Ketamine Relieves Depression by Restoring Brain Connections

[BuzzyBee]

Might give the clinic in Lower Manhattan and or Long Island a call next week and see what they have to say. I've also struggled with some severe anxiety earlier in the year, which did get much better, and depression that's been up and down all year long, so it might be a worthwhile shot.

I just hit eight months earlier this week. Seems like you and I share the definition of "good" days vs. bad/regular days.

The Arizona clinic says it helps people who are less than a year into it, so maybe there's a chance it will work. Good luck! Keep us posted. So far people have reported back that it helped anxiety and depression, but didn't help the tinnitus.

 

[GBB]

Might give the clinic in Lower Manhattan and or Long Island a call next week and see what they have to say. I've also struggled with some severe anxiety earlier in the year, which did get much better, and depression that's been up and down all year long, so it might be a worthwhile shot.

I just hit eight months earlier this week. Seems like you and I share the definition of "good" days vs. bad/regular days.

Much better day today so I don't quite have the blinders on I usually do. I may give Ketamine a try, still working through some other things before I commit, but I will definitely let you know results if I do it.

Likewise, if you feel comfortable, please report back if you don't mind. Best of luck!

 

[tbuzz89]

Likewise, if you feel comfortable, please report back if you don't mind.

If I decide to give it a try I'll definitely be updating everyone here. I may give the clinic here in New York a call to see if they can speak with the Arizona clinic regarding their tinnitus treatment or see if they already have something of a similar nature.

 

[Lane]

Just a brief note: I tried topical Ketamine many years ago for chronic neck and head aches. It was so long ago that I can't describe precisely my reactions to it, but what I recall is that it was pretty bad, and I quit taking after only two topical applications. Though it may work for some, it certainly didn't work for me--at the time. Health can be so mysterious at times, it wouldn't surprise me that if I tried it again, I could very well have a different reaction.

 

[kingsfan]

I'm tempted to drive over to AZ and give this a shot. One infusion is affordable, but the fact they say you need 4 or 5 to start feeling benefits sounds like a bait and hook to me.

 

[tbuzz89]

I'm tempted to drive over to AZ and give this a shot. One infusion is affordable, but the fact they say you need 4 or 5 to start feeling benefits sounds like a bait and hook to me.

I've read that even for the infusion's main purpose of treating severe depression, a few to a handful of infusions may be necessary. Each person is different, so I can only assume it's the same for their alleged tinnitus treatment. The AZ clinic is very affordable compared to the one I have locally in New York City, so I still haven't pulled the trigger in calling them to discuss any options.

 

[just1morething]

The AZ clinic is very affordable compared to the one I have locally in New York City, so I still haven't pulled the trigger in calling them to discuss any options.

Maybe they will do Ketamine infusions cheap in Mexico? Some people go to Mexico for dental; e.g. implants, crowns, etc. (vacation dentistry).

You might come back in a pine box but at least you saved a nickel.

 

[kingsfan]

I've read that even for the infusion's main purpose of treating severe depression, a few to a handful of infusions may be necessary. Each person is different, so I can only assume it's the same for their alleged tinnitus treatment. The AZ clinic is very affordable compared to the one I have locally in New York City, so I still haven't pulled the trigger in calling them to discuss any options.

Yea they want to do 4 infusions over something like 2 weeks. That's probably two trips and a few nights of hotel stays. I was thinking of just trying 2 and seeing how I felt, but with 4 the costs start to add up. It may be worth the try, though. I'm still on the fence about it.

 

[TealD]

I will be starting Ketamine treatment on Tuesday for this lingering depression that has gone on for three years. I have had significant trauma dealing with tinnitus, cancer, and major depressive disorder.

Does anyone know how Ketamine can affect tinnitus?

I have almost completely forgot I had this crap until a recent air flight to Atlanta.
On my way back on the flight my tinnitus seemed to get louder. I also used airline given headphones on the flight to watch movies although the volume was real low. Not sure if the flight, headphone usage, or new anxiety medicine (Buspirone) I started has made it louder lately.

I am now afraid that Ketamine can make this even louder. The doctor is also insisting that I listen to music while doing the injections to help with the therapeutic effects.

