Kinetic in Poland Claim They Reduce Tinnitus

[Mentos]

Hi to all,
You may find this interesting, there's a company in Poland who claims with their technology they can reduce Tinnitus. They have 4 different platforms to be used depending on origin of your tinnitus:
http://kinetic-cna.pl/en

I recently started ARC therapy they offer which should last at least 6 months, I'll let you know how are things going.

Mentos

 

[Pleasure_Paulie]

Looks interesting but the website is rather devoid of much detail apart from saying they use "technology". I'm hopeful of any developments will push this cause forward though.

What does the ARC therapy look like?

 

[RaZaH]

Site is riddled with grammar mistakes , never very trustworthy.

 

[Mentos]

Looks interesting but the website is rather devoid of much detail apart from saying they use "technology". I'm hopeful of any developments will push this cause forward though.

What does the ARC therapy look like?

It's a combination of sound therapy, special diet and physical excersizes to assure propoer level of BDNF protein which they believe is crucial for adaptation of damaged synapses in inner ear. They belive it's a synaptic damage which causes Tinnitus in my case (noise exposure at rock concert). It's a bit similar theory that Charles Libermann has about cochlear synaptopathy and hidden hearing loss.

 

[Pleasure_Paulie]

I think for the good of the community - please keep us updated on your progress. We are all interested to hear of anything that may assist us all

 

[Asia88]

Mentos, do you have any positive update on that? I'm living not far away and considering to try

 

[PatrickG]

@Mentos any updates?

 

[Mentos]

It's been 2 months I'm using it, unfortunately no improvement in my T. Either the treatment is not effective in general or I'm just unlucky one. I'll let you no in case things improve for me.

 

[Sander]

I've decided to give it a try - I have an online consultation next week. I will write here if I hear something interesting from them. Before the consultation I was told to make a serotonin level test because it is important to be qualified to their therapy. @Mentos did you make such a test? Do you have to monitor this level during therapy?

 

[mintblue]

My girlfriend is Polish, asking her if she knows anyone who has been to that clinic.

 

[Sander]

I've just finished my online consultation. They seem to be professional - we have been talking for about an hour. They use a few therapies including Acoustic CR Neuromodulation, rTMS and Synaptic adaptation Arc. According to my test results the best for me could be the last one (synaptic adaptation). Hovewer my serotonin level is very low (39) and I should rise it to at least 100. They granted me an access to the online patient portal where I can find instructions, short movies etc. for diet and physical activities. I should follow these all instructions for one month and then make further serotonin level tests. If I can get a result of 100 or more (and more important - keep it on such a level) I should be able to start using their device for synaptic adaptation.

 

[Mentos]

I've just finished my online consultation. They seem to be professional - we have been talking for about an hour. They use a few therapies including Acoustic CR Neuromodulation, rTMS and Synaptic adaptation Arc. According to my test results the best for me could be the last one (synaptic adaptation). Hovewer my serotonin level is very low (39) and I should rise it to at least 100. They granted me an access to the online patient portal where I can find instructions, short movies etc. for diet and physical activities. I should follow these all instructions for one month and then make further serotonin level tests. If I can get a result of 100 or more (and more important - keep it on such a level) I should be able to start using their device for synaptic adaptation.

Hi Sander, and how it goes with the Diet / exercises? Did you manage to lift up your serotonin the the level required to start the therapy?

 

[RaZaH]

yeah,, how did this turn out ?

 

[Sander]

Hi, sorry for the late response. I realized that it is quite challenging process to rise the serotonin level. Maybe not even rising but maintaining at the same high level. My last result was 92. I noticed a slightly less intensive tinnitus recently (as I heard from Kinetic - it is normal due to serotonin level). The common decision was to give the therapy a try. I received a week ago a device (looks like mp3 player to me) with handmade in-ear-canal headphones. It produces short sequences of sounds. I must wear it for at least 8 hours a day (thanks to the construction of headphones it is quite comfortable and allows to make conversations) and every 2 weeks they are going to change the sequences according to my results. So far I don't see enormous improvement (as I already wrote, it is maybe a little change and I connect it rather with diet and exercises than with this short period of therapy). I will write here if I notice any major improvements (or contrary).

 

[RODRIGO]

HI,
I am very interested in the treatment.

I have been in touch with the Polish clinic as well, and I have been told that I should have an optimal level of BDNF, and serotenine, through diet and exercise.

Are you being positive treatment? Do you think they are very professional?

Thank you very much for your information.

