Solsaem Clinic (Dr. Minbo Shim) Experience

[JohnAdams]

Here is my ultimate opinion about this:

I have improved tremendously since this treatment but I have not been cured. There is a critical lack of peer reviewed third party data about this specific treatment, but that doesn't mean it's not effective, it just means that it hasn't been proven out through establishment sanctioned trials. The components of bone marrow and PRP are laden with things that have been proven, or are being investigated as being able to improve hearing and nephropathy. This includes IGF-1, BDNF, EGF, etc. It is expensive. Dr. Shim does not guarantee anything. He has visited and learned from the Heller Lab at Stanford University, where they discovered that hearing regeneration in mammals is even possible in the first place. If he was a provable medical fraud the South Korean government would have shut him down and prosecuted him, just like America or Europe, he would be in jail. South Korea is an extremely prosperous first world nation with very strict laws, such as prohibitions against pornography, drugs etc. He also uses PRP to regenerate olfactory sensation, and that is backed up by scientific peer reviewed publications, that were published years after he started treating it with PRP. The stem cells in your nose and ear are both LGR5+. FX-322 has improved hearing and it too works on LGR5+ stem cells.

I am am not making any unsubstantiated claims here and nobody else can actually help us. I am probably the most educated person about biology in this discussion. If anyone else with an accredited degree in medical science wants to jump into this discussion, please do. I have a bachelor's degree in Biomedical Engineering Technology. If you can't debate the science behind any of this, then hold your tongue. If anyone wants to have this treatment, then go for it. I experienced improvement. Glenn did not. Neither of us showed any improvement on our audiograms. Which it really should have. I implore all of you to apply the same scrutiny as you apply to this to Neuromod or else go shove it.

I'm 100% that others should try this. I want this to be tested more.

 

[Allan Mcmillan]

You should try other stuff before, that's my humble opinion.

JohnAdams, it seems like curcumin is working like a charm for you. And from what I've read on the forum it actually looks like it has more impact than Dr. Shim's therapy?
Also I am not sure you had a lot of improvement from Dr. Shim's therapy, same for GlennAz, right?

I would keep this stuff for a last chance treatment.
If you are going to do it anyway, I wish that it will work for you and gives you a lot of comfort, or even complete silence.

Keep us updated man.

Thanks but I've tried many things since the onset of my tinnitus and it only seemed to get worse. I've tried LLLT, magnesium, niacel, craniosacral therapy, turmeric and curcumin, carnivore diet and fasting, ginkgo biloba and a lot more.

 

[Earing]

It was so bad before that I couldn't even play with my son or do the dishes. Now it is only triggered when metal clangs loudly. I'd say it has reduced to about 1% or less than what it was.

I have experienced major reductions in hyperacusis in the last 4 months or so. I have been taking the usual recommended vitamins, but also I have stopped exposing my ears to anything that can cause damage. I wear earplugs religiously and now know that 30dB NRR means 11.5dB reduction not 30. I was relying on 20dB musician's plugs which only give 6.5dB reduction. Not much when playing beside a drummer with my guitar amp loud enough to keep up...

 

[Ctw]

I don't know, seems like I have. I was on curcumin before I went to Korea and although it was helping, and even taking me to near silence sometimes, I was never experiencing nearly as much silence every day as I am now.
It would be nice if I had more proof, which I have none.

Honestly, if someone wants to go and knows the risks, then isn't that good? If they come back and report no improvement then we will have more of an idea about the efficacy.

One thing that puzzles me is that this gets so much scrutiny and Neuromod doesn't. @Allan1967, who has been around and is trusted is saying it is spiking his tinnitus and the last trial's principal investigator works at the company, which seems like a conflict of interest to me. Also, that thread gets policed hard, and this one doesn't.

I don't know... I wish we all had more answers. I want to be healed 100% and play guitar loud and not be afraid of ruining my life all the time.

I was really hoping this would cure me, but it didn't.

I do understand the concern, but people are able and allowed to make their own choices and I'm definitely not misrepresenting my experience at all. It just makes me annoyed to see everyone talking to other people like they are children and need to be warned as if the people warning them somehow know something that they don't.

I think you're pretty awesome...