I told her I have tinnitus but she insists the headphones won't cause any damage in low volume, yet here I am with a spike because of potential headphone usage.

I want the Ketamine to be as effective as possible but I am terrified of using headphones. Is it worth the risk to use headphones while doing Ketamine? What do you think is causing my tinnitus spike lately? My tinnitus is noise induced.

 

[GBB]

I will be starting Ketamine treatment on Tuesday for this lingering depression that has gone on for three years. I have had significant trauma dealing with tinnitus, cancer, and major depressive disorder.

Does anyone know how Ketamine can affect tinnitus?

I have almost completely forgot I had this crap until a recent air flight to Atlanta.
On my way back on the flight my tinnitus seemed to get louder. I also used airline given headphones on the flight to watch movies although the volume was real low. Not sure if the flight, headphone usage, or new anxiety medicine (Buspirone) I started has made it louder lately.

I am now afraid that Ketamine can make this even louder. The doctor is also insisting that I listen to music while doing the injections to help with the therapeutic effects.

I told her I have tinnitus but she insists the headphones won't cause any damage in low volume, yet here I am with a spike because of potential headphone usage.

I want the Ketamine to be as effective as possible but I am terrified of using headphones. Is it worth the risk to use headphones while doing Ketamine? What do you think is causing my tinnitus spike lately? My tinnitus is noise induced.

In theory it should quiet tinnitus because it is an NMDA antagonist, meaning there should be less Glutamate action, and fewer hyperexcited neurons. In practice nobody can tell you what will happen, full stop.

I would definitely refuse the headphones, btw.

 

[L34]

I will be starting Ketamine treatment on Tuesday for this lingering depression that has gone on for three years. I have had significant trauma dealing with tinnitus, cancer, and major depressive disorder.

Does anyone know how Ketamine can affect tinnitus?

I have almost completely forgot I had this crap until a recent air flight to Atlanta.
On my way back on the flight my tinnitus seemed to get louder. I also used airline given headphones on the flight to watch movies although the volume was real low. Not sure if the flight, headphone usage, or new anxiety medicine (Buspirone) I started has made it louder lately.

I am now afraid that Ketamine can make this even louder. The doctor is also insisting that I listen to music while doing the injections to help with the therapeutic effects.

I told her I have tinnitus but she insists the headphones won't cause any damage in low volume, yet here I am with a spike because of potential headphone usage.

I want the Ketamine to be as effective as possible but I am terrified of using headphones. Is it worth the risk to use headphones while doing Ketamine? What do you think is causing my tinnitus spike lately? My tinnitus is noise induced.

I know nothing about this, really, but just thought that an idea could be using foam earplugs and then the headphones on top of that. She couldn't refuse that... I think.

Definitely exciting to hear more when you have had the treatment.

 

[d'Wooluf]

I told her I have tinnitus but she insists the headphones won't cause any damage in low volume, yet here I am with a spike because of potential headphone usage.

Lol at the flight attendant handing out health advice. What she forgot to mention is that with the high level of ambient noise in the airplane you have to turn the volume up pretty high to hear anything at all.

Don't take health advice from me either btw, but here it comes...

What you could do is get yourself a pair of headphones with good isolation (passive and active) to keep the total volume of sound as low as possible. Play music at low volumes for five minutes a day for a week and see how you go. If all goes well, make it ten minutes a day, then fifteen...

Good luck.

 

[TealD]

In theory it should quiet tinnitus because it is an NMDA antagonist, meaning there should be less Glutamate action, and fewer hyperexcited neurons. In practice nobody can tell you what will happen, full stop.

I would definitely refuse the headphones, btw.

I will let you know. I honestly have no idea why my tinnitus is so loud right now. It was good for a whole year. It was so low it was like I didn't even have this crap anymore, then one flight and so many variables, I am hearing it again and back on Tinnitus Talk. I looked online for Buspar side effects and I don't even see the medication causing tinnitus, let alone making it worse. It has to have been the flight or the headphones. The headphones were so low in volume that I could hear the airplane whining over the movie. I eventually put the movie on subtitles to be able to listen.

Usually when I take any antidepressant medication I will get a few days of higher ringing until the medication sets in. I have stopped taking the Buspar to see if it helps.

