Low-Level Laser Therapy (LLLT) for Tinnitus — Experiences (Dr. Wilden, etc.)

#391
dboy said:
Sorry for delay, must have missed the alert about this post. No, not noticed any difference yet. Not sure I've got the technique/positioning right for behind the ears. I tried it a couple of times, but needing to hold the lasers in position gets hard 'cos I got joint problems in my elbows at the moment. Didn't get the instant sound changes that you and Fernando reported.

So I've just been doing 2 lots of 45 mins a day in the ear. Sometimes 3 lots. I've started using a headband to adjust the position of the earpieces (pointing back and down), which is causing a bit of minor soreness, but bearable. Did you mention a while ago that you had a method for adjusting the angle of the earpieces?
Click to expand...
No worries :)

Hmmm thats a bit strange.
I have heard some saying that not all respond to LLLT. But i find that hard to believe.
How many hours have your laser been operating?? It shows in the menu under "timer".
When i do the behind the ear, i obv. make sure there is skin contact and that the laser is pointing directly into the skull and is NOT in and angel, so laserlight wont go anywhere else then inward.
I also point the laser to the edge of the skull right behind the ear (like 1cm max) and adjust the spot and laser every 10min. or so. I move it like 1cm up and down along this skull edge.
I also do like 10min in that hole u have behind the earflip and point the laser upward.

About this elbowproblem.
Lay on the side, so the treated ear point up and then put a pillow on your hip to support the elbow!
I think this may help a great deal!

Anyway...keep it up and try a clinic with high dose as soon as u get the chance!
Just to make sure something is happening.
 
#392
Hi @Nick J. under 'Time Counter' it says 214 hours. I think the laser diodes are supposed to be good for 10,000 hours, so that should be no problem assuming 214 hours is correct (it does seem a low figure). They still emit plenty of light anyway, and make my ears glow very orange when they are in, which amused my little boy when he saw it a few nights ago. ;)

Cheers for the tips! I'll have another go behind the ears using the method you suggest. Holding position for 10mins should be OK, just struggling to manage 45. Did Dr. Wilden recommend doing it this way? I did not get any instructions with the laser I bought, so not sure if I am missing any guidance.
 
#393
dboy said:
Hi @Nick J. under 'Time Counter' it says 214 hours. I think the laser diodes are supposed to be good for 10,000 hours, so that should be no problem assuming 214 hours is correct (it does seem a low figure). They still emit plenty of light anyway, and make my ears glow very orange when they are in, which amused my little boy when he saw it a few nights ago. ;)

Cheers for the tips! I'll have another go behind the ears using the method you suggest. Holding position for 10mins should be OK, just struggling to manage 45. Did Dr. Wilden recommend doing it this way? I did not get any instructions with the laser I bought, so not sure if I am missing any guidance.
Click to expand...
Ah yes...time counter it is!!
I have used mine ALOT since the 21. Of October and it says 63 hours!
So previous owner could still have been using it for more then 6month with "normal use" (35min. 5 days a week)
So i wouldent doubt that the number is correct and yet its still a very low number! So plenty of life left in it like u point out and thats good news.

Yes it was Wilden who told me this and also instructed me in how to do it.
But i just got the feeling that i should mix it up like how i felt like doing on the day of treatment from talking with him.
Some days i dont have the energy to do behind the ears for a full 40min. Which is my treatment a day now.
So i might just do 30-40min. Inside the ears on my back relaxing and then finishing off with only 10min. Or how long i feel like, behind the ear that day.
Cuz i dont really enjoy doing it, since u put on alot of stress on your shoulder and fingers.
But i get the best respond from my ears when i treat behind. So thats why i keep doing it from time to time.

About the adjustmend to make the laser point back and down....
The thing i found out, was just that when the rubber on the diodes gets warm after a few minutes, i can adjust the earplugs in my ears, so the pretty much stay like i want them to, when im on my back.
But u have to twist and turn them alot yourself, to find out how this works on u and maybe it doesn't, since we are not build the same.
But try it out atleast.
 
