When to Run for the Hills in Noisy Environments?

[Tanni]

You are right, nothing is certain. This has to do with Probabilities. Anecdotal reports establish that something has the potential to cause louder T. If you do that activity, you are increasing the chance that your T will get louder. If you learn from the anecdotal report [by the way, we are not talking about one person making a post on this forum sometime over the past 10 years, we are talking about the same patterns being reported on a weekly (and sometimes on a daily) basis] you could abstain from the activity, reducing the probability of giving debilitating T to yourself.

I agree that the vast majority of spikes end up being temporary. However, those spikes can't be promoting healing. It is likely that they are interfering with healing. It seems to me that the spikes for a person with T are analogous to pain for a person with a broken arm. Both are signals from the body. If someone breaks an arm and feels pain after doing an activity that used to be ok for them, they will likely stop. The pain will eventually subside. However, if you keep doing something that results in your broken arm hurting, Eventually you will likely end up totally messing up your arm.

If you keep giving yourself temporary spikes, it is possible that eventually you might end up with a permanent spike. In other words it is possible that, either every time you get a spike, there is a small chance that the spike is permanent, so the probability that at least one of X spikes is permanent grows with X. Or every time you get a spike, the probability that it will be permanent is higher.

I can't disagree with anything you have written . Particularly as you have clarified that you are not taking into account any isolated instances. I think that the advice you give people (myself included) has always been very measured, and your message - that we can recover somewhat if we 'rest' our ears and let them heal - is absolutely right.

The problem with anecdotal evidence for me is that because of the anxiety caused by this condition, a person often loses all objectivity and the ability to recognise correlation from causation. And if one person believes that they have experienced a spike caused by an everyday occurrence (a motorbike passing, for instance) then that will lead others to question whether the same thing may have caused their spike as well. And then it looks like everyone is experiencing a spike from passing motorbikes. Even worse, people become so anxious about passing motorbikes that when one does pass them, their anxiety actually causes a spike.

I'm all for protection around loud noises, but just don't want people to develop a fear of everyday noises, because I think that can be counter-intuitive and there is simply no way of avoiding them.

 

[Jack Straw]

But as our Tinnitus is so individual to us, how might anecdotal reports from someone else help? We all have different triggers, and if someone new to Tinnitus were to avoid them all in case one applied to her, they would end up unable to live a decent life.

I personally think that it's the fear of a permanent increase that makes everyone so dependant on anecdotal reports. If we could establish that mostly spikes are temporary (and Bill Bauer has great info on this) people would be more comfortable simply trying things out for themselves.

Winner Winner Chicken Dinner.

 

[Bill Bauer]

Even worse, people become so anxious about passing motorbikes that when one does pass them, their anxiety actually causes a spike.

Anxiety is unlikely to cause a new tone or a spike that lasts for over a month...

just don't want people to develop a fear of everyday noises

One should be careful around everyday noises, and if one of those noises ends up causing a serious problem, then it would make sense to try to avoid being exposed to that noise (at least for the next year or two, while one is healing).

Winner Winner Chicken Dinner.

Did you read my reply to that message?

 

[Flamingo1]

One should be careful around everyday noises, and if one of those noises ends up causing a serious problem, then it would make sense to try to avoid being exposed to that noise (at least for the next year or two, while one is healing).

Why do you keep mentioning "healing?" It is my understanding that one the nerves and hair cells are damaged, that's it. There is no reversal.

 

[Tanni]

Why do you keep mentioning "healing?" It is my understanding that one the nerves and hair cells are damaged, that's it. There is no reversal.

This is the interesting part for me. If most people's Tinnitus gets better over time, is that due to perception or actual recovery? Why does some people's Tinnitus steadily disappear, or spontaneously disappear one day? If Tinnitus is caused by damaged ears then that doesn't make sense, because hair cells don't recover, but if it's due to misfiring signals in the brain brought on by an acoustic trauma, then that's another matter...

Maybe it's caused by both those things, depending on the type you have.

Not enough is known about Tinnitus - it appears to act completely randomly, and this understandably leads us all to search for patterns to gain some control. But there may very well not be a pattern to it at all.

 

[Bill Bauer]

Why do you keep mentioning "healing?" It is my understanding that one the nerves and hair cells are damaged, that's it. There is no reversal.

T tends to fade for a large fraction (the majority?) of the sufferers. I refer to this fading as "healing".

If most people's Tinnitus gets better over time, is that due to perception or actual recovery?

It is definitely not just perception. People report hearing T over a car driving on a busy highway, and then the same people report Not hearing it over the sound of the fridge.

 

[Tanni]

T tends to fade for a large fraction (the majority?) of the sufferers. I refer to this fading as "healing".

It is definitely not just perception. People report hearing T over a car driving on a busy highway, and then the same people report Not hearing it over the sound of the fridge.

You don't feel that the brain de-prioritises the sound over time? And that when people become anxious, it re-prioritises it, causing 'spikes'.

