Frequency Therapeutics — Hearing Loss Regeneration

[Samir]

Samir... at the :55 second mark the reporter states it not Luchinno

Ah yes! Good catch! The text rolls off quickly there, it's hard to tell. But you are right.

 

[Reinier]

To expand the supporting cells they used "the glycogen synthase kinase 3b (GSK3b) inhibitor CHIR99021 (CHIR or C) and the histone deacetylase (HDAC) inhibitor valproic acid (VPA or V)" as well as a "growth factor cocktail". They refer to this combination as EFICVP6. To differentiate the supporting cells into hair cells they use LY411575 and CHIR

Could I ask?:
Are we talking about the same supporting cells? What I mean is, are the supporting cells that expand the same supporting cells that differentiate?
If it is a cocktail I suppose we are talking about different supporting cells. There also was talk about supporting cells that where actually progenitor cells (LGR5). Where do these cells play a part?
Or did I misunderstand that part?

 

[Aaron123]

Are we talking about the same supporting cells? What I mean is, are the supporting cells that expand the same supporting cells that differentiate?

Yes. They use small molecules to induce Lgr5+ supporting cells to divide (expand). Some of those expanded supporting cells then naturally (that is the goal anyway) differentiate to become hair cells. Thus, you end up with new hair cells while retaining a population of supporting cells.

There also was talk about supporting cells that where actually progenitor cells (LGR5). Where do these cells play a part?

Their process only works on Lgr5+ supporting cells.

 

[Paulmanlike]

Will all this development if it's get approved though cure tinnitus?

That is the million dollar question.

 

[Paulmanlike]

I mean would you rather have 20-30% hearing loss and no tinnitus or good hearing with screaming tinnitus? I know what I'd prefer.

 

[90's Kid]

I mean would you rather have 20-30% hearing loss and no tinnitus or good hearing with screaming tinnitus? I know what I'd prefer.

I have 1/10 tinnitus and no hearing loss so I think that if tomorrow you tell me that a treatment is available, I think I won't take it.

I mean, just the fact that a treatment is available will make me more confident and less stressed. When you know something can be cured you don't live the same. I could go in nightclub more times than I actually do knowing that if it increases I can cure.

Actually I hear it only in silence or quiet room when no distraction.

My problem is that I'm scared to go to loud places even with protection because I'm scared that it increases.

I don't know all of your different situations, but I'm really excited about what's going on with research and FX even if my case is not that hard.

 

[NatureHiker]

Will all this development if it's get approved though cure tinnitus?

That is the million dollar question.

Will McClean has answered this question. Many times. There's no guarantees, but if your tinnitus is caused by your cochlear hair cells dying/not working because of loud music or whatever that kills cochlear hair cells then regenerating them might fix it.

 

[DoNotGoGentle]

I mean would you rather have 20-30% hearing loss and no tinnitus or good hearing with screaming tinnitus? I know what I'd prefer.

Oh dang! Yeah take more hearing loss then I have now if don't have this SCREAMING IN MY HEAD FU T!!!!

 

[grate_biff]

Just had a thought here. Would it be necessary to operate with a placebo in the forthcoming trial?
I mean the evidence, if it works, would be pretty evident, would´nt it?

 

[Jim51042]

Would it be necessary to operate with a placebo in the forthcoming trial

If non-invasive imaging was available then we wouldn't have to ask this question. Because their are some minor risks with the delivery (injection into the ear) it might be considered unethical to do that on a person not receiving treatment. However the control group could be considered everyone who could not get into the trial. This wouldn't be "double blind" though.

 

[papu]

Because their are some minor risks with the delivery (injection into the ear) it might be considered unethical to do that on a person not receiving treatment

Already has been done in AM 101. If you did only the first set of injections you had no idea if you received esketamine or not

 

[Rubenslash]

Already has been done in AM 101. If you did only the first set of injections you had no idea if you received esketamine or not

Useful because tinnitus is subjective, aim here is to treat hearing loss which is objectively measurable and doesnt improve without treatment so I see limited value in placebo treatment

 

[RB2014]

The Genvec trial didnt have a placebo from what I remember. It was only different dosages of the solution. I'm hoping for the same thing for this clinical trial.

I'm actually hoping for a single dosage as well. This could be the quickest trial ever if it was only that simple.

 

[acufenero]

Since Frequency's approach utilizes our supporting cells, some people were worried about how do we know if we have any. Well, according to what Frequency's The-Leviathan published this week at Reddit:

 

[Cal18]

I wonder if they are able to/or would consider splitting the trial into hearing loss and tinnitus groups. It seems that this is more of an urgency for the tinnitus sufferers who will most likely be excluded from the trial due to not having sufficient hearing loss.

 

[BohemianLife]

That is bad new actually. I supposed loss of hearing is just due to loss of outer and inner hair cells.
In an other saying I thought people with profound loss have supporting cells.

For me I have modarate-modarately severe hearing loss. I have to protect my hearing till the trials start.