#394
Thanks @Nick J. for all that useful info. I'm thinking my tinnitus is maybe a little louder or more shrill the last couple of days, although I have not done anything that might cause a spike. Sometimes it just goes that way, although of course I am hoping that the laser effect is starting to kick in - maybe after I adjusted the angle of the earpiece using the headband. By the way, my earpieces do not have rubber on, only metal (old style I guess). I think rubber would be helpful to keep them in position as the metal tends to slide a little if not positioned firmly.

Anyway, fingers crossed. I am still undecided about whether it is best to treat continuously or do 5 days on, 2 days off. I had to take a break last weekend as we had guests for the weekend, and I only managed one treatment yesterday with various things going on. So life seems to be suggesting the answer to this question for me, although after Xmas should be calmer. Did you come to any conclusion about whether breaks are a good idea?

And by the way, how is your tinnitus doing now? Are you still getting improvements?
 
#395
Hi,

I'm new here and i suffer from hyperacusis and tinnitus and i think that LLLT is the best way to treat our inner ear problem.Actually i'm shared between purchasing Combilaser or irradia :)

Peace
 
#396
Hi @Aaron beck, welcome to Tinnitus Talk. I hope you let us know how you get on if you do purchase a laser. There was some talk a page or two ago about a cheaper and higher powered laser that could be bought from China. Maybe @FERNANDO GIL has bought one and can report back. I think he was considering it if I remember right?
 
#399
dboy said:
By the way, my earpieces do not have rubber on, only metal (old style I guess). I think rubber would be helpful to keep them in position as the metal tends to slide a little if not positioned firmly.
Click to expand...
I told u right after u bought the MLS, that u should buy the rubber peices for the diodes!
Its the same rubber u find on earplugs used for phones and ipods!
These can be changed when the get filthy and the former owner obv. dident wanted to share his earwax with u, but then forgot to tell u to buy some new ones yourself i guees ;)

dboy said:
Did you come to any conclusion about whether breaks are a good idea?
Click to expand...
Not really...right now im doing breaks myself, just to make sure i dont keep doing no break for 6month and then it turns out all treatment is wasted due to overtreatment.
So im kind of mixing it up.
But me and Fernando have been discussing this alot lately and with no 100% conclusion, other then breaks from time to time is good, so u get a feeling for how your T is when its not beeing stressed from LLLT.
Cuz my T is always high when i treat and goes down a bit on breaks.
Also when treating like frosen shoulder with LLLT, u also need breaks between treatment for the shoulder to heal optimal. So maybe the earcells need the same..im not sure!
So i do breaks, but keep them at a minimum...like once a week.
So the natural breaks u have is perfectly fine i think.

dboy said:
And by the way, how is your tinnitus doing now? Are you still getting improvements?
Click to expand...
Its really hard to say, cuz until two weeks ago, i used betaserc to keep the T down and now i use some pills called "clear tinnitus" and the seems to work.
The do the same as betaserc, but are natural ingredience and therefore better imo on the overall health!
Cuz im gonna take this junk 2-3 month still and dont want any nasty sideeffects.
But my recent audiogram dident show improvement since ibiza with Wilden!
But it might take longer before u can see any improvement.
So im just gonna keep treating.
In a few days im going to Norway for the same insane high dose Fernando got and im pretty sure that is gonna show on my next audiogram!
But im def feel better overall since i started doing LLLT...no doubt!
 
#400
Aaron beck said:
Hi,

I'm new here and i suffer from hyperacusis and tinnitus and i think that LLLT is the best way to treat our inner ear problem.Actually i'm shared between purchasing Combilaser or irradia :)

Peace
Click to expand...
Hi and welcome!
Im pretty sure u will benefit from the LLLT if u buy one of those high powered lasers.
My oversensitivity to specific noises went away after doing LLLT.
And some of the sounds in my ear are also gone or reduced to a minimum and only turns up sometimes during treatment, which is actually not a bad sign!
So good luck
 
#403
dboy said:
@Nick J. Is this the sort of thing you mean? I do not use earbuds so not very familiar. I misunderstood before I think.

http://www.amazon.co.uk/Replacement-headphones-MDR-EX71-MDR-EX35-MDR-EX500-BLACK/dp/B0031TYWTW/ref=sr_1_9?ie=UTF8&qid=1418588962&sr=8-9&keywords=rubber earpiece
Click to expand...
Yes thats exactly the ones!
But bring the diodes to your local tv/hifi store, so the can find the correct size for u.
Cuz i have no idea of the name of the size u need.
The might also have them in most shops that sell phones.
 
