2020 US Presidential Election

[Christiaan]

Trump warned of severe consequences if the Taliban acted up, as a condition of the withdrawal.

Meanwhile, the only thing Hidin' Biden will tell the Taliban is "C'mon, man". The Taliban know this, hence why they swiftly took over Afghanistan.

Trump has said many things that are in conflict with one another, like keeping or bringing the troops home. It's maybe one of Biden's worst geopolitical mistakes, but you can also say that Trump was the one who initially ordered the withdrawal of American troops. So this is another example of Trumpian & Republican hypocrisy that we're seeing (and I'm already in the not-surprised mood when it comes to Republican shenanigans).

Trump 'to order further troop withdrawal' from Afghanistan and Iraq (11/16/2020)

''The US military expects President Donald Trump to order a further withdrawal of troops from Afghanistan and Iraq, according to defence officials quoted by US media.''

''Those in Afghanistan will be cut from about 5,000 down to 2,500 by mid-January, officials said. In Iraq they will be reduced from 3,000 to 2,500.President Trump has previously said he wants "all" troops home by Christmas.''

''The withdrawal should be finished by 15 January, US media reported, just days before Mr Biden's inauguration as president. But Mr Trump's reported plan is facing rare criticism from a fellow Republican - Senate leader Mitch McConnell, who warned militants would "love" the idea.''

''Speaking on the floor of the upper chamber on Monday, the Kentucky senator said: "We're playing a limited - limited - but important role in defending American national security and American interests against terrorists who would like nothing more than for the most powerful force for good in the world to simply pick up our ball and go home. ''

"They would love that."

''President Trump has long called for US troops to come home and has criticised US military interventions for being costly and ineffective.''

''Military leaders were told at the weekend about the planned withdrawals, according to officials quoted by the Associated Press news agency. An executive order is being drawn up but has not yet been sent to commanders, they added.''

''In September, the Pentagon announced it was to withdraw more than a third of its troops from Iraq within weeks - from about 5,200 to 3,000. At the time, top US Middle East commander Gen Kenneth McKenzie said those remaining would continue to advise and assist Iraqi security forces in "rooting out the final remnants" of the jihadist group Islamic State (IS).''

(...)

''The US started withdrawing troops from Afghanistan earlier this year as part of a deal with the Taliban aimed at securing peace in the country.''

''Drawing back troops was a condition of a historic accord signed by the US and the militants on 29 February. However, military chiefs, including Gen McKenzie, have warned in the past that peace negotiations between the Taliban and Afghan authorities could be undermined by a hasty US withdrawal.''

 

[Luman]

I wish we had a socialist government! Our right wing government unfortunately picks on the poor and minorities, as has been the case in the recent social benefits affair (Toeslagen Affaire). People, some of them parents, committed suicide because of the way they were harshly treated (e.g. ethnic profiling) by the national tax authorities. A socialist government would not have been perfect, but it would not have degraded people to the ''welfare queen'' fallacy that is often propagated by right wing ''intellectuals'' and politicians.

I'd like to invite you to visit Holland again. I don't know why being a full-blooded white person has something to do with our welfare, but we're generally a multicultural society (I'm also a product of that society, as I am about 1/2 Dutch), and the way we keep some things like health care affordable , is the fact that EVERYONE pays a limited amount to have health coverage. Everyone paying their fair share is what makes health care affordable. It would be similar to a Medicare for all system, but Obama unfortunately didn't even come close with his healthcare policies. Maybe not for your sake, but I hope Joe Biden will do a better job at fulfilling the single payer promise and help the people who are really struggling at the moment.

I am sorry for the problems in your country, but it looked damn nice to me when I visited Amsterdam and Utrecht some 26 years ago.

Joe Biden is an ass who is incapable of doing anything correctly - witness what is going on in Afghanistan. He opened our borders, to allow almost a million undocumented, unvaccinated aliens in. He destroys everything he gets his hands on.

Your nation is about 5% the size of the United States. To compare these countries is fine, but they are very, very different.

Are you aware of Wesley Cook, AKA Mumia Abu-Jamal, who was convicted of murdering a Philadelphia police officer in 1981? Some of his Dutch supporters were demonstrating, to demand his release from prison, when I visited. He was going to be executed, but this unfortunately was rescinded. Are you among those who think he is innocent?

 

[Luman]

And therefore the neighbouring countries and ultimately Europe will have to receive millions of Afghan refugees. We hope the US takes its fair share of refugees, since all this mess was caused by the US.