 

[Cal18]

@Sander What method did they use for measuring serotonin? Just asking because there is much controversy over the accuracy of neurotransmitter testing. Also wondering what you did to get your level up to 92? Thanks pretty impressive.

 

[maltese]

Site is riddled with grammar mistakes , never very trustworthy.

Polish language version is quite bad as well.

 

[Sander]

@Cal18
It is a test for a serum serotonin level. The aim is to measure serotonin level as a hormone with strong correlation with insulin's proteins (igf-1 and bdnf), not to measure it as a neurotransmitter. If you give this information to the lab, they should know which test must be applied.

To rise serotonin level I was given an access to their webservice with dietary recommendations and short clips with physical exercises. So I guess healthy diet and physical activity is do the job.

@RODRIGO
Did you get access to this patient's portal? If you follow their instructions you can write in a couple weeks if you managed to get your serotonin level up. Maybe it will confirm me words to @Cal18

When it comes to my results for tinnitus I'm really more than happy about this. My tinnitus in a left ear is almost entirely reduced now. In right ear it is reduced in 20-30% maybe. But believe me it is a huge relief for me. Right now I'm somewhere in the middle of the therapy and I'm looking forward with hope it will be even better. On the other side I don't know if there will be a long lasting positive effect after therapy. They say so, but who knows?

You asked if they are professional. I have rather positive experiences so far so yes.

 

[The King]

@Cal18
It is a test for a serum serotonin level. The aim is to measure serotonin level as a hormone with strong correlation with insulin's proteins (igf-1 and bdnf), not to measure it as a neurotransmitter. If you give this information to the lab, they should know which test must be applied.

To rise serotonin level I was given an access to their webservice with dietary recommendations and short clips with physical exercises. So I guess healthy diet and physical activity is do the job.

@RODRIGO
Did you get access to this patient's portal? If you follow their instructions you can write in a couple weeks if you managed to get your serotonin level up. Maybe it will confirm me words to @Cal18

When it comes to my results for tinnitus I'm really more than happy about this. My tinnitus in a left ear is almost entirely reduced now. In right ear it is reduced in 20-30% maybe. But believe me it is a huge relief for me. Right now I'm somewhere in the middle of the therapy and I'm looking forward with hope it will be even better. On the other side I don't know if there will be a long lasting positive effect after therapy. They say so, but who knows?

You asked if they are professional. I have rather positive experiences so far so yes.

Hi Sander; How much is expansive this treatment ? Them give you a music dispositve ?

 

[Sander]

I paid 2000 EUR.

Them give you a music dispositve ?

Music dispositive? I don't know if I understand you correctly. Price includes this sound device and headphones being used during therapy (delivery to Germany).

 

[Erik9810]

http://cordis.europa.eu/project/rcn/207962_en.html

Saw this while searching for some info concerning this clinic, interesting to say the least.

 

[Paul10]

Saw this while searching for some info concerning this clinic, interesting to say the least.

Says the EU contributed €50,000 to the research. That is interesting Erik. I might give them more attention going forward!

 

[RaZaH]

@Sander did you get these results from only an audio type device?
For how long did you have T before you started this treatment and how long after you started did you get results?

 

[Erik9810]

Hey guys, I've done some additional research. The link below leads to Kinetic's youtube channel, in the end of their latest video is another logo and name for the company. My theory is that they are adapting into a larger scale operation with the aid of the EU-funding. What are your thoughts?

 

[RaZaH]

What an horrible ad ...lol

 

[Erik9810]

They seem to have appeared on polish television as well.

 

[RaZaH]

@Sander It would be awesome to hear from you now that its been another month .

 

[maltese]

If you need any help with the translation, just let me know guys

I'm in Warsaw next month, I might pop in and ask what they can offer.

 

[Rings-a-Bell]

So if I understand this correctly, the theory is... if you lost your hearing suddenly (say at a Rock Concert) your nervous system cannot adapt and you get T. So these guys give you a hearing aid that amps up the frequencies you lost and then over several months gradually reduces the amplification until you get back to your original level of hearing loss. The hypothesis being if your hearing loss comes on gradually your nervous system can adapt and you don't get T.

For this hypothesis to be correct, then it seems to me that your T must be able to be stopped after a few weeks/months with a regular (no white noise) hearing aid. Right? So they get you to a point where there is no T and then gradually bring you back to your natural state without retriggering it?

Sounds good. Certainly my T was the result of a sudden loss, so that fits. BUT... I haven't seen any evidence that hearing aids without white noise can stop T. I would want to see that evidence before I could believe in this approach.

 

[RaZaH]

Interesting , do any hearing aids bring up freq above 8 k ?