In addition I have a hyphotesis ; we heard people in Genvec trials haven't benefited from trial. That people have profound hearing loss as much as I know. If they used mild or modarate hearing loss person, trial could be more successful.

 

[90's Kid]

That is bad new actually. I supposed loss of hearing is just due to loss of outer and inner hair cells.
In an other saying I thought people with profound loss have supporting cells.

For me I have modarate-modarately severe hearing loss. I have to protect my hearing till the trials start.

In addition I have a hyphotesis ; we heard people in Genvec trials haven't benefited from trial. That people have profound hearing loss as much as I know. If they used mild or modarate hearing loss person, trial could be more successful.

I don't speak english well and I didn't really understand what Leviathan said on Reddit.

I mean, I understand that if it's moderate, supporting cells are still here, but if it's severe they are dead.

So if we still have supporting cells because of moderate hearing loss, it is good, isn't it ?
FX trial can help people with moderate hearing loss (because supporting cells are here).

So if I understood well, it is a bad new for severe hearing loss because FX and others are using supporting cells whereas you lost them with severe hearing loss.

Am I right ? xD

 

[BohemianLife]

I don't speak english well and I didn't really understand what Leviathan said on Reddit.

I mean, I understand that if it's moderate, supporting cells are still here, but if it's severe they are dead.

So if we still have supporting cells because of moderate hearing loss, it is good, isn't it ?
FX trial can help people with moderate hearing loss (because supporting cells are here).

So if I understood well, it is a bad new for severe hearing loss because FX and others are using supporting cells whereas you lost them with severe hearing loss.

Am I right ? xD

Yes, that is why understood too. But Leviathan mentioned profound hearing loss that don't have supporting cells. Severe hearing loss can have some supporting cells.

 

[Rubenslash]

You are right.

 

[90's Kid]

You are right.

There is still something I don't get.

If you have moderate hearing loss (supporting hair cells) and you do FX trial :
- Does it mean that you will lose these cells ?
- Same for others companies ?

 

[spingee]

Do you have scientific paper or some proof that you also losing supporting cells along with hair cells?

 

[dmorg]

There is still something I don't get.

If you have moderate hearing loss (supporting hair cells) and you do FX trial :
- Does it mean that you will lose these cells ?
- Same for others companies ?

The way I understand it is that Audion's method causes your existing supporting cells to differentiate into hearing cells whereas Frequency's method promotes formation of new supporting cells followed by differentiation into hair cells.So would have fewer supporting cells after Audion's method.

 

[Mricha37]

I haven't been keeping up with any of the FX trials. So information wise, where are we at now? It sounds like the company is VERY confident

 

[Iliasp]

I would like to know why it seems so that they have figured it out, there are still so many questions waiting to be answered from people that are nowhere near the medical field but yet they seem to bring up the difficulties of such treatments all the time in such threads

 

[Reinier]

That is bad new actually. I supposed loss of hearing is just due to loss of outer and inner hair cells.
In an other saying I thought people with profound loss have supporting cells.

It would not surprise me that there is a difference between loss of cells because of ototoxicity and loss of cells (hair-cells) because of noise.
It could be that noise "only" destroys hair-cells and supporting cells remain. No matter how severe the hearing loss because of this noise.
Does that make sense (-;

 

[dmorg]

Does anyone know if "they" (Frequency TX and the like) have the diagnostic ability to determinine the amount of supporting cells?

 

[Iliasp]

Nope

 

[Samir]

Does anyone know if "they" (Frequency TX and the like) have the diagnostic ability to determinine the amount of supporting cells?

I wish! Something like that would slingshot research several years into future!

No, I'm afraid Frequency and the like will be working in the blind. There is some indirect evidence that so and so much hearing loss on audiograms means this and that type of hair cell loss. But that's about it. They will be relying on audiograms I think. Possibly also OAE and ABR.

You may want to check these threads:
https://www.tinnitustalk.com/threads/ear-imaging-technology.21697/
https://www.tinnitustalk.com/threads/where-do-we-stand-on-inner-ear-imaging-technology.19580/

 

[Mricha37]

I wonder if that 18 month timeline is still on track? Do y'all think that would stop other companies from research if FX is successful?

I for one, would pay thousands out of pocket. 30 minutes and I'm out the door

 

[BraveNewWorld]

I wonder if that 18 month timeline is still on track?

Same here. That 12-18 months quote was given Feb 21 2017 so we're nearing 8-14 months left. But i don't think they can tell individuals personally, we have to wait on the next press release.

Do y'all think that would stop other companies from research if FX is successful?

I don't think if FX is successful then it will stop other companies.

Hearing regeneration can always be perfected or utilized through various methods be it gene therapy, stem cell therapy, or molecular therapy.

Think about how many other conditions have various treatments and drugs offered. For Rheumatoid Arthritis you could take Arava, Orencia, Humira, Enbrel, Remicade, or Xeljanz.