

What they didn't do was continue with the stolen election claims; that seems to have been abandoned. And almost none of them supported Trump himself.

They actually have continued. Even after the Capitol was stormed, most House Republicans voted to object to the election results. It was a stunning scene.

 

[Luman]

Why wouldn't he be able to pay for his own security? Isn't he a billionaire? He told the public he was.

He is capable of hiring bodyguards, and should be able to pay for his own security. If he couldn't, and did not have secret service protection, he would probably have trouble, just as any ex-President would.

 

[Ken219]

BLM was mentioned a lot.

You must be young? Stick around. It will be BLM and ANTIFA everyday after January 20, 2021.

 

[TeeOh]

@Christiaan -- I think something important to keep in mind: My understanding is many more Republican house members would have voted to impeach, but didn't do so because of the serious security concerns they have for themselves and their families. I think those concerns are legitimate, as I've heard many times of people falling out of favor with Trump having their names and addresses posted online by some of his rabid followers, with family members then becoming targets of their threats.

In before someone says "b-b-but Trump supporters are peaceful and have never been violent once in their existence!"

 

[Lane]

Then they should resign from Congress if they aren't brave enough to vote their convictions. They're paid generous salaries and given benefits better than anyone else in America and they're compensated to do the work of the American people. If they vote a certain way because they're intimidated, they should resign.

@Born To Slay -- Interestingly, I just read a short article by a retired 3-star general that supports your comment (bolded below).

...After serving in countries where democracy and the rule of law were goals the people there could only aspire to achieve, it has been more than heartbreaking to see what I could never imagine happening in our own country. President Donald Trump must be removed from office as soon as the law allows, either by impeachment, the 25th Amendment, or best yet a voluntary resignation (as unlikely as that is). -- Leaders must lead, or they should step aside and resign if they are fearful for their personal safety or future of their political career.

We ask our military and our young men and women in uniform to put their lives on the line every day in defense of our country. Right now, many of them are on the front line in Afghanistan and other places around the world. If political leaders are not ready to do the same and put their careers at risk by taking a stand against those whose actions may have provoked or encouraged the attack on our Capitol, resulting in the death of five Americans, they should resign. They are in the wrong role and do not deserve the honor and privilege to be our leaders. They should be held accountable and voted out of office.​

 

[Born To Slay]

He is capable of hiring bodyguards, and should be able to pay for his own security. If he couldn't, and did not have secret service protection, he would probably have trouble, just as any ex-President would.

If he really couldn't, I'd be more concerned, because frankly as much as I'm not a fan, I don't want to see him murdered. But considering his wealth, it's hard to care too much since I'm sure he can afford it.

 

[Lucifer]

Since the US House of Representatives voted to impeach Trump, now we have to wait for the vote in the US Senate which will not be until after Joe Biden's Inauguration Day.

To impeach Trump in the Senate, it needs a 2/3 majority. That means 17 Republican Senators will have to vote to impeach Trump. This is a tough ask and I don't think 17 Republican Senators will vote to impeach Trump.

On the one hand, if the Republican Senators vote to impeach Trump, then they will be respected by Democrats but they may also lose in the next Senate elections for going to the Democrats' side in the impeachment of Trump but get disrespected by their Republican colleagues who voted against the impeachment of Trump.

On the other hand, if they don't vote for an impeachment of Trump, they would get respected by their Republican colleagues that voted against an impeachment of Trump but they would be disrespected by the Democrats but they may be able to win the next Senate election since they sided with the Republicans.

 

[Zugzug]

Then they should resign from Congress if they aren't brave enough to vote their convictions. They're paid generous salaries and given benefits better than anyone else in America and they're compensated to do the work of the American people. If they vote a certain way because they're intimidated, they should resign.

Truer words have never been spoken in this thread. There are people brave enough to handle it. Namely, AOC gets more death threats than all of these people combined.

There are plenty of people with more guts willing to do the job. I'll admit, I could never do it, but come on. That's such a weak reason to not convict a terrorist.

 

[Tanni]

They actually have continued. Even after the Capitol was stormed, most House Republicans voted to object to the election results. It was a stunning scene.

I mean that it wasn't mentioned today. McCarthy made a point of calling Biden's win legitimate, there were mentions of a peaceful transfer of power etc. We'll see, I guess.

 

[Lucifer]

You must be young? Stick around. It will be BLM and ANTIFA everyday after January 20, 2021.

I believe it will stop come Inauguration Day cause the Democrats have got what they wanted. They have control of the US Senate, US House of Representatives and the Presidency.

