Lenire — Bimodal Stimulation Treatment by Neuromod

[Jack Straw]

@Redknight @Nanny chocolate @Allan1967 @Cojackb

Can any of you tell us whether the hearing test they do is any different than your average hearing test at the audiologist?

If someone had perfect hearing on a regular test, would it differentiate from their test?

I ask because if someone has perfect hearing under one audiologist's test, they assume they would not be denied Lenire, and when they go to Neuromod, they could be refused treatment because their hearing test is different.

What range do they test? The typical audiologist test range?

 

[JohnAdams]

I had a similar chat with the consultant who said pretty much the same, and that the noise can "move" to other parts of the head. An interesting comment she made was some people have come back reporting their tinnitus has improved, but when they do the masking test etc there is no record-able difference in the amount of white noise it takes to mask.

I guess the thing to take away is an improvement doesn't necessarily equate to a reduction in loudness, but can mean overall reduction of intensity or intrusiveness of the frequency.

It's my first day using the treatment properly and although my tinnitus does seem much quieter today I put this down to being distracted with work and having fans on everywhere in the house due to the heat. There's no way it works that quickly!


Absolutely.

So as per the instructions from Lenire, find a comfortable seated position - upright preferably. In their words, this reduces the risk of you falling asleep during the treatment and the tongue tip losing contact with your tongue.

Switch on the Lenire device by pressing and holding the power button, you'll get a green battery light (top light) which indicates the battery is well charged. This turns orange when the battery needs charging. If the tongue tip is already plugged into the device, the status light for the tongue tip will pulse green (Left hand light).

View attachment 31114

There is also a status light for the Bluetooth headset (right hand light) which pulses blue until the headset is switched on and pairs automatically. So before treatment can start, you have to make sure this is connected and the status light changes from pulsing blue to solid green.

View attachment 31115

Once everything is plugged in and paired (it's very easy) you will notice the white light that appears directly underneath the power button. This basically means the device is ready to go and treatment can begin.

Place the tongue tip over your bottom lip so your lip sits just behind the notch and rest the metal nodes onto your tongue. It takes a bit of fiddling at first to find a comfortable position so you're not forcing your lips closed or pressing your tongue up the entire time. As soon as your tongue makes contact with the nodes, the pulsing green light goes to a solid green light.

Pop the headphones over your ears, they're comfortable enough for the length of treatment. During the training they do emphasize the importance of making sure the correct speaker is over it's corresponding ear, R - Right and L - Left. This is due to the device being configured for your audio profile and hearing levels in each individual ear. They've made this pretty easy...

View attachment 31116

Now everything's switched on, in your mouth and over your ears you can press play. You'll notice the white LED will begin to rotate clockwise around the light bars.

View attachment 31117

The first thing you'll hear is white-noise, it sounds very similar to waves on a shoreline or wind rushing through tree's - very soothing. There's a mixture of raindrop noises alongside slow piano chords. This in my opinion, is just ambient sound to make the experience more soothing. The important sound comes in the form of a strange chirp (I don't know any other way to describe it) - @Redknight @Allan1967 you guys might be able to explain that sound better than I can.

This "chirp" is much faster in that it will play multiple chirps per piano chord but they're still in sync. The reason I say this is the important sound is because as soon as the chirp begins, your tongue tip will begin to give off synchronized tingles onto your tongue. It's not an uncomfortable sensation, but it is very foreign in that it's difficult to relate to other feelings. They're very isolated tingles / pops in the exact position of the metal nodes on the tongue tip.

FYI - According to the product specialist at Lenire, these "tingles", their frequency and the way they are sync'd with the sound depends on the treatment you've been given. The impression I got here is there is more than one pattern that Lenire can choose from to set on your device (My interpretation of what was said, not fact).

The music varies slightly throughout the treatment, sometimes the white-noise is more prominent, sometimes the piano chords and chirps are more prominent.

Around 20 minutes into my treatment the white-noise was much louder than any other sound coming through the headphones - almost borderline with what I'd consider as my comfortable max volume and this lasted for a few minutes, at which point it returned to its default level alongside the other sound effects.

Truthfully, after 20 - 25 minutes of sitting, doing nothing and listening to the "music" it does get a little boring and you find yourself struggling to not get distracted by other things.