I'm not saying that this is what I believe, btw. I know people who have woken up one day and it is gone, no explanation. But I feel it could explain 'fading' for some.

 

[Bill Bauer]

You don't feel that the brain de-prioritises the sound over time?

Habituation does happen. Initially one has loud T, after T fades and gets quieter, one is still Bothered by the quiet T. As months and years go by, eventually one stops noticing the quiet T. Perhaps the same process happens even to loud T (for Some people), but they know that their T is loud - they are not under an illusion that it is quiet.

In other words, just because you stop noticing the sound of an air conditioner, doesn't mean that you can't judge the volume level of that sound, when you try to do so.

 

[Daniel Lion]

Has anyone been to Jamaica? Beautiful country, fantastic people, amazing music, and loud like you wouldn't believe.

I live in Laos, Laos is like Jamaica, it's noisy as hell, glass shaking, walls shaking, parties all the time. One of the most laid back places on earth, getting shitfaced in the morning is totally acceptable, after giving arms to the monks of course. It's so noisy people....wow.....i got to run to the hills but my kids are in school here. I've gotten real good about protecting myself, and plan to get even better. This place is noisy, it's just part of the culture. If I ever have the money, I am off to the countryside, where I can listen to the birds, crickets, and my tinnitus of course.

 

[Striveon]

I was exposed to a 75-80 decibels this weekend at a party while wearing 27dB musician's ear plugs, and the next day to some very loud music in a department store (??!) with no plugs. My bad ear now feels full but there has been no spike in my tinnitus.... yet. This has proven to me that my fear of noise is valid. Unfortunately, I live in a place that believes noise sells and the louder the better.

Did your tinnitus end up spiking or did it subside?

 

[Bill Bauer]

I live in Laos

Were you and your ancestors born in Laos?

 

[Flamingo1]

Did your tinnitus end up spiking or did it subside?

It subsided after a week or so I'm back to baseline.

 

[Striveon]

It subsided after a week or so I'm back to baseline.

Yaaaay!! I'm glad to hear!!! I had a bad experience yesterday and this gives me hope! I hope I'm lucky like you!

 

[Flamingo1]

Yaaaay!! I'm glad to hear!!! I had a bad experience yesterday and this gives me hope! I hope I'm lucky like you!

What happened and what are your symptoms now?

 

[Daniel Lion]

Were you and your ancestors born in Laos?

Nope... Warsaw Poland, Germany, Lithuania, Russia... Long story how I ended up in Laos... but glad we left my ancestral homes... I am an American citizen... just living abroad... long story... but a good one.

 

[Striveon]

What happened and what are your symptoms now?

I'm a university student, my classroom is small size and has 22 students. The teacher said, turn to your partners and discuss your answers. It got so loud that I couldn't hear my partner. After two minutes I left. Tinnitus sounds louder, I hope it's my anxiety, lack of sleep, and ear plug usage (I didn't use it in class) later on in the day. What do you think ? Be honest... :/

 

[Flamingo1]

I'm a university student, my classroom is small size and has 22 students. The teacher said, turn to your partners and discuss your answers. It got so loud that I couldn't hear my partner. After two minutes I left. Tinnitus sounds louder, I hope it's my anxiety, lack of sleep, and ear plug usage (I didn't use it in class) later on in the day. What do you think ? Be honest... :/

I think it's just a temporary flare-up like mine was. You did the right thing by leaving since you did not have earplugs. It's interesting that you too are affected by noise levels less than 80 decibels (I can't imagine the classroom was above 80 dBs.) That puts another nail in the argument that experiencing tinnitus related symptoms with sound levels less than what OSHA determines safe is a psychological mirage or simply due to ear wax @Ed209 @david c

 

[Striveon]

I think it's just a temporary flare-up like mine was. You did the right thing by leaving since you did not have earplugs. It's interesting that you too are affected by noise levels less than 80 decibels (I can't imagine the classroom was above 80 dBs.) That puts another nail in the argument that experiencing tinnitus related symptoms with sound levels less than what OSHA determines safe is a psychological mirage or simply due to ear wax @Ed209 @david c

I'm not even sure anymore I woke up to louder tinnitus!!! God I am so scared!!

 

[Flamingo1]

I'm not even sure anymore I woke up to louder tinnitus!!! God I am so scared!!

How long ago was this?

 

[Striveon]

How long ago was this?

This happened Friday morning

 

[Flamingo1]

This happened Friday morning

It's way too early. My spike didn't start getting better for at least a week. Give it time. In the meantime relax and maybe take some supplements like magnesium.

 

[Amv]

Spikes can last 3 or 6 months (some people even a bit more), so just take it easy, take NAC, Magnesium, go to visit an ENT to see if Prednisone can help you and give it time!

 

[Mi1]

Yes, it did! And the fullness has about 90% cleared up.

is it still gone, the fullness?