New University of Michigan Tinnitus Discovery — Signal Timing

[TheDanishGirl]

You could get an approximate reading if you have a decibel reader... Just find a sound to play that is sort of like your tinnitus and set the volume so it is about the same, and then measure that with the reader. (There are smartphone decibel reader apps that use your phone mic, but I do not know how accurate they actually are.)

That's not an accurate way to measure what db your T is. I mean, I can hear my T above a tv that is at a reasonable loud volume, that does not mean that my T is 70 db or more. I can also hear faint noises besides the noise of my tv, for example: me pressing a key on my laptop.

EDIT: of course, if you meant finding an exact, or almost exact sound of your own T, and having it play at a volume where it just about melts into your own T sound, then it is another mather.....that would work fine I think

 

[hans799]

Third, I was pretty depressed when I read that the noted dB reduction was only 12.

Don't be. The decibel scale is logarithmic. If one signal is 3 dB stronger than the other, then its power is double. If the difference is 6 dB, the difference is 4x. Etc.

For audio signals as perceived by humans, a difference of 10 dB is about a doubling in loudness.

So if the machine reduces your T by 12 dB, that means the volume of your T has been more than halved. That is awesome. And that is just 1 month of use, with the first version of the thing. There's a good chance that with longer use or a better tuned machine, the reduction can be even more significant.

 

[threefirefour]

Don't be. The decibel scale is logarithmic. If one signal is 3 dB stronger than the other, then its power is double. If the difference is 6 dB, the difference is 4x. Etc.

For audio signals as perceived by humans, a difference of 10 dB is about a doubling in loudness.

So if the machine reduces your T by 12 dB, that means the volume of your T has been more than halved. That is awesome. And that is just 1 month of use, with the first version of the thing. There's a good chance that with longer use or a better tuned machine, the reduction can be even more significant.

This thing has so far been so much better than I thought it would be. I really hope it hits the market ASAP. Susan Shore and her team could release upgrades as time goes like a computer. If they charge for it, they could make more money than a single release.

 

[hans799]

Susan Shore and her team could release upgrades as time goes like a computer. If they charge for it, they could make more money than a single release.

Haha just imagine the in-app purchases. "Base package: 12 dB reduction. Buy another 6 dB for just $49.99!"

 

[Vincent R]

During the weeks the volunteers were using the real device (the one that emitted both sounds and shocks), they reported less noisy and high-pitched episodes of tinnitus along with fewer episodes overall—two even said their tinnitus went fully away.

I personally won't settle with anything less than regenerative medicine, but this result still strikes me as impressive. Maybe it will lead the way to more definite solutions.

 

[Markku]

Thanks to @Autumnly for posting this (this was a live stream earlier today):

 

[leledany]

If someone dressed like this and a group of few students, found a good treatment for T, I would put my face inside a WC if I were an ENT doctor! Is this video a joke?

 

[cviechec]

I personally won't settle with anything less than regenerative medicine, but this result still strikes me as impressive. Maybe it will lead the way to more definite solutions.

I don't understand this viewpoint personally. To each his own I suppose. I would rather be severely hearing impaired and not have tinnitus than have tinnitus and almost perfect hearing.

 

[RichardGuy]

So I sent an email in to Dr. Shore explaining my situation. Not entirely sure I could make it but was interested in trying it out. Got the generic "we have recorded your message and will be in touch near the fall".

K.

 

[Paulmanlike]

Some questions, please state though whether it's fact or your own speculation.

1.) the only way I modulate my tinnitus is by pushing my ear / blowing it with pressure. The frequency and volume increases, then when I let go it goes back to 'normal'. Is this somatic tinnitus?

2.) can it help even if you don't know how to modulate your tinnitus?

3.) will this need to be personally calibrated to each sufferer? How do they do this, will it be matching it to your tinnitus frequency? This concerns me because even trying ACRN therapy I had trouble finding it

4.) is there any criteria in tonal/atonal tinnitus for this to work? What about multiple tones? Restricted to ringing, what about the hissing etc

5.) time frame for this to come out?

My own view....

You remember the hype of this ACRN therapy coming out, with the fancy videos - that never really took off even though the private trials had good reviews. How could this be different?

 

[Spiral]

Thanks to @Autumnly for posting this (this was a live stream earlier today):

Very informative. Though I think it would be taken more seriously if the guy was wearing more presentable like a suit and tie...

 

[parsky]

You remember the hype of this ACRN therapy coming out, with the fancy videos - that never really took off even though the private trials had good reviews. How could this be different?

ACRN was based on a poor understanding of the root cause at the time. Also the studies provided poor evidence that it even worked.

https://www.frontiersin.org/articles/10.3389/fneur.2017.00036/full

The brain can be retrained in some ways, but when the source of the ringing is hyperactive nerves, ACRN isn't going to work in my opinion. It's taken Shore's group 10yrs to get to this point. So I would say we have a better understanding of what is going on. I'm sure there is more to be learned as always.

 

[EDDTEKK]

Wasn't aware that Susan shore has also Tinnitus. She said it's mild and it doesn't bother her. Hope they will find a way to help most sufferes. Good video.