As the treatment ends, the music begins to fade out gently - there is no abrupt stop in sound. It's a gentle gradient until the sound fades into nothing. This indicates the end of the treatment and the white light will return back to its position under the power button.

Overall - The treatment is by no means uncomfortable, distressing or overbearing. It's a very user friendly piece of equipment and the treatment seems to have been refined to match. Volumes can be adjusted, intensity of the tongue tip can be adjusted and all the equipment is charged via USB which is handy. They do provide a charger in the box!

That's about as much as I can explain having only used it for 30 minutes, if there's anything particular you want to know then you're welcome to ask.

It begins.

Will you record the sound and post it for us?

 

[Martin69]

Hi all fellow tinnitus sufferers. A quick report as I just got back to the UK. I think I was trying to avoid disappointment by thinking I wouldn't be accepted for Lenire.

I took a copy of my latest audiogram and then Caroline the audiologist gave me another hearing test. For some reason it seemed as if I could hear less and it was quite obvious I was not hearing some of the sounds. The sound inputs seemed different to N.H.S. but maybe that's not so. I was being observed by two German people who I guess will be involved in the roll out in Germany. No empathy from them! One was scrolling her phone.

Caroline then gave the refusal as I wouldn't be able to hear the sound inputs on the device.
Currently it is not possible to use Lenire with hearing aids. That was my stressed understanding and my daughter confirmed this as she sat in on the consultation.

My details will be kept on file should this become an option at some point.

I can't say exactly what my hearing loss is (caused by a virus and deterioration with age), I can't really understand the graph. I don't wear hearing aids and mostly manage ok.

Today's conclusion is that it is a big financial and emotional investment. Dublin Airport is now International and very busy, taxis are expensive but prolific. Dubliners are friendly and helpful. Premier Inn near the airport was a good standard and can recommend.

@Liz Windsor
@Sam Bridge

I'm completely confused here. My understanding is that I was refused Lenire as my hearing wasn't good enough. I don't wear hearing aids even though I could.

I'm also confused as I also understood that wearing hearing aids under the current headphones weren't an option.

I'm completely Neuromodded out. The audiologist suggested to try hearing aids so maybe that was her first line of reducing tinnitus.

I give up, I'm exhausted by trying so hard and getting nowhere.

Need coffee now. Phew.

P.S. on the questionnaire it might be more helpful to enquire about any degree of hearing loss rather than ask if hearing aids are worn.

Bye for now,
Eve

Thanks for information. But really strange.
Sounds a little bit like a lottery to me - if you can hear the sounds or not.
At least I will not plan to travel from Germany to Dublin being rejected.

And don't give up please. I am sure, sooner or later, everyone will get the opportunity to get the device.

 

[Bndsmheowqhe]

I think people really need to take stock here. Neuromod aren't offering an online audiogram assessment business (as handy as that would be) and anyone going to a consultation needs to be aware that they might be refused. They're offering a device, the initial consultation for which is €250. Nobody is holding a gun to your head but if you take the appointment and thus staff time and resources this is the cost of it. Simple.

It really doesn't to be fair. To be clear I have the utmost sympathy and best wishes for anyone who feels their tinnitus affects them badly enough that they'd travel for treatment. Mine was catastrophic for the first number of months so i can empathize with the desperation and need for hope.
But for all their faults Neuromod has been unflinchingly consistent in their message that they don't recommend people to travel as they can't assure they'll get the best possible level of treatment this way.

"It really doesn't to be fair."

They lack the resources necessary to make the device available in a large number of locations. In other words their business model is going to require that a large portion of potential patients will have to repeatedly travel significant distances to get there. Especially when it comes to a geographically expansive country like the US. Wasting their time with "an initial assessment" visit is an unnecessary luxury at the patient's expense.

 

[Redknight]

I had a similar chat with the consultant who said pretty much the same, and that the noise can "move" to other parts of the head. An interesting comment she made was some people have come back reporting their tinnitus has improved, but when they do the masking test etc there is no record-able difference in the amount of white noise it takes to mask.

I guess the thing to take away is an improvement doesn't necessarily equate to a reduction in loudness, but can mean overall reduction of intensity or intrusiveness of the frequency.