This "mess" was caused by Afghanistan, which refused to turn over the terrorist bin laden to the United States, after the attacks of 9/11. Had they complied, and handed him over, there would have been no war or occupation.

I guarantee that if we take Afghani refugees, they will wish they had stayed in their own country. If Europe wants them, they can have 'em all.

CNN is not Fox News, and they are ripping into Biden - not just for his handling of Afghanistan, but other major issues as well. The world now sees that he is "Incompetent".

Those who supported his election, as well as everybody else, must now deal with the disastrous results of his presidency.

 

[Juan]

Are you saying that you support the Taliban taking control of Afghanistan?

Of course not. It is your government who left the country at the mercy of the Taliban. And also the US who created this mess in Afghanistan, and also in Irak.

All these wars started by Busch backfired in Europe, resulting in terrorist attacks in London and Madrid.

I guarantee that if we take Afghani refugees, they will wish they had stayed in their own country. If Europe wants them, they can have 'em all.

No one wants refugees. That's why I said that, since the US started the war and created the whole mess, the US should take the refugees.

 

[Luman]

Of course not. It is your government who left the country at the mercy of the Taliban. And also the US who created this mess in Afghanistan, and also in Irak.

All these wars started by Busch backfired in Europe, resulting in terrorist attacks in London and Madrid.

No one wants refugees. That's why I said that, since the US started the war and created the whole mess, the US should take the refugees.

BIDEN left the country "at the mercy of the Taliban"/

What do you think of 9/11, were you there? I was .7 mile away on that day. Bin Laden did that to us, under the protection of Al Quida and the Taliban. The government of Afghanistan refused to turn him over, which would have avoided the war. It was their own fault. The current crisis is due to the election of a man with dementia, who is incompetent to lead this country, and he should be impeached.

 

[Lilah]

Trump has said many things that are in conflict with one another, like keeping or bringing the troops home. It's maybe one of Biden's worst geopolitical mistakes, but you can also say that Trump was the one who initially ordered the withdrawal of American troops. So this is another example of Trumpian & Republican hypocrisy that we're seeing (and I'm already in the not-surprised mood when it comes to Republican shenanigans).

Trump 'to order further troop withdrawal' from Afghanistan and Iraq (11/16/2020)

''The US military expects President Donald Trump to order a further withdrawal of troops from Afghanistan and Iraq, according to defence officials quoted by US media.''

''Those in Afghanistan will be cut from about 5,000 down to 2,500 by mid-January, officials said. In Iraq they will be reduced from 3,000 to 2,500.President Trump has previously said he wants "all" troops home by Christmas.''

''The withdrawal should be finished by 15 January, US media reported, just days before Mr Biden's inauguration as president. But Mr Trump's reported plan is facing rare criticism from a fellow Republican - Senate leader Mitch McConnell, who warned militants would "love" the idea.''

''Speaking on the floor of the upper chamber on Monday, the Kentucky senator said: "We're playing a limited - limited - but important role in defending American national security and American interests against terrorists who would like nothing more than for the most powerful force for good in the world to simply pick up our ball and go home. ''

"They would love that."

''President Trump has long called for US troops to come home and has criticised US military interventions for being costly and ineffective.''

''Military leaders were told at the weekend about the planned withdrawals, according to officials quoted by the Associated Press news agency. An executive order is being drawn up but has not yet been sent to commanders, they added.''

''In September, the Pentagon announced it was to withdraw more than a third of its troops from Iraq within weeks - from about 5,200 to 3,000. At the time, top US Middle East commander Gen Kenneth McKenzie said those remaining would continue to advise and assist Iraqi security forces in "rooting out the final remnants" of the jihadist group Islamic State (IS).''

(...)

''The US started withdrawing troops from Afghanistan earlier this year as part of a deal with the Taliban aimed at securing peace in the country.''

''Drawing back troops was a condition of a historic accord signed by the US and the militants on 29 February. However, military chiefs, including Gen McKenzie, have warned in the past that peace negotiations between the Taliban and Afghan authorities could be undermined by a hasty US withdrawal.''

Trump would have removed the troops in a more strategic way. He would have removed the diplomats, government contractors, etc. BEFORE removing the troops.

He would not have turned over the air force base until the very end. Just a few things Trump would have done differently.

Instead, Biden REMOVED THE TROOPS FIRST and left everything (equipment) and everyone else there. Pure incompetence, now costing lives.