 

[another sean]

Here is my ultimate opinion about this:

I have improved tremendously since this treatment but I have not been cured. There is a critical lack of peer reviewed third party data about this specific treatment, but that doesn't mean it's not effective, it just means that it hasn't been proven out through establishment sanctioned trials. The components of bone marrow and PRP are laden with things that have been proven, or are being investigated as being able to improve hearing and nephropathy. This includes IGF-1, BDNF, EGF, etc. It is expensive. Dr. Shim does not guarantee anything. He has visited and learned from the Heller Lab at Stanford University, where they discovered that hearing regeneration in mammals is even possible in the first place. If he was a provable medical fraud the South Korean government would have shut him down and prosecuted him, just like America or Europe, he would be in jail. South Korea is an extremely prosperous first world nation with very strict laws, such as prohibitions against pornography, drugs etc. He also uses PRP to regenerate olfactory sensation, and that is backed up by scientific peer reviewed publications, that were published years after he started treating it with PRP. The stem cells in your nose and ear are both LGR5+. FX-322 has improved hearing and it too works on LGR5+ stem cells.

I am am not making any unsubstantiated claims here and nobody else can actually help us. I am probably the most educated person about biology in this discussion. If anyone else with an accredited degree in medical science wants to jump into this discussion, please do. I have a bachelor's degree in Biomedical Engineering Technology. If you can't debate the science behind any of this, then hold your tongue. If anyone wants to have this treatment, then go for it. I experienced improvement. Glenn did not. Neither of us showed any improvement on our audiograms. Which it really should have. I implore all of you to apply the same scrutiny as you apply to this to Neuromod or else go shove it.

I'm 100% that others should try this. I want this to be tested more.

I can't decide if you should change your username to MC Hammer or Thor cause you just threw down he hammer. Yeah boy! "you can shove it"

 

[JohnAdams]

I wear earplugs religiously

I never wear earplugs unless I'm at a noisy restaurant or something. I hate them.

 

[Gabriel]

If he was a provable medical fraud the South Korean government would have shut him down and prosecuted him, just like America or Europe, he would be in jail.

The rules are not the same in South Korea as in USA or Europe. Some things might be legal here and not in USA. Also if he is a fraud, there needs to be complaints, and then years of investigation before he would be shut down. If nobody complains and nobody looks into it, as far as I know, he could do this without the government knowing.

So that doesn't prove anything.

Here is my ultimate opinion about this:
The stem cells in your nose and ear are both LGR5+. FX-322 has improved hearing and it too works on LGR5+ stem cells.

FX-322 is a combination of different molecules which are targeted to activate LGR5+ progenitor cells to differentiate.
So while it works on LGR5+, it doesn't work the same way at all. This is not a scientific argument, this is what we call a shortcut.
Though, LGR5+ alone could still work, or with other molecules, you can't just compare it to FX-322. These are two different things that can have completely different outcomes.

I am probably the most educated person about biology in this discussion. If anyone else with an accredited degree in medical science wants to jump into this discussion, please do. I have a bachelor's degree in Biomedical Engineering Technology.

This is really presumptuous of you... Also this sounds a lot like an argument from authority. I would advise you to stay humble, honestly reading this part really made me grind my gears.
I have what you call in USA an associate degree in medical studies, plus a Master of Science in Engineering, so basically almost two times more academic background than you do, but I am not bragging about it... because I have no interest in doing that.

If you can't debate the science behind any of this, then hold your tongue.

Then you should hold your tongue, because you actually CAN'T debate the science behind any of this.
You don't have access to even 1/10th of the science behind this, all you have is some articles on internet.
You are neither working with the team of Dr. Shim or the team of behind FX-322 or any team that work on stem cells, you don't have the knowledge to debate any of it, and you can't have it, unless you go work with the scientific teams for years and have access to all of their papers and research on that subject...

 

[Gabriel]

I guess I should say thank you for triggering me, because now that I looked more into it, Dr. Shim looks totally like a scam.





This is all on his website.
http://cmclinics.com/category/about-our-clinic/

- The guy didn't even spell "tinnitus" right in the TITLE of his main post
- His certificate of Membership is FAKE, the Korean association of stem cell and tissue regeneration there is no trace of it !
- Have you seen the pros and cons? Using emoji, saying don't rely on hearing aids? Seriously?

I will look more into it, and contact this Rhie Jong Won, so called President of this non-existent association. This guy actually exists, but I think his name was used without him knowing. If this is proven to be fake, everything is fake.

 

[Earing]

I never wear earplugs unless I'm at a noisy restaurant or something. I hate them.

I am always getting hit with some unexpected loud noise. I was in the hospital visiting someone the other day. I went to the washroom. It was a single toilet washroom in a small room. I flushed the toilet and it was so loud. It was like a jet taking off. Etc.

 

[JohnAdams]

- His certificate of Membership is FAKE, the Korean association of stem cell and tissue regeneration there is no trace of it !

WRONG!!!!!!