It's my first day using the treatment properly and although my tinnitus does seem much quieter today I put this down to being distracted with work and having fans on everywhere in the house due to the heat. There's no way it works that quickly!

Absolutely.

So as per the instructions from Lenire, find a comfortable seated position - upright preferably. In their words, this reduces the risk of you falling asleep during the treatment and the tongue tip losing contact with your tongue.

Switch on the Lenire device by pressing and holding the power button, you'll get a green battery light (top light) which indicates the battery is well charged. This turns orange when the battery needs charging. If the tongue tip is already plugged into the device, the status light for the tongue tip will pulse green (Left hand light).

View attachment 31114

There is also a status light for the Bluetooth headset (right hand light) which pulses blue until the headset is switched on and pairs automatically. So before treatment can start, you have to make sure this is connected and the status light changes from pulsing blue to solid green.

View attachment 31115

Once everything is plugged in and paired (it's very easy) you will notice the white light that appears directly underneath the power button. This basically means the device is ready to go and treatment can begin.

Place the tongue tip over your bottom lip so your lip sits just behind the notch and rest the metal nodes onto your tongue. It takes a bit of fiddling at first to find a comfortable position so you're not forcing your lips closed or pressing your tongue up the entire time. As soon as your tongue makes contact with the nodes, the pulsing green light goes to a solid green light.

Pop the headphones over your ears, they're comfortable enough for the length of treatment. During the training they do emphasize the importance of making sure the correct speaker is over it's corresponding ear, R - Right and L - Left. This is due to the device being configured for your audio profile and hearing levels in each individual ear. They've made this pretty easy...

View attachment 31116

Now everything's switched on, in your mouth and over your ears you can press play. You'll notice the white LED will begin to rotate clockwise around the light bars.

View attachment 31117

The first thing you'll hear is white-noise, it sounds very similar to waves on a shoreline or wind rushing through tree's - very soothing. There's a mixture of raindrop noises alongside slow piano chords. This in my opinion, is just ambient sound to make the experience more soothing. The important sound comes in the form of a strange chirp (I don't know any other way to describe it) - @Redknight @Allan1967 you guys might be able to explain that sound better than I can.

This "chirp" is much faster in that it will play multiple chirps per piano chord but they're still in sync. The reason I say this is the important sound is because as soon as the chirp begins, your tongue tip will begin to give off synchronized tingles onto your tongue. It's not an uncomfortable sensation, but it is very foreign in that it's difficult to relate to other feelings. They're very isolated tingles / pops in the exact position of the metal nodes on the tongue tip.

FYI - According to the product specialist at Lenire, these "tingles", their frequency and the way they are sync'd with the sound depends on the treatment you've been given. The impression I got here is there is more than one pattern that Lenire can choose from to set on your device (My interpretation of what was said, not fact).

The music varies slightly throughout the treatment, sometimes the white-noise is more prominent, sometimes the piano chords and chirps are more prominent.

Around 20 minutes into my treatment the white-noise was much louder than any other sound coming through the headphones - almost borderline with what I'd consider as my comfortable max volume and this lasted for a few minutes, at which point it returned to its default level alongside the other sound effects.

Truthfully, after 20 - 25 minutes of sitting, doing nothing and listening to the "music" it does get a little boring and you find yourself struggling to not get distracted by other things.

As the treatment ends, the music begins to fade out gently - there is no abrupt stop in sound. It's a gentle gradient until the sound fades into nothing. This indicates the end of the treatment and the white light will return back to its position under the power button.

Overall - The treatment is by no means uncomfortable, distressing or overbearing. It's a very user friendly piece of equipment and the treatment seems to have been refined to match. Volumes can be adjusted, intensity of the tongue tip can be adjusted and all the equipment is charged via USB which is handy. They do provide a charger in the box!

That's about as much as I can explain having only used it for 30 minutes, if there's anything particular you want to know then you're welcome to ask.

I kind of know what she means. Some days my tinnitus has a noise to it that is way more intrusive and harder to deal with than the single tone. I'd be happy if the buzzing noise went away.

Great report! You should copy that to the Lenire User Experiences thread.