I hope to god the Ketamine does not make my tinnitus worse. I can't deal with this crap again.

 

[Tomas80]

I was treated with Ketamine. While Ketamine was in my system, my tinnitus climbed to a level where I wanted to die. I've never experienced anything worse and I couldn't even have imagined anything so terrible until then. After Ketamine's effect ran out, the tinnitus returned to its baseline level.

It devastated my life

 

[TealD]

I was treated with Ketamine. While Ketamine was in my system, my tinnitus climbed to a level where I wanted to die. I've never experienced anything worse and I couldn't even have imagined anything so terrible until then. After Ketamine's effect ran out, the tinnitus returned to its baseline level.

It devastated my life

How long did it take until your tinnitus returned to baseline?

I am only afraid that it gets permanently louder. If it seems louder during the treatment then I am ok with that as long as it relieves depression.

How did Ketamine devastate your life?

 

[Tomas80]

How long did it take until your tinnitus returned to baseline?

I am only afraid that it gets permanently louder. If it seems louder during the treatment then I am ok with that as long as it relieves depression.

How did Ketamine devastate your life?

My tinnitus returned to baseline after about 3 hours after Ketamine. I received 2 doses. The second two days after the first.

Ketamine had no effect on tinnitus or depression. Tinnitus is ruining my life, not Ketamine.

 

[kingsfan]

So what's the consensus on Ketamine? I'm seeing negative accounts of it in this thread and another now. I was going to call the place in Phoenix but thought I'd re-read these threads first.

To my surprise the most recent posts don't give me confidence to shell out over a grand. My tinnitus is beating me down after a month in which I've had to take Prednisone, antibiotics and that stupid COVID-19 vaccine.

 

[GBB]

So what's the consensus on Ketamine? I'm seeing negative accounts of it in this thread and another now. I was going to call the place in Phoenix but thought I'd re-read these threads first.

To my surprise the most recent posts don't give me confidence to shell out over a grand. My tinnitus is beating me down after a month in which I've had to take Prednisone, antibiotics and that stupid COVID-19 vaccine.

I think Ketamine can be good or bad, but I've never heard in the bad outcomes that it's been permanent, if that's helpful.

 

[Matchbox]

I think "where" Ketamine goes matters a whole lot for tinnitus as well.

Systemic just leaves so many things to go wrong, sure it inhibits neurons, it also inhibits the GATING neurons.

So it's a complete crapshit gamble with injections.

In the middle ear is likely the safest bet possible for it to actually work. If it doesn't work there it might not work anywhere.

It's the difference between using benzos on the auditory system or on the ear itself.

On the auditory system it can zap it out, but the original problem still remains and will re-establish. On the cochlea it can't "send the signal" to begin with. That ultimately means if the signal comes from there, it will stop. If the signal comes from the auditory system though, you would "expect" the noise to reach insane volume.

Where it goes basically makes it a completely different drug.

 

[FGG]

I think "where" Ketamine goes matters a whole lot for tinnitus as well.

Systemic just leaves so many things to go wrong, sure it inhibits neurons, it also inhibits the GATING neurons.

So it's a complete crapshit gamble with injections.

In the middle ear is likely the safest bet possible for it to actually work. If it doesn't work there it might not work anywhere.

It's the difference between using benzos on the auditory system or on the ear itself.

On the auditory system it can zap it out, but the original problem still remains and will re-establish. On the cochlea it can't "send the signal" to begin with. That ultimately means if the signal comes from there, it will stop. If the signal comes from the auditory system though, you would "expect" the noise to reach insane volume.

Where it goes basically makes it a completely different drug.

I had a similar thought. In the inner ear, NMDA blockage might be helpful for local hyperexcitabilty but muscle rigidity (an effect of Ketamine) middle ear could worsen symptoms (temporarily).

Centrally, there would be both positive and negative effects (as you pointed out) and also depend highly on the degree of local cochlear hyperexcitabilty that's propagated through the auditory system.

I think "crap shoot" describes it well. So far, I haven't read about any permanent worsenings, however.