 

[Juan]

What do you think of 9/11, were you there? I was .7 mile away on that day. Bin Laden did that to us, under the protection of Al Quida and the Taliban.

I was there when bombs exploded in Madrid in 2004, killing nearly 200 people. I took that train line every day. My family took that train line every day. The train line where the bombs exploded. Actually my father rode just the previous train, so he is alive just by a miracle.

"The 2004 Madrid train bombings (also known in Spain as 11M) were nearly simultaneous, coordinated bombings against the Cercanías commuter train system of Madrid, Spain, on the morning of 11 March 2004 – three days before Spain's general elections. The explosions killed 191 people and injured around 2,000."

The Spanish people never supported the Irak war. Our government (Aznar) acted against the people's wish.

But we cannot forget the whole story: the US, London and Madrid bombings were also a reaction to the US invading Irak, pretending that "Irak possessed weapons of mass destruction", which was not true. It was also a reaction to the Gulf War of the 90s.

The US knew that Irak did not possess weapons of mass destruction and still put pressure on the UN Security Council to approve resolutions to "authorise" the Gulf War. The US engaged Europe on this mess (what a novelty!) and our dear leaders (Blair and the infamous Aznar) were happy to offer support. Later on both Blair and Aznar became rich by some mysterious reason.

 

[Luman]

The Taliban now has American weapons, vehicles, and more, thanks to Biden.

Get ready for Republican wins in 2022, and in Washington 2024.

 

[Juan]

Joe Biden is an ass who is incapable of doing anything correctly - witness what is going on in Afghanistan. He opened our borders, to allow almost a million undocumented, unvaccinated aliens in. He destroys everything he gets his hands on.

I suppose the US will offer now to take millions of Afghan refugees to America... if the US has spent around $820,000 million dollars in Afghanistan, spending a couple of thousands more on refugees should not be a problem.

 

[Juan]

The Taliban now has American weapons, vehicles, and more, thanks to Biden.

It seems to me the whole thing, the Afghan war, has been a Republican scheme to pay for weapons produced by American companies with taxpayers money. And this scam has been running for 20 years with no one protesting or saying anything against it...

After all it was the Republicans who made up that story of the "weapons of mass destruction" to find excuses for the Gulf War and steal oil.

 

[PeteJ]

It seems to me the whole thing, the Afghan war, has been a Republican scheme to pay for weapons produced by American companies with taxpayers money. And this scam has been running for 20 years with no one protesting or saying anything against it...

After all it was the Republicans who made up that story of the "weapons of mass destruction" to find excuses for the Gulf War and steal oil.

The Democrats are no different. The parties are more or less the same but many are in denial. Trump or whatever puppet is in just flip flops on what they say but never do anything different. Now, Sleepy Joe is the puppet.

 

[Luman]

It seems to me the whole thing, the Afghan war, has been a Republican scheme to pay for weapons produced by American companies with taxpayers money. And this scam has been running for 20 years with no one protesting or saying anything against it...

After all it was the Republicans who made up that story of the "weapons of mass destruction" to find excuses for the Gulf War and steal oil.

I have no idea but if you are happy with the way Biden has handled this withdrawal, then I'm glad for you because the vast majority of people are not.

You say that the United States steals oil, which is a lie, to change the subject and get off the subject of Biden, but it won't work.

 

[Juan]

You say that the United States steals oil, which is a lie, to change the subject and get off the subject of Biden, but it won't work.

Ohh, so you are one of those who thinks the US went to Irak to liberate the world or to get rid of Saddam (who previously was obviously ruling Irak because the US wanted him there).

If the US is in favour of freedom and democracy and all that, why don't US soldiers go to Palestine to fix that? Or to Venezuela (hey, there's oil in Venezuela!)?

I am not sure that many Americans approve the mess this guy did while he was in office:

 

[Juan]

The Democrats are no different. The parties are more or less the same but many are in denial. Trump or whatever puppet is in just flip flops on what they say but never do anything different. Now, Sleepy Joe is the puppet.

I just say that Republicans have routinely got the world involved in wars that did not deserve to be fought, on false pretences, on fake evidence, on made up stories like the existence of "weapons of mass destruction" in Irak.

And of course Republicans got the world (including Spain) involved in a war in Afghanistan. The conflict backfired and we got bombings in Madrid, on a train line that people who commute to hour use every day, at rush hour, leaving nearly 200 people dead and thousands of injured.

This is how international US politics affect the rest of the world.