They spent most of last year causing havoc and chaos by the violent rioting and looting in Democratic states. The governors could have done something to stop it but they allowed it because when things look like chaos and havoc, who did they blame, Trump of course. None of these events happened in Republican states.

I have a feeling America will end up like South Africa. Firstly, they will implement affirmative action, secondly, they will implement a quota system like South Africa did. A lot of white South Africans migrated to countries which had none of that crap because they were limited to the opportunities due to the quota system. Affirmative action and quota system equals systemic racism.

 

[Lilah]

Why wouldn't he be able to pay for his own security? Isn't he a billionaire? He told the public he was.

He can afford his own security. Maybe it would be a good idea if the government isn't tracking him.

 

[Christiaan]

@Christiaan -- I think something important to keep in mind: My understanding is many more Republican house members would have voted to impeach, but didn't do so because of the serious security concerns they have for themselves and their families. I think those concerns are legitimate, as I've heard many times of people falling out of favor with Trump having their names and addresses posted online by some of his rabid followers, with family members then becoming targets of their threats.

Is democracy worth fighting for if these representatives give in to pressure or death threats? I don't think old school Republicans like Dwight Eisenhower would allow this to happen. He would certainly have more self respect and moral fiber to stand up to these horrible people than someone like Kevin McCarthy.

If Republicans allow this to happen, they give way to making death threats and other deplorable versions of pressure as the best means for despicable, antidemocratic people to have their own way. Representatives ought to fulfill their civil duty to represent the interests of their constituents, not a particular group that gets to them by pointing their guns or making threats. Effectively, Republicans who show a lack of courage allow these despicable people to hijack democracy.

 

[Lane]

the contemporary Republican Party is without a doubt one of the worst parties that ever existed IMHO.

I've been watching politics closely for decades, and at one time leaned Republican, having voted for Reagan twice, and Bush once. I used to believe them when they said they were the party of fiscal responsibility, balanced budget, strong military, small government, keeping government out of our lives, pro-business, high moral ethics, etc. But as I mentioned in another post, I came to realize they could talk the talk, but wouldn't walk the walk.

I eventually realized they were more the party for the wealthy and most privileged in our society. They continually altered the nation's tax structure so that the wealthy and corporations paid less and less (as a percentage of government revenues), and the middle and lower income classes paid more. Corporations in the 1950's provided over 50% of total government revenue. Today that number is around 10%. -- They also became the party of major voter suppression.

This has led to the gradual disappearing of the middle class, which led to huge discontent, and ironically led to a big part of Trump's appeal. They've felt left behind in many ways, especially economically. The genius of the Republican party (if it can be called that) is that they've been able to convince so many to vote against their own economic interests for so long. Then Trump came along with his more populist appeal, and it struck a chord with many of those voters, even though they weren't diehard Republicans to begin with.

The split within the Republican party seems to be growing wider by the day. I think many disenchanted Trump voters will be less likely to vote in the future, and if they do, may even look to the Democratic party to address their economic concerns. This doesn't bode well for the Republican party, and I think it's possible it could lead to its eventual demise, something I've been waiting for for about 30 years now. It really is a party that started rotting badly back in the 1990's, and is now rotten to the core.

 

[Ken219]

I believe it will stop come Inauguration Day cause the Democrats have got what they wanted. They have control of the US Senate, US House of Representatives and the Presidency.

They spent most of last year causing havoc and chaos by the violent rioting and looting in Democratic states. The governors could have done something to stop it but they allowed it because when things look like chaos and havoc, who did they blame, Trump of course. None of these events happened in Republican states.

I have a feeling America will end up like South Africa. Firstly, they will implement affirmative action, secondly, they will implement a quota system like South Africa did. A lot of white South Africans migrated to countries which had none of that crap because they were limited to the opportunities due to the quota system. Affirmative action and quota system equals systemic racism.

Sadly agree. They were made promises. Promises that will not be ignored.

BLM and ANTIFA fulfill the promises! It is official! Medicare for ALL! Corrupt marketplace health insurance companies out of business! Free College Tuition! Cancel Student Loans! Free Housing.

 

[just1morething]

In all my years of studying political history and cross party systems on a global scale, the contemporary Republican Party is without a doubt one of the worst parties that ever existed IMHO. The cult-like culture, the uncritical support

I didn't know the Netherlands had a Republican Party?

 

[Daniel Lion]

I believe it will stop come Inauguration Day cause the Democrats have got what they wanted. They have control of the US Senate, US House of Representatives and the Presidency.