Here is the organization's website:

http://www.kterms.or.kr/

And Rhie Jong Won was their president as of 2015

He is no longer the president, of this organization, that you said doesn't exist.

http://skhealth.net/doctor-details/193/jong-won-rhie

Do you realize how wonky Koreans translate English??? Even Minbo's English skills aren't the best which is why he has a translator there all the time.

I will look more into it, and contact this Rhie Jong Won, so called President of this non-existent association. This guy actually exists, but I think his name was used without him knowing. If this is proven to be fake, everything is fake.

Yeah, let's see. Let us know. If you're correct then I will have no other choice but to apologize the the entire community.

 

[Allan Mcmillan]

I guess I should say thank you for triggering me, because now that I looked more into it, Dr. Shim looks totally like a scam.

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This is all on his website.
http://cmclinics.com/category/about-our-clinic/

- The guy didn't even spell "tinnitus" right in the TITLE of his main post
- His certificate of Membership is FAKE, the Korean association of stem cell and tissue regeneration there is no trace of it !
- Have you seen the pros and cons? Using emoji, saying don't rely on hearing aids? Seriously?

I will look more into it, and contact this Rhie Jong Won, so called President of this non-existent association. This guy actually exists, but I think his name was used without him knowing. If this is proven to be fake, everything is fake.

JohnAdams's improvements are fake?

 

[Gabriel]

WRONG!!!!!!

Here is the organization's website:

http://www.kterms.or.kr/

Is that a joke?
"Korean Tissue Engineering and Regenerative Medicine Society"
versus
"Korean association of stem cell and tissue regeneration"

Are you kidding me? He just made up the Korean association title from the first one. These are not even the same name.

JohnAdams's improvements are fake?

He said he is not sure about the improvement coming from this clinic, and that he has no proof. As far as we know it could be placebo or just natural improvement or just improvement from other things he is taking.
Or maybe it is from Dr. Shim's clinic.

But from what I see now, seems like this is a really shady clinic.

By the way, did Dr. Shim ask for a particular way of paying him or can you pay him through normal bank payment?

 

[GregCA]

JohnAdams's improvements are fake?

No, they're real (I assume he's not lying), but there is no proof that his improvements are related to his treatment in Korea. It could simply be the passing of time, since most people see improvements in their tinnitus by simply doing nothing. Or it could be all the other things he's been doing at the same time. That's why reputable researchers and doctors do clinical studies and compare their results against a control group and placebo group. They also get their results peer reviewed.

JohnAdams himself doesn't recommend you go:

Don't just up and go. I'm not so sure if my improvements are from using neurotrophics and curcumin, or this, or both.

Well, of course getting another data point from a guinea pig would be helpful, but I think one should know what they're getting into in terms or risk/reward, which is why I suggest to go get second/third/more opinions from doctors before pulling the trigger on this.

 

[JohnAdams]

He just made up the Korean association title from the first one.

Why don't you wait until you get confirmation from Rhie Jongwon before you start lobbing more accusations.

You do realize that these are English phrases that have been translated from Hangul right?

 

[Allan Mcmillan]

By the way, did Dr. Shim ask for a particular way of paying him or can you pay him through normal bank payment?

He asked for a regular bank deposit or a wire to his account.

 

[Gabriel]

Why don't you wait until you get confirmation from Rhie Jongwon before you start lobbing more accusations.

You do realize that these are English phrases that have been translated from Hangul right?

You do realize it's immensely weird they just didn't use the same translation?
Their website is literally KTERMS.org which stand for Korean Tissue Engineering and Regenerative Medicine Society.
But yet they would use a complete different name for an official certificate? They can't just copy paste? Or use the same one as their already-done translation which actually is the name of their website?
Doesn't that ring an alarm?

He asked for a regular bank deposit or a wire to his account.

At least that is one red flag less. You would have a proof of payment which is good.

@GregCA I couldn't more agree with what you wrote. Plus we don't know the long-term effect of this.

This is why I said it was a last chance therapy. But now looking at his unprofessional website and his really weird certificate... I think I would try to be in the FX-322 trial, or try anything else other than Dr. Shim.

 

[Allan Mcmillan]

You do realize it's immensely weird they just didn't use the same translation?
Their website is literally KTERMS.org which stand for Korean Tissue Engineering and Regenerative Medicine Society.
But yet they would use a complete different name for an official certificate? They can't just copy paste? Or use the same one as their already-done translation which actually is the name of their website?
Doesn't that ring an alarm?

At least that is one red flag less. You would have a proof of payment which is good.

@GregCA I couldn't more agree with what you wrote. Plus we don't know the long-term effect of this.
This is why I said it was a last chance therapy. But now looking at his unprofessional website and his really weird certificate... I think I would try to be in FX-322 test, or try anything else than Dr. Shim.