 

[Juan]

Still I want to know if the US is going to take to America the millions of refugees produced by the US war in Afghanistan.

I am sure those Republicans can house some of the refugees in their big mansions.

 

[Luman]

Still I want to know if the US is going to take to America the millions of refugees produced by the US war in Afghanistan.

I am sure those Republicans can house some of the refugees in their big mansions.

Why do you keep attacking Republicans in posts addressed to me? I voted Democrat twice for Obama, and also for Hillary Clinton in 2016. I found Biden and Harris unacceptable in 2021, and voted for Trump, who is not a typical Republican.

A blood bath in Afghanistan is coming. The Taliban are going to kill thousands, and Joe Biden won't be able to do a damn thing about it.

 

[Christiaan]

Trump would have removed the troops in a more strategic way. He would have removed the diplomats, government contractors, etc. BEFORE removing the troops.

He would not have turned over the air force base until the very end. Just a few things Trump would have done differently.

Instead, Biden REMOVED THE TROOPS FIRST and left everything (equipment) and everyone else there. Pure incompetence, now costing lives.

@Lilah, are we're talking about the same strategic mastermind who thought that COVID-19 was a regular flu that would somehow magically go away? Is that the same guy who largely ignored Dr. Fauci's advise to tackle COVID-19 spreading with containment policy?

@Juan already covered in great detail that Trump is not the strategic overlord some people seem to think of him. So why would we hypothetically assume that the ''great leader'' would finally use his remaining brain cells in geopolitical situations? Are there any articles in which Trump mentioned a great plan of how he would safely retract American troops while keeping the pro-West government in Kabul? Answer: a big nop.

In Vice's recent article on this issue, Trump mentioned earlier in his presidency he wanted to get out of Afghanistan ASAP. No considerations or mentions of the delicate political balance of power between the Afghan government vs. Taliban, the weak state of governmental forces or supply from US/ foreign countries to create a barrier against Taliban expansion.

Exhibit A:

The Republican Party Is Trying to Erase Trump's Role in Afghanistan

 

[Luman]

By pulling the troops out before the evacuation, and before the Taliban takeover which he claimed was highly unlikely to happen, Biden has placed the lives of many thousands at risk. This man is completely unqualified to lead the U.S.

 

[Juan]

and voted for Trump, who is not a typical Republican.

And Trump is the worst kind of Republican. The far right. An asshole that managed to annoy the whole world for 4 years. He did nothing but increase the public debt and create a massive housing and stock market bubble.

I think Biden is doing the right thing, because it was a mistake to get in a war in Afghanistan. That was just nonsense from day one. Trump of course said he wanted the troops out of Afghanistan but he did not want to take the political responsibility for their withdrawal.

Now the question is: who is going to take care of the Afghan refugees?

It would be fair that the US addressed this issue as soon as possible. The US got other nations in the Afghan mess and now the US should deal with the Afghan refugees and take them to the United States. It was a shame to see on TV how those planes left with people trying to grab the sides of the aircraft, in pure desperation.

 

[Juan]

By pulling the troops out before the evacuation, and before the Taliban takeover which he claimed was highly unlikely to happen, Biden has placed the lives of many thousands at risk. This man is completely unqualified to lead the U.S.

I think the presidents that started this nonsense war were way less qualified to rule any country than Joe Biden. For instance, George Bush: totally unqualified.

Or the coward Donald Trump: completely unqualified, since he said troops should be withdrawn from Afghanistan but did NOT want to take political responsibility for it. Such a coward.

 

[PeteJ]

I think the presidents that started this nonsense war were way less qualified to rule any country than Joe Biden. For instance, George Bush: totally unqualified.

Or the coward Donald Trump: completely unqualified, since he said troops should be withdrawn from Afghanistan but did NOT want to take political responsibility for it. Such a coward.

They're puppets. Both parties.

 

[PeteJ]

I just say that Republicans have routinely got the world involved in wars that did not deserve to be fought, on false pretences, on fake evidence, on made up stories like the existence of "weapons of mass destruction" in Irak.

And of course Republicans got the world (including Spain) involved in a war in Afghanistan. The conflict backfired and we got bombings in Madrid, on a train line that people who commute to hour use every day, at rush hour, leaving nearly 200 people dead and thousands of injured.

This is how international US politics affect the rest of the world.

Obomber and Clinton didn't sign off on any warmongering? Wake up, man.