They spent most of last year causing havoc and chaos by the violent rioting and looting in Democratic states. The governors could have done something to stop it but they allowed it because when things look like chaos and havoc, who did they blame, Trump of course. None of these events happened in Republican states.

I have a feeling America will end up like South Africa. Firstly, they will implement affirmative action, secondly, they will implement a quota system like South Africa did. A lot of white South Africans migrated to countries which had none of that crap because they were limited to the opportunities due to the quota system. Affirmative action and quota system equals systemic racism.

Nah bro, you don't get race in America.

You don't get BLM, you never have by reading your posts. BLM does not negate All lives. It's about G. Floyd and saying no to killing Black folk, in a nutshell.

The vast majority of Black, White, Asian, Jewish, and Hispanic and everybody else that makes our melting pot are cool with each other. We will be just fine.

Thanks for the negativity, but we got this.

 

[Daniel Lion]

@just1morething, you need to see Republican officials who supported Trump telling the truth.

 

[just1morething]

@just1morething, you need to see Republican officials who supported Trump telling the truth.

Did you watch the Georgia Election Hearings yet? It's not all about Trump, but election integrity.

 

[FGG]

Did you watch the Georgia Election Hearings yet? It's not all about Trump, but election integrity.

I'm still planning on watching this but if it's all the things Sterling already dismissed in his press conference, I'm gonna be pretty convinced you maybe didn't actually watch the link I shared with you and maybe had it on in the background while you watched OANN.

 

[Zugzug]

I believe it will stop come Inauguration Day cause the Democrats have got what they wanted. They have control of the US Senate, US House of Representatives and the Presidency.

They spent most of last year causing havoc and chaos by the violent rioting and looting in Democratic states. The governors could have done something to stop it but they allowed it because when things look like chaos and havoc, who did they blame, Trump of course. None of these events happened in Republican states.

I have a feeling America will end up like South Africa. Firstly, they will implement affirmative action, secondly, they will implement a quota system like South Africa did. A lot of white South Africans migrated to countries which had none of that crap because they were limited to the opportunities due to the quota system. Affirmative action and quota system equals systemic racism.

And yet you post this fraud nonsense, which is all over a guy who lost the popular vote by a historical margin, trying to con his way to an affirmative action electoral college victory.

The extreme obsession with race doesn't do it for me on the left, but it is funny to me that Republicans would not hold any power ever without white Christian affirmative action.

 

[GlennS]

I'm sure they will riot and loot as usual. The pathetic thing about these groups is they wouldn't last ten minutes against groups that actually have military and law enforcement training. I know some guys from the Michigan militia. I wouldn't want to go to war with them. Fuck that.

I knew it was only a matter of time before the dick-measuring contests would start here.

 

[GlennS]

Sadly agree. They were made promises. Promises that will not be ignored.

BLM and ANTIFA fulfill the promises! It is official! Medicare for ALL! Corrupt marketplace health insurance companies out of business! Free College Tuition! Cancel Student Loans! Free Housing.

So you decided to barge into this thread late just to issue drive-by Fox News talking points? That's all you've got to offer?

 

[just1morething]

I'm still planning on watching this but if it's all the things Sterling already dismissed in his press conference, I'm gonna be pretty convinced you maybe didn't actually watch the link I shared with you and maybe had it on in the background while you watched OANN.

I watched it in its entirety without TV. I just don't totally trust Sterling after watching the Georgia hearings. There is just too many non-partisan unbiased people presenting evidence of fraud for me to ignore. I know mainstream media says there is no fraud.

 

[Lucifer]

Nah bro, you don't get race in America.

You don't get BLM, you never have by reading your posts. BLM does not negate All lives. It's about G. Floyd and saying no to killing Black folk, in a nutshell.

The vast majority of Black, White, Asian, Jewish, and Hispanic and everybody else that makes our melting pot are cool with each other. We will be just fine.

Thanks for the negativity, but we got this.

Well good luck. In the upcoming years we will see what happens in America. I hope I don't have to say I told you so when they start implementing quota systems.

I would not be surprised if they started implementing affirmative action and quota systems at a federal level. They have already implemented affirmative action in most US States where unless you are African-American, your own kids and grandkids have limited opportunities of success, especially when it comes to attending Ivy League schools. I wouldn't be surprised if one kid had a C+ overall grade but got denied but some African-American kid gets a C grade overall and is accepted in Ivy League schools. Now that's systemic racism.

Unless your kids and grandkids are smart, I hope that doesn't happen to anyone.