 

[El BUZZ]

I had a similar chat with the consultant who said pretty much the same, and that the noise can "move" to other parts of the head. An interesting comment she made was some people have come back reporting their tinnitus has improved, but when they do the masking test etc there is no record-able difference in the amount of white noise it takes to mask.

I guess the thing to take away is an improvement doesn't necessarily equate to a reduction in loudness, but can mean overall reduction of intensity or intrusiveness of the frequency.

It's my first day using the treatment properly and although my tinnitus does seem much quieter today I put this down to being distracted with work and having fans on everywhere in the house due to the heat. There's no way it works that quickly!

Absolutely.

So as per the instructions from Lenire, find a comfortable seated position - upright preferably. In their words, this reduces the risk of you falling asleep during the treatment and the tongue tip losing contact with your tongue.

Switch on the Lenire device by pressing and holding the power button, you'll get a green battery light (top light) which indicates the battery is well charged. This turns orange when the battery needs charging. If the tongue tip is already plugged into the device, the status light for the tongue tip will pulse green (Left hand light).

View attachment 31114

There is also a status light for the Bluetooth headset (right hand light) which pulses blue until the headset is switched on and pairs automatically. So before treatment can start, you have to make sure this is connected and the status light changes from pulsing blue to solid green.

View attachment 31115

Once everything is plugged in and paired (it's very easy) you will notice the white light that appears directly underneath the power button. This basically means the device is ready to go and treatment can begin.

Place the tongue tip over your bottom lip so your lip sits just behind the notch and rest the metal nodes onto your tongue. It takes a bit of fiddling at first to find a comfortable position so you're not forcing your lips closed or pressing your tongue up the entire time. As soon as your tongue makes contact with the nodes, the pulsing green light goes to a solid green light.

Pop the headphones over your ears, they're comfortable enough for the length of treatment. During the training they do emphasize the importance of making sure the correct speaker is over it's corresponding ear, R - Right and L - Left. This is due to the device being configured for your audio profile and hearing levels in each individual ear. They've made this pretty easy...

View attachment 31116

Now everything's switched on, in your mouth and over your ears you can press play. You'll notice the white LED will begin to rotate clockwise around the light bars.

View attachment 31117

The first thing you'll hear is white-noise, it sounds very similar to waves on a shoreline or wind rushing through tree's - very soothing. There's a mixture of raindrop noises alongside slow piano chords. This in my opinion, is just ambient sound to make the experience more soothing. The important sound comes in the form of a strange chirp (I don't know any other way to describe it) - @Redknight @Allan1967 you guys might be able to explain that sound better than I can.

This "chirp" is much faster in that it will play multiple chirps per piano chord but they're still in sync. The reason I say this is the important sound is because as soon as the chirp begins, your tongue tip will begin to give off synchronized tingles onto your tongue. It's not an uncomfortable sensation, but it is very foreign in that it's difficult to relate to other feelings. They're very isolated tingles / pops in the exact position of the metal nodes on the tongue tip.

FYI - According to the product specialist at Lenire, these "tingles", their frequency and the way they are sync'd with the sound depends on the treatment you've been given. The impression I got here is there is more than one pattern that Lenire can choose from to set on your device (My interpretation of what was said, not fact).

The music varies slightly throughout the treatment, sometimes the white-noise is more prominent, sometimes the piano chords and chirps are more prominent.

Around 20 minutes into my treatment the white-noise was much louder than any other sound coming through the headphones - almost borderline with what I'd consider as my comfortable max volume and this lasted for a few minutes, at which point it returned to its default level alongside the other sound effects.

Truthfully, after 20 - 25 minutes of sitting, doing nothing and listening to the "music" it does get a little boring and you find yourself struggling to not get distracted by other things.

As the treatment ends, the music begins to fade out gently - there is no abrupt stop in sound. It's a gentle gradient until the sound fades into nothing. This indicates the end of the treatment and the white light will return back to its position under the power button.

Overall - The treatment is by no means uncomfortable, distressing or overbearing. It's a very user friendly piece of equipment and the treatment seems to have been refined to match. Volumes can be adjusted, intensity of the tongue tip can be adjusted and all the equipment is charged via USB which is handy. They do provide a charger in the box!

That's about as much as I can explain having only used it for 30 minutes, if there's anything particular you want to know then you're welcome to ask.