#405
tomm said:
How much are the lasers and how long do you do it for before you see a result?
Click to expand...
Hi @tomm The price are diferente from brand to brand. And of corse the price will depende as well on the power and quality. No science in there.

How long?

That is 1 million dollar question.

Depends, how serious is your T, what frequencies are more "damaged", what type of lifestyle you do, if you were ear plugs all day or not , and so many factors.

For now, all we have now more documentated, is Hansi and Sam blogs, that told there story. I´m trying to bring as much info as I can to this fórum, giving updates as much as possible.

But do not expect to be cured in less than 1/2 years . I started in June is making today 6 months. And felling better, but already had two power treatements, one in Dr Wilden, other in Anne Harila at Norway and in the midlle a stem cell treatment.

The best to do is to start with a power treatmente and buy a laser.

Sheers
 
#407
FERNANDO GIL said:
Hi @tomm The price are diferente from brand to brand. And of corse the price will depende as well on the power and quality. No science in there.

How long?

That is 1 million dollar question.

Depends, how serious is your T, what frequencies are more "damaged", what type of lifestyle you do, if you were ear plugs all day or not , and so many factors.

For now, all we have now more documentated, is Hansi and Sam blogs, that told there story. I´m trying to bring as much info as I can to this fórum, giving updates as much as possible.

But do not expect to be cured in less than 1/2 years . I started in June is making today 6 months. And felling better, but already had two power treatements, one in Dr Wilden, other in Anne Harila at Norway and in the midlle a stem cell treatment.

The best to do is to start with a power treatmente and buy a laser.

Sheers
Click to expand...
Hi Fernando,
Thanks for that - my T is very high frequency, when I try to match it it's t the edge of my hearing (and speakers!) - about 14-15kHz. I've not had an audiologist be able to test that high. The normal kits says I have 20dB or below on the normal scale - no dip.

My T is a 4-5 right now. I can just about manage it at the moment. My lifestyle is pretty quiet - I wear plugs whenever I'm outside the house or office. If you need more info just say.

I guess I want high power right? Can you recommend some legitimate shops please?

I'd consider a trip to Anne or Dr Wilden if it makes a big difference.
 
#408
Hi @tomm
Hi hope to get to that stage, on the really high frequency.
Try a visit to Anne first, and then see what happens, Then you should consider the laser if you feel the LLLT
helps.
If you have a chance try to make a high frequency audiogram before going, so you know exactly
about your future progress. Note that high frequencies take longer to heel.

You can buy a device from Dr Wilden or others brands on the market.
Sheers
 
#409
FERNANDO GIL said:
Hey @Nick J.
How was your day?
I think you started today tretament?
Correct?

Sheers
Click to expand...
Hey mate

Correct...yesterday was my first day of treatment in Norway.
I had the same kind of treatment like u i think. About 5 hours in total, plus necktreatment.
But i had no reaction at all...just like the first day at Wilden.

Today it was about the same amount, but alot of necktreatment also, since i have some problems with it and Anne thinks some of my tinnitus might be related to the problems i have in it.
So i got 1 hour laser in the neck and at the same time some laser behind the ears from a distance. Just like wilden does and it looked similar.
After this i got 3-4hours of laser in one session. 830nm behind the ear and 820nm inside the ear and then 1 hour break.
Then 1 hours of 808nm behind the ear and 650nm inside the ear at the same time on both ears.
After this i couldent take it anymore. I could feel my body saying stop.
Then we finnished of with another kind of laser in the neck for 15min.
So really great powersession :)
My T went up right away when i got the laser in the neck today. Think some of it might have hit behind the ear. But it was not surpose to. The young guy doing it, was only trying to treat my neck while i was laying on my side. But then Anne came and corrected him and turned on one more laser for behind the ears.
I dont know what kind of laser that was.
But my reaction is totally different then back on ibiza treated by Wilden.
Back then on day 2 i had crazy cricketnoises going on and alot of ziiings and biibs.
But this time there was none of that. Only a increase of this rusty, metallic spinning wheel kind of sound i have.
So i think this is a really good sign that i lost those scary sounds.
At the end of the treatment, my T was very low and it have stayed like this the rest of the day.