 

[Lukee]

I have talked to a local Ketamine clinic. In Canada (maybe not all of Canada but at least locally), they use lozenges and not injection or nasal spray. I asked specifically about worsening of tinnitus, either temporary or permanent, and whether tinnitus was a contradiction. The lady told me that not only do they not have it listed as a contradiction, she knows of two patients who have had remission of their tinnitus symptoms after therapy. She said that it seems like more people with tinnitus are inquiring about Ketamine but she doesn't know anything more than at least two people have had remission. I don't know if that has anything to do with lozenge vs IV.

 

[GBB]

I have talked to a local Ketamine clinic. In Canada (maybe not all of Canada but at least locally), they use lozenges and not injection or nasal spray. I asked specifically about worsening of tinnitus, either temporary or permanent, and whether tinnitus was a contradiction. The lady told me that not only do they not have it listed as a contradiction, she knows of two patients who have had remission of their tinnitus symptoms after therapy. She said that it seems like more people with tinnitus are inquiring about Ketamine but she doesn't know anything more than at least two people have had remission. I don't know if that has anything to do with lozenge vs IV.

Remission - interesting...

 

[kingsfan]

I had a similar thought. In the inner ear, NMDA blockage might be helpful for local hyperexcitabilty but muscle rigidity (an effect of Ketamine) middle ear could worsen symptoms (temporarily).

Centrally, there would be both positive and negative effects (as you pointed out) and also depend highly on the degree of local cochlear hyperexcitabilty that's propagated through the auditory system.

I think "crap shoot" describes it well. So far, I haven't read about any permanent worsenings, however.

What do you think about tinnitus that seems to be coming from the head? Maybe it could have some effect on that? Or is that still being triggered by the ears?

 

[FGG]

What do you think about tinnitus that seems to be coming from the head? Maybe it could have some effect on that? Or is that still being triggered by the ears?

All tinnitus ultimately seems to come from the head. Do you mean bilateral vs unilateral?

 

[kingsfan]

All tinnitus ultimately seems to come from the head. Do you mean bilateral vs unilateral?

I have some sounds that seem to be coming from my left, others from my right, but some general just hissing that just isn't directional... it's hard to explain, it feels like I'm not hearing it in my ears. It's just in my head.

 

[FGG]

I have some sounds that seem to be coming from my left, others from my right, but some general just hissing that just isn't directional... it's hard to explain, it feels like I'm not hearing it in my ears. It's just in my head.

I have two main tones. Both are bilateral and seem to be coming from my head (one is a high pitched tone and one is "crickets"). I personally don't know what it feels like to "come from the ears" except for fleeting tinnitus. And my tinnitus is definitely from hearing damage in both ears.

But I'm not sure if that can tell you the likelihood of success with Ketamine or not.

 

[Tezcatlipoca]

I have two main tones. Both are bilateral and seem to be coming from my head (one is a high pitched tone and one is "crickets"). I personally don't know what it feels like to "come from the ears" except for fleeting tinnitus. And my tinnitus is definitely from hearing damage in both ears.

But I'm not sure if that can tell you the likelihood of success with Ketamine or not.

Can I ask when your crickets appeared? I have them too occasionally.

 

[BuzzyBee]

I personally don't know what it feels like to "come from the ears" except for fleeting tinnitus.

Ear tinnitus sounds like fleeting tinnitus, just longer and more sustained. It's really annoying. I have hearing damage, but my tinnitus also comes from the head and sounds like crickets or drills. But occasionally I do get ear tinnitus. It's usually easier to mask than head tinnitus.

Following all the Ketamine posts, but I've talked about it with doctors already and the ones astute in pharmacology basically said what @Matchbox said.

 

[kingsfan]

Ear tinnitus sounds like fleeting tinnitus, just longer and more sustained. It's really annoying. I have hearing damage, but my tinnitus also comes from the head and sounds like crickets or drills. But occasionally I do get ear tinnitus. It's usually easier to mask than head tinnitus.

Following all the Ketamine posts, but I've talked about it with doctors already and the ones astute in pharmacology basically said what @Matchbox said.

I had crickets until an acoustic reflex test worsened my left ear. Now the tones in that ear cover most of the other sounds.

 

[kingsfan]

If this Ketamine infusion does help and the effects can somehow last 6 months, this will be a pricey way to cope...