 

[Luman]

And Trump is the worst kind of Republican. The far right. An asshole that managed to annoy the whole world for 4 years. He did nothing but increase the public debt and create a massive housing and stock market bubble.

I think Biden is doing the right thing, because it was a mistake to get in a war in Afghanistan. That was just nonsense from day one. Trump of course said he wanted the troops out of Afghanistan but he did not want to take the political responsibility for their withdrawal.

Now the question is: who is going to take care of the Afghan refugees?

It would be fair that the US addressed this issue as soon as possible. The US got other nations in the Afghan mess and now the US should deal with the Afghan refugees and take them to the United States. It was a shame to see on TV how those planes left with people trying to grab the sides of the aircraft, in pure desperation.

Are you joking? Donald Trump is moderate and disliked intensely by the far-right factions of the Republican Party.

You do not know American politics if you consider Trump to be "far-right".

As far his annoying "the whole world", I'm sorry that his demeanor offends everybody. Consider the heads of Russia, China, Iran, Afghanistan, Iraq, Iran, Cuba, North Korea, and others of their ilk, and send Mr. Rogers in to deal with them.

Biden was not doing the "right thing" by foolishly pulling the troops out, before the evacuation. There is no way in hell, that any intelligent, responsible president would do such a stupid, dangerous, and deadly thing.

 

[Luman]

By the final quarter of 2019, a few months before COVID-19 struck, employment was at a 50 year high, under Trump. Minority unemployment hit record lows. Trump did this, not the Democrats.

Black and Hispanic unemployment is at a record low
PUBLISHED FRI, OCT 4 2019
There have never been more Black and Hispanic Americans in the workforce, Friday's Labor Department job report showed.
The jobless rate for Hispanics hit a record low of 3.9% in September, while African Americans maintained its lowest rate ever, 5.5%.

Another bright-spot of the report was the overall unemployment rate. The jobless rate dropped 0.2 percentage points to 3.5%, its lowest reading in 50 years.

https://www.cnbc.com/2019/10/04/black-and-hispanic-unemployment-is-at-a-record-low.html

 

[Juan]

Obomber and Clinton didn't sign off on any warmongering? Wake up, man.

They did not start the war. It was Bush and the Republicans who started the Gulf War and then that nonsense that they labelled the "War on Terror".

Then the world suffered the consequences. We had train bombings in Madrid due to this, despite the Spanish population was against the war and demonstrated against it.

 

[Juan]

Are you joking? Donald Trump is moderate and disliked intensely by the far-right factions of the Republican Party.

Donald Trump was just a fool.

 

[Lilah]

Or the coward Donald Trump: completely unqualified, since he said troops should be withdrawn from Afghanistan but did NOT want to take political responsibility for it. Such a coward.

Actually I am now glad Trump did not completely withdraw during his term. His exit strategy would have been much more smooth with less errors, however with even a little bit of of mishap the media and the Democrats would have blown it out of proportion. Had he remained in office, the Taliban would not have acted up.

 

[Luman]

Donald Trump was just a fool.

The media and many people complained constantly about how he was, based on his personality and quirkiness. He did not ruin this country, in fact, we were doing fine. I have already posted the high employment numbers that we had, right before COVID-19 struck and the vaccines that he managed to bring us in amazingly fast time, which was six months earlier than the CDC predicted they would be available. They probably would have been available earlier, but that would have guaranteed a win for Trump, so they were not released until after the election.

Now, the chickens come home to roost, with Biden and that cackling idiot Harris. How many more disasters, bad policies, and deaths will they be responsible for, in the remaining 85% of their terms? Time will tell.

 

[Juan]

The media and many people complained constantly about how he was, based on his personality and quirkiness.

You still do not realise that Trump did absolutely nothing during his term except of continue kicking the can down the road: more debt, more polarisation, divisiveness, and of course he did not withdraw the troops from Afghanistan because he did not want to recognise that the Republicans had wasted 2tn dollars in a useless and senseless war started by the very Republican George Bush.

Trump supported the assault on Capitol, an attempt of coup d'etat, and called those idiots who carried out the assault and those who supported them "very special", which in Europe means "you are a bunch of idiots"

 

[Juan]

His exit strategy would have been much more smooth with less errors

I think it is a bit hard to judge theoretical scenarios. It would have been... this would have turned out like this or that... all that is hypothetical.

The fact is Joe Biden has been brave enough to withdraw the troops and take on himself the political responsibility of a war started by the Republicans and spanning at least 4 administrations.