Thanks for your concerns. You're absolutely right about that but in his defense that website is more of a personal blog. His corporate/clinic address is here:

https://www.heliocityclinic.com/

Plus I received a formal invoice for the procedure.

 

[Gabriel]

https://www.heliocityclinic.com/?p=ear

On his website, he talks about 7 different therapies for tinnitus, and the stem cells only come in 7th position... ok why not.

1. Medication (improving blood circulation)
2. Stimulation Therapy (sensory nerve is stimulated)
3. Sound Therapy (TRT)
4. Steroid Therapy
5. Brain magnetic charges (rTMS)
6. Hearing aids, cochlear implants, surgery -> funny when you know he said on his website I quote "don't rely on the hearing aids, it will destroy your cochlea, hearing organ"
7. Latest Research Methods (Stem cell)

And in this last part he says I quote "In Japan, research is being conducted on dedifferentiated stem cells and growth factors for the treatment of hearing loss, and human embryonic stem cells are also studied at Stanford University"

He doesn't talk about him or his research... because there is none?
At least he doesn't lie about the fact that research is BEING conducted.

Basically this is an experimental therapy, he has more likely done no studies himself, has no double blind studies.

So this is like being in the trial of FX-322 except this is not a trial and it costs you a lot of money and doesn't advance the field of research, and the guy is all alone, not with a team of scientists, there is no paper written on this either.

By the way I tried to look out for any papers with his name, 0 results. Seems like he is not a researcher himself and doesn't publish anything.

 

[Earing]

I hope the Minbo treatment doesn't mess with the cells FX-322 uses. It would suck if Minbo doesn't work and in a couple of years FX-322 fails because of the Minbo experiment.

 

[Tinnitard]

If you can, hold out for FX-322.

So when's that then?

I don't want to keep losing more hearing with time!

 

[Earing]

So when's that then?

I don't want to keep losing more hearing with time!

https://www.tinnitustalk.com/threads/frequency-therapeutics-—-hearing-loss-regeneration.18889/

It's a drug in clinical trial that regrows the hearing hair cells. It is promising to regenerate hearing. A side effect may be curing tinnitus.

 

[Gabriel]

So when's that then?

I don't want to keep losing more hearing with time!

Apart from the normal loss of hearing with age, which is really slow, you won't really lose more hearing like that. Plus if you are just concerned about hearing loss and not tinnitus, hearing aids already exist for that.

FX-322 is not just for hearing loss but for curing tinnitus

If I were you @Allan Mcmillan I would look into being part of the phase 2 trial of FX-322.

You have the contact details here https://www.frequencytx.com/contact/index.php
I guess they are/will be enrolling a lot of people for phase II.

 

[Daniel Lion]

This thread will never die, PRP remains contentious for many of its proposed treatments, especially for arthritis. Cosmetic skin treatments, athletes, and some dentists claim lots of success.

A few points.
I have no educational background in science, so I wrote Dr. Stephen Heller at Stanford University about this treatment and Dr. Shim. He said that Dr. Shim visited but received no special training or "secrets". He also said there is no scientific foundation for the efficacy of this treatment.

Make of that what you will.

Next, some members have said why aren't there trials? People responded that it would take millions of dollars etc... wrong. Dr. Silverstein in Sarasota Florida who has taught at Harvard and has many times spoken at ontological meetings has pioneered a few new techniques, like Dr. Shim, but the difference is that all of his results he makes public. He has pioneered a surgery for severe hyperacusis, did a trial that is public knowledge with national institute of health, and is completely transparent. He also vets and interviews people extensively to see if they would be a good candidate for the treatment. All surgical results are recorded, nothing is hidden. If you are not appropriate, he will not take your money.

The latter is essentially my issue with Dr. Shim, who I think and know is a super skilled ENT. He should publish results, and advise patients, like GlennAz for example, if they are good candidates for the surgery and if they would benefit from the surgery based on prior results. He does not need to conduct an expensive clinical trial, he needs merely to enter the data from each operation, make that public, and then other doctors and patients can learn from this evidence. I have seen audiograms posted on his website, but I have always thought it would be more transparent and helpful to post the good and the bad so that people could make informed decisions. I really think Dr. Silverstein is a good example of how a maverick and revolutionary ENT should do things. Even Dr. Silverstein admits openly that the medical community is resistant to change, much of what Dr. Shim is up against, bu Dr. Shim I think gives little for the medical community at large to go on.

PRP remains uncharted for so many things. Each clinic should record results, techniques and timing with the center fugue, etc.
The pricing is all over the place, but is not out of hand, considering the skill and talent to do 70 plus intratympanic injections successfully and not screw things up, that takes skill, no doubt.