So im really happy i dicided to go for this treatment. Its the best value for the money u can get anywhere on this kind of treatment. So if im doing another high dose treatment in a few month from now, its deffinently gonna be here!


Any new change in your T these last days??
I assume u have started useing the new laser?
 
#410
Nick J. said:
Hey mate

Correct...yesterday was my first day of treatment in Norway.
I had the same kind of treatment like u i think. About 5 hours in total, plus necktreatment.
But i had no reaction at all...just like the first day at Wilden.

Today it was about the same amount, but alot of necktreatment also, since i have some problems with it and Anne thinks some of my tinnitus might be related to the problems i have in it.
So i got 1 hour laser in the neck and at the same time some laser behind the ears from a distance. Just like wilden does and it looked similar.
After this i got 3-4hours of laser in one session. 830nm behind the ear and 820nm inside the ear and then 1 hour break.
Then 1 hours of 808nm behind the ear and 650nm inside the ear at the same time on both ears.
After this i couldent take it anymore. I could feel my body saying stop.
Then we finnished of with another kind of laser in the neck for 15min.
So really great powersession :)
My T went up right away when i got the laser in the neck today. Think some of it might have hit behind the ear. But it was not surpose to. The young guy doing it, was only trying to treat my neck while i was laying on my side. But then Anne came and corrected him and turned on one more laser for behind the ears.
I dont know what kind of laser that was.
But my reaction is totally different then back on ibiza treated by Wilden.
Back then on day 2 i had crazy cricketnoises going on and alot of ziiings and biibs.
But this time there was none of that. Only a increase of this rusty, metallic spinning wheel kind of sound i have.
So i think this is a really good sign that i lost those scary sounds.
At the end of the treatment, my T was very low and it have stayed like this the rest of the day.

So im really happy i dicided to go for this treatment. Its the best value for the money u can get anywhere on this kind of treatment. So if im doing another high dose treatment in a few month from now, its deffinently gonna be here!


Any new change in your T these last days??
I assume u have started useing the new laser?
Click to expand...
Do they ever put it actually inside your ear canal Nick? Maybe it's possible to ask for it?
 
#411
Hi @Nick J.
Nice you felinng is working.

Since 4/5 days ago I notice all the flactuation is calming down. So I thing the efects of the treatment will last
for about a month.
Last Sunday in China I wake up and T was low, stay like that most part of the day. At night was high
but monday morning was low,really low.
At one part of the day I didn´t notice it at all for a some time.

Come back to Portugal and T was manageble truth out the return trip.
Today I wake up and T was low again.
So I presume results from last treatment in Norway are now showing up.

Concerning the use of the new laser, I didn´t want to use it before talking with Anne.
I had decided to start to use it only by this weekend, so it will be 2 weeks break from LLLT.
Anne said that if I feel is low till next Sunday I should do some extra days for relaxing.

Tomorow I will post pictures of the laser. And will advise if T is still low.

Sheers
 
#413
FERNANDO GIL said:
Hi @Nick J.
Nice you felinng is working.

Since 4/5 days ago I notice all the flactuation is calming down. So I thing the efects of the treatment will last
for about a month.
Last Sunday in China I wake up and T was low, stay like that most part of the day. At night was high
but monday morning was low,really low.
At one part of the day I didn´t notice it at all for a some time.

Come back to Portugal and T was manageble truth out the return trip.
Today I wake up and T was low again.
So I presume results from last treatment in Norway are now showing up.

Concerning the use of the new laser, I didn´t want to use it before talking with Anne.
I had decided to start to use it only by this weekend, so it will be 2 weeks break from LLLT.
Anne said that if I feel is low till next Sunday I should do some extra days for relaxing.