So detailed it almost has a positive impact on my tinnitus.

Thanks for taking your time and energy to let us know.

 

[Redknight]

I am not sure about this. Some elements could be provided easily in remote. You can submit an audiogram and fill a mood and medication questionnaire, send them this material via a secure link and get perhaps an initial estimate of the probability for you to fulfill the criteria, or perhaps a quick no go in case there is something that clearly excludes you. Neuromod could charge say 100 to 200EUR for this preliminary screening service but the benefit would be that if you get a no go you don't have to travel to Ireland and face a huge disappointment.

Also, the mere fact that the criteria are not of easy comprehension to the lay public is no good reason not to publish them. They can be made available simply as a guarantee that a criterion is there, first of all, and that it is the same for everyone and consistent in time. This adds to the company credibility.

More than that, if you take the criteria and visit a local audiologist you might be able to save yourself a trip to Ireland in case you are unlikely to qualify, as the audiologist would be able to interpret them. This may be relevant and quite cost-saving for people travelling from far away.

So no, not publishing the criteria is not good, and it's lack of transparency in my view. Clearly they are in a strong position, as there are thousands of potential clients waiting for a date, but it would be helpful if they were more transparent. Clearly they have no obligation to do so.

You just described Neuromod's plan! They have opened in Ireland only so far. The intention is to roll it out to local audiologists across the world.

Neuromod try and dissuade people from traveling far because of the chance of huge disappointment, then people travel anyway and get really disappointed. I disagree with your assessment that it could all be done remotely; there is too much chance of people giving false information and then being disappointed when it doesn't work. Bad for everyone involved; patients, Neuromod and the tinnitus community.

 

[kelpiemsp]

I think you are all missing the point in regards to hearing loss. Tinnitus frequency and pitch don't matter. The device as I understand it, broadcasts a wide spectrum of sounds. It goes up to 12 kHz, and it has to be calibrated to your hearing such that you receive (hear) all frequencies similarly. If you are -60 dB in one frequency, the device can't send you a sound of 60 dB across most frequencies and then 120 dB in the frequencies you can't hear.

Also, it's crazy to think they would accept an audiology report from anyone else at this juncture. Seriously people.

Can you call a doctor and ask for Vicodin because you have an X-ray? That's not how it works.

 

[KotaDomowa]

@Cojackb

Good luck!

Can I ask what MML (Minimum Masking Level) you have?

 

[spedgas]

I had a similar chat with the consultant who said pretty much the same, and that the noise can "move" to other parts of the head. An interesting comment she made was some people have come back reporting their tinnitus has improved, but when they do the masking test etc there is no record-able difference in the amount of white noise it takes to mask.

I guess the thing to take away is an improvement doesn't necessarily equate to a reduction in loudness, but can mean overall reduction of intensity or intrusiveness of the frequency.

This is the thing I can't wrap my mind around. My tinnitus is heard in my head. I don't perceive it in my ears. It fills my head. The only improvement I can imagine is a lowering in volume with perhaps a reduction in reactivity. I don't know what lowering intensity is meant to refer to. I'm not necessarily willing to trade one tone for another either.

I'm hoping that some of you early users can adequately convey the changes that are going on. It so hard to use words to describe subjective sounds. If you have an improvement in "intensity", but not volume what is that like?

 

[ajc]

Also, it's crazy to think they would accept an audiology report from anyone else at this juncture. Seriously people.

They already did accept a third-party audiogram for one person here. So get your facts straight.

Unfortunately I don't have that info as I provided Neuromod with a very recent audiogram I'd had done prior to my assessment with them. They used that instead of carrying out another hearing test!

 

[Redknight]

This is the thing I can't wrap my mind around. My tinnitus is heard in my head. I don't perceive it in my ears. It fills my head. The only improvement I can imagine is a lowering in volume with perhaps a reduction in reactivity. I don't know what lowering intensity is meant to refer to. I'm not necessarily willing to trade one tone for another either.

I'm hoping that some of you early users can adequately convey the changes that are going on. It so hard to use words to describe subjective sounds. If you have an improvement in "intensity", but not volume what is that like?

I can only speak for me, but this is how I explain it to my wife.