 

[leledany]

Very informative. Though I think it would be taken more seriously if the guy was wearing more presentable like a suit and tie...

Because tinnitus is taken less seriously! They do not still understand that for many of us it is life-threatening, imagine if a person like this discuss therapy for cancer as example!
Hope they do not take us too much easy

 

[Paulmanlike]

I'm glad he's not wearing a suit, then he would look like a potential venture capitalist. Instead he looks like an eccentric nerd that knows his shit.

 

[Mic]

Found this paper on Pubmed published yesterday (unfortunately no abstract):

Sensory systems: Bimodal cochlear nucleus stimulation alleviates tinnitus.

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/29348542

Somebody know if it is related with signal timing or not? The author is Heather Wood.

 

[Aaron123]

Somebody know if it is related with signal timing or not? The author is Heather Wood.

This is a "research highlight" that discusses the signal timing paper. It is not new research.

You can see this if you go to the actual journal. You can't see the review itself, but it says that it is a research highlight and the only reference listed is the signal timing paper.

 

[Alberte]

Do you know if the Dr Shore research and the device she create concern only « somatosensory » tinnitus?

 

[Spiral]

I'm glad he's not wearing a suit, then he would look like a potential venture capitalist. Instead he looks like an eccentric nerd that knows his shit.

Not quite. Venture Capitalist is better because they are the ones that will get the funding and the tools that researchers need to find a treatment. A cure or treatment isn't going to come out of the goodness of their heart or a gift, there has to be big money potential for investors to fund researchers make any progress.

The medical community and by extension the mainstream needs to take real notice of Tinnitus (and by extension us, the sufferers) more seriously. If you're given a platform to say your ideas and spread the message, the least that you can do is be more presentable especially if this video will be shown to the mainstream.

 

[Spiral]

Because tinnitus is taken less seriously! They do not still understand that for many of us it is life-threatening, imagine if a person like this discuss therapy for cancer as example!
Hope they do not take us too much easy

That's what we need to change! We someone more serious, not Bill Nye the science guy.

 

[Greg Sacramento]

There's many treatments for somatic tinnitus, but the University of Michigan approach may help many. It would be interesting to view the pre treatment physical test results including for those who had their somatic T cured to see if there was nerve pressure to a muscle or if it was auditory nerve pressure.

I have been correcting an over curved c spine that may be placing pressure on degenerative conditions, muscles, nerves and hearing nerves. I slightly carefully just perform a few turns in my neck both ways, 5 times a day. Sometimes just only 20 degrees. I'm starting to see an overall slight 10% -15% improvement of T after during this every day for two months. There's also times when it goes back to pre exercise levels from bad posture. The U of M procedures could also help me.

 

[Carlyi]

My tinnitus is constantly worsened by vibrations, driving, walking, anything that makes my inner ear vibrate, I don't understand how but hopefully this can help me too.

Same for me. It temporarily worsens after a shower, car drive and walking. Weird that vibrations make it spike.

 

[Jiri]

I personally won't settle with anything less than regenerative medicine

What about RL-81 and SF0034?

 

[Shera]

Same for me. It temporarily worsens after a shower, car drive and walking. Weird that vibrations make it spike.

Mine worsens after showers and car drives as well. Though walking doesn't always do it. Probably our TMJ messing with our ears.

I went sledding a couple of weeks ago and that spiked my T. Probably all the hiking in the snow.

 

[Vincent R]

What about RL-81 and SF0034?

I haven't monitored those treatments.

Medication or signal therapy is ultimately just a way to suppress the symptoms. It's not the same as healing. I think stem cell is the most interesting option.

 

[Paulmanlike]

I haven't monitored those treatments.

Medication or signal therapy is ultimately just a way to suppress the symptoms. It's not the same as healing. I think stem cell is the most interesting option.

If you've had tinnitus for years - you wouldn't be picky or "accept anything less" that regeneration.

Even if all this treatment does is suppress the symptoms and requires continued use, it's a massive step into improving treatments for tinnitus.

 

[Jiri]

Medication or signal therapy is ultimately just a way to suppress the symptoms. It's not the same as healing. I think stem cell is the most interesting option.

Well, even suppressing the symptoms, you know what I mean? Stem cells is definitelly the most interesting option but that's more geared towards the next generation I think (decades).

 

[Vincent R]

Well, even suppressing the symptoms, you know what I mean? Stem cells is definitelly the most interesting option but that's more geared towards the next generation I think (decades).

Stem cell treatments have already helped some T sufferers. It's history rather than future.

However, there are those who have tried the treatment without any improvements. Anyone who tries might waste his/hers hard-earned money.

I agree that suppressing the symptoms is a step in the right direction.

 

[Jiri]

Stem cell treatments have already helped some T sufferers. It's history rather than future.

However, there are those who have tried the treatment without any improvements. Anyone who tries might waste his/hers hard-earned money.

I agree that suppressing the symptoms is a step in the right direction.

Well, the adipose derived stem cells seemed to have helped this lady @DebInAustralia

 

[Aaron123]

Well, the adipose derived stem cells seemed to have helped this lady @DebInAustralia

There are other threads to talk about stem cells and other treatments such as SF0034 etc. Could we keep this one on topic?