Tomorow I will post pictures of the laser. And will advise if T is still low.

Sheers
Click to expand...
Really interesting!
Do u feel like u have more and more periods with low T then maybe just a month ago?

I might also take a longer break after this. Maybe until newyear.
But will talk to Anne and hear what she thinks.
Cuz now its not gonna be the same with u and me as far as treating goes.
I think i can start sooner with the MLS, since its so low in power and may only be extending the effect of this treatment. I will ask about this tomorrow.

I think i was a little to fast in previous post, by saying the cricket noises were gone.
Cuz i have been sitting in the big livingroom in the guesthouse and was sitting 6-7 meters from the doorway that leads outside and 2 times did some one open thoses doors and that triggert a loud burst of crickets in my right ear.
Really strange, cuz the sound from opening the door is not loud. Maybe its the change in pressure in the air i think! But thats still strange.
Anyway, the cricketnoises i normally had throug out the day is gone atleast...hehe..(knock on wood) maybe i should just shut up! :D

Okay... Talk tomorrow!


Cheers
 
#415
Hi @Nick J.

Nick J. said:
Do u feel like u have more and more periods with low T then maybe just a month ago?
Click to expand...
Yes, just happen yesterday and this morning again.

Been 4 months since I did the SC and in the middle I made a power session at Anne clinic.

So What I notice?
Defenetly my T changed, is now a thinner and flat sound, overal the T is lower that it was when I went to the SC in
September. And from times to times I have periods with no T. In the morning I notice is lower than it was in the past.

Hope all this means the high frequencies are now activated and getting eaed.

Since today I start to use a new laser, Is from a brand called Lucky Laser. I will be making 1 Hour a day 5 days a week. I will do 650 in one ear and 808 at the other, change it from day to day.

I did buy it direct from factory in China and cost is 1500 USD with one probe of each.
Here is there website.
http://www.lucky-laser.com/productview.php?id=LK-COMBI

and photo of the front painel, wich is diferent from the ones in the website. More easier to use. IMG_0134.jpg

All the best

Fernando
 
#416
Hey @FERNANDO GIL

Im really happy on your behalf.
I feel pretty confident your T is gonna be gone if u continue and i know u do!
Must feel good :beeranimation:

I just got home after 5 crazy days with 5 hours LLLT every day.
Got 632nm, 650nm, 808nm, 820nm, 830nm and 904nm every day. So right now its pretty noisy in my ears.
Will take minimum one week off and let my father try my laser.
Talked to Anne about buying your laser in about 2-3 month when iv reach full effect of this treatment and need a new kick.
Might even go back to norway for more. Best treatment of any kind iv tried and Anne is so sweet when u really get to know and talk to her.

I will write u in inbox about other stuff.

FERNANDO GIL said:
. I will be making 1 Hour a day 5 days a week. I will do 650 in one ear and 808 at the other, change it from day to day.
Click to expand...

Did Anne instruct u to do it like this??

By the way... A danish clinic called me in Norway and wanted to test my tinnitus.
The lady told me somthing about one of them were doing some kind of exam about this and needed people.
So i said ok.
Its in january before i go on vacation. So its perfect to see if there is any progress. But i dont have to much hope. I keep telling myself im still only i the beginning stage and cant expect much.
So it is what it is, nomatter what the test says.

Cheers
 
#420
FERNANDO GIL said:
So What I notice?
Defenetly my T changed, is now a thinner and flat sound, overal the T is lower that it was when I went to the SC in
Click to expand...

When u say your T is getting more flat, what exactly do u mean??
Is it like just one steady tone of T that is not changeing in volume??

Cuz in the beginning of my treatment, i had many different sounds going on and T went up and down all the time.
Now most sounds are gone and the spikes in other sounds i have is very short and before going to Norway, i basicly just had one steady sound in my ears. Lowest in the morning and felt higher during the night.
So that could possible be the same, if thats what u mean by flat.
I know Hansi also talked about this. I just wasent sure what it ment.
 

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