Imagine you're tuning an old radio. As you turn the dial the sound changes from music or a tone to annoying static. The volume hadn't changed, but the annoyingness (made up up word!) or intrusiveness has.

https://www.hear-it.org/Impressions-of-hearing-loss-and-Tinnitus-

My tinnitus changes between the 4000 Hz tone on this site to example 3 with a 4000 Hz tone. It's that buzz that drives me nuts, I could handle the tone if the buzz would do one! Also the beeps, they can go too.

If anyone here has example 12, my heart goes out to you. All tinnitus sucks, but I couldn't cope with 12.

 

[JohnAdams]

Tinnitus frequency and pitch don't matter.

What is the difference between frequency and pitch?

 

[Chinmoku]

Also, it's crazy to think they would accept an audiology report from anyone else at this juncture. Seriously people.

Can you call a doctor and ask for Vicodin because you have an X-ray? That's not how it works.

I was saying that the local audiologist might understand the criteria. It's your interest to tell her the truth or you get a distorted opinion. Clearly Neuromod would not be bound by the local audiologist's opinion but that can be helpful to you to assess whether to travel to Ireland or not. In your example, it's like you have to do a special scan in Ireland, the Irish radiologist explains the technical conditions for the scan to work, and you consult a local radiologist to check whether you have good chances to qualify for the scan. This is useful to you to decide whether you should travel to Ireland.

P.S. I had a question for you on meditation in the Laurence McKenna thread, it would be great if you could advise. Thanks.

 

[Nanny chocolate]

@Jack Straw

I can't answer that question Jack, only to say that I seemed to be able to press the button more during my N.H.S. assessment. I was told the results were similar but I don't understand the graph.

I asked for a print out of their graph but they operate a paperless system.

I may receive it in an email?

Grace, the admin lady, is charming but probably reeling under demands. They are a very small team currently. Goodness knows what happens if someone is unwell.

Over and out from Torbay.

Eve

 

[GlennS]

They already did accept a third-party audiogram for one person here. So get your facts straight.

They may take in an external audiogram but will they do that prior to the assessment to spare people a trip? They could always pre-charge to account for the time spent looking at the audiogram.

 

[kelpiemsp]

They already did accept a third-party audiogram for one person here. So get your facts straight.

It's possible this audiogram was done by a licensed provider with contracts already set up with Neuromod. Maybe it was in a specialized format that they were able to accept, i.e. up to 12 kHz and digital. We have no idea. Maybe you should understand this device or how the medical system works before you make smug replies.

 

[Stefaniie]

Is there anyone else with moderate hearing loss planning to go in for a consultation?

Also, was there any people with moderate hearing loss in the clinical trials?

 

[kelpiemsp]

What is the difference between frequency and pitch?

Frequency = scientific nomenclature and pitch = more musical as a descriptor. I should have put in a / instead of an and.

 

[jmasterj]

Is there anyone else with moderate hearing loss planning to go in for a consultation?

Also, was there any people with moderate hearing loss in the clinical trials?

I still have my appointment scheduled in November and it is interesting reading about this. I have, according to my audiogram mild to moderate loss. I have 40ish dB loss at 8 kHz with some mild loss from 3 kHz through 8 kHz. I will plan on keeping the appointment for now.

As far as the clinical trials you couldn't have more than 80 dB loss in any frequencies.

 

[Cojackb]

@Cojackb

Good luck!

Can I ask what MML (Minimum Masking Level) you have?

I didn't get actual figures from the consultant but they did comment to say my masking level is very low, meaning white noise works well for me.

 

[Cojackb]

They already did accept a third-party audiogram for one person here. So get your facts straight.

They will accept an audiogram done within the last 2 months, IIRC. Anything outside of this is not an option as your audio profile can change significantly outside of that.

 

[Cojackb]

@Redknight @Nanny chocolate @Allan1967 @Cojackb

Can any of you tell us whether the hearing test they do is any different than your average hearing test at the audiologist?

If someone had perfect hearing on a regular test, would it differentiate from their test?

I ask because if someone has perfect hearing under one audiologist's test, they assume they would not be denied Lenire, and when they go to Neuromod, they could be refused treatment because their hearing test is different.

What range do they test? The typical audiologist test range?