I am priced out, I certainly have severely bad hearing loss and bad tinnitus... I struggle with both and the roller coaster of hyperacusis. But, if I won the lottery tomorrow, I would be hesitant on the lack of transparency. I think all post operation information should be made public and a statistical analysis could be done quite easily.

Whoever does go to Korea, I wish you great luck and hope you can be freed from this dreadful illness.

Please do an independent audiogram in your home country before and say three to six months after, so we can at least start our own study for the forum.

My kids are running around, a cartoon is going, so I am a little distracted...

Have I made any sense?

 

[all to gain]

Update:

I'm starting this treatment on September 1st and will be spending two weeks in Seoul. I understand that this might not be a complete cure for tinnitus but he has had cases of people going on remission in the past so there's hope. Besides a 50% improvement would still justify the cost in my opinion.

Hi Allan,

So did you have the treatment? Any updates?

Hope all is well!

 

[Allan Mcmillan]

Hi Allan,

So did you have the treatment? Any updates?

Hope all is well!

Regarding that, I've decided to postpone going to Seoul until around late October or November to see whether my tinnitus would improve by itself and if not I'll pack my bags and head over there.

 

[Tinnitard]

So I am in Seoul and had my first treatment with Dr Shim.

Let's see what happens.

I've got noise induced hearing loss from working and playing piano in noisy environments.

My tinnitus is frankly insane with tones from low humming below 100 Hz to hissing at 10 kHz with stuff inbetween.

When my tinnitus first started I immediately stopped doing noisy stuff and it was only in the right ear with a steady G beep. After six months the left ear started too.

18 months down the line I've got ringing, hissing, humming and beeping!

I've also discovered that avoiding loud sounds whilst leading a normal working life is nearly impossible.

 

[JohnAdams]

So I am in Seoul and had my first treatment with Dr Shim.

Let's see what happens.

I've got noise induced hearing loss from working and playing piano in noisy environments.

My tinnitus is frankly insane with tones from low humming below 100 Hz to hissing at 10 kHz with stuff inbetween.

When my tinnitus first started I immediately stopped doing noisy stuff and it was only in the right ear with a steady G beep. After six months the left ear started too.

18 months down the line I've got ringing, hissing, humming and beeping!

I've also discovered that avoiding loud sounds whilst leading a normal working life is nearly impossible.

Oh wow. Seriously, wear earplugs when you ride the train. Also, you should try a pizza place called Pizza School. They are everywhere. Definitely try some real Korean food too. There are these restaurants called kimbap cheonguks all over the place. Definitely try some of those. They serve stuff like bulgogi and stuff. I'm sure Minbo has told you to eat plenty of meat.

Also, know it all loser attack incoming in 3.... 2..... 1.....

 

[Tinnitard]

Oh wow. Seriously, wear earplugs when you ride the train. Also, you should try a pizza place called Pizza School. They are everywhere. Definitely try some real Korean food too. There are these restaurants called kimbap cheonguks all over the place. Definitely try some of those. They serve stuff like bulgogi and stuff. I'm sure Minbo has told you to eat plenty of meat.

Also, know it all loser attack incoming in 3.... 2..... 1.....

Not worried what other people think.

Their opinions are exactly that, their opinions.

At least I feel like I'm doing something.

I've tried fasting (like you wouldn't believe) and a ketogenic diet too.

That was going well until further noise exposures brought more tinnitus and more tones.

Because of playing the piano (and the organ and guitar), I haven't got a classic NIHL 4 kHz notch.

Instead it's all over the place because the instruments are tuned and have a large range.

Perhaps those deep near piano busting Beethoven chords weren't such a great idea after all!

 

[another sean]

So I am in Seoul and had my first treatment with Dr Shim.

Let's see what happens.

I've got noise induced hearing loss from working and playing piano in noisy environments.

My tinnitus is frankly insane with tones from low humming below 100 Hz to hissing at 10 kHz with stuff inbetween.

When my tinnitus first started I immediately stopped doing noisy stuff and it was only in the right ear with a steady G beep. After six months the left ear started too.

18 months down the line I've got ringing, hissing, humming and beeping!

I've also discovered that avoiding loud sounds whilst leading a normal working life is nearly impossible.

That's great to hear. May I ask what is your age, or age range? Are you in your 20's, 30's, 40's?

I ask because according to the doctor, age is a contributing factor for success and it will be helpful data when you share you final results in few months.

 

[Tinnitard]

I am 39.

Tinnitus started in Feb 2018.

I taught piano professionally in a noisy environment for 2 years. That's what totally messed my ears up.

I've since changed professions and stopped all live performance.