Unfortunately I can't comment as Lenire didn't carry out a hearing test at my assessment. I had an extremely recent audiogram already that I provided them.

The only thing I will say is the audiologist that carried out my hearing test previously used a certain type of tone to make it easier for me to distinguish the sounds. If I can remember, she used a pulsing type of tone that would repeat a couple of times.

Could it be that Lenire have a specific sound set that is relatively difficult to pick up on with certain hearing loss?

 

[Redknight]

@Redknight @Nanny chocolate @Allan1967 @Cojackb

Can any of you tell us whether the hearing test they do is any different than your average hearing test at the audiologist?

If someone had perfect hearing on a regular test, would it differentiate from their test?

I ask because if someone has perfect hearing under one audiologist's test, they assume they would not be denied Lenire, and when they go to Neuromod, they could be refused treatment because their hearing test is different.

What range do they test? The typical audiologist test range?

It felt the same as a normal one. I think it was 8 kHz, but it might not have been.

I've never done the masking level test before. My tinnitus is easily masked by beeps or chirping, but not by white noise.

No test to tell if I could discern speech over other people talking.

 

[Chinmoku]

You just described Neuromod's plan! They have opened in Ireland only so far. The intention is to roll it out to local audiologists across the world.

Neuromod try and dissuade people from traveling far because of the chance of huge disappointment, then people travel anyway and get really disappointed. I disagree with your assessment that it could all be done remotely; there is too much chance of people giving false information and then being disappointed when it doesn't work. Bad for everyone involved; patients, Neuromod and the tinnitus community.

I'm not saying to do it all in remote. You only do a pre-screening go/no-go in remote. Then you repeat the test in Ireland if it's go. If you provide false information you go against your interest as you want to know whether to go there or not. This would have spared Nanny Chocolate the trip.

 

[Stefaniie]

I still have my appointment scheduled in November and it is interesting reading about this. I have, according to my audiogram mild to moderate loss. I have 40ish dB loss at 8 kHz with some mild loss from 3 kHz through 8 kHz. I will plan on keeping the appointment for now.

As far as the clinical trials you couldn't have more than 80 dB loss in any frequencies.

Hope you're accepted if you choose to go! Let's pray that the exclusion criteria for hearing loss is more complicated than just excluding anyone with anything larger than a mild hearing loss.

I wonder if anyone with a moderate hearing loss participated in the clinical trials and if they saw any results...

 

[newbieT]

Let's just remember that if reports of Lenire working come back, it will be for the first time in history there is actually a science based treatment for tinnitus!!

Imagine you just came back to visit Tinnitus Talk for the first time in a year and BOOM! A potential cure has been discovered!

How can you not be positive even if the wait is a little longer

 

[jmasterj]

Hope you're accepted if you choose to go! Let's pray that the exclusion criteria for hearing loss is more complicated than just excluding anyone with anything larger than a mild hearing loss.

I wonder if anyone with a moderate hearing loss participated in the clinical trials and if they saw any results...

Thanks. I am a bit worried now after reading the new responses. The hard part is that I am traveling from the US. I was under the impression based on the 80 dB cutoff from the trial I would be OK, but now I am not so sure. If anything I guess I can enjoy a few days in Ireland. I do have a feeling they are being a bit more selective in who they choose right now to show more success to push this towards further commercialization.

 

[kelpiemsp]

This is the thing I can't wrap my mind around. My tinnitus is heard in my head. I don't perceive it in my ears. It fills my head. The only improvement I can imagine is a lowering in volume with perhaps a reduction in reactivity. I don't know what lowering intensity is meant to refer to. I'm not necessarily willing to trade one tone for another either.

I'm hoping that some of you early users can adequately convey the changes that are going on. It so hard to use words to describe subjective sounds. If you have an improvement in "intensity", but not volume what is that like?

One example that comes to mind is my tinnitus seemed "breathy." It sounded, empty, hollow, not as piercing. It spent a few months this way before the volume reduced for me.

 

[zhiyuan]

I applied for an appointment, but I think I will be refused. I can't hear anything above 10 kHz in my bad ear, although my hearing is normal below 8 kHz. It's a steep decrease from 9 kHz.

Maybe FX-322 can help me with my hearing and then I could try Lenire to solve